What's a realistic expectation for Collingwood in 2017?

[dean33]

The improvement will come from a clear run with injury in defence and small forward departments especially, combined with plenty of natural improvement yet to come from Grundy aish Adams and even treloar who is still nowhere near career best form. Wells should be the icing on the cake and make our midfield one of the best in the competition.

Questions remain over the new Kpps we have brought in and they will have to prove themselves. Some are longer term projects. That said the players we lost are all limited in some way so at worst we have not lost much. Keeffe needs to make an immediate impact, Reid needs to stay fit, and Moore needs to continue his upward progress, with assistance from Mayne and white.

midfield one of the best in the comp? cmon timmy...

 

[Bokonon_]

I've seen very little of him, he did carve us up one time though, and he's carved up other teams as well from what I've heard, talent obviously isn't an issue, probably just needs some continuity to build confidence.

That's the enigma thing. I just dont beleive he's destined to be mediocre. I've seen him do incredible things including running the length of the field and kicking long and accurately for goal at the end of it. At the end of 2014 our guys seemed to have a thing where they kicked high into a vacant 50 for him to outpace the defenders and mark.
Can sadly see him quietly being delisted if he isn't right or starring if he is.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

midfield one of the best in the comp? cmon timmy...

Individually it is without a doubt.

Pendlebury - A+

Treloar - A

Adams - B+

Sidebottom - B+

Crisp - B

Wells - A-

Degoey - B-

To name a few.

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

We dont need to save money. Were not poor like the saints. You should respect the club that contributes millions of dollars to the equalization fund set up by the afl. Becouse its the only way your club will survive. There should statutes of Eddie outside your training ground so you can pay homage to your reall hero and saviour!

Ok champ. Lol

How am i distespecting pies???
All i said was it was stupid to get wells (whos cooked, calf old mans injured) mayne (whos a 29yo spud) and dunne (who cant even crack the demons 22, why not get MBrown??)
Every pie supporter ive talked to thinks the same. So calm down little betty betsy.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Ok champ. Lol

How am i distespecting pies???
All i said was it was stupid to get wells (whos cooked, calf old mans injured) mayne (whos a 29yo spud) and dunne (who cant even crack the demons 22, why not get MBrown??)
Every pie supporter ive talked to thinks the same. So calm down little betty betsy.

Mitch Browns worse than his brother, no thanks!

 

[Gone Critical]

I think you need to take the coloured off.

Attacking half backs generally are good users of the footy and with good long kicking skills/pace. Just don't see any of the listed half back options who would worry any opposition.

Dunn - come on (ex Melbourne flanking KPD.... please) - short at 192cm. Keefe is coming from a 2 year lay off and the other 2 don't have any strong AFL experience.

Elliott is a good finisher, but does go missing.

Wells, I've said is a 50-50, plainly from an injury viewpoint.

I think all teams improve year on year, generally. Pies seem to have gone backwards in some areas, and only covering losses on other areas. Wells is essentially Swan's replacement, except he is still under an injury cloud.

Maybe Scharenberg can come on... but after 2 years, it'll take him some to adjust. Others, B/C graders... not gonna win you matches.

Hardly be rose coloured glasses when I am saying I am not expecting any significant improvement in Collingwood but dont agree with your idea that Collingwood will head towards the bottom four.

What you need to consider what we had in 2016 when we already played so badly. We don't have elite HB with good kicking skills pace but what we had in 2016 was pretty diabolical. Toovey was at career end, Williams had major off field issues and played accordingly, Maynard and Smith were very inexperienced, Sinclair and Ramsay were the two best performers off HB in 2016 but missed a lot of footy. 5 had long term injury worries. Langdon, Ramsay, Sinclair, Maynard, Goldsack and Smith should all have better years in 2017. So we wont be elite in 2017 or anywhere near that but we were terrible in 2016 so should at least improve towards being average in that area. Scharenberg I doubt will have any great role to play in 2017. Just playing VFL would be a step in the right direction. He is way back in the line.

With the KPB sure we are exposed just like we were in 2016, especially if Reid goes down like he did at the end. Dunn isnt anything great coming in, Brown isnt anything great going out. Keeffe has missed 2 seasons and may struggle when come in, Frost did struggle and finished in the VFL before going out. Marsh showed some signs and could turn into a loss, McLarty and Schade have potential coming in and could turn into wins. We were not much chop with KPD in 2016 and we will be the same in 2017 most likely . Looks a nil all draw.

You claim Wells is Swans replacement but forget Swan didnt play in 2016, not 1 stat of any sort for the 1 game he played. So Wells is a bonus on top of the the 2016 midfield. We improve form 2016 with him in the team.

I could talk about Hoskin -Elliott, Broomhead, Scharenberg, Mayne etc but not s let even factor them into the equation. Just if we can get full seasons from Wells, Elliott, Moore, Fasolo, Adams, Ramsay, Goldsack and Langdon we have at least plenty of room to hold our own at around 11 th position of even move a bit closer to the 8. Still cant see how you have made a case for us getting worse in 2017. You are forgetting we were terrible in 2016 already. All we need to do is improve on that terrible effort to stay where we are or move up a little. You dont seem to have factored in the 2016 base we sunk to when considering which way we will go in 2017

 

[Gone Critical]

Ok champ. Lol

How am i distespecting pies???
All i said was it was stupid to get wells (whos cooked, calf old mans injured) mayne (whos a 29yo spud) and dunne (who cant even crack the demons 22, why not get MBrown??)
Every pie supporter ive talked to thinks the same. So calm down little betty betsy.

Again most of these gets were about getting some experience for all the experience lost.

Dunns no great pick up, similar standard to Nathan Brown who he replaces. Picking up M Brown would be a step down from Dunn.

Wells cam 4th in the NM B&F. The 3 who finished ahead of him all played 4 more games (23 v 19). Wells was better than all of them if you look at votes per game. He has some risks with injury but has played 19, 21, 20, 22 and 19 games in 5 of the last 7 seasons. Only 2 years majorly affected by injury. He is hardly cooked but may be before his 3 years is up. Still we are talking about 2017.

 

[madmug]

72,000 members?

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

Again most of these gets were about getting some experience for all the experience lost.

Dunns no great pick up, similar standard to Nathan Brown who he replaces. Picking up M Brown would be a step down from Dunn.

Wells cam 4th in the NM B&F. The 3 who finished ahead of him all played 4 more games (23 v 19). Wells was better than all of them if you look at votes per game. He has some risks with injury but has played 19, 21, 20, 22 and 19 games in 5 of the last 7 seasons. Only 2 years majorly affected by injury. He is hardly cooked but may be before his 3 years is up. Still we are talking about 2017.

Dunn same as N Brown?? Oh please.
You lost brown deal with it and forget the BS yeah?

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

Wells is a gun no disputing that. But guys hes cooked. 100% cooked. Will play 10 games max per year and wheres his leadership skills? Hardly the player you want leading the youngsters. Hes a nice kid but not a leader of men.
For christs sakes its a couple of trades gone bad.
Who cares not the end of the world dont get all defensive. I tell you what lets revisit if wells mayne dominate or dunne proves better than NBrown. Until then its all opinion.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Wells is a gun no disputing that. But guys hes cooked. 100% cooked. Will play 10 games max per year and wheres his leadership skills? Hardly the player you want leading the youngsters. Hes a nice kid but not a leader of men.
For christs sakes its a couple of trades gone bad.
Who cares not the end of the world dont get all defensive. I tell you what lets revisit if wells mayne dominate or dunne proves better than NBrown. Until then its all opinion.

How are you Adam H? Or should we call you Finger?

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

How are you Adam H? Or should we call you Finger?

Whos this adam h? So you calling me a troll because my opinion is wells is cooked and NBrown is much better than dunne??? Really? Grow up

 

[Gone Critical]

Dunn same as N Brown?? Oh please.
You lost brown deal with it and forget the BS yeah?

Maybe forget the big talk and make your argument

Don't see a big difference between Brown and Dunn. Dunn beats Brown stats wise and has better skills and delivery. Brown a better stopper. Here are their career stats, neither world beaters

Lynden Dunn Name Nathan Brown
Collingwood Magpies Team St Kilda Saints
Defender Position Defender
165 Career Games 130
Calder Cannons Origin Nth Ballarat
May 14, 1987 Date of Birth December 17, 1988
29yr 6mth Age 27yr 11mth
192cm Height 195cm
99kg Weight 98kg
2004 National Draft Last Drafted In 2006 National Draft
Round 1, Pick #15 Last Draft Position Round 1, Pick #10
Melbourne Demons Last Drafted By Collingwood Magpies
Career Stats for Season Career
165 Games 130
9.5 Kicks Per Game 4.4
4.9 Handballs Per Game 5.1
14.4 Disposals Per Game 9.4
4.4 Marks Per Game 3.0
0.6 Goals Per Game 0.1
0.4 Behinds Per Game 0
2.6 Tackles Per Game 1.9
0.7 Hitouts Per Game 0
0.8 Frees For Per Game 0.4
0.9

 

[Gone Critical]

Wells is a gun no disputing that. But guys hes cooked. 100% cooked. Will play 10 games max per year and wheres his leadership skills? Hardly the player you want leading the youngsters. Hes a nice kid but not a leader of men.
For christs sakes its a couple of trades gone bad.
Who cares not the end of the world dont get all defensive. I tell you what lets revisit if wells mayne dominate or dunne proves better than NBrown. Until then its all opinion.

Wells played 19 games last year. Continually saying he is cooked despite the evidence to the contrary isn't going to make it true.

How are these trades gone bad when they havent even started playing for their new club?

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Whos this adam h? So you calling me a troll because my opinion is wells is cooked and NBrown is much better than dunne??? Really? Grow up

You're not hard to spot mate.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Adam H doesn't use apostrophes either

 

[freebloke]

You claim Wells is Swans replacement but forget Swan didnt play in 2016, not 1 stat of any sort for the 1 game he played. So Wells is a bonus on top of the the 2016 midfield. We improve form 2016 with him in the team.

I could talk about Hoskin -Elliott, Broomhead, Scharenberg, Mayne etc but not s let even factor them into the equation. Just if we can get full seasons from Wells, Elliott, Moore, Fasolo, Adams, Ramsay, Goldsack and Langdon we have at least plenty of room to hold our own at around 11 th position of even move a bit closer to the 8. Still cant see how you have made a case for us getting worse in 2017. You are forgetting we were terrible in 2016 already. All we need to do is improve on that terrible effort to stay where we are or move up a little. You dont seem to have factored in the 2016 base we sunk to when considering which way we will go in 2017

I didn't forget it. I know Swan didn't play even 1 full game due to that horrific injury. But in 2015, he played 21 games, and Pies ended up 12th as well. Wells + Treloar add cover for Swan (a brownlow winner and still a game winner in 2015), but at 32, Wells is a 50-50 due to injury history. Wells might be like Waite, brilliant when he plays, but fades during the season due to injuries, etc. (not saying it will happen, but is a risk).

The 2016 low is there, except the list changes and the profile of the list (poor KPD depth, no star rebounder, reliance on very young KPF in Moore), etc.

Again, just don't see enough quality coming through to have a match winner, outside of the usual suspects.

As I said earlier, most teams improve every year (some do go back, e.g. Hawthorn might not do so well as last year). So, its a case of most of the opponents improving more than the Pies improvement, plus a slightly tougher fixture. If Pies don't look like making finals, Buckley might end up having to leave mid season, resulting in some more demoralising losses.

 

[mightymouse75]

Mayne to kick 3 goals and 23 points.

 

[adammania9]

Collingwood has a hella good midfield on paper and one of the best in the comp, but they're all too similar which has us still lacking in important areas - we don't have dominant contested midfielders, and we don't get clearances.

 

[adammania9]

Dunn same as N Brown?? Oh please.
You lost brown deal with it and forget the BS yeah?

I can forgive you for not watching Collingwood in 2016 - we were pretty trash for most of the year, but Brown is absolute trash now and basically a physical definition of cooked.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Collingwood has a hella good midfield on paper and one of the best in the comp, but they're all too similar which has us still lacking in important areas - we don't have dominant contested midfielders, and we don't get clearances.

Treloar Adams De Goey are potentially exactly the definition of dominanant contested midfielders. Greenwood too. Its not amatter of not having them, more waiting for some of them to mature a bit.

 

[adammania9]

Treloar Adams De Goey are potentially exactly the definition of dominanant contested midfielders. Greenwood too. Its not amatter of not having them, more waiting for some of them to mature a bit.

Yes they are, but when the club is still finishing something like 13th or 14th in contested possessions, something isn't right. Greenwood isn't much of a ball winner; I like him shut down ability on opposition mids but otherwise he should stay away from the midfield because his kicking is poor. Can kick a goal or two, I'd like to see him play more up front.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

the cattle we have can move us up the contested possessions table is what I'm saying. I'd have no doubt that a top six spot in that statistic would be one of the clubs goals this year.

Natural improvement from Grundy will also help these guys win first use of the ball more often.

 

[12kilos]

Ok champ. Lol

How am i distespecting pies???
All i said was it was stupid to get wells (whos cooked, calf old mans injured) mayne (whos a 29yo spud) and dunne (who cant even crack the demons 22, why not get MBrown??)
Every pie supporter ive talked to thinks the same. So calm down little betty betsy.

No offence intended girlfriend. One smart arse remark from you, if that was your only actual comment as what is in your reply .I would have been fine with that, however you did put a bit of salt and peper to your comment.
Just like i did with the saints.
In regards to our recruiting time will tell. We did loose plenty of experience in Swan Toovey Macafer Cloke and Brown.
Dunn i am sure is backup as were a bit short of key position players. Who knows? I was pulling my hair when we got Wakelin from you guys , but he managed to play alot of good footy at the pies
In regards to Wells and Mayne i am not chucking a party about there recruitement but time will tell. We got all 3 for nothing so from that aspect we have nothing to loose

 

[Dez!]

Dunn same as N Brown?? Oh please.
You lost brown deal with it and forget the BS yeah?

You're right, Dunn isn't the same as Brown.

He's better than him currently.