What unpopular AFL opinions do you have? - Part 2

Heaps of fun

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 13, 2013
17,465
37,651
AFL Club
North Melbourne
Cam McCarthy is a good player, but is forced to play out of position due to continuous injuries to key forwards as well as lack of key forwards over the past 3 years.

Not unpopular amongst Fremantle fans but most non-fans look at him and go "Hurr hurr porn state pedo, lazy and fat amirite hurt durr:joycat::joycat:"
Isn't he pretty frequently dropped from the side though?
 

Righteo

Purple Campaigner
Apr 7, 2010
30,854
35,994
AFL Club
Fremantle
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Celtics - The Brew Crew
Cam McCarthy is a good player, but is forced to play out of position due to continuous injuries to key forwards as well as lack of key forwards over the past 3 years.

Not unpopular amongst Fremantle fans but most non-fans look at him and go "Hurr hurr porn state pedo, lazy and fat amirite hurt durr:joycat::joycat:"
Yes it is, and he is fat and lazy.
 

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adammania9

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 18, 2013
10,003
20,540
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Collingwood
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University
Its a popular opinion on this site that Richmond and West Coast are the two best teams in the comp.

I can see the arguments for Richmond but for West Coast I cannot argue the same.
Happy for people to carry that opinion into 2020 with the addition to Kelly (although I‘m still not as convinced as others) but West Coast were definitely not the second best side of 2019 like people seemed to think all season. Colloquially “unlucky to miss top four”, West Coast’s record against top four teams was terrible and the only truly comprehensive four quarter efforts put together in the back half of the season leading toward finals were against Fremantle, North Melbourne at home and an out of form Bulldogs at home. The bulk majority seemed to absolutely love their round 22 effort against Richmond at the MCG which in my opinion was the complete opposite of a side that deserved to be considered one of the best in the league, they should have won that.

Most likely overrated based on their never say die attitude displayed in 2018, West Coast were a long way off the mark in 2019 and their subsequent top four miss and semi final exit was exactly the result that the level they displayed deserved.
 

Cuzz09

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 21, 2004
22,183
8,450
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Norwood & Liverpool.
Happy for people to carry that opinion into 2020 with the addition to Kelly (although I‘m still not as convinced as others) but West Coast were definitely not the second best side of 2019 like people seemed to think all season. Colloquially “unlucky to miss top four”, West Coast’s record against top four teams was terrible and the only truly comprehensive four quarter efforts put together in the back half of the season leading toward finals were against Fremantle, North Melbourne at home and an out of form Bulldogs at home. The bulk majority seemed to absolutely love their round 22 effort against Richmond at the MCG which in my opinion was the complete opposite of a side that deserved to be considered one of the best in the league, they should have won that.

Most likely overrated based on their never say die attitude displayed in 2018, West Coast were a long way off the mark in 2019 and their subsequent top four miss and semi final exit was exactly the result that the level they displayed deserved.
Pretty much correct. We fumbled and farted through games. Hardly played 4 qtrs.

To be honest though I dont think there was a standout best team in 2019.

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RichLeMonde

Debutant
Sep 26, 2019
129
160
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And why is that? Because women’s football development was neglected for over a hundred years. AFLW will change that.
AFLW in and of itself won’t change that. It won’t change until playing junior footy is as typical for girls as it is for boys (obviously having a pro league makes that lite likely). There will be an absolutely tiny talent pool for AFLW to draw upon for at least 100 years
 

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RichLeMonde

Debutant
Sep 26, 2019
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The AFL needs more rule changes not less. To return to more one on one contests - in the air and on the ground - footy should introduce netball-like positional restrictions. There should be 3 deep fwds/backs who can’t leave their 50, 3 HFs/HBs who can leave their 50 but can’t enter the other 50, and 6 mids who can go anywhere. That way there would never be more than 12 players from each team in either 50 and in the middle of the ground. 3-3-3 rule on steroids 💪
 

RichLeMonde

Debutant
Sep 26, 2019
129
160
AFL Club
Richmond
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Celtics
The AFL needs more rule changes not less. To return to more one on one contests - in the air and on the ground - footy should introduce netball-like positional restrictions. There should be 3 deep fwds/backs who can’t leave their 50, 3 HFs/HBs who can leave their 50 but can’t enter the other 50, and 6 mids who can go anywhere. That way there would never be more than 12 players from each team in either 50 and in the middle of the ground. 3-3-3 rule on steroids 💪
Obviously to enforce the positional restrictions the players would wear collars around their necks and their heads would explode if they left their zone, like in the excellent 1980s documentaries ‘The Running Man’ and ‘Wedlock’
 

jatz14

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 13, 2011
6,049
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AFLW in and of itself won’t change that. It won’t change until playing junior footy is as typical for girls as it is for boys (obviously having a pro league makes that lite likely). There will be an absolutely tiny talent pool for AFLW to draw upon for at least 100 years
You haven't been paying attention then. Vic has been through a period where female playing numbers doubled every couple of years. It's not increasing exponentially like that now of course, otherwise we would have arrived at a point where statistically, everybody on the planet would have been a footy playing Vic women.

However it is still increasing quickly.

The issue now is improving the standards of junior girls comps. The numbers as they are, are enough to drive improvement in the AFLW for years if they get the junior comps right, and numbers will not remain as they are.

Remember, the explosion in junior teams, and the development pathways started over the last 4 or 5 years, so the girls that entered the beginning of that pathway are still only 12-14.

What we have now in the AFLW are the girls that bucked the trend, and played junior footy at a time it wasn't the thing to do, and girls that started later in life.

So it isn't going to take 100 years, I doubt it takes 10.

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RichLeMonde

Debutant
Sep 26, 2019
129
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You haven't been paying attention then. Vic has been through a period where female playing numbers doubled every couple of years. It's not increasing exponentially like that now of course, otherwise we would have arrived at a point where statistically, everybody on the planet would have been a footy playing Vic women.

However it is still increasing quickly.

The issue now is improving the standards of junior girls comps. The numbers as they are, are enough to drive improvement in the AFLW for years if they get the junior comps right, and numbers will not remain as they are.

Remember, the explosion in junior teams, and the development pathways started over the last 4 or 5 years, so the girls that entered the beginning of that pathway are still only 12-14.

What we have now in the AFLW are the girls that bucked the trend, and played junior footy at a time it wasn't the thing to do, and girls that started later in life.

So it isn't going to take 100 years, I doubt it takes 10.

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Depends on what we're measuring. From my quick search, it looks like currently girls make up about 27% of all junior participants, which might sound like a lot, but I think that figure is counted per head, so girls who try it for one year are counted the same as girls (or boys) who play for 6 years. I'd be keen to know what percentage girls make up of the sum of all juniors who play footy for, say, 6 years continuously. I'm guessing it's a much, much lower percentage. The talent pool will remain small until there is a large group of girls playing continuously in a fairly dedicated fashion from the ages of around 10-17, and I don't think that will happen in 10 years, or 50 years.
 

jatz14

Norm Smith Medallist
Dec 13, 2011
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Depends on what we're measuring. From my quick search, it looks like currently girls make up about 27% of all junior participants, which might sound like a lot, but I think that figure is counted per head, so girls who try it for one year are counted the same as girls (or boys) who play for 6 years. I'd be keen to know what percentage girls make up of the sum of all juniors who play footy for, say, 6 years continuously. I'm guessing it's a much, much lower percentage. The talent pool will remain small until there is a large group of girls playing continuously in a fairly dedicated fashion from the ages of around 10-17, and I don't think that will happen in 10 years, or 50 years.
2 issues.

If the 27% of junior participants who are girls includes a lot of girls that try it once, then girl numbers will collapse soon. You could argue they should have already collapsed.

Any region is going to run out of girls willing to give footy a go, if it turns them over that quick.

Secondly, it doesn't actually matter (for the AFLW). Logic says, those girls that stick with it will be those that are into it, and are good at it. Those that would walk away after 1 season were never making an impact anyway.

Plenty of fairly niche sports produce top end talent his way, it's the really good ones that stick with it.


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Kapow!!!

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 29, 2003
8,424
2,716
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Fremantle
r/iamverysmart. What team you support is irrelevant, the fact of the matter is you do try and bait and troll Fremantle supporters often and it's blatantly obvious. And you pushing people down, calling then stupid likely to inflate your own ego just makes you look like a little twat.
Then stop f***ing responding to him. Inane, obtuse and delibrately antagonistic trolls like him require attention to thrive. It's pretty bloody obvious to everyone what his intentions are, so don't reply and this thread will correct itself from its derails.
 

RichLeMonde

Debutant
Sep 26, 2019
129
160
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Richmond
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Celtics
2 issues.

If the 27% of junior participants who are girls includes a lot of girls that try it once, then girl numbers will collapse soon. You could argue they should have already collapsed.

Any region is going to run out of girls willing to give footy a go, if it turns them over that quick.

Secondly, it doesn't actually matter (for the AFLW). Logic says, those girls that stick with it will be those that are into it, and are good at it. Those that would walk away after 1 season were never making an impact anyway.

Plenty of fairly niche sports produce top end talent his way, it's the really good ones that stick with it.


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Issue 1: I get what you’re saying but it could take a lot more than a couple of years to reach that drop off. For eg we could, over a couple of decades, reach a point where every schoolgirl in Australia played footy for at least one year, but if 95% of them play for only one year, then we would have growing participation numbers for many years without much growth in quality.

Issue 2: could not disagree more. Those with talent only develop it fully by competing at a high standard, which requires a density of good juniors, 99% of whom will never make it to the pros. The single biggest factor in the progression of a sport to an elite standard is the size of the available talent pool. A good example is women’s mixed martial arts. Far fewer women than men participate, which means there’s very little elite talent at the top end. Ronda Rousey was a pioneer for women’s mma and went on a great winning steak, leading some people to call her a ‘once in a 100 year athlete’. It turned out they were wrong, and her record occurred only because she was crushing cans. Once the level of completion increased, as more women around the globe participated in the sport, she was shown up to be very one dimensional and somewhat mediocre. The same will happen if you have a few good junior girls footy players dominating their weak opposition. AFL already has the problem of drawing 99% of its players from one country - for AFLW, I stick to my original point: unless it’s as widely and dedicatedly played by junior girls as junior boys, then the standards will struggle. The part which is more crystal-ball gazing is whether or not that will happen. I don’t believe it will, as I think a process of cultural change to occur where little girls become socialised just as strongly as little boys are to want to play footy, to enjoy tackling and being tackled, etc, is an enormous cultural shift that could not happen, to that scale, in less than several generations. I’m not sure why any of that makes you feel you should smugly chide me for ‘not paying attention’.
 

Minka Beaver

Club Legend
Feb 5, 2004
1,061
1,655
AFL Club
Melbourne
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Everton
You nailed my point.

"Enjoy the game". That's what it should be about, I find everything else that is attached to the league actually brings it down. You can't even enjoy a goal without some junk product advertised around the goal posts or flashing around the ground trying to get the kids attention. I understand it's a balance between being a (non for profit) business and a sporting leauge, I just find it could engage with with people who follow footy (and will continue to no matter what) in a better way.
You've inadvertently reminded me of something - the AFL should be stripped of its not-for-profit status.

They currently act like a corporate entity, but without having any of the responsibilities (such as paying the corporate tax rate).
 

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