List Mgmt. What to do with McCartin?

Coconut_twirl

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DeGoey or Brayshaw should have been no.1 not Petracca.
That said in 20/20 hindsight as I wanted Petracca ahead of McCartin however, he has been underwhelming to say the least.

If we had of taken Petracca, Richo would have been blamed for not developing him.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but nobody had DeGoey as the number 1. The top two seemed pretty clear cut on draft night, it was the order that surprised the footy world. That is how I recalled things back in 2014.
 

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Coconut_twirl

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Yes but its much harder to find good marking forwards than it is defenders. Its the old bowlers win you games, batsmen lose them scenario. Also Marsh is a ready made replacement.
Battle may return to the forward line, but how does he fit in with Membrey, Bruce and hopefully King? And that's not counting Paddy. Saints forwards isn't the problem, it's the deliveries going inside 50m. Even Lockett wouldn't be marking helicopter kicks going over his head.

Marsh is a beauty and I would like to see him in the seniors very soon. It's going to be difficult to see Logan Austin fitting into the best 22. Even more so if Brown plays in 2020.
 

gringo2011

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Yes but its much harder to find good marking forwards than it is defenders. Its the old bowlers win you games, batsmen lose them scenario. Also Marsh is a ready made replacement.

I was talking to some Collingwood mates who rate Marsh, they said he's more a third tall but probably plays a bit more of a mobile game than a KPB. They think he could play mid so perhaps a utility type. They made him sound like a Marley Williams more than Josh Battles replacement any way.
 

Joffaboy

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You don’t need to be mechanical expert to know your cars stuffed when there’s smoke & fire coming from the bonnet nor do you need to be an expert in the medical field to know 8 concussions in 40 games isn’t good for the long term health of a 22 year old. It’s common sense.

IMO Paddy will not play AFL at the top level again & his retirement will come in about 12 months. It took Picken 12-18 months to formally retire.

Paddy’s contract runs until the end of next year so he’s in no rush to publicly retire & I’m sure it won’t come easily conceding that he won’t ever again play the game he loves.
I think we are all in agreement that it is unlikely he will make it.

He needs to overcome the concussions, then get fit, then get a block of games together then prove his worth in the seniors.

The issue is a definitive statement made about someone's condition without a skerrick of information.

And the analogy between a motor vehicle and the physiology of the human body is so laughably poor, it does not require a reply.
 

Joffaboy

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Please correct me if I'm wrong, but nobody had DeGoey as the number 1. The top two seemed pretty clear cut on draft night, it was the order that surprised the footy world. That is how I recalled things back in 2014.
Correct. That's why my 20/20 hindsight worked a treat.

It was Paddy and Petracca
 

gringo2011

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To me the kid has had a shit run of luck regardless of where he was taken. This is probably the most trying time of his life. The point that he comes to the realisation that the dream might be over. I'd rather people stopped speculating about him and gave him some space and clear air to deal with all the shit he's going through. As he said it's his family and friends that are all wearing it with him and it's probably pretty traumatic for them all. What ever happens he deserves a bit of luck to off set the crap he's had to deal with.
 

VDS66

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To me the kid has had a shit run of luck regardless of where he was taken. This is probably the most trying time of his life. The point that he comes to the realisation that the dream might be over. I'd rather people stopped speculating about him and gave him some space and clear air to deal with all the shit he's going through. As he said it's his family and friends that are all wearing it with him and it's probably pretty traumatic for them all. What ever happens he deserves a bit of luck to off set the crap he's had to deal with.
Sensible post.

It would be an absolute shit tine for him.

It's out of his control which would make it even more frustrating.
 

lewdogs

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To be fair he was tracking very well up forward also. And most likely trained as a backman with the idea that McCartin was going to play forward and Carlisle was going to miss most of the year. We could really use Battle up forward right now. Rhys Stanley would be even better - would make a great ruck/forward combo with Marshall.
He was tracking ok as a forward but last week was his best game for the club. We also have King waiting in the wings. Great intercepting backs aren't that easy to find, look how important Rance has been for Richmond. Just think the club deserves credit when they get something right and in this case they have.
 
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Im a paddy fan, but the reality is footy is just a game and will be over in the blink of an eye. I just wince every time he flies for a mark. I hope he puts the cue in the rack for his own benefit.
this

it's so rare that the your first love gets to be your career, more often people have to learn to let one idea go to make room for the next, it's a hard lesson but I hope he learns it before he does irreversible damage :s if he hasn't already
 

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Ricmel

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Petracca is a gop though, does not excite me at all, puffs his chest and runs around a bit there was always going to be a smokey or random assortment of players that simply went past him, it was just a matter of when and how many.
I know it has nothing to do with Paddy - but they will always be linked. What is going on with Petracca? If we had taken him number 1 and he was playing for us like he is currently playing for Dees, the place would be up in arms. He looks worse with every season!
 

plugger66

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I know it has nothing to do with Paddy - but they will always be linked. What is going on with Petracca? If we had taken him number 1 and he was playing for us like he is currently playing for Dees, the place would be up in arms. He looks worse with every season!
you missed last night? Good not great but vital to their win. Still think there is so much improvement in him but he will never be the best player from that draft
 

triggering bro

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I know it has nothing to do with Paddy - but they will always be linked. What is going on with Petracca? If we had taken him number 1 and he was playing for us like he is currently playing for Dees, the place would be up in arms. He looks worse with every season!
Petracca has been extremely disappointing for a top 2 pick. For someone who is talked about as being versatile he appears so limited as a player. He doesn’t have the fitness nor the footy smarts to play much midfield time. He’s a leading forward who can’t jump. He will do the odd freakish thing but he doesn’t look like being a dependable 30 possession midfielder or a 50 goal small-medium forward. It was difficult not to compare him with Heeney in last nights game. Heeney looks everything Petracca is not; Tough, smart, agile, athletic & capable of slotting just about anywhere on the ground. He’s a star.
 

mad-saint-guy

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Battle may return to the forward line, but how does he fit in with Membrey, Bruce and hopefully King?
Realistically King is at least 2 year away from being ready to play seniors regularly. More likely 3 years, and that's assuming he develops as we're hoping and doesn't have any more major injuries, which happens a lot with young key forwards. By that point Bruce is 30 and may not have the same athletic ability he has now, so King replaces him.

The first choice forward line I'd like to see right now is:

HF: Parker, Bruce, Gresham
F: Long, Battle, Membrey

Rotating through: Billings, Steven, Acres, Sinclair, Marshall


Joyce, Austin and Marsh are absolutely capable of producing similar results to Battle in defence but we don't have anyone in reserve who can do what he can up forward.
 

mad-saint-guy

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Petracca has been extremely disappointing for a top 2 pick. For someone who is talked about as being versatile he appears so limited as a player. He doesn’t have the fitness nor the footy smarts to play much midfield time. He’s a leading forward who can’t jump. He will do the odd freakish thing but he doesn’t look like being a dependable 30 possession midfielder or a 50 goal small-medium forward. It was difficult not to compare him with Heeney in last nights game. Heeney looks everything Petracca is not; Tough, smart, agile, athletic & capable of slotting just about anywhere on the ground. He’s a star.
To be fair, there is absolutely no question that he would be in our starting 18. Even though he has had a fairly poor start to the year by his standards, he is still averaging 16 disposals and 1 goal per game while leading the league for tackles inside 50 and is 7th for goal assists. He's doing a lot more than the guy picked before him.
 

gringo2011

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The fact is that we ended up with a lot of bad luck. Most top 5 picks generally at least make a best 22 player even if they don't become stars. Injury is the most likely reason to be a bust. Petracca is better just by the fact he can get on the park and is probably a middling player so far. Still has time to get better but hard to see him being a star.
 

triggering bro

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To be fair, there is absolutely no question that he would be in our starting 18. Even though he has had a fairly poor start to the year by his standards, he is still averaging 16 disposals and 1 goal per game while leading the league for tackles inside 50 and is 7th for goal assists. He's doing a lot more than the guy picked before him.
I don’t doubt that Petracca would be in our best 22. He’s not a star & is not a bottom 6 player IMO. He sits around the 10-16 best player on Melbourne’s list. And he shouldn’t be anywhere near top 50 in the league.

The Petracca vs Paddy argument has been done to death. We all know which player we should’ve taken, at the time, & in hindsight. It’s a no-brainer. But the longer Petracca’s career goes on for the lesser the damage of not picking him. He’s an average player & nothing more IMO. He’s the type you expect to pick up with a pick in the middle rounds not at the pointy end of the draft.
 
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I'm happy for him to walk away if he feels he needs to, but I'm not pushing him out the door as he's still a brilliant forward, he's just not there to do it consistently.

Petracca is a gop though, does not excite me at all, puffs his chest and runs around a bit there was always going to be a smokey or random assortment of players that simply went past him, it was just a matter of when and how many.
Is he though? Is he really a brilliant forward? So far in his career at his absolute best he's been serviceable and he hasn't been at his best for most games.
 

StCicatriz

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Petracca has been extremely disappointing for a top 2 pick. For someone who is talked about as being versatile he appears so limited as a player. He doesn’t have the fitness nor the footy smarts to play much midfield time. He’s a leading forward who can’t jump. He will do the odd freakish thing but he doesn’t look like being a dependable 30 possession midfielder or a 50 goal small-medium forward. It was difficult not to compare him with Heeney in last nights game. Heeney looks everything Petracca is not; Tough, smart, agile, athletic & capable of slotting just about anywhere on the ground. He’s a star.
its interesting reading back on peoples views during that year:
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/2014-draft-prospects.1067101
 
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Is he though? Is he really a brilliant forward? So far in his career at his absolute best he's been serviceable and he hasn't been at his best for most games.
Maybe to a fault but I still hold out hope. I think his age combined with his inexperience and lack of consecutive games in a row means I can't yet write him off as a player.

I look at blokes like Lonie and Ross who just seemed to turn the corner after hitting the 40+ game mark. Especially considering Paddy is a key forward.

My biggest reservation is his ability to stay on the field physically for obvious reasons. But I'm not yet ready to write him off as a player due to ability.

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