West Coast Eagles 2021

[Tiger08]

It’s a close league that really hard to win. So many clubs have shoulda, coulda, woulda stories. The likelihood of that increases when you travel across the country every second week and need to finish top two to stay at home.

It’s easier when you don’t travel for the last 7 weeks of the season and get home finals against teams above you.

You also get the GF at home irrespective of where you finish.

I agree we don’t have the consistency you have had. For 30 years you were very consistent. It’s easier to plan when you know your finals are going to be at home.

Did you just arrive in a time machine from a year ago? There's a few things to catch up on.

Get yourself a mask.. I'll explain that too.

 

[db26]

You need to come up with something more substantial than that tripe.

Remind me again what question has not been answered?

Victim narrative and entitlement to success? WTF are you on?

The narrative is about equalisation for all teams. Not just West Coast. It means that pampered teams such as Richmond over the past 4 years stop getting hand outs to the detriment of other sides.

It means Richmond goes and plays Geelong in Geelong, the most difficult away game in the league by far.

It means Richmond do not get a nice soft fixture leading into finals travelling once in two months while other contenders travel multiple times.

Not hard to comprehend if you open both eyes.

Richmond get forced to play home games away from home? What in 2020 when everyone was forced to do that? Now that is just a dumb argument in itself.

Please explain all these advantages West Coast get over Vic teams. The only one I can think of is they don't share home ground advantage with multiple clubs, thats it. The AFL simply can't change that where as they can address a number of 'benefits' they gift the Tigers in fixturing. Something they actually finally did with the 2021 draw should it remain as published but not as far as they can. (Still no trip to Geelong or Tassie)

Now trot off and do some more homework because the above you submitted is a F-.

Maybe do yourself bit of homework your a clown , we did what no other club has done or ever will achieve that's winning the hardest flag ever to be won all year on the road in Qld , playing 4 finals and the GF in 2020 that's the facts you failed to mention that didn't you.

 

[db26]

7 games at the MCG leading into the finals in 2019

Did you even come to the W.A hub in 2020? I think Brooke put an end to that while Dimma was cheating on his wife

Loool is that best you can come with.Come to WA no need to when your on the road all year and play all your finals interstate in 2020 , you couldn't even win against a vfl side Collingwood.Lets not open the a can of worms considering the eagles history of early 2000 and what former players have come out and admittedly happen yet the afl swept it under the carpet and the club.

 

[DanWA]

Loool is that best you can come with.Come to WA no need to when your on the road all year and play all your finals interstate in 2020 , you couldn't even win against a vfl side Collingwood.Lets not open the a can of worms considering the eagles history of early 2000 and what former players have come out and admittedly happen yet the afl swept it under the carpet and the club.

Richmond has done pretty well to sweep a lot away from scum like Jake King and Dusty etc

2018 really broke the "dynasty"

Bring on Round 14

 

[Tiger08]

Richmond has done pretty well to sweep a lot away from scum like Jake King and Dusty etc

2018 really broke the "dynasty"

Bring on Round 14

On the contrary.. if we won 2018 (which we didn't deserve to because we peaked 2 months too early) then we dont get Lynch and we don't win 2019 or 2020 AND we probably aren't contending this year either IMO.

And the great part of 2018 is that the second best result for a year (after a Tigers flag) is the Pies losing a GF.. especially when they looked home.. So thanks for that!

Dom Sheed could win a Norm Smith against us this year and I'd still have a soft spot for him.

 

[DanWA]

On the contrary.. if we won 2018 (which we didn't deserve to because we peaked 2 months too early) then we dont get Lynch and we don't win 2019 or 2020 AND we probably aren't contending this year either IMO.

And the great part of 2018 is that the second best result for a year (after a Tigers flag) is the Pies losing a GF.. especially when they looked home.. So thanks for that!

Dom Sheed could win a Norm Smith against us this year and I'd still have a soft spot for him.

2019 was won on the back of 7 games at the MCG in a row heading into the finals

Agree on 2018. We had a lot of extra supporters due to playing Collingwood haha

 

[Obeanie1]

You couldn't get past semi
at home

Pretty sure we lost to Port in Adelaide with Judd limping around with shot groins and another mid blew a hammie in the game. Wewere physically and mentally cooked. 2005 and 2006 from the grand final seasons and the Cousins debarcle used up a lot of fuel tickets.

 

[FreeTK]

Loool is that best you can come with.Come to WA no need to when your on the road all year and play all your finals interstate in 2020 , you couldn't even win against a vfl side Collingwood.Lets not open the a can of worms considering the eagles history of early 2000 and what former players have come out and admittedly happen yet the afl swept it under the carpet and the club.

2019 was won on the back of 7 games at the MCG in a row heading into the finals

Agree on 2018. We had a lot of extra supporters due to playing Collingwood haha

With all due respect to both posters, this debate is so boring.

1- If there was any lingering doubt about Richmond being considered a bona fide powerhouse of their era after 2017 & 2019 flags, 2020 put that to bed. They thoroughly deserve the title as the best team in the the post Hawthorn era, and have established a dynasty that will be referred to in the same breath as Lions/Cats/Hawks.

2- West Coast has underperformed on expectation and very small margins (1 point loss in R17 v Collingwood 2019 & 2 point loss R16 v Bulldogs in 2020) has cost them top 4 finishes and has effectively ended their flag chances before finals has even started.

3- Point 1 & Point 2 have zero impact on 2021.Like, there is zero correlation, zilch.

In my opinion, West Coast has the best B15 of all the top teams, but the worst depth, especially in the middle of the ground. We saw that in the latter part of 2020 with injuries to Shuey, Yeo, Redden. Richmond and Geelong both carried injuries during portions of the season, but the injuries didn't make them appear like a fair inferior team in the way it did West Coast. Players like Ainsworth, Luke Foley or Hamish Brayshaw would not be on a list at clubs like Richmond or Geelong, let alone seem them play games (let alone a final like Ainsworth did).

It's telling that in the EF West Coast won almost all of the key match ups. Kennedy towelled up Roughhead, Darling did the same to Moore, Nic destroyed Grundy and Ryan decimated Maynard. The only exception is the great job Greenwood did on Kelly. West Coast's depth came back to haunt them with performances from players like Ainsworth and Petrucelle (3 disposals all night). And that was enough to see Collingwood win a gripping contest in a backs against the wall away elimination final.

A counter point to this is Richmond's R17 win over fellow grand finalist Geelong. In that game, not a single Richmond player had over 20 disposals. The key to winning (and winning comfortably) was that no single player had less than 10 disposals (not counting injured ruckman Soldo). This evenness across the ground is what set Richmond apart in 2020, and something that West Coast needs to close the gap on in 2021.

West Coast has made some smart recruiting decisions over the off-season in acquiring Langdon and Witherden. They immediately bolster depth in areas of need for West Coast, and allow Simpson more flexibility with how he chooses to use players such as Liam Ryan, Liam Duggan, Jackson Nelson, Tom Cole.

There are some concerns about injuries to West Coast, given their fixture is heavily front loaded with difficult matches. If they can navigate the opening half dozen matches, they should come home with a wet sail given the relative lack of difficulty in the latter 2/3 of their fixture.

 

[FreeTK]

Nothing to do with skill in the team. To do with management of the club and the team being very poor

This is so false.

 

[Obeanie1]

Might be on your board , but I'm telling you on the main board very few do.As you can see here now some living in fairyland could off and should off.

This is a continuing issue with Richmond fans. Open both eyes and read.

Stop ignoring dozens ofposts on the main board that dont suit your silly agenda.

95% of Eagles fans are honestly critical of our team. They should be tougher mentally and need to be in order to succeed. They have the talent for sure but need to be better as we dont get pampered like some Vic teams. Need to make our own chances instead of relying on the fortunes of being a big Vic team.

 

[Obeanie1]

Loool have a sook how about you answer and address the facts you fail to acknowledge.

We we're on the road in 2020 all year away from home, 4 finals games interstate and a GF in the most difficult season in the history of the afl.

Away all year?

4 of the first 5 games were at the MCG then one at Marvel. Thats close to the first 3rd of the season btw.

Yet again Tigers ignoring basic history.

Nice comfortable start whilst WA and SA clubs forced to hub with no covid in either state. Massive mental boost for some teams, massive dissadvantage to others.

Some side start the season off at home and get their confidence up, others forced to carry the travel load.......again.

Thems the facts buddy.

 

[FreeTK]

You couldn't get past semi
at home

You are kind of right about this.

West Coast blew top 2 chance in the last round of the season against Essendon and had to play Port away, and lost after injuries to Cousins and Judd, and then lost to Collingwood with Judd, Cousins and Kerr in the stands watching on.

West Coast has a history of two opposing forces.

West Coast has finished top 2 on 6 occasions for 3 flags and 3 runner up finishes (1991, 1994, 2005, 2006, 2015, 2018)

West Coast has finished outside top 2 and made finals 19 times for 1 flag and 0 Runner ups (1992).

People in the industry readily acknowledge the challenge of winning the flag from out West, and the need to finish top 2 to do so from WA.

The flip side, is it is extremely difficult for clubs to knock West Coast off at home in a final. They have a ridiculous home final record, losing only 5 finals at home in 30 years.

Basically if West Coast finish top 2, lock them in for the GF, if they finish 3rd or lower, they are up against it.

For a team in another state, they probably don't get the same strong benefit of top 2 finish, but are also not as disadvantaged by finishing outside top 2.

That is a simple pros and cons analysis of a team based on the other side of a large continent in a national comp.

 

[Jupes]

West Coast has finished outside top 2 and made finals 19 times for 1 flag and 0 grand finals (1992).

the sign of a truly elite club is winning flags without even making the big dance

 

[FreeTK]

the sign of a truly elite club is winning flags without even making the big dance

1 flag, 0 Runners ups.

Fixed it for the simpletons out there.

 

[My Tilly]

Maybe do yourself bit of homework your a clown , we did what no other club has done or ever will achieve that's winning the hardest flag ever to be won all year on the road in Qld , playing 4 finals and the GF in 2020 that's the facts you failed to mention that didn't you.

Hardly hardest flag ever.
Shortened quarters made it less taxing on older players.
Only 17 games played per team for the season. lol, that's a full month less of footy!

I loved the AFL narrative though. Talk of being the most deserved flag and all but seriously, get us back to full 20 minute quarters and 22 rounds per season thanks.

 

[Gavin Excell]

You are kind of right about this.

West Coast blew top 2 chance in the last round of the season against Essendon and had to play Port away, and lost after injuries to Cousins and Judd, and then lost to Collingwood with Judd, Cousins and Kerr in the stands watching on.

West Coast has a history of two opposing forces.

West Coast has finished top 2 on 6 occasions for 3 flags and 3 runner up finishes (1991, 1994, 2005, 2006, 2015, 2018)

West Coast has finished outside top 2 and made finals 19 times for 1 flag and 0 Runner ups (1992).

People in the industry readily acknowledge the challenge of winning the flag from out West, and the need to finish top 2 to do so from WA.

The flip side, is it is extremely difficult for clubs to knock West Coast off at home in a final. They have a ridiculous home final record, losing only 5 finals at home in 30 years.

Basically if West Coast finish top 2, lock them in for the GF, if they finish 3rd or lower, they are up against it.

For a team in another state, they probably don't get the same strong benefit of top 2 finish, but are also not as disadvantaged by finishing outside top 2.

That is a simple pros and cons analysis of a team based on the other side of a large continent in a national comp.

West Coast also suffer criticism (like Geelong) for regularly making finals but not winning the big dance. I'm always a little taken aback by that sort of criticism. Premierships are very very hard to win

 

[i am a logo]

West Coast right now remind me of Carlton after 1995 and Essendon after 2000

What about West Coast in 1995-1999 and 2002-2004? Falling into the finals due to home ground advantage and getting knocked out by anyone and everyone in the first two weeks of the finals isn't something foreign to the club

 

[Kwality]

West Coast also suffer criticism (like Geelong) for regularly making finals but not winning the big dance. I'm always a little taken aback by that sort of criticism. Premierships are very very hard to win

Its how we tend to measure things particularly with 1 winner & 17 losers. So often the flag is the first for a generation of fans or more. They have been with all the other losers for a while/years.

Thats how we judge things.

I was surprised by the number of Eagles fans over rating the 2018 team after a great win v the Pies, but anyone with any sense knows it could have gone either way. Equally the 2020 loss to the Pies could have gone either way - we had a BF thread wanting to get rid of Barass & McGovern, pardon my mirth.

Your likening with the Cats is appreciated, they arent down for long & never far out of contention for years.

 

[FreeTK]

West Coast right now remind me of Carlton after 1995 and Essendon after 2000

I don't really see the comparison.

My personal opinion is after their most recent flag win, the two clubs you mentioned struggled to adapt to equalisation/national competition.

Both clubs were VFL powerhouses with talent rich recruiting zones, and loads of cash to entice players to stay/play for them.

For clubs like Carlton and Essendon, that were very well set up in the 80's and early 90's the full impacts of TPP/national draft was only really felt in the late 90's to early 00's when their VFL era players were all retired and the AFL began to rigorously enforce the salary cap. It's no coincidence that is precisely when these two clubs started to fall away (and have not yet recovered).

In my opinion, a closer comparison is West Coast in the late 90's. An established older team trying to find the extra 1-2% required to get them over the top and lift the cup again.

I think Malthouse is our greatest coach. I also think that towards the end of his era, he was too "all in right now" and that, along with a poor recruiting decision in Ken Judge, is what saw us fall down the ladder for a couple of years in '00-'01.

To my mind, Simpson seems to have an eye on the future while competing right now.

It might be me being a one eyed supporter, but I don't think West Coast will be dropping down and rebuilding like the two clubs you mentioned.

 

[FreeTK]

Stating obvious.Alot fail to acknowledge those facts or mention them you might be one of a few.

I've just read the last couple of pages of this thread, and almost every single West Coast supporter acknowledged those facts.

I also notice that you only answer posts where you are able to bring up those games, again and again.

What I don't think you understand, is those games will have zero impact on the 2021 AFL season, so they aren't really relevant unless you are trying to reduce this thread to a reductive point scoring competition (which I think is your intention).

If West Coast is doomed to repeat 2019/2020 in 2021, just because history repeats, then Richmond would have never won 2017 given their history over the preceding 35 years.

But that probably doesn't suit your narrative.

 

[mcfazza28]

Did you just arrive in a time machine from a year ago? There's a few things to catch up on.

Get yourself a mask.. I'll explain that too.

I live in London. I have been in lockdown for 8 of the last 12 months as shielding my son.

But credit where it is due. Richmond have rebuilt into the strong successful club they should have always been.

You play the cards you have been dealt and you have played them well. I am aware of the awesome premiership win in a hub last year. Totally deserved.

You usually have a better hand than us due to our geographic location. That’s frustrating some times.

That said, I think you’ll find many Eagles supporters frustrated we never cash in with multiple premierships when we are strong. It is harder for us due to built in disadvantages and a tendency to botch critical moments.

 

[Taylor]

Maybe do yourself bit of homework your a clown , we did what no other club has done or ever will achieve that's winning the hardest flag ever to be won all year on the road in Qld , playing 4 finals and the GF in 2020 that's the facts you failed to mention that didn't you.

That's almost how every non Victorian club has won a flag every time they've done it. Almost.

 

[db26]

Hardly hardest flag ever.
Shortened quarters made it less taxing on older players.
Only 17 games played per team for the season. lol, that's a full month less of footy!

I loved the AFL narrative though. Talk of being the most deserved flag and all but seriously, get us back to full 20 minute quarters and 22 rounds per season thanks.

You forgot the main point through on the road all season, away from family's etc takes a toll your underestimating the difficulty of 2020.

 

[db26]

I've just read the last couple of pages of this thread, and almost every single West Coast supporter acknowledged those facts.

I also notice that you only answer posts where you are able to bring up those games, again and again.

What I don't think you understand, is those games will have zero impact on the 2021 AFL season, so they aren't really relevant unless you are trying to reduce this thread to a reductive point scoring competition (which I think is your intention).

If West Coast is doomed to repeat 2019/2020 in 2021, just because history repeats, then Richmond would have never won 2017 given their history over the preceding 35 years.

But that probably doesn't suit your narrative.

You make no sense at all.You haven't read the posts we're the Eagles fans claiming we should have won more flags with alot of could off and should off or that suits you.

 

[db26]

That's almost how every non Victorian club has won a flag every time they've done it. Almost.

Yes to a extent, but travelling every second week right during the season not permanent based.