When the AFLW reaches all 18 teams

[maskmcgee]

How are they going to run a 17 - 22 game season against the AFL? When the leauge gets to full 18 team size, they should play on the opposite half of the year to AFL.
This ensures that neither compeition (particuarly the AFL at this time) steals attention/focus/grounds/timeslots/attendence/Tv viewers from the other.

Example 2018 - 2019 AFLW season

The season could be extended by moving the Grand Final back one week, playing through one or both byes, doing a final 4 or a final 6.

 

[briztoon]

Probably won't ever reach 18 teams, so we won't have to worry about there being no Essendon in the competition.

 

[Great8]

The availability of grounds could be an issue during the cricket season and the heat would be a huge factor also.
FWIW I don't think I'll ever see 18 clubs in my lifetime anyway, the comp probably can't even support another 2 teams until the game grows a bit more.

 

[BringBackTorps]

The availability of grounds could be an issue during the cricket season and the heat would be a huge factor also.
FWIW I don't think I'll ever see 18 clubs in my lifetime anyway, the comp probably can't even support another 2 teams until the game grows a bit more.

I don't think you are aware of what the Female Football Revolution is achieving in GR football -do you have any direct involvement with a community club which has introduced female teams, & its positive impact (culturally, financially, more club volunteers, with more expertise etc)?
The AFL is certainly aware- both McLachlan & Lethlean have both publicly stated recently they approve of the "community club ímprovement in culture"& "goodwill"respectively that the FFR has brought to community football. Its rapid growth is immutable.

The AFL knows the AFLW requires clean media air, to maximise its influence, popularity & community potential, & strategic implications cf. other sports (C.Wilson ,The Age, has written that some of the high rating AFLW games played would be worth c. $1,000,000 EACH game to advertisers!).

The AFLW will always be played primarily in the off-season, & 2 new teams will be introduced every 2 years. Thus, 18, by 2028.
Are you aware of how many elite Youth Girls are emerging already in Vic? And that an U18 girls TAC Cup is being introduced in Vic. in 2017?

 

[Great8]

I don't think you are aware of what the Female Football Revolution is achieving in GR football -do you have any direct involvement with a community club which has introduced female teams, & its positive impact (culturally, financially, more club volunteers, with more expertise etc)?
The AFL is certainly aware- both McLachlan & Lethlean have both publicly stated recently they approve of the community " ímprovement in culture"& "goodwill"respectively that the FFR has brought to community football. Its rapid growth is immutable.

The AFL knows the AFLW requires clean media air, to maximise its influence, popularity & community potential, & strategic implications cf. other sports (C.Wilson ,The Age, has written that some of the high rating AFLW games played would be worth c. $1,000,000 EACH game to advertisers!).

The AFLW will always be played primarily in the off-season, & 2 new teams will be introduced every 2 years. Thus, 18, by 2028.
Are you aware of how many elite Youth Girls are emerging already in Vic? And that an U18 girls TAC Cup is being introduced in Vic. in 2017?

I can only go by what I see in SA and whilst the numbers are booming I think it will take a couple of years before there is enough numbers of good quality footballers to start even thinking about adding new teams. I'd be very surprised if 2 new teams were entered every year and FWIW I think the AFLW will go with the same amount of teams next year

 

[maskmcgee]

The availability of grounds could be an issue during the cricket season and the heat would be a huge factor also.

Play at night, at Etihad. For both. Have any day games at Etihad, roof + aircon. Play night/twilight for all other games. AFL owns Etihad, they can boot soccer out in the winter and send them to the rectanuglar stadium. MCG, Gabba, Adelaide Oval, Peth Stadium (?) are used for all of 3 weeks a year max for cricket? I know nothing about surburban grounds outside of Victoria but surely there's some oval/midsize stadium that the teams there could play 2/3 matches on that's used for cricket?

FWIW I don't think I'll ever see 18 clubs in my lifetime anyway, the comp probably can't even support another 2 teams until the game grows a bit more.

If the standard is low across the board, then the matches will all be competitive. The standard will grow over time. As for attendence, if AFLW was running for 24 weeks of the year, opposite side of the year to the AFL, I'd follow it like I do the AFL, and I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one.

Anyway, if they ever want to make it into a really serious competition, they will have to play it sometime, and if not summer, it will be monstered by the AFL. Can you imagine the crowd AFLW would draw in the same timeslot as tonight? Essendon vs Hawthorn will get 90,000 tonight, AFLW would get buried. If they want to expand the leauge, they have to play summer. Also, you mentioned grounds. With the AFL and the local leauges running the same season as AFLW, where would they play then? They would have literally no stadiums, for the entire season. Pretty much every major stadium would be locked out. The AFLW would have to play 4 games a week in Melbourne with 18 teams, like the AFL. The Dome/G would only be avaliable a max 2 timeslots a week for 4 matches.

 

[BobbyMorri]

Play at night, at Etihad. For both. Have any day games at Etihad, roof + aircon. Play night/twilight for all other games. AFL owns Etihad, they can boot soccer out in the winter and send them to the rectanuglar stadium. MCG, Gabba, Adelaide Oval, Peth Stadium (?) are used for all of 3 weeks a year max for cricket? I know nothing about surburban grounds outside of Victoria but surely there's some oval/midsize stadium that the teams there could play 2/3 matches on that's used for cricket?



If the standard is low across the board, then the matches will all be competitive. The standard will grow over time. As for attendence, if AFLW was running for 24 weeks of the year, opposite side of the year to the AFL, I'd follow it like I do the AFL, and I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one.

The BBL already goes for a month. that doesnt include Test+ODI matches, FC and club cricket. And any extension of the season will run into the juggernaut of the BBL, especially in late December/Early Jan. playing out of Eithad would ruin one thing which makes the league great atm and that is accessibility and use of small local grounds. it created a great atmosphere. the weather causes a problem as well. you need to play most games in twilight or evening in certain climates. local grounds would not have the required lights for TV coverage.

And the standard is very important. If it is no good to watch, then no one will watch it. people already complain about the standard with 18 AFL teams in the mens game. well, there is 10x more mens players than women. it will never be mens and i am not comparing the standard to that. but there is only so much rolling rugby scrums, dropped marks and missed kicks a someone can take before they get so annoyed they turn it off. it happens in every sport. there is a reason why NBA is more popular than the NBL, for example.

 

[FRUMPY]

It would be so dumb to allocate 18 teams as they are in the AFL. The AFL already has too many teams in Melbourne, it would be dumb to do the same in the AFLW. If the players are there they should go for 3 teams in each of WA, SA, QLD, NSW and have 1 or 2 in TAS along with the 4 in MELB. There is your 18

 

[iameviljez]

It would be so dumb to allocate 18 teams as they are in the AFL. The AFL already has too many teams in Melbourne, it would be dumb to do the same in the AFLW. If the players are there they should go for 3 teams in each of WA, SA, QLD, NSW and have 1 or 2 in TAS along with the 4 in MELB. There is your 18

Yeah, exactly. I think if they were to start the AFL all over again they'd probably cap it at fourteen. There's only so many teams because of the old VFL.

 

[Teen Wolf]

It would be so dumb to allocate 18 teams as they are in the AFL. The AFL already has too many teams in Melbourne, it would be dumb to do the same in the AFLW. If the players are there they should go for 3 teams in each of WA, SA, QLD, NSW and have 1 or 2 in TAS along with the 4 in MELB. There is your 18

So just ignore the reality of where the talent is coming from? The AFL's intentions are clear, they've started off with half the teams based in Melbourne and there's nothing to suggest they will or should significantly change that ratio going forward.

There are five teams with provisional licenses, 3 Melbourne (including North who would probably play at least some of their games in Tasmania), 1 Geelong, and 1 WA, so that should tell you something.

 

[HairyO]

Even 12 team will be a farce, given there currently isnt enough talent to fill 4 teams.

 

[Gigantor]

It might take a while, but it will definitely reach 18 teams at some point in the future, so it's definitely worth a bit of a discussion as to the options they would have.

One thing is for sure, they would take the opportunity to cap the home and away season at 17 rounds, unlikely in the extreme that they would ever go beyond that (and in fact 17 rounds is hard enough).

Given that we are likely to have 12 teams as early as 2019, with some sort of finals (probably over two weeks, with top four, two prelims, then grannie), it's worthwhile looking at how you would construct a 13 week season if you want the grand final played the weekend before the AFL starts in late March.

Working backwards, 13 weekends from around March 22 (inclusive) takes you back to around December 28.

So the first logistical question is: how do you want top operate around that Xmas/New Year's period? Do you avoid it altogether, or do you try to offer a Summer Holiday type product and basically have at least one game on a nightly basis?

Given the family atmosphere I witnessed myself at most games, it wouldn't be the worst idea to go for some sort of fixturing that offers one game per night, from the start of the school holidays, most of the way through. It would be up against the BBL, but I think it would attract a reasonably following at this time of year.

Also, given the shorter games, you might end up with a fixturing system whereby each round is completed in around six days, with a minimum guarantee of four day breaks for clubs, so that you effectively complete seven full rounds in 42 days rather than six full rounds (meaning you can can complete a 13 week season in less than 84 days).

 

[Dirty Bird]

How are they going to run a 17 - 22 game season against the AFL? When the leauge gets to full 18 team size, they should play on the opposite half of the year to AFL.
This ensures that neither compeition (particuarly the AFL at this time) steals attention/focus/grounds/timeslots/attendence/Tv viewers from the other.

Example 2018 - 2019 AFLW season

The season could be extended by moving the Grand Final back one week, playing through one or both byes, doing a final 4 or a final 6.

I'd throw in another bye Australia Day weekend to push the gf into the week off

 

[masai]

You don't want to over stretch the talent pool, then the quality suffers.

Get the current teams up and running solidly, with increased numbers in the local leagues over the coming seasons. These increased number of players will improve the quality of the footy produced.

They should play more games, maybe play each team home & away.

 

[jatz14]

Gil said in an interview recently that they will keep it at 8 teams next year, but the year after may see more than 2 teams added. So it could go from 8 to 12 in 1 hit.
He also mentioned that 70 - 80 girls will come out of youth girls next year who will have skill levels equal to the top 40 or so in the AFLW.

EDJFL in Vic has gone from 12 girls teams to 86 in 2 years. The Vic ammos will have something like 40 teams this year, and only 4 of them have moved across from the VWFL, the rest are new.

I believe that the AFL is thinking that the amount of talent that will come out over the next 2 years will easily be enough for 4 new teams, and to push out some of the borderline players in existing teams. So they can expand, without diluting.

Seeing large numbers of youth girls going into the AFLW is also going to be pretty good as a promotional tool, reinforcing the growth.

 

[jatz14]

How are they going to run a 17 - 22 game season against the AFL? When the leauge gets to full 18 team size, they should play on the opposite half of the year to AFL.
This ensures that neither compeition (particuarly the AFL at this time) steals attention/focus/grounds/timeslots/attendence/Tv viewers from the other.

Example 2018 - 2019 AFLW season

The season could be extended by moving the Grand Final back one week, playing through one or both byes, doing a final 4 or a final 6.

The AFLW with an expanded comp will always be up against something. In summer however, footy loses control of a lot of the grounds.
Also, if its competing with the AFL mens, the AFL controls both fixtures, they can arrange it to give the women some clear air.
I think it will always start prior to the mens preseason comp so it gets a good run, but it will push later and later into the season, and the AFL is just going to have to deal with it imo

 

[Gibbke]

If it expands to that size, they will definitely create conferences and keep things to roughly the same timespan and time of the year...all arguments about that topic as they have been applied to the men's comp will be null and void...

 

[Gigantor]

The AFLW with an expanded comp will always be up against something. In summer however, footy loses control of a lot of the grounds.
Also, if its competing with the AFL mens, the AFL controls both fixtures, they can arrange it to give the women some clear air.
I think it will always start prior to the mens preseason comp so it gets a good run, but it will push later and later into the season, and the AFL is just going to have to deal with it imo

Although a lot of the old VFL grounds and modern training grounds are now available year round: Whitten Oval, Collingwood's, Casey, not sure about Ikon - I don't think cricket would get in the way of an earlier AFLW start - certainly we would not be using any BBL grounds.

 

[BringBackTorps]

The AFLW with an expanded comp will always be up against something. In summer however, footy loses control of a lot of the grounds.
Also, if its competing with the AFL mens, the AFL controls both fixtures, they can arrange it to give the women some clear air.
I think it will always start prior to the mens preseason comp so it gets a good run, but it will push later and later into the season, and the AFL is just going to have to deal with it imo

Disagree.

Don't assume everyone loves the BBL. They are willing to watch it, as no other sporting options are palatable (The A League ratings are usually lower than the WBBL, very modest). AFLW (where the skill level will continue to rise exponentially in a few years) will still attract very good crowds & ratings, directly against BBL, WBBL & Test cricket.

Sufficient AFLW grounds ARE available in the Oct-March period.
Vic. Park, Punt Rd, Arden St, Princess Park & Moorabbin (I believe), other VFL & VFA grounds are available. I assume suitable grounds, with tiered viewing, also exist in other states in the off-season (although South Pines is a big problem, but not Metricon).

Playing AFLW games in the AFL season, late March -GF, will cause AFLW support to virtually evaporate, probably over 80%. It needs CLEAR AIR (ie no AFL played) to maximise female AF recruitment, TV ratings, crowds, media coverage & hype.
The AFL will not want to cannibalise AFLW support -but is certainly content that other sports will be adversely affected by the AFLW. The A League & NRL are sweating over the AFLW off-season media dominance, strong crowds/ratings, & AF female regd. nos. growth.
Female AF player growth has important long term strategic implications for the Australian game.

The AFL, wisely, wants AF to be in the "media spotlight" for c. 52 weeks pa. And so does the AFL's ever expanding, 100+ person media dept., sponsors, & media partners!
Also, don't forget there are also an additional 1,000+ AFL -accredited media commentators in Aust. ; give them some AF to write about in the off-season!

 

[McRobie]

I don't think you are aware of what the Female Football Revolution is achieving in GR football -do you have any direct involvement with a community club which has introduced female teams, & its positive impact (culturally, financially, more club volunteers, with more expertise etc)?
The AFL is certainly aware- both McLachlan & Lethlean have both publicly stated recently they approve of the "community club ímprovement in culture"& "goodwill"respectively that the FFR has brought to community football. Its rapid growth is immutable.

The AFL knows the AFLW requires clean media air, to maximise its influence, popularity & community potential, & strategic implications cf. other sports (C.Wilson ,The Age, has written that some of the high rating AFLW games played would be worth c. $1,000,000 EACH game to advertisers!).

The AFLW will always be played primarily in the off-season, & 2 new teams will be introduced every 2 years. Thus, 18, by 2028.
Are you aware of how many elite Youth Girls are emerging already in Vic? And that an U18 girls TAC Cup is being introduced in Vic. in 2017?

You seem to know a fair bit about the woman's comp, out of interest what were crowd numbers like toward the end of the 8 rd season? Was it still free to get in?
I'm only asking as I think when the afl decide to start charge for entry or up prices for entry it could kill the game off. They have set the precedent at minimal cost so it's going to hard to increase cost of entry all of a sudden.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[jatz14]

You seem to know a fair bit about the woman's comp, out of interest what were crowd numbers like toward the end of the 8 rd season? Was it still free to get in?
I'm only asking as I think when the afl decide to start charge for entry or up prices for entry it could kill the game off. They have set the precedent at minimal cost so it's going to hard to increase cost of entry all of a sudden.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

I heard a few people express annoyance it was free, as they would have been prepared to pay. People who support the league are aware of the financial constraints on it and generally willing to contribute.

The number of memberships sold when membership got you not much is an indication of that

Charging a hundred for a family wouldn't be smart, and is unlikely, but $10 an adult, $5 for a child.

Doubt that would have much impact at all.

Sent from my XT1068 using Tapatalk

 

[Gigantor]

I dont see the need to charge anything, indefinitely. Families appear to enjoy going out on a Summer's evening. The crowds look good on TV. Sponsorship revenue is already very close to making the comp financially viable right now. A tiny bit of TV revenue starting 2019 will allow the comp to become fully professional and allow an expansion in teams and number of games played.

No need to charge.

 

[Garlic muncher]

I dont see the need to charge anything, indefinitely. Families appear to enjoy going out on a Summer's evening. The crowds look good on TV. Sponsorship revenue is already very close to making the comp financially viable right now. A tiny bit of TV revenue starting 2019 will allow the comp to become fully professional and allow an expansion in teams and number of games played.

No need to charge.

I like the idea of not charging, you can make money without doing it, i think it gives people the opportunity to buy a jumper, a couple more beers, or a extra special fried rice at the local chinese shop before the game, which seeing it is at a local suburban ground helps local business whom in turn may consider sponsoring the club, people work out where their bread is buttered and act accordingly.

This is exactly how local football before the corporate takeover worked.

Dont fix what is not broken.

 

[Gigantor]

I like the idea of not charging, you can make money without doing it, i think it gives people the opportunity to buy a jumper, a couple more beers, or a extra special fried rice at the local chinese shop before the game, which seeing it is at a local suburban ground helps local business whom in turn may consider sponsoring the club, people work out where their bread is buttered and act accordingly.

This is exactly how local football before the corporate takeover worked.

Dont fix what is not broken.

This is precisely what some might not be seeing - going to a women's game is like going to a big country footy game, or big surbuban footy game, especially with some of the old VFL grounds being used - a large chunk of footy fans love it - so leave it as is.

The girls love being able to play in front of 5k+ crowds, families love it, many footy fans love it, some non-footy fans are attracted to it, I really don't see why you would change a winning formula.