Autopsy What just happened? A draw???

[Hong Kong Pie]

There are about a dozen things which happened in the 2nd half that led to the final result, so trying to pinpoint just a single one for it is a futile mission. It was a 'perfect storm' of bad play, bad luck and bad decisions that cost us, and which have to be looked at evenly as a whole. In the cold light of Monday, i feel less angry, but hopeful - hopeful that the whole club will learn from yesterday and take steps to make sure that it doesn't happen again, from the coach/coaches to every player.

 

[Dogs_Playing_Poker]

Why are focusing on the Langdon kick so much.
Firstly. the fault was with the players who failed to make a contest
Secondly after that monumental heck up of not being able to make a contest we conceded another mark 30 meters out from goal.

Two times in the final 10 seconds of the game we failed to kill the ball. That is the real issue. Not whether or not Langdon should have kicked the ball 1,76 meters closer to the boundry line

Even knocking the point through from Lynch's shot at goal? The ball pretty much landed on the goal line, how we didn't concede a point there..... the beauty of a close game is you isolate incidents.

 

[MarkT2]

The chocolates were only because Jenkins kept dropping uncontested marks. Goldsack got lucky in the first half and then paid the price for his lax defence in the second half.

Goldsack paid the price for poor list management and coaching. He's far too small for Jenkins but our only decent option was used forward because we don't have 2 viable key forward options.

 

[Collingwoodity]

I think we can catch any side off guard with our ballistic style of football.. really not much thinking as a coach is involved. It's when Buckley needs to play chess and start thinking strategically is where he gets caught out. Do we need to give this bloke a contract when he can only complete one side of a Rubix Cube in record time.. halia of a coach.

Xalia is too harsh.

Etsi kai etsi coach imo.


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[ottoman]

Xalia is too harsh.

Etsi kai etsi coach imo.


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πατάτα

 

[Alexander323bc]

I think you will find that the siren actually goes half a second or so early in every game.
I think that the reason for that is that by the time the sound reaches the umpires ear it will be correct time. In other words if they sound the siren exactly on time then there is an added fraction of a second for it to reach the umpire so to allow for that it is blown a fraction early.
Either way it doesn't really matter as the game officially finishes when the umpire blows his whistle not when the siren sounds.

Sorry to be pedantic but the game officially finishes when an umpire hears the siren. Not when he blows his whistle! See Hawthorn game from a few rounds ago when trying to punch the ball for a behind when it was a draw.

 

[ottoman]

Sorry to be pedantic but the game officially finishes when an umpire hears the siren. Not when he blows his whistle! See Hawthorn game from a few rounds ago when trying to punch the ball for a behind when it was a draw.

Ok thanks for the info.
Wasn't aware of that.

 

[Countrypie]

Was at the game yesterday - sat roughly in the same position as did when I was a kid in 1973 when Richmond came back from 8 goals down at half time to win. the game had an eerily similar feel about it. From us playing sublimely in the first half to getting caught in the headlights in the 2nd and not being able to buy a goal in the last 10 minutes.
For me, yesterday demonstrated how fine the line between success and failure is. The game turned on a disallowed mark/freekick to Elliott in the 3rd quarter. Somedays it would have been paid others it wouldn't. The ball was swept down the field and Adelaide goaled. The next 3 or 4 forward entries Collingwood made were all millionaire type entries - all or nothing trying to land the knock out punch. Whereas in the first half we held the ball and made goo ddecisions - that 3rd quarter we got caught trying to bury them . The ball was rushed deep out of our fwd 50 on 4 occassions- all resulted in goals. On every occassionwe were half a chance to score. We weren't clean, forwards over committed to the contest and Adelaide swept the ball out. They are very, very good. We aren't that far away

 

[Vankri]

I'm glad that after the frenzy of the first pages most people are arguing against putting blame on Langdon.

He has absolutely nothing to blame himself for and it's disappointing to see some good posters falling for the trap of blaming the turnover kick instead of the receivers. It's been explained before but it's unbelievably bad that on a high ball towards the boundary line not one of our players went remotely close to contesting the mark. Most of our forwards should have been running towards the same spot to give Langdon more confidence to kick it there and rather than wait for ball spillage, their primary thought should have been to go and spoil the kick to the boundary.

That wasn't the only costly sequence of play in the last. Blair's usual inefficient fend off was the wrong decision (a nice handball rolling on the ground to get it out and keep it contested would have been good), Maynard's run after his kick out and decision to take on the forward instead of sending a long bomb was his usual quota of a brain fade in game costing a goal, Fasolo completely messing up a counter attack by going the complicated option and kicking it too late resulted in a slingshot goal to the crows and of course we also kicked our fair share of points when the crows were running at crazy levels of goal efficiency.

I'm not sure what moves the coaching box made in that third quarter but watching it on TV I couldn't see anything obvious we made to stop their run of goals. The defence had been great until then but surely we've got to have a plan for when we're 50 points in front and need to defend tighter not looser. Maybe go man on man, maybe send Reid back, but it's a failure to allow them 7 goals in a quarter when they only had 3 to half time.

That and the frustration of the result set aside, we were very impressive without Pendles and Varcoe (for his run at half back which we can't really replace when he and Sinclair are out). Our ball movement was vastly different to what we've seen during the year, a lot of support to teammates by hand, a lot of quicker decision made and risks taken in defence to go to the corridor instead of switching. I wish we had seen more of those risks during the season.

Wells was our best player and showed the class we are missing and the importance of finding someone who can take over that role in a few years when he's gone (Daicos and Broomhead probably the closest on our list but certainly nowhere near the level at this stage). But most encouraging for our future was the very high performances of some of our players <25yo in Grundy, Adams, Scharenberg, Moore and Langdon. Let's hope to see them continue on this trend for the remaining games and joined by a few more so we have the confidence that we're building a strong list of under 25s (Maynard, Phillips, De Goey playing good final games and hopefully a few new faces) and not just relying on a few of our recent recruits in Wells, Dunn, Howe and on Pendles. We really don't know when our next chance at a flag will be and to determine the right strategy we need to know how much we can rely on that core younger group to make the right calls in the off season.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Was at the game yesterday - sat roughly in the same position as did when I was a kid in 1973 when Richmond came back from 8 goals down at half time to win. the game had an eerily similar feel about it. From us playing sublimely in the first half to getting caught in the headlights in the 2nd and not being able to buy a goal in the last 10 minutes.
For me, yesterday demonstrated how fine the line between success and failure is. The game turned on a disallowed mark/freekick to Elliott in the 3rd quarter. Somedays it would have been paid others it wouldn't. The ball was swept down the field and Adelaide goaled. The next 3 or 4 forward entries Collingwood made were all millionaire type entries - all or nothing trying to land the knock out punch. Whereas in the first half we held the ball and made goo ddecisions - that 3rd quarter we got caught trying to bury them . The ball was rushed deep out of our fwd 50 on 4 occassions- all resulted in goals. On every occassionwe were half a chance to score. We weren't clean, forwards over committed to the contest and Adelaide swept the ball out. They are very, very good. We aren't that far away

50 points up.. I woulda just thrown Reid down back to keep their talls in check.. game was done and dusted if Buckley had done that. They were always going to come back.. Reid stayed up front for the entire game.

 

[underbelly]

for what's it's worth, it would have been so easy to throw our hands in the air a few rounds ago and collapse much like Carlton are currently doing. All I ask is Effort & Development. Yes mistakes get made but how can anybody demand perfection given that we have so much raw talent in our list. Looking forward to the next few weeks and hopefully a couple more debutants (Daics & Kirby). We are going to frighten the hell out of a few sides and can't wait to play Richmond and Geelong soon, 2 sides that we've had good success over in recent times.

 

[jackcass]

Because just about every week

It cripples us

We should have won four more (3 and 1/2 games actually) this year.

But we didn't

5 posters today. 5. just 1 of those squeeze through and result is different.

 

[jackcass]

We went from linking up with great separation and momentum going forward to this shit crowding the ball and flat footed handballing to a stationary player again.
I hate the way we play and I hate that it happens every week, this was a terrible performance and we may as well have lost.

I think you're overlooking Adelaide in all of that.

 

[Soups]

I thought the defenders had more confidence in him today and used him well as an outlet. No idea what stats he had.

Don't crucify him for not takling. We have many shit tacklers in our team........he definitely is one and needs to get better at that.

Looking at all the games played over the weekend and all the intercept type players all have one thing in common, they all have low tackle numbers. While I agree he needs to improve in that area, the position he plays is always a low tackle position because he's the one getting fed the ball.

 

[TW Sherrin]

5 posters today. 5. just 1 of those squeeze through and result is different.

or if Adelaide kick for goal at 70% instead of 81%.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

5 posters today. 5. just 1 of those squeeze through and result is different.

Even the mercurial Wells.

Yes what could have been?

 

[jackcass]

Where was Treloar when it counted?

Skis in a very downward-sloping direction.

Might have learned that from a section of our supporter base.

 

[Scribe26]

Some of the ranting at Buckley post-game was peak 2017 on this board.

We butchered the ball in the second half. We turned it over in dangerous spots and opened ourselves up for Adelaide's sling shot footy.

Despite the mounting pressure, we kicked back in the fourth term. Crisp doesn't hit the post, we're 27 points up and home. Reid doesn't hit the post, we're home. Darcy kicks the set shot, we're home.

Adelaide may not have been at their best, but they're a bloody good football side with a number of weapons.

The coach put together a pretty good plan. We shut out their key mids. The defensive match-ups were pretty much spot on.

This group, like we've seen all year, is just not quite ready to execute consistently.

Christ, look out when it is. Look out when we fill a couple of holes on the list. Look out when Moore, JDG, Grundy, Treloar, Adams, Maynard, Hoskin Elliot, Elliot, Scharenberg and a few others have another summer together and begin to work it all out consistently.

Waiting is the hardest part.

 

[jackcass]

I don't get why people would focus on the negatives...We're no chance to play finals, our season is over, yet people are losing the plot over a draw...Geez maybe it's cause I'm no longer invested in 2017, but give me a spell.

Wells was unreal, as was Adams. Langdon before he got a knock was sensational, and Moore proved his worth once again.

For a team with nothing to play for, coming up against the best team in the comp, it was a bloody good effort. Just appreciate the match and move on...

It's a weird paradox isn't it. Going into the game not too many would have given us a chance against the Ravens yet the fact we managed a draw instead of getting pantsed just isn't good enough. Go figure.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

5 posters today. 5. just 1 of those squeeze through and result is different.

That and the crows nailing every single set shot.

A game of inches.

 

[jackcass]

He fell away badly in the second half ehen the heat went up.
Tends to play well when we are in control and allowed freedom to roam, then goes missing or panicks when the heat is applied.

Rubbish, Langdon performed well across all 4 quarters. Not sure what more you could expect from a HBFer than 21 possessions, 11 intercept possessions, 5 marks, 3 inside 50's, 95% DE%. If you want to look at where things went wrong in the 2nd half look at forward 50 entry and team defence, particularly coming out of our forward line. We just started losing those 50/50 contests we were winning before 1/2 time. We kept kicking points and giving them back control of the footy.

 

[swiftdog]

I think Adelaide changed the way they played at the long break also. I think they over-possessed in the first half and always tried to find an option. In the second half it seemed to me that they were happy to be a little more cavalier in their approach and just get the ball forward as quickly as possible, trusting their players to win a contest (or to beat the first layer of the zone completely) rather than trying to pinpoint passes.

The draw sucks but the side went face-to-face with the biggest dog in the yard and ran them to within an inch. Plenty of positives to take away from the game.

 

[Gone Critical]

Gotta say the criticism of Blair and particularly Langdon is OTT

Langdons kick at the end was exactly what he should of done. Great play, gets the free, holds on and waits for the umpire to call him to play, kicks a good kick 50+m down to HBF. Anyone quibbling over it being 10 m to far from the boundary is way overanalysing things. Only problem was no Pie flew and thats nothing to do with Langdon. There were no short options on. It was clearly the % play properly executed.

 

[jackcass]

Langdon had to be smarter. He should have waited until the umpire called play-on and then bounced the ball. That would have given the Crows a point and then we could have wasted the last ten seconds with a kick-in.

Or it would have given them a free kick and shot on goal for insufficient intent.

 

[DaVe86]

Frustrating result, but I think in the scheme of things it's probably not a bad result. Realistically, that snuffs out any chance of making finals. You need 12 games to make finals, maybe more...and that's impossible now.

I think we were duty bound to fight it out while we were still a hope. I think now we can finally put the focus back onto development in the final 4 rounds. Surely Pendles and Varcoe are put in cotton wool for the rest of the season, and anyone suffering any niggles are treated sooner rather than later.

If you look at our season, we have drawn to Adelaide, beaten Geelong, beaten Sydney, got within a kick of GWS, beaten West Coast, and challenged both Melbourne and Richmond.

So our form against top 8 sides stacks up.

Ultimately, I thought we continued to play pretty well in the second half yesterday, but the difference was that they were able to open us up from the counter and they were just so efficient. They couldn't miss.

I thought we still were on top in general play, around stoppages, and we still kept moving the ball fairly well. But it got to the point where whenever we missed or turned the ball over, it was a guaranteed goal. In the first half, we tied them down completely.

Hard to lay blame on coaching. I thought the strategy going in was perfect. We tagged Sloane, we shut down their half back line, and we weren't pressing too high up. After half time, that all changed. But we hung on for a draw which wasn't a bad effort considering the tidal wave going against us.

Hard to blame Langdon either. I thought he could've kicked the ball more to the boundary line, but ultimately it shouldn't have mattered.