List Mgmt. What Happens To Our Young Players If We Are Not in the SANFL in 2020

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chiwigi

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Apr 9, 2009
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Presumably, as all clubs are in the same boat. Practice match before or after the AFL game ? Ideally immediately after or the next morning so that that way the emergencies get a run.
This is exactly why I don't see how AFL Reserves is such an issue.

The push back is 99% political.
 

Schulzenfest

TheBrownDog
Feb 23, 2008
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Come next year lists won’t be large enough anyway. Crows will leave the Sanfl. Sanfl won’t want to lose a magpies team so they will go back to how it was. A Pamfc club. 2 ceos , 2 clubs. Training back at ethelton. A mini draft for the 9 clubs To fit the players needing a Sanfl side
There may be some small chance that the PAFC and AFC don't have teams in the SANFL next season.

There is categorically an absolute zero chance of the PAMFC coming back next season.
 

DaTBird187

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Breaking our club in half isn't sustainable, nor is it morally right.

List sizes to 35 is a crap idea also. I'd do 43 players on reduced pay + SANFL captain + give our zones back and under 18s can round out the side.

Remove the SANFL reserves comp also and rely on under 18s so development of players in this state improves.
SANFL reserves nowadays is the most pointless league in the history of football.

Also, as a player why would you play in it? Surely you can make some money playing country football instead.
 

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VineValerian

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SANFL reserves nowadays is the most pointless league in the history of football.

Also, as a player why would you play in it? Surely you can make some money playing country football instead.
100% agree.
Disband all State League level Reserves comps, and keep it to just 'A' grade and juniors. Players not required for State League 'A' grade games to filter back to Ammo's, other suburban, or country comps for those weeks.
And slash salary caps, to stop clubs recruiting ex-AFL players, or poaching from less financial clubs in their own leagues.
All about development from now on in.
 

Coobk001

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You may be laughing now but you will not be able to sustain an afl reserves side. No club will.

Options will be
The 18 clubs all have an affiliated SANFL/WAFL/VFL/NEAFL club to send all of their extra players to. EG Box Hill for Hawks. Port Magpies for Power
or
The extra players get spread out across the clubs in the SANFL/VFL/WAFL/NEAFL via mini drafts depending on which state the club is from. Port and Crows players to the SANFL. Crows leaving the SANFL and Port becoming a stand alone SANFL club with their zones and juniors returned.

I thought you would like the option B. I think thats the way to go rather than have two SANFL clubs with all the AFl players going back to it. Imagine Crows being affiliated to say Norwood.
I'm laughing because your ignorance is beyond belief.

The PAFC was forced to make a PAMFC. It failed. The PAMFC has come back to the PAFC now. We are 1 club.

There would be absolutely no reason, no justification, to create a PAMFC again, the PAFC would never agree to give the identity we own to another club, and our club would never, ever split again. There'd be no fan base, no financial support and structure at SANFL level. It would be a complete failure.

If the SANFL exists, the PAFC and AFC will have reserves teams unless the AFL develops a reserves comp. The AFL is the priority, the SANFL is just a feeder comp.
 

Granny Duurs is Lovely

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Surely if you're the AFL you don't allow any club to participate in the secondary leagues, or you run a reserves comp alongside the main competition. The risk from catching Covid-19 from a state league players (particularly VFL) would be massive you'd think.
 

RussellEbertHandball

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KT on 5AA on Friday.

At 5.35 sums up his explanations which are worth a listen in full but says - "Bottom Line we are fighting for status quo in the SANFL in 2021. Our position is really clear and for 2020 we want to play but we need to understand what the seasons look like.


Then talks China and last minute about AFL having more control over Port as will be asking for financial assistance.
 
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RussellEbertHandball

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If the protocols put in place for professional sports are going to be different to semi professional and community sports and the AFL and the clubs are a bit paranoid about playing against players who aren't in an AFL protected bubble, then maybe the answer to giving guys not selected in the first 22, is to play AFL 12's or AFL 15's as curtain raisers before the main game just for the 2020 season. This assumes the schedule will be dominated by night games for TV so can't play that game after main game, and all club officials and TV and IT facilities are there for both clubs to use for both games.

That means the AFL and clubs have full control of what all their players get exposed to re facilities and standards of hygiene at every stadium.

This assumes no AFL clubs have state league top up players involved with their club in 2020.

AFL 12's/15's would have exactly same rules as a normal game, not AFLX bullshit rules. 12/15 players on a full ground would let the players have a good workout and make it flat 4 x 20 minute quarters, that way you don't need a dozen time keepers to make sure time on is correctly controlled, and you don't have umpires having to worry about blowing time on, just umpire the game.

AFL 12's would allow for injuries as you would have as many on the bench as are fit enough to play and didn't get selected in the A grade. AFL 15's less so once injuries toll kicks in. Not sure what happens if you have less than 34 fit players to pick from, but maybe some assistant coaches who are in the same AFL bubble, can fill in. I'm sure something could be worked out.

Got to be better than having continuous practice games against yourself. Would be more expensive sending an extra 12-22 players around the country, but its a price that probably has to be paid this year.

Its a long way from a satisfactory solution but if the AFL health bubble protocols is the main driver of what the AFL will do, not integrating with state league and community league players, then some sort of modified B grade comp - that allows for clubs not having full lists as the season progresses - has to be on the agenda.
 
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RussellEbertHandball

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Whately reporting that the email mentioned below also states that no AFL listed player is allowed to play in state leagues.



ALL PLAYERS will be tested for COVID-19 by the end of the week as part of the AFL's plans to allow a resumption of training as early as next Monday.In a detailed memo sent to clubs, the AFL has ordered the tests, which take 5-10 minutes, be completed before Friday.
.......................

In the update to clubs, the AFL has also referenced the savage financial cuts that will be applied to all clubs' football departments.
 

Grave Danger

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Whately reporting that the email mentioned below also states that no AFL listed player is allowed to play in state leagues.



ALL PLAYERS will be tested for COVID-19 by the end of the week as part of the AFL's plans to allow a resumption of training as early as next Monday.In a detailed memo sent to clubs, the AFL has ordered the tests, which take 5-10 minutes, be completed before Friday.
.......................

In the update to clubs, the AFL has also referenced the savage financial cuts that will be applied to all clubs' football departments.

 

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Redline

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Why wouldn't we be in the SANFL in 2020?? Because the AFL wont let the AFL players train / play before the SANFL kicks off. That's not an argument that is sustainable given the AFL will be financially propping up the WAFL, SANFL etc in 2020 and probably 2021 as well, as they will be their bankers.

If the SANFL don't let the Port and crows play I assume that means the licence fee payment over 15 years to the SANFL by the 2 clubs will be suspended ie $450k and $730k respectively. The crows are also paying about $430,000 to play in the SANFL. Surely that is suspended if the crows can't field a team??

A smart way thru this - but let's remember the AFL are control freaks - is that if WAFL and SANFL and even NEAFL start before AFL, VFL wont start before the the AFL, is;

* Both Port and the crows have to play a minimum say 8 or 10 of their community club players inc leadership players ie Goldsack Port, ???? crows.

* AFL gives permission for all Cat A and Cat B rookie players to start training early and can play in state league.
(Port 6 rookies + 1 Cat B, crows 6 rookies + 0 Cat B, Freo 6 rookies + 3 Cat B, WCE 6 rookies + 0 Cat B)

* AFL allow each club to nominate another 6-12 of their primary list players to start training early - they have to be considered the lowest ranked players on the list, not that hard to put in a clause that it has to be realistic list, and these players can't be selected for AFL until 3 games after AFL kicks off or the 2 clubs have less than 22 players fit, only then can they select any of those players that were on that 6-12 list.

So for the 2 AFL clubs they could have a squad that trains together something like this;
Port 10 community players, 7 rookies, 8 AFL bottom end listed players = 25
crows 10 community players, 6 rookies, 9 AFL bottom end listed players = 25
If they end up getting lots of injuries then dip into community player pool for more players. The AFL listed players only can train with SANFL squad if the AFL wet their pants they are getting some massive advantage.

I just don't see why the SANFL have to start without the 2 AFL reserve sides in the comp.
They haven't been removed from the comp. It is a Port and Crows decision. I think they will both be back in 2021 depending on list sizes.

The issue is 'mixing' AFL listed players and SANFL players. Obviously the infection controll can be easier at AFL level but with top ups it gets a bit harder and the risk increases.
 
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Redline

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SANFL reserves nowadays is the most pointless league in the history of football.

Also, as a player why would you play in it? Surely you can make some money playing country football instead.
Why? If you have been involved in SAAFL / country football you would know there is a huge difference in standards on and off the field. Contrary to opinion the facts are

1) Whenever there is a trial game SANFL reserves teams beat full strength Div 1 teams by over 10 goals. Plenty of examples of that over the years.

2) You wouldn't find more than a handful of players over 23 in any given SANFL reserves round. In fact the oldest player was 22 in the SANFL reserves premiership team last year.

3) The AFL has ruled under 18's have to play in the SANFL under 18 comp unless they play league. With all the state commitments the best players are gone from the SANFL clubs for a couple of months anyway. So no 19-22 year old player is stopping development of an 18 year old.

4) Every comp in Australia has a reserves comp apart from the AFL teams which play in the various state leagues. Why would the SANFL be any different?

Anyway, even if we disagree on the above, is it a bad thing to have guys wanting to be best they can in a semi pro environment? It doesn't always have to be about money. It serves it's purpose for 19 to 23 year olds who want to challenge themselves with the odd Senior player coming back from injury.
 
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chiwigi

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Why? If you have been involved in SAAFL / country football you would know there is a huge difference in standards on and off the field. Contrary to opinion the facts are

1) Whenever there is a trial game SANFL reserves teams beat full strength Div 1 teams by over 10 goals. Plenty of examples of that over the years.

2) You wouldn't find more than a handful of players over 23 in any given SANFL reserves round. In fact the oldest player was 22 in the SANFL reserves premiership team last year.

3) The AFL has ruled under 18's have to play in the SANFL under 18 comp unless they play league. With all the state commitments the best players are gone from the SANFL clubs for a couple of months anyway.

Is it a bad thing to have guys wanting to be best they can in a semi pro environment? It serves it's purpose for 19 to 23 year olds with the odd Senior player coming back from injury.
When the AFL clubs have to pay for it.
Yes.
 

DaTBird187

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Why? If you have been involved in SAAFL / country football you would know there is a huge difference in standards on and off the field. Contrary to opinion the facts are

1) Whenever there is a trial game SANFL reserves teams beat full strength Div 1 teams by over 10 goals. Plenty of examples of that over the years.

2) You wouldn't find more than a handful of players over 23 in any given SANFL reserves round. In fact the oldest player was 22 in the SANFL reserves premiership team last year.

3) The AFL has ruled under 18's have to play in the SANFL under 18 comp unless they play league. With all the state commitments the best players are gone from the SANFL clubs for a couple of months anyway.

Is it a bad thing to have guys wanting to be best they can in a semi pro environment? It serves it's purpose for 19 to 23 year olds with the odd Senior player coming back from injury.
I'm not sure what points one and two contribute to this discussion.

Point three must be new as it wasn't the case last year. It is a step in the right direction if true.

My brother is the head coach of an SANFL u/18s side. He completely agrees that the SANFL reserves competition serves no purpose anymore. That's good enough for me.
 

shewho

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If the protocols put in place for professional sports are going to be different to semi professional and community sports and the AFL and the clubs are a bit paranoid about playing against players who aren't in an AFL protected bubble, then maybe the answer to giving guys not selected in the first 22, is to play AFL 12's or AFL 15's as curtain raisers before the main game just for the 2020 season. This assumes the schedule will be dominated by night games for TV so can't play that game after main game, and all club officials and TV and IT facilities are there for both clubs to use for both games.

That means the AFL and clubs have full control of what all their players get exposed to re facilities and standards of hygiene at every stadium.

This assumes no AFL clubs have state league top up players involved with their club in 2020.

AFL 12's/15's would have exactly same rules as a normal game, not AFLX bullshit rules. 12/15 players on a full ground would let the players have a good workout and make it flat 4 x 20 minute quarters, that way you don't need a dozen time keepers to make sure time on is correctly controlled, and you don't have umpires having to worry about blowing time on, just umpire the game.

AFL 12's would allow for injuries as you would have as many on the bench as are fit enough to play and didn't get selected in the A grade. AFL 15's less so once injuries toll kicks in. Not sure what happens if you have less than 34 fit players to pick from, but maybe some assistant coaches who are in the same AFL bubble, can fill in. I'm sure something could be worked out.

Got to be better than having continuous practice games against yourself. Would be more expensive sending an extra 12-22 players around the country, but its a price that probably has to be paid this year.

Its a long way from a satisfactory solution but if the AFL health bubble protocols is the main driver of what the AFL will do, not integrating with state league and community league players, then some sort of modified B grade comp - that allows for clubs not having full lists as the season progresses - has to be on the agenda.
That is the best solution suggested so far but it will depend on injury lists. If Adelaide only has 12 available player (after mass suspensions following their next brief, it can only be an 10- a-side game with 2 subs etc. Play to the lowest common denominator. There would have been noise if the AFL were considering this so it's unlikely, but it is the best solution.

Otherwise T.Burgoyne, Bergman, Mead, Grundy etc will miss a year of important development.
 

Redline

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I'm not sure what points one and two contribute to this discussion.

Point three must be new as it wasn't the case last year. It is a step in the right direction if true.

My brother is the head coach of an SANFL u/18s side. He completely agrees that the SANFL reserves competition serves no purpose anymore. That's good enough for me.
Someone questioned the relevance of the reserves comp, I was just pointing out that it is not the same standard as SAAFL and country football.

Interesting take by your brother, he is entitled to his opinion. That rule about under 18 playing reserves has been in place for a few years. It is to make it easier for AFL recruiters. Towards the end of the year the rules relax.

All 8 SANFL clubs recently gave the SANFL Commison a submission on the future of the SANFL reserves comp and if it provides value for money moving forward given the costs and it was a resounding yes from all clubs.
 

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