What is a fair trade for Kurt Tippett?

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farmer maynard

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Because the Swans were under the impression there was a gentleman's agreement to make it easy for Tippet to get to where he wants, perhaps?

Paying Tippett $800,000-$1mill a year is a risk. It's overpaying, but worth it if it comes off. But if you're going to be overpaying financially, you're not going to want to give up much in picks/players. That obviously doesn't help Adelaide, but Tippett knows he can earn the most at the Swans. Fair enough that he chooses us on that basis. The Swans thought they could get him with what they had when they offered, so fair enough they chased him. Now it's clear they can't, but the offer has been made, that ship has sailed. Adelaide is the victim of shitty circumstances/Blucher (speculation, of course), but that doesn't mean the Swans should be made to cough up more than they were willing to.
I more or less agree with that.

But I think Sydney was incredibly naive if they've accepted the spin about a gentleman's agreement and easy trade without doing due diligence. Blucher probably spun this to Sydney back in August, now after a premiership and with "no premiership players to be traded", Sydney simply don't (or wont) have anything to offer. I wonder if in hindsight they would have gone down this path?

Which is a shame for Sydney.

And a much bigger shame for Adelaide because White is pointless on our list, and picks 18ish to 40ish are in a similar bracket in terms of player outcome, so pick 22 is hardly an upgrade on our 2nd rounder, so all things considered Adelaide are better off walking away from that deal because it just makes the premier stronger when we're trying to have a tilt ourselves and makes us look like anyone who want to leave in the future can set their own terms.

Adelaide get nothing. We lose. Sydney keep a premiership list, (win) but come out of this looking pretty naive and ordinary at the trade table. Kurt ends up at GWS, or Freo, or Carton or anyone else with a pick before Sydney because any of those clubs would be crazy not to take him.
 

FreeAgent1

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Well your club is quite happy to overpay Kurt Tippett but isn't happy to give the Crows a fair deal. Pretty pathetic from where I am sitting. Piss poor from the Swans. It is like going to a car yard and wanting to buy a new Camry but only taking $15000 and just expecting to walk out of the dealership with that car.
Hahaha nah mate,
Its like going to a car yard with $1000 bucks for a camry who's rego exipires tomorrow.

I get that crows are going to get screwed with pick 22, and to be honest havent heard anything that sydney have tried very hard to get anything else happening. But why add insult to injury and take white, thats like trading pick 22 for pick 44 its just clearly worse than what you have before. Unless the swans are paying his entire salary leave him in reserves wishing he was in the NBA.

Crows fans are delusional if they thought they were ever going to get any better outta sydney than 22. Its not that the club is ******ed just they were put in an impossible position but Kirt Tippett, i compare it to the swans getting a clearly unfair and incorrect 50m penalty to 30m out after the siren. Of course you kick the goal who wouldnt, but it wasnt the swans who put them in the favourable position.
 

andrew99

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Why would you flag your interest in a player who is worth around a pick 8 and a ok player when you aren't prepared to give that up? I think it is the Swans playing silly buggers. They never really had enough to satisfy the Crows unless they give up one of their quality young players. If Tippett is on the 800K a year type figure he is surely worth more than pick 22 and Jesse White.
Because they thought they could get him anyway. What do you think? It looks like they are going to pull this deal off as well. Very well played by Sydney. I am glad you are not my clubs negotiator dude.

You only ever give up what you have to. If I was Sydney, I'd be tempted to offer even less than pick 22, given he's probably going to end up there anyway.
 

scottwade

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You'd hope the crows get the swans r1 and r2 picks. Swans would be real c****s to not give them.
At this point in time Adelaide wouldn't use the 2nd rounder.
Assuming White in, they'd have 3 free spots 2 1st rounders (19 & 22) and their own 2nd rounder.
Even if they open up another spot Sydney's 2nd rounder wouldn't be of any value as Adelaide intend to upgrade Callinan with their last ND selection.
 

Suma Magic

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At this point in time Adelaide wouldn't use the 2nd rounder.
Assuming White in, they'd have 3 free spots 2 1st rounders (19 & 22) and their own 2nd rounder.
Even if they open up another spot Sydney's 2nd rounder wouldn't be of any value as Adelaide intend to upgrade Callinan with their last ND selection.
I know. I'd still want it if I was the crows.

I'm not saying being a c**** is a good/bad thing, I'm just saying giving Adelaide massive unders (which less than r1 + r2 + White would be) makes Sydney c****s.
 

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BACCS

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Because they thought they could get him anyway. What do you think? It looks like they are going to pull this deal off as well. Very well played by Sydney. I am glad you are not my clubs negotiator dude.

You only ever give up what you have to. If I was Sydney, I'd be tempted to offer even less than pick 22, given he's probably going to end up there anyway.
They are not that stupid. The trade would rightfully get thrown back in their face if they tried that.

GWS and Carlton are really threats in the draft if Tippett decides to chose that path. Sydney didn't go all out to persuade Tippett to come and then not trade for him, in the hope of picking him up in the draft, that is plain stupidity.
 

dangle

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All my goodwill towards Sydney after winning the flag has dissipated.
What exactly has Sydney done wrong? They have offered all they are willing to offer and they're not obliged to offer any more than that - just like Adelaide are not obliged to agree to the deal. I feel for the Adelaide Footbal Club and it's supporters as Tippet's decision has put them in the unenviable position of not being able to move much with this trade. But, at the end of the day it's swings and roundabouts. You win some and you lose some. Every club has had players walk out and request trades to other clubs....this is nothing new. It's very unfortunate for the Crows and it looks like Sydney may be lucky this time and potentially pick up a decent player with huge potential for not much. Unfortunately these things happen and will continue to happen with the current system the way it is.

FreeAgent1's analogy about the unfair 50m penalty is spot on. Don't blame Sydney. They have done nothing wrong and if anyone thinks their club would go about it any other way, they're extremely niave. I have no doubt that the Crows will do the best they can for their club, even though in this situation, they unfortunately have one hand tied behind their back. There are plenty of people working on this and any decision they make will not be made lightly. I have no doubt that David Noble and the team have a better understanding of the situation than most Adelaide supporters, so I think you just have to trust that they will do the right thing by the club. You may not like the result of this trade, and Adelaide FC won't like it either. The Crows have been dealt a tough hand, but that is not Sydney's fault, nor is it their responsibility to make it any better. You just gotta do the best you can with what you got.
 

dangle

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By the way, I think Jesse White has a lot of potential and is no where near as bad as everyone is making him out to be. Sure, he hasn't delivered on his potential yet but I'm not convinced that Kut Tippett has either. I hope Jesse White ends up at the Crows and really turns his career around, delivers on his potential and cracks a couple of huge free range eggs on all the haters faces!
 

BarneyBent

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Which was always BS as far as I am concerned. You'd have to be pretty dumb to put such an agreement on a contract.
Doesn't have to be in a contract to exist. I don't think there was ever thought to be contractual by anyone but some hack journos. But there was definitely an agreement or understanding of some sort. There just seems to have been confusion over whether it applied to the Swans.
 

daniel_4tw

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What exactly has Sydney done wrong? They have offered all they are willing to offer and they're not obliged to offer any more than that - just like Adelaide are not obliged to agree to the deal. I feel for the Adelaide Footbal Club and it's supporters as Tippet's decision has put them in the unenviable position of not being able to move much with this trade. But, at the end of the day it's swings and roundabouts. You win some and you lose some. Every club has had players walk out and request trades to other clubs....this is nothing new. It's very unfortunate for the Crows and it looks like Sydney may be lucky this time and potentially pick up a decent player with huge potential for not much. Unfortunately these things happen and will continue to happen with the current system the way it is.

FreeAgent1's analogy about the unfair 50m penalty is spot on. Don't blame Sydney. They have done nothing wrong and if anyone thinks their club would go about it any other way, they're extremely niave. I have no doubt that the Crows will do the best they can for their club, even though in this situation, they unfortunately have one hand tied behind their back. There are plenty of people working on this and any decision they make will not be made lightly. I have no doubt that David Noble and the team have a better understanding of the situation than most Adelaide supporters, so I think you just have to trust that they will do the right thing by the club. You may not like the result of this trade, and Adelaide FC won't like it either. The Crows have been dealt a tough hand, but that is not Sydney's fault, nor is it their responsibility to make it any better. You just gotta do the best you can with what you got.
Sydney went after a big fish by pricing him out of other teams cap, whilst having no intention of trading for him.

Sydney have solely prevented Adelaide from getting even close to a fair deal.

If they didn't want to trade out quality when they have no picks (which is fair enough) they shouldn't have got Tippett to nominate them.

Crows would have gotten a fair trade had he been going to Brisbane or Gold Coast.

Don't tell me Sydney are an innocent bystander in this saga, because they're not. If they wanted to Tippett, they should have been prepared to trade. If not, don't throw your hat in the ring.
 

scottwade

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Sydney went after a big fish by pricing him out of other teams cap, whilst having no intention of trading for him.

Sydney have solely prevented Adelaide from getting even close to a fair deal.

If they didn't want to trade out quality when they have no picks (which is fair enough) they shouldn't have got Tippett to nominate them.

Crows would have gotten a fair trade had he been going to Brisbane or Gold Coast.

Don't tell me Sydney are an innocent bystander in this saga, because they're not. If they wanted to Tippett, they should have been prepared to trade. If not, don't throw your hat in the ring.
Sydney are prepared to trade.
If the rumours are to be believed pick 22 & White.
Tippett is well within his rights to nominate his contractual requirements.
If that priced other clubs out of the market, so be it.
He gets the contract he wants, Sydney gets the player they want.
Adelaide can reject the offer and send Tippett to the draft.

The competition isn't run as a benevolent society to assist Adelaide.
 

FreeAgent1

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Sydney went after a big fish by pricing him out of other teams cap, whilst having no intention of trading for him.

Sydney have solely prevented Adelaide from getting even close to a fair deal.

If they didn't want to trade out quality when they have no picks (which is fair enough) they shouldn't have got Tippett to nominate them.

Crows would have gotten a fair trade had he been going to Brisbane or Gold Coast.

Don't tell me Sydney are an innocent bystander in this saga, because they're not. If they wanted to Tippett, they should have been prepared to trade. If not, don't throw your hat in the ring.
So sydney should never have tried to get him cause pick 22 isnt fair. What if after he burned all his bridges no1 wanted him, 22 would be looking preety good!!

I agree this whole saga would have been way smoother if he just said i wanna go home, to QLD crows get the best deal outta either team that you can im going to thailand. Crows would have got something reasonable and could negotiate from a way stronger position. KT screwed them by not only nominating one club, but nominating a club who were never going to able to adequately compensate the crows. Does this mean that syd should have sed, lets not try cause its not fair on Adelaide......pfft
 

Richo83

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What exactly has Sydney done wrong?
How does holding a club to ransom sound?

How to screw Adelaide in 5 easy steps:

1. Realise that Tippett wants to leave

2. Offer him large sums of money in the chance he will come to you

3. Do this largely behind Adelaide's back

4. Wait for him to acknowledge his desire to play for you and only you

5. Force Adelaide to accept a packet of chips and a half drunk coke

They have offered all they are willing to offer and they're not obliged to offer any more than that
No-one's accusing Sydney of being illegal, just that they were manipulative and effectively pulled the rug underneath Adelaide's feet.


- just like Adelaide are not obliged to agree to the deal.
Adelaide don't accept your deal and he leaves for nothing. Hey, a half drunken coke is better than no coke at all!


I feel for the Adelaide Footbal Club and it's supporters as Tippet's decision has put them in the unenviable position of not being able to move much with this trade. But, at the end of the day it's swings and roundabouts. You win some and you lose some. Every club has had players walk out and request trades to other clubs....this is nothing new. It's very unfortunate for the Crows and it looks like Sydney may be lucky this time and potentially pick up a decent player with huge potential for not much. Unfortunately these things happen and will continue to happen with the current system the way it is.
Okay so there's two claims here:

1. Clubs win and lose trades. Which is true, however, most lost trades are realised in hindsight, with both parties assuming they can win the trade. No-one in Adelaide wants to do this trade, they were forced to and they know they're being screwed.

2. Players occasionally want to leave. Which is also true, however, most trades of a homesick player try to at least make it even. See for instance the Judd trade. This has to be one of the most lopsided trades in recent history. At least most lopsided trades end up as so because a club made a mistake in player evaluations. Adelaide know Tippett's worth. They've just been conned because there's only one car salesman in town and the only car he has is a 1987 Honda Civic shitbox. And don't they know it.

You just gotta do the best you can with what you got.
Such a charming attitude. I wonder how Sydney fans would feel if, for some bizarre reason, Kennedy wanted to return home and Hawthorn offered pick 21 and Xavier Ellis? If someone offered up pick 22 and White for Cotchin, Martin, Deledio or Riewoldt I'd tell them to thuck off. Heck, if someone offered the same offer for Tyrone Vickery I'd say the same thing.

By the way, I think Jesse White has a lot of potential and is no where near as bad as everyone is making him out to be. Sure, he hasn't delivered on his potential yet but I'm not convinced that Kut Tippett has either. I hope Jesse White ends up at the Crows and really turns his career around, delivers on his potential and cracks a couple of huge free range eggs on all the haters faces!
Jessie White was kept out of a side by a guy a Canadian who grew up playing rugby. Adelaide are already well stocked for the gangly ruckman department.
 
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Jesus. Pick 22 + a player who was about to be delisted for Tippett. Haha is this a joke? On principle they should make the prick walk into the PSD and go to whoever picks him. I would be filthy if I was a Crows fan..in fact i'm filthy anyway. Not sure how the AFL is able to champion an equal competition when the premier is able to sign a player for $800k-1m, and give up nothing in return. That is a total farce. I suppose the only positive to come from this is that the 'living allowance' will surely be scrapped. What a crock of shit. When do sydney play in adelaide next year?
 

dangle

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Sydney went after a big fish by pricing him out of other teams cap, whilst having no intention of trading for him.

Sydney have solely prevented Adelaide from getting even close to a fair deal.

If they didn't want to trade out quality when they have no picks (which is fair enough) they shouldn't have got Tippett to nominate them.

Crows would have gotten a fair trade had he been going to Brisbane or Gold Coast.

Don't tell me Sydney are an innocent bystander in this saga, because they're not. If they wanted to Tippett, they should have been prepared to trade. If not, don't throw your hat in the ring.
1. There is no actual proof that Sydney chased him. We also don't know how much was actually offered to him...it's all just reports. I read a quote last week where Andrew Ireland stated that if Tippet plays for Sydney next year, he will be on less than what he was getting paid at Adelaide

2. You say Sydney got Tippet to nominate them? Surely that is Kurt Tippett's choice. Do you think Sydney held a gun to his head and said "You have to nominate us!"?

3. You're right, the Crows would have gotten a better trade had he nominated Brisbane or the Gold Coast but he didn't. He nominated Sydney and somehow you think that's Sydney's fault? How?

4. I can't see how you, or anyone can say the Sydney Swans have done the wrong thing. As if they're not going to make an offer. If you found something you wanted for super cheap on ebay or at a garage sale and it said 'make an offer', you would make an offer based on how much money you had/what you were willing to spend....correct? You wouldn't say..."Wow that's cheap, but I should really pay the correct amount which is more than I can afford." would you? To continue with this analogy, asking the Swans to give up one of their best 22 or any of their required players is like asking you to sell something you love and don't want to get rid of in order to pay for that item you found at the garage sale in order to pay the "fair" price, even though you could have got it at a bargain price!

In an industry as competitive as the AFL, you're going to do the best thing you can for your club which is all the Sydney Swans are guilty of doing. There is nothing they have done that is outside of the rules and as stated, every other one of the 17 clubs would do the exact same thing.
 
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