What They're Saying - The Bulldogs Media Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

TedDougChris

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Posts
19,166
Likes
21,613
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Charlton Athletic, Roys FFC
I thought the points made by King and Derm, on their own, were valid.

We don't score enough currently to win a flag.

However, like you pointed out, as Jonno said, we are generating enough inside 50s to kick a high score. We're just butchering it going forward and missing set shots. This is what's different to the Freo sides who played a defensively minded game and didn't generate large amounts of inside 50s. Also, I can't agree with the argument that we add an extra player at stoppages. I can't back this up but surely if we did this the opposition is just conceding the game as they wont win the footy! So a bit short sited, particularly from Derm.

Also we butcher the ball a lot going forward under minimal pressure. However a lot of that might be fatigue. I don't know how many times this year I've heard from commentators and opposition supporters when we played their team that the game was suffocating and high pressured. Robbo said this week our game against the Eagles had no room to breathe. When we played the pies I heard from their supporters they haven't seen such a high pressured game in a while - and that was with us having an off day. All our games are high pressured - and most of the time we're seeing the oppositions best effort in terms of intensity (save for freo round 1. Saints sucked but brought the intensity against us).

We're doing alright and once (if) we start converting our inside 50s and set shots we will be an all mighty force
I don't have the data to back any of this up, but my thoughts on the scoring subject are as follows:

1) We are a young side, still learning how to play for 25 - 26 weeks at 100% of capability. And with Redpath back, we have a better structure now in the forward line.
2) As the season progresses, sides adapt and learn to counter anyone who makes a fast start - so that the scoring (across the board, not just us) dries up as the year progresses.
3) Injuries have robbed us of many of our better ball users and speedy players - guys that can run 20 - 30 and kick for 50 - which has made our scoring output drop.
4) Consequently, this has pushed players who aren't as good into these roles and this has decreased our forward efficiency - similar I50's, but less value from them.
5) Out set shot goal scoring is a bit shit.....
6) We are still yet to have a free hit at a scoring boost from either Essendon or GC to artificially increase our average...

If we can get players back (ie Suckling, JJ etc) and approach close to full fitness - our scoring should increase. If we could fix our goal kicking, it would improve even further.

I have us at 91 ppg at present, eliminate the lol Norf game and we are at 95 ppg. That's getting closer to the media's 'premiership standard'.

As for the extra player at stoppages, On the Couch highlighted our extra numbers at the stoppage for a few instances on Monday. In our bad games, I think sides are letting us win the contest, then immediately pressuring the ball carrier and receivers - denying us time to move it quickly and accurately - look at the lol Norf game for the very high level of turnovers during this match. Our quick ball movement via hands is great, provided we have even numbers outside the contest. This quick ball movement is not always precise, so an extra man on the outside might be able to intercept the wayward quick movement and counter. We need to learn to counter this, which I'm sure Bevo and co are looking into....
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

gangsta deluxe

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Posts
7,488
Likes
7,907
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Rajasthan Royals!!!
Apparently because we tend to play an extra at the stoppage, we should expect to have such an advantage. Kingy shut him down though and said that 1 extra still doesn't equate to those kinds of numbers.
Loved the camera angle on that moment. Kingy looking at him while he was spouting shit... No respect there.
 

Dogs_R_Us

Space Traveller
Joined
May 3, 2001
Posts
10,587
Likes
10,045
Location
Sirius - the Dogstar
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Yeah but the whispers were that wood went to hawthorn and Bev wasn't happy
Theory: our docs are pally with the Hawthorn medics (and probably other club docs) and SENT Woody to see them, or call them. Highly doubt Woody would just go off his own bat. Maybe Bev was the last to find out.
 

MJ_Dogs

Club Legend
Joined
Oct 29, 2013
Posts
2,163
Likes
2,938
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Spurs, Man U, Leafs, Patriots, Cubs
I don't have the data to back any of this up, but my thoughts on the scoring subject are as follows:

1) We are a young side, still learning how to play for 25 - 26 weeks at 100% of capability. And with Redpath back, we have a better structure now in the forward line.
2) As the season progresses, sides adapt and learn to counter anyone who makes a fast start - so that the scoring (across the board, not just us) dries up as the year progresses.
3) Injuries have robbed us of many of our better ball users and speedy players - guys that can run 20 - 30 and kick for 50 - which has made our scoring output drop.
4) Consequently, this has pushed players who aren't as good into these roles and this has decreased our forward efficiency - similar I50's, but less value from them.
5) Out set shot goal scoring is a bit shit.....
6) We are still yet to have a free hit at a scoring boost from either Essendon or GC to artificially increase our average...

If we can get players back (ie Suckling, JJ etc) and approach close to full fitness - our scoring should increase. If we could fix our goal kicking, it would improve even further.

I have us at 91 ppg at present, eliminate the lol Norf game and we are at 95 ppg. That's getting closer to the media's 'premiership standard'.

As for the extra player at stoppages, On the Couch highlighted our extra numbers at the stoppage for a few instances on Monday. In our bad games, I think sides are letting us win the contest, then immediately pressuring the ball carrier and receivers - denying us time to move it quickly and accurately - look at the lol Norf game for the very high level of turnovers during this match. Our quick ball movement via hands is great, provided we have even numbers outside the contest. This quick ball movement is not always precise, so an extra man on the outside might be able to intercept the wayward quick movement and counter. We need to learn to counter this, which I'm sure Bevo and co are looking into....
love the explanation re stoppages. That game against north I was watching thinking we were getting smashed in the clearances only to look at the stats and see us winning it clearly. It was because as soon as we won the ball we turned it over. What's the answer to this setup from north? Coach? :)
 

TedDougChris

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Posts
19,166
Likes
21,613
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Charlton Athletic, Roys FFC
love the explanation re stoppages. That game against north I was watching thinking we were getting smashed in the clearances only to look at the stats and see us winning it clearly. It was because as soon as we won the ball we turned it over. What's the answer to this setup from north? Coach? :)
I'd have to watch those games again (which for obvious reasons I'm reluctant to do) - but potentially you would almost like players such as Wallis, Libba and Bont to briefly pause - then see what happens. If we have numbers around the contest, we should be able to shepherd and create a slight gap in play. So if that happens, does this draw the extra opposition player to the ball carrier - who then has a 50 - 50 contest to give the next disposal to. That nullifies the oppositions numerical advantage outside the stoppage. The other option is to somehow find a short kick option - which then creates a marking situation rather than a stoppage.

it will be interesting to see if, for example, lol Norf's gameplan against us works in the finals - or does the extra intensity and pressure draw them to the contest and they lose their structure....
 

MJ_Dogs

Club Legend
Joined
Oct 29, 2013
Posts
2,163
Likes
2,938
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Spurs, Man U, Leafs, Patriots, Cubs
I'd have to watch those games again (which for obvious reasons I'm reluctant to do) - but potentially you would almost like players such as Wallis, Libba and Bont to briefly pause - then see what happens. If we have numbers around the contest, we should be able to shepherd and create a slight gap in play. So if that happens, does this draw the extra opposition player to the ball carrier - who then has a 50 - 50 contest to give the next disposal to. That nullifies the oppositions numerical advantage outside the stoppage. The other option is to somehow find a short kick option - which then creates a marking situation rather than a stoppage.

it will be interesting to see if, for example, lol Norf's gameplan against us works in the finals - or does the extra intensity and pressure draw them to the contest and they lose their structure....
Agreed. Shepparding would help break down the tactic, which hopefully we normally try to do anyway.

And I guess this is where stringer in the midfield can break the game open if he is able to break through contests. If he can break the initial tackle and draw a second tackler it will open up the stoppages. Of course we can't rely on this but even having him around the contest will make the opposition think twice about the tactic.
 

TedDougChris

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Posts
19,166
Likes
21,613
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Charlton Athletic, Roys FFC
Agreed. Shepparding would help break down the tactic, which hopefully we normally try to do anyway.

And I guess this is where stringer in the midfield can break the game open if he is able to break through contests. If he can break the initial tackle and draw a second tackler it will open up the stoppages. Of course we can't rely on this but even having him around the contest will make the opposition think twice about the tactic.
It's all about balance. We are getting good at moving the ball quickly by hand, but that won't always work. So we'll have to develop new weapons. Stringer is clearly one. I think Daniel is another - he has a very good range of kicks and is quite efficient with the ball. Perhaps we also need to use a variant of another tactic, which is that when we win the ball, some of the players outside the contest congregate at a point, which is where we direct the next handball to - allowing us to outnumber the opposition at that point as well. We cannot be too predictable in the point at which we congregate to obviously....
 

LittleG

Premiership Player
Joined
Nov 18, 2015
Posts
4,248
Likes
4,548
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Agreed. Shepparding would help break down the tactic, which hopefully we normally try to do anyway.

And I guess this is where stringer in the midfield can break the game open if he is able to break through contests. If he can break the initial tackle and draw a second tackler it will open up the stoppages. Of course we can't rely on this but even having him around the contest will make the opposition think twice about the tactic.
How about varying the handball to a quick high kick forward. Play a tall 20-30 up the line and instruct them to punch the ball forward/backward/sideways per instructions from team on ballers.
This forces the defense to cover the tall downfield and takes the player away from the outside of the contest, as the ball is not going outside this contest but outside the next one.
 

gangsta deluxe

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Nov 14, 2005
Posts
7,488
Likes
7,907
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Rajasthan Royals!!!
The differential will change dramatically as the season progresses and the top group play each other more. Clearly a result of the lower teams getting pasted.


10 teams in positive. Bottom four negative teams have a huge differential.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

threenewpadlocks

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 10, 2012
Posts
10,623
Likes
13,258
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Part of the reason that we're conceding less scores - winning contested possession at the rate that we do means that the opposition actually has less time with the ball in their hands.

We might be 1st for points against, but we're also 1st for conceding the least Inside 50's. I'm too lazy to calculate goals per inside 50 defensively but my guess is that we're not in the top few for that either.
 

giblj

Club Legend
Joined
Nov 15, 2014
Posts
1,999
Likes
4,640
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Through sheer morbid curiosity I always seem to end up reading what our good friend Damo Barrett has to say about us in sliding doors and this week it's "Stringer used to be our favourite Bulldogs player but he's not flavour of the month any more and Bont is so now Bont is our favourite". Again. I swear he rotates between that and "Hey remember how Tom Boyd is on a lot of money?" when he can't think of something. Quite amusing, really. Maybe.
 

yebiga

Anglo Guilt - suck it up
Joined
Aug 1, 2008
Posts
10,468
Likes
10,874
Location
Mens Gallery
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I'm not convinced with this extra number inside being touted by King and friends. It no doubt occurs from time to time but the differential is I believe more a factor of how deep we bat with quality in and under contested ball players.

I noticed that early in each quarter, when wedtcoast had their A team at the contest they would lead or break even in contested ball. However, as the quarter progressed and the A team was rotated with the B team our depth would begin to dominate.

This was more and more apparent as the game progressed. After they got that late flurry of lucky goals we sent in a fresh liber and a fresh macrae and turned their momentum around.

This depth: bont liber Wallis Dalhaus hunter macrae McLean & Picken with a pinch hit from stringer runs deeper than any other team this year. Try picking your top 3 as the A team is near impossible - for most teams it's very obvious.
 

House_of_Dahl

Premiership Player
Joined
Oct 12, 2012
Posts
4,469
Likes
5,777
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I'm not convinced with this extra number inside being touted by King and friends. It no doubt occurs from time to time but the differential is I believe more a factor of how deep we bat with quality in and under contested ball players.

I noticed that early in each quarter, when wedtcoast had their A team at the contest they would lead or break even in contested ball. However, as the quarter progressed and the A team was rotated with the B team our depth would begin to dominate.

This was more and more apparent as the game progressed. After they got that late flurry of lucky goals we sent in a fresh liber and a fresh macrae and turned their momentum around.

This depth: bont liber Wallis Dalhaus hunter macrae McLean & Picken with a pinch hit from stringer runs deeper than any other team this year. Try picking your top 3 as the A team is near impossible - for most teams it's very obvious.
Fair points. Does also look like we have an extra inside at times, which correlates to them having an extra in defence, which is potentially one reason we get a lot of inside 50s but then have a hard time scoring from it. Still even if true I'd still rather have the ball to start with than to have an extra back trying to stop it.
 

DexterTan

Club Legend
Joined
May 11, 2007
Posts
2,355
Likes
2,315
Location
Springfield, USA
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Gold Coast Suns, Charlotte Bobcats
Rohan Connolly is an absolute muppet. Ever since his cry for Essendope, I've ignored him completely
I disagree with you completely. He was great assistance to me for a feature article for the Journalism unit of my Masters. He left out doggiies players a personal attack is the comeback. Unbelievable.
 
Last edited:

DexterTan

Club Legend
Joined
May 11, 2007
Posts
2,355
Likes
2,315
Location
Springfield, USA
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Gold Coast Suns, Charlotte Bobcats
I think Derm called himself "The Objectionist" at one stage.

He just deliberately took the opposing side to the argument and was even more of a flog than normal.

So they should...like winning contested footy just happens with the click of the fingers.

Moron.
Isn't that from The West Wing? Get the "smart" person to take the opposition's view? Then again, Dermie ain't no Sam Seaborne ☺
 

King Harold

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Apr 23, 2013
Posts
5,224
Likes
6,628
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Cleveland Indians
“Havent won a flag for 54 years” - Dennis Cometti when the final siren went after we defeat West Coast.

To be fair I think he was more so alluding to the fact that we are a real challenger right now and how huge that is for us.
We may have if we full of uncle Dougs all those years like team we played.
 

bobby2

Club Legend
Joined
Jun 19, 2015
Posts
2,158
Likes
4,326
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Through sheer morbid curiosity I always seem to end up reading what our good friend Damo Barrett has to say about us in sliding doors and this week it's "Stringer used to be our favourite Bulldogs player but he's not flavour of the month any more and Bont is so now Bont is our favourite". Again. I swear he rotates between that and "Hey remember how Tom Boyd is on a lot of money?" when he can't think of something. Quite amusing, really. Maybe.
You swear that for a very good reason.

Round 10: "If Stringer was our favourite to watch at this club... Then Bontempelli is closing. Hard."
Round 11: Something something Tom Boyd.
Round 12: "If Stringer has been our favourite Dog for the past season-and-a-half... Then the Bont is closing hard. Like Chautauqua in this year's Lightning Stakes."

Edit: Also, six of the twelve rounds talk about Stringer. Three of the remaining six talk about injuries. How does this guy get so creative?
 
Last edited:

Norm De Guerre

Left of the dial.
Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Posts
7,273
Likes
19,625
Location
Sharpening Occums Razor
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Australian Farnarkling XI
So, I get in the car and flick the radio over to SEN and hear Peter Gordon talking like the über fan that he is and all is going well. Questions are then thrown over to the rest of the panel and of course Robbo falls all over himself to be first and launches into a long winded, almost entirely complimentary statement about where he thinks we are at, only to finish (and you could literally sense it coming) with, but...

Would anybody that didn't happen to hear it care to take a stab at what that 'but' might be?

A lollipop to the correct first answer.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom