Roast WHAT I WANT TO SEE FROM A WELL COACHED PORT SIDE THAT KEN HINKLEY HAS FAILED TO SHOW US

How will Janus twist this?


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tribey

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NUFC, YES.
4-7 in the 2nd half of the year. The two finals were genuinely great performances but the 2nd half of the season overall was quite bad.
Apart from some late Schulz heroics we almost lost to a diabolical Melbourne team packed full of imminent delistees at Adelaide Oval in Cassisi’s last game, and followed that up with an unconvincing win over the Suns. In the context of the 11-2 start going down the drain, the loss to the Dees would’ve been hands down the worst result in the history of the club - every bit as unfathomable as the ones to come against Brisbane and Carlton in 2015. Or the wider slide from 11-4 in 2018.

We can’t say we weren’t warned - that happened in a year when we were supposed to be awesome and Ken could walk on water.

This is why it’s so hard to cop narratives that say it’s all part of a cunning plan. Or we just need this player, or that player was a net negative because scuttlebut.

If anything, Port playing well in a given week seems to be more a symptom of most of the team having coincidental belief/form as individuals rather than the result of any tactical or strategic brilliance on behalf of the Field Marshal directing the troops during the week and on the day.

Yeah, we can beat the threepeat Hawks in Melbourne as 10/1 underdogs. We can pump the reigning premier at their sandy seizure-inducing heap out west. We can also bash up the flag favourite Cats at home.

But history says we’re still just as likely to cough up the game tomorrow because at no stage has the man in charge shown he can extract those performances on a consistent, weekly basis, let alone grind out the necessary wins when expectation is high and the team is off the boil. Or when one or two players have suffered an ouchie as if that’s the first time a team has had to deal with an unexpected injury on the day.

Can we go on a run and challenge for finals and more from here with the team available? Absolutely. Is it likely based on past performance? Absolutely not.
 

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El_Scorcho

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Apart from some late Schulz heroics we almost lost to a diabolical Melbourne team packed full of imminent delistees at Adelaide Oval in Cassisi’s last game, and followed that up with an unconvincing win over the Suns. In the context of the 11-2 start going down the drain, the loss to the Dees would’ve been hands down the worst result in the history of the club - every bit as unfathomable as the ones to come against Brisbane and Carlton in 2015. Or the wider slide from 11-4 in 2018.

We can’t say we weren’t warned - that happened in a year when we were supposed to be awesome and Ken could walk on water.

This is why it’s so hard to cop narratives that say it’s all part of a cunning plan. Or we just need this player, or that player was a net negative because scuttlebut.

If anything, Port playing well in a given week seems to be more a symptom of most of the team having coincidental belief/form as individuals rather than the result of any tactical or strategic brilliance on behalf of the Field Marshal directing the troops during the week and on the day.

Yeah, we can beat the threepeat Hawks in Melbourne as 10/1 underdogs. We can pump the reigning premier at their sandy seizure-inducing heap out west. We can also bash up the flag favourite Cats at home.

But history says we’re still just as likely to cough up the game tomorrow because at no stage has the man in charge shown he can extract those performances on a consistent, weekly basis, let alone grind out the necessary wins when expectation is high and the team is off the boil. Or when one or two players have suffered an ouchie as if that’s the first time a team has had to deal with an unexpected injury on the day.

Can we go on a run and challenge for finals and more from here with the team available? Absolutely. Is it likely based on past performance? Absolutely not.
Absolutely.

I posted in another thread that we've shown good enough football in individual games this year to believe we can beat anyone anywhere.

But to win a flag, we're going to have to win 3-4 games in a row against battle hardened opposition under finals pressure.

Nothing about our consistency or mentality over the last 7 years suggests that's going to happen. It could happen, but it would take a philosophical change from the coach in terms of motivation, selection and maintaining structure.
 

Schulzenfest

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Feb 23, 2008
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Apart from some late Schulz heroics we almost lost to a diabolical Melbourne team packed full of imminent delistees at Adelaide Oval in Cassisi’s last game, and followed that up with an unconvincing win over the Suns. In the context of the 11-2 start going down the drain, the loss to the Dees would’ve been hands down the worst result in the history of the club - every bit as unfathomable as the ones to come against Brisbane and Carlton in 2015. Or the wider slide from 11-4 in 2018.

We can’t say we weren’t warned - that happened in a year when we were supposed to be awesome and Ken could walk on water.

This is why it’s so hard to cop narratives that say it’s all part of a cunning plan. Or we just need this player, or that player was a net negative because scuttlebut.

If anything, Port playing well in a given week seems to be more a symptom of most of the team having coincidental belief/form as individuals rather than the result of any tactical or strategic brilliance on behalf of the Field Marshal directing the troops during the week and on the day.

Yeah, we can beat the threepeat Hawks in Melbourne as 10/1 underdogs. We can pump the reigning premier at their sandy seizure-inducing heap out west. We can also bash up the flag favourite Cats at home.

But history says we’re still just as likely to cough up the game tomorrow because at no stage has the man in charge shown he can extract those performances on a consistent, weekly basis, let alone grind out the necessary wins when expectation is high and the team is off the boil. Or when one or two players have suffered an ouchie as if that’s the first time a team has had to deal with an unexpected injury on the day.

Can we go on a run and challenge for finals and more from here with the team available? Absolutely. Is it likely based on past performance? Absolutely not.
The Essendon game that year. Just gross. The first 'Ken' loss. If only we'd known back then how many more of them were to come.
 

Enviable Tradition

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B0ydmental

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This is going to sound like the worst sort of revisionist Hinkley hating garbage, but the issues we were having were really already apparent in 2014, and we were talking about them right near the start of that season.

2014 is remembered with rose coloured glassed because it's the only time we've looked anywhere approaching good in over a decade. It was a great year considering where we'd been in 2012, and it should have certainly been a stepping stone to greater things, but we needed to continue improving to do so, which we didn't do.

The structural issues were already on show then and there, but were wallpapered over by wins. The canary in the coal mine dropping of Butcher for the round 4 Brisbane pasting. Trengove and Carlile getting injured in the Showdown and then being replaced for the game against Essendon the following week by Young and O'Shea, leaving Clurey out.

4-7 in the 2nd half of the year. The two finals were genuinely great performances but the 2nd half of the season overall was quite bad.

Certainly teams run harder when they believe the running will achieve something, and for most of 2014 it did. It stopped in 2015 when every other team in the league bought into our hype and started setting up with +2 in defence to stop the slingshot. Then the running slowed because of diminishing returns.

The elite standards dropped after that because Ken had well and truly fallen in love with his playing list and the gold passes were out in force. The selection policy has been wildly inconsistent throughout, with bizarre selection decisions every season. We certainly could have dipped into our depth a lot more than we did to test it out. We certainly had a pretty high performing SANFL side in the 2014-2017 era.
This post cannot be explored enough.
 

B0ydmental

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I'm not convinced that having Ollie & Charlie back will guarantee that we'll get better. There's a big risk they'll make us worse.

I'm concerned about Ollie's poor disposal, in the same way that I think Jack Viney's poor disposal made Melbourne worse against Collingwood. So, more turnovers, more wrong-footing of our defence, more missed clutch goals.

And with Charlie back, we're more likely to forget other avenues to goal and bomb-it-to-Charlie. We become more predictable and easier to stifle.

I was surprised to find yesterday at the QB match that May can't seem to play anywhere other than FB. So this gave Collingwood the chance to create one mismatch by having de Grey or Stevenson opposed to him, and another mismatch by playing Mason Cox further up the ground, where he was opposed to Wagner or Lever most of the game, and at one stage by Salem. So they always had a very good bomb-it-to-Cox option with every attack. However, they used it sparingly, and really varied their avenues to goal, which made it extremely difficult for the defence to know how the ball was going to come in, and made their attack much more potent & dangerous.

This is the right way to use a tall forward. But we'll go the other way and become far too Charlie-centric, like we did last year, when I vaguely remember a stat that after Buddy, big Dix was the next most frequent forward target in the AFL, way above whoever was third, but with a far worse outcome. Because from memory he was also high on the list for the frequency of dropping marks after getting both hands to the ball.

Or maybe Ollie's worked real hard on his disposal and Charlie on holding on to his marks (which I strongly doubt, because neither seem to consider it a problem)
Wasn't this post spot on about Wines and Dixon
 

Port01

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We don't just kick to dixon in a pack in the forward line, last quarter our whole way to get to the forward line was to kick it to dixon in a pack on the wing.
3rd time this year alone we have had more inside 50's than points scored.
 

AwwThatsApples

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Has this thread gone empty because we've run out of tactical advice and complaints?
Or is he finally starting to do some of the things we have wanted him to?
 

Butters Made Me Do It

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SUMMARY (or TL;DR)

Under Ken Hinkley:

- We don’t have a reliable plan for bringing the ball from end to end, other than randomness & Robbie Gray
- We overwork our midfield, and particularly our forward players, when good teams work out how to reduce the load through team play.
- We don’t play intelligent football at clearances, and can’t manage outside players because of it
- We don’t give our forwards prime opportunities to secure positionally useful marks and kick goals
- Defenders are allowed to coast behind unambitious counterattacks
- Robbie Gray has played some ******* stellar football to drag us to midtable and he’s gone soon
- All our players (after a couple years in Hinkley system, draftees degrade) lack the composure to play smarter, not harder. YES THIS INCLUDES SENIOR PLAYERS.
vs Bulldogs - all still true
vs Crows - all true except we gave forwards some chance with corridor play

try again
 

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Chachi

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Fu** No
I enjoy reading your posts mostly but I'm surprised by this one. Your opinion is no more or less important than your ignore list.
 

AwwThatsApples

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No, I think if you watch the replay you'll find that we had several clean passages of play coming off of the defensive 50 that lead to goals, and they weren't accidents, because otherwise, we wouldn't have won by 57 ******* points.
SPP also added a lot to our pace in the middle.
 
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jakey

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No, I think if you watch the replay you'll find that we had several clean passages of play coming off of the defensive 50 that lead to goals, and they weren't accidents, because otherwise, we wouldn't have won by 57 ******* points.
SPP also added a lot to our pace in the middle.
Is a great convo.
 

Butters Made Me Do It

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I enjoy reading your posts mostly but I'm surprised by this one. Your opinion is no more or less important than your ignore list.
Had a think about this because really the problem is the ignore function doesn’t work properly.

Rarely a problem in fast moving threads but when the thread jumps up the thread list, marked bold with unread messages, three times in a row due to people on the ignore list posting, it gets annoying. Particularly as I only have three or four people even on it

Seeing as Chief has confirmed he has no intention to fix the ignore function, telling muppets on your ignore list to stop bumping a thread is pretty much all there is to do.

I don’t mind discussion with most people, but Janus burned all his bridges with lies while Apple fell off the bridge into the Torrens and is shouting from the river about how its not at all muddy down there. Not really worth it.
 

AwwThatsApples

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Had a think about this because really the problem is the ignore function doesn’t work properly.

Rarely a problem in fast moving threads but when the thread jumps up the thread list, marked bold with unread messages, three times in a row due to people on the ignore list posting, it gets annoying. Particularly as I only have three or four people even on it

Seeing as Chief has confirmed he has no intention to fix the ignore function, telling muppets on your ignore list to stop bumping a thread is pretty much all there is to do.

I don’t mind discussion with most people, but Janus burned all his bridges with lies while Apples fell off the bridge into the Torrens and is shouting from the river about how its not at all muddy down there. Not really worth it.
DAFUQ?

There are a few people I don't like very much that like to post on the threads I like to use, but that doesn't mean I have the right to tell them to fu** off.
 
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Byrons Firen

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Actually getting the ball end to end has been MUCH easier in recent weeks.
Last weekend we ate up every opportunity we got from the defensive 50.
... and kicked straight.
Yeah we're playing better, it's more organised more often and the clanger count is down.
SPP has clearly been told drop the dumb frees and the wild disposal. When he lowers his eyes he's a much better player.
We're better on clearances, less blind hoicks.
Coast to coast tells me good coaching and good execution. We are beginning to see more of it especially in the showdown.

The false dawn, seen it and heard it all before camp have facts and history on their side.
Well I've put some hope on the emotional credit card.

It's obvious we're getting better, how you react to it your business.
 

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