NO TROLLS What is the actual case against COVID Vaccination?

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Gruffles

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The AusVaxSafety data also shows that 1.1% of Covid-19 doses (vs Influenza 0.3%) results in the person seeking a GP or ER/Hospital/medical attention (I believe within 0-3 days) ... which further demonstrates that 0.06% Switzerland statistic to be misleading.

Do you not think that people are possibly hypersensitive to any sort of reaction to the covid vaccine given the situation we are in and the chatter associated, leading them to react more to an adverse reaction that they would normally brush off with a flu vaccine?
 

Chief

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Because VAERs, Switzerland and TGA are designed to misrepresent and under-report the actual number of vaccine adverse reactions, as shown by the AusVaxSafety data which better represents the actual percentage of risk associated with each dose.
No they aren't.

You're misleading yourself because you don't understand what VAERS is.

"VAERS collects data on any adverse event following vaccination, be it coincidental or truly caused by a vaccine."

You're comparing two different types of data.

From their site:


Evaluating VAERS Data​

When evaluating data from VAERS, it is important to note that for any reported event, no cause-and-effect relationship has been established. Reports of all possible associations between vaccines and adverse events (possible side effects) are filed in VAERS. Therefore, VAERS collects data on any adverse event following vaccination, be it coincidental or truly caused by a vaccine. The report of an adverse event to VAERS is not documentation that a vaccine caused the event.
 

PurpleEyes

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Do you not think that people are possibly hypersensitive to any sort of reaction to the covid vaccine given the situation we are in and the chatter associated, leading them to react more to an adverse reaction that they would normally brush off with a flu vaccine?

I brought AusVaxSafety data in to this discussion because I believe if you send a survey to a recently vaccinated person and they respond then you are able to get a fairly good (but not perfect) representation of adverse reactions per survey (and each survey responded to becomes part of you study population). I have far less faith in the methodology of those other reporting sites (eg. VAERs/TGA/Switzerland).

I'm not sure how one can measure any possible hypersensitivity and the effect that has on the data. I have friends who are proud to say they had no adverse reactions from their jabs, and some who are hesitant to admit it kept them in bed stopping them from doing activities.

In contrast, I would imagine finding how to fill in a VAERs/TGA/Switzerland report and submit it (or to ensure a medical representative does so), would take more effort. But having done neither, I'm guessing like the rest of us in here.

If anybody has completed an AusVaxSafey survey (or received one and not responded), I'd be interested in your experience.
 

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Gruffles

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I brought AusVaxSafety data in to this discussion because I believe if you send a survey to a recently vaccinated person and they respond then you are able to get a fairly good (but not perfect) representation of adverse reactions per survey (and each survey responded to becomes part of you study population). I have far less faith in the methodology of those other reporting sites (eg. VAERs/TGA/Switzerland).

I'm not sure how one can measure any possible hypersensitivity and the effect that has on the data. I have friends who are proud to say they had no adverse reactions from their jabs, and some who are hesitant to admit it kept them in bed stopping them from doing activities.

In contrast, I would imagine finding how to fill in a VAERs/TGA/Switzerland report and submit it (or to ensure a medical representative does so), would take more effort. But having done neither, I'm guessing like the rest of us in here.

If anybody has completed an AusVaxSafey survey (or received one and not responded), I'd be interested in your experience.
So this comes back to my point of comparing the adverse reaction to the covid vaccine with numbers from the flu vaccine. It means nothing as you can't actually compare them. One has a thorough follow-up system in place while the other does not.
 

Chief

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I brought AusVaxSafety data in to this discussion because I believe if you send a survey to a recently vaccinated person and they respond then you are able to get a fairly good (but not perfect) representation of adverse reactions per survey (and each survey responded to becomes part of you study population). I have far less faith in the methodology of those other reporting sites (eg. VAERs/TGA/Switzerland).
They are different data sets.

You can't compare them.

But you are trying to compare them so you can say the Swiss are publishing misleading data.

So you can call into doubt the safety of the vaccines.

Am I wrong here?
 

PurpleEyes

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So this comes back to my point of comparing the adverse reaction to the covid vaccine with numbers from the flu vaccine. It means nothing as you can't actually compare them. One has a thorough follow-up system in place while the other does not.
No. Both the Influenza and the Covid-19 surveys were both done by AusVaxSafety. There are comparable.
 

PurpleEyes

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On a different topic, but certainly related to this thread, the latest data from the NSW Health reports show that for the week ending 8/1/22 they reported; 159,127 cases (for Two effective doses) vs 779 cases (for No effective dose).
(NB: there are other vaccine status classifications, eg. Under Investigation, One effective dose, Not eligible 0-11 year old)

These sort of numbers also increase hesitancy when trying to understand the true worth and effectiveness of these vaccines.
 

Gruffles

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No. Both the Influenza and the Covid-19 surveys were both done by AusVaxSafety. There are comparable.
What I'm saying is that one survey is way more thorough than the other. Speaking from my own experience, I've been sent multiple questionnaires regarding my covid vaccines but I've never been sent a questionnaire regarding my yearly flu vaccine, and I'm sure this is not just a one off experience. This alone would account for a huge difference in data between the 2 surveys, meaning they are not comparable.
 

PurpleEyes

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What I'm saying is that one survey is way more thorough than the other. Speaking from my own experience, I've been sent multiple questionnaires regarding my covid vaccines but I've never been sent a questionnaire regarding my yearly flu vaccine, and I'm sure this is not just a one off experience. This alone would account for a huge difference in data between the 2 surveys, meaning they are not comparable.
They are comparable.
They both have data relating to the percentages of Vaccine Adverse Reactions reported and percentages reported visiting a Dr or Emergency department.
They are the statistics I am comparing.
 

Gruffles

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They are comparable.
They both have data relating to the percentages of Vaccine Adverse Reactions reported and percentages reported visiting a Dr or Emergency department.
They are the statistics I am comparing.
OK... We'll just have to agree to disagree.

If they sent out the same survey for the flu vaccine as they are doing for the covid vaccine I would be very confident that we would have a higher value for adverse reactions to the flu vaccine. I certainly have never reported pain/swelling to the flu vaccine even though I've experienced it, while I reported pain/swelling to the covid vaccine because they actively asked me.

The data for the flu vaccine is nowhere near as comprehensive as the data for the covid vaccine.
 

PurpleEyes

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OK... We'll just have to agree to disagree.

If they sent out the same survey for the flu vaccine as they are doing for the covid vaccine I would be very confident that we would have a higher value for adverse reactions to the flu vaccine. I certainly have never reported pain/swelling to the flu vaccine even though I've experienced it, while I reported pain/swelling to the covid vaccine because they actively asked me.

The data for the flu vaccine is nowhere near as comprehensive as the data for the covid vaccine.

AusVaxSafety monitor more than just Influenza and Covid-19 vaccines.
If you have a browse around the website's safety data you will find that the non-Covid-19 vaccines pretty consistently report much lower percentages for medical attendance/adverse reactions than those reported for the various Covid-19 vaccines and doses.
All of which are still considerably higher than the Switzerland 0.06% statistic that I first commented on.
 

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DERIBERATE

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The AusVaxSafety data is fairly consistent with the Pfizer submission to the FDA back in December 2020 in which the following was reported;
"The most common solicited adverse reactions were injection site reactions (84.1%), fatigue (62.9%), headache (55.1%), muscle pain (38.3%), chills (31.9%), joint pain (23.6%), fever (14.2%)."

What is out of place is the data from Switzerland in which they present just 0.06% of doses resulted in reports of serious or non-serious adverse reactions.
84% of people had a sore arm which is an adverse event. Adverse events include death. Therefore 84% of people died.

Am I doing it right, freethinker

shit-ice-cream.gif
 

The 747

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On a different topic, but certainly related to this thread, the latest data from the NSW Health reports show that for the week ending 8/1/22 they reported; 159,127 cases (for Two effective doses) vs 779 cases (for No effective dose).
(NB: there are other vaccine status classifications, eg. Under Investigation, One effective dose, Not eligible 0-11 year old)

These sort of numbers also increase hesitancy when trying to understand the true worth and effectiveness of these vaccines.

Source?
 

Gruffles

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AusVaxSafety monitor more than just Influenza and Covid-19 vaccines.
If you have a browse around the website's safety data you will find that the non-Covid-19 vaccines pretty consistently report much lower percentages for medical attendance/adverse reactions than those reported for the various Covid-19 vaccines and doses.
All of which are still considerably higher than the Switzerland 0.06% statistic that I first commented on.
Once again, you're saying these things while completely disregarding what I'm saying. They have never run an information gathering campaign as thoroughly as they are doing for the covid vaccine for ANY other vaccine in history.

Question... Have you ever reported a sore injection site for any vaccine other than your covid vaccine?
 

kingswood71

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The AusVaxSafety data also shows that 1.1% of Covid-19 doses (vs Influenza 0.3%) results in the person seeking a GP or ER/Hospital/medical attention (I believe within 0-3 days) ... which further demonstrates that 0.06% Switzerland statistic to be misleading.
AusVax state "AusVaxSafety does not specifically ask participants the reason why they accessed medical care in the days following vaccination. Therefore medical attendance reported may or may not be related to any adverse events reported.".....
Its wrong therefore for you to assume that by saying "1.1% of Covid-19 doses (vs Influenza 0.3%) results in the person seeking a GP or ER/Hospital/medical attention"
 

kingswood71

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On a different topic, but certainly related to this thread, the latest data from the NSW Health reports show that for the week ending 8/1/22 they reported; 159,127 cases (for Two effective doses) vs 779 cases (for No effective dose).
(NB: there are other vaccine status classifications, eg. Under Investigation, One effective dose, Not eligible 0-11 year old)

These sort of numbers also increase hesitancy when trying to understand the true worth and effectiveness of these vaccines.
Link?
The data I am seeing shows that from Nov to 8 Jan, 267,381 cases for fully vaccinated and 3,552 for no effective dose.
What is significant is that the hospitalization rate for fully vaccinated cases was 1% cf. 8.9% for unvaccinated....
 

Chief

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AusVax state "AusVaxSafety does not specifically ask participants the reason why they accessed medical care in the days following vaccination. Therefore medical attendance reported may or may not be related to any adverse events reported.".....
I dropped an engineering block on my toe and broke my toenail. Why? Pfizer vaccine.
 

kingswood71

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The AusVaxSafety data is fairly consistent with the Pfizer submission to the FDA back in December 2020 in which the following was reported;
"The most common solicited adverse reactions were injection site reactions (84.1%), fatigue (62.9%), headache (55.1%), muscle pain (38.3%), chills (31.9%), joint pain (23.6%), fever (14.2%)."

What is out of place is the data from Switzerland in which they present just 0.06% of doses resulted in reports of serious or non-serious adverse reactions.
Likely related to different Swiss methodology.
Whats their methodology for data collection?
 

Gruffles

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