When will the Carlton FC Arrive?

[Chief]

Part 2 of this thread is here:

When will the Carlton FC Arrive? Part 2

PART 1 of this thread is here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/when-will-the-carlton-fc-arrive.1259822/ ============= We're all thinking it. We're watching this story play out for the 4th time in the last 20 years and it's the same story every time. They have a great list of exciting...

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[Yoda_]

Carlton have two A-Graders.

McKay and Walsh.

Also the most overrated player in their history in Cripps, dead set spuds it up in front of goal alllll the ******* time.

He really is not a captains arsehole.

Nat Fyfe would give Cripps a run for his money in front of goal. Wasn’t it 0.10 over 3 weeks?


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[Kreuuuzeurns]

That’s incorrect.
2006 - Riewoldt and Edwards
2007 - Cotchin and Rance
2008 - Vickery
2009 - Dusty

Rebuild started before Wallace left.

Not undermining Hardwick at all. Turns out he’s a brilliant coach. Just think old Richo needs some perspective on where it all began.

 

[Yoda_]

A grade talents. Guys who can, are or should be playing A grade football.

We have 3 A graders as it stands. Walsh, Weitering and McKay. I’m under no illusions as to where we are at right now, but I also know what we have on the list if we get it all right. Clearly easier said than done.

It’s fairly easy to see the A grade talents especially from early on. I’m not sure Carlton has 6 - 8 on the list (including the 3 you named). Some could be valuable b/c role players but are they good enough to lead the line?


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[Kreuuuzeurns]

It’s fairly easy to see the A grade talents especially from early on. I’m not sure Carlton has 6 - 8 on the list (including the 3 you named). Some could be valuable b/c role players but are they good enough to lead the line?


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It depends how you define A grade. We have three as of now.

Cripps - needs to remodel his game to get back to his best.
Docherty - is up in the air with his injuries.
Charlie - see above.
Williams - great hbf, can he be as good in the guts?
Saad - great footballer, injured at the moment, really depends on your definition of A grade.
Fisher - truely believe he has what it takes with continuity.
Martin - has the talent, very inconsistent.

Still plenty of improvement to be had through this group of players, who are either not on the park, hampered by injury or struggling with their roles and the current game plan. Need 1-2 of the “kids” to push into this group over the next 15 games.

Every team has a similar list. I don’t think this separates the Blues at all, it just shows we have some great maturing talent on the list that is for whatever reason underperforming.

 

[Soapy V]

Does this new Carlton have the balls to make tough decisions?

That is my No 1 concern

 

[Yoda_]

That is my No 1 concern

Without detailing the thread, I’m glad Essendon had its hand forced last year. We spy going around in circles making the same mistakes. A big decision made for us has seen us refocus our direction and the first 6 rounds has seen us debut 6 players already.

Would be huge if Carlton looked at a guy like Dow and said thanks for coming and tried to get a second rounder for him. Mitch McGovern? Get a second, go for it. The easy ones are bleedingly obvious. Retire Murphy/Betts.


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[Yoda_]

It depends how you define A grade. We have three as of now.

Cripps - needs to remodel his game to get back to his best.
Docherty - is up in the air with his injuries.
Charlie - see above.
Williams - great hbf, can he be as good in the guts?
Saad - great footballer, injured at the moment, really depends on your definition of A grade.
Fisher - truely believe he has what it takes with continuity.
Martin - has the talent, very inconsistent.

Still plenty of improvement to be had through this group of players, who are either not on the park, hampered by injury or struggling with their roles and the current game plan. Need 1-2 of the “kids” to push into this group over the next 15 games.

Every team has a similar list. I don’t think this separates the Blues at all, it just shows we have some great maturing talent on the list that is for whatever reason underperforming.

That is what has happened at Essendon for some time now. I don’t think talent identification has much to do with AFL It’s about the development of said players, even more so guys taken in the top 10/20.

Dow can play, SPS can play, how they are used is to blame imho.

The key for Carlton is that natural progression. Can those guys you mention take the step from good defender to great midfielder?


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[Kreuuuzeurns]

That is what has happened at Essendon for some time now. I don’t think talent identification has much to do with AFL It’s about the development of said players, even more so guys taken in the top 10/20.

Dow can play, SPS can play, how they are used is to blame imho.

The key for Carlton is that natural progression. Can those guys you mention take the step from good defender to great midfielder?


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Sounds like I’m preaching to the choir.

 

[Soapy V]

Without detailing the thread, I’m glad Essendon had its hand forced last year. We spy going around in circles making the same mistakes. A big decision made for us has seen us refocus our direction and the first 6 rounds has seen us debut 6 players already.

Would be huge if Carlton looked at a guy like Dow and said thanks for coming and tried to get a second rounder for him. Mitch McGovern? Get a second, go for it. The easy ones are bleedingly obvious. Retire Murphy/Betts.


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Betts shouldn’t be playing. Murphy or Casboult either. It’s a major issues within the club. Teague is way too close to some players

Dow should not have been selected. Needs a month of football in the middle to get his confidence and form up. Needs to come in with a block of good football.

Teague has this belief that a run and gun style is the way too go. It hurts Cripps and he won’t give Setterfield or Kennedy a go in their proper spots because of it.

SPS gets moved last week and was okay. This week dropped and will be sub. How does that help him?

I believe we have the talent if it was developed and coached properly. Development has improved but I have concerns about the coaching. Teague plays favourites and coaches to a style he wants to play instead of coaching to suit the talent we have

 

[Great8]

Can you please not arrive today!
What’s another day or two late

 

[TENACIOUS]

These are all great stories by opposition supporters...

If you look at the facts

• We have been missing 36% of our best 22 long term. (Yes, a lot of teams have)
• Our depth has been competitive against top 4 teams. (Smashed Freo, currently a top 8 team)
• Our draw, the first 9 games were always going to be a tough start. Richmond, Port, Brisbane, Melbourne & Bulldogs

We should be judged at the end of the year when our draw opens up and we get some players back..
*Bolded players best 22

Back This Week	De Konning (VFL), Newman (VFL), Parks (AFL)
Back Short Term	Williams, Murphy, Silvagni, Carroll , Kemp, Martin
Second Half of Year	Curnow & Fisher
Long Term	Marchbank, McDonald

It's not all doom and gloom as some supporters, opposition supporters and the media make out.

Yes, we need some changes at the end of the year.

• Turn over football department
• Turnover assistant coaching staff
• Upgrade game plan
• Upgrade match committee
• Moving on old players

Along with list upgrades from draft or trade, depends on what we have to how hard we go turning over players..

Future is bright at Carlton

 

[bigm386]

These are all great stories by opposition supporters...

If you look at the facts

• We have been missing 36% of our best 22 long term. (Yes, a lot of teams have)
• Our depth has been competitive against top 4 teams. (Smashed Freo, currently a top 8 team)
• Our draw, the first 9 games were always going to be a tough start. Richmond, Port, Brisbane, Melbourne & Bulldogs

We should be judged at the end of the year when our draw opens up and we get some players back..
*Bolded players best 22

Back This Week	De Konning (VFL), Newman (VFL), Parks (AFL)
Back Short Term	Williams, Murphy, Silvagni, Carroll , Kemp, Martin
Second Half of Year	Curnow & Fisher
Long Term	Marchbank, McDonald

It's not all doom and gloom as some supporters, opposition supporters and the media make out.

Yes, we need some changes at the end of the year.

• Turn over football department
• Turnover assistant coaching staff
• Upgrade game plan
• Upgrade match committee
• Moving on old players

Along with list upgrades from draft or trade, depends on what we have to how hard we go turning over players..

Future is bright at Carlton

So what your saying is it's not so bad provided.

- We have a dream injury run (considering we have taken so many players from other clubs and drafts with injury issues super unlikely. Kemp, C Curnow, Marchbank, Williams etc)
- Sack our football department and coaches
- Change our game plan
- Change or selection
- Change our players

Not that I disagree but that is basically change everything and start again. So what is exactly going well lol.

 

[bigm386]

If that's the way you want to interpret it mate..

With our injured players back should drastically change the way we play, seeing we have been competitive without these guys.

Our football department, assistant coaches, game structure & Match committee have been poor at best..

List upgrades are natural progression

I don't think we can count on our injured players being any less injury prone.

We have major issues and I'd suggest it's more than assistant coaches.

 

[LFTWNG11]

Carlton have proven themselves terrible at drafting and development since forever. Not sure why they don’t revert to a Geelong or the previous Hawthorn model of targeting already developed talent to integrate into the team at the cost of draft picks. Granted this strategy is used by top teams staying at the top but with a money ball type approach it could work for a team trying to climb the ladder.

The pick 6 (and 5 years of development) wasted on SPS could have been traded for a ready made 23 year old who can contribute from day 1.

 

[Macca18]

They'll win today and they'll be "back" all of a sudden. Such a fickle sport/industry, the worst for it in world sport.

 

[PP34]

Watching Carlton, they seem to be the worst handballing side in the competition.
Other teams handball to put their teammate in a better position. Carlton players largely handball to get rid of the ball. It's glaring once you focus on it during the game.

Yes and it seems contagious. Cripps used to be one of the best handballers you’ll see. Could handball long distances, release blokes into space and get the ball free in tight situations. For the last year or so I’ve seen him put far more teammates under the pump than usual.

 

[Toffee Lion]

They'll win today and they'll be "back" all of a sudden. Such a fickle sport/industry, the worst for it in world sport.

Bombers a bit under the radar IMO, good chance your lot.

 

[Great8]

Not sure they arrived today but they did enough to put aside a pretty ordinary Essendon

 

[Yoda_]

Not sure they arrived today but they did enough to put aside a pretty ordinary Essendon

Did what they had to do. I would still take our list over the Blues though


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[DrPowellPepper]

How in the world is betts getting a game?

 

[Thrawn]

How in the world is betts getting a game?

Did pretty well today, if you bothered to watch.

 

[Crankyhawk]

Carlton have proven themselves terrible at drafting and development since forever. Not sure why they don’t revert to a Geelong or the previous Hawthorn model of targeting already developed talent to integrate into the team at the cost of draft picks. Granted this strategy is used by top teams staying at the top but with a money ball type approach it could work for a team trying to climb the ladder.

The pick 6 (and 5 years of development) wasted on SPS could have been traded for a ready made 23 year old who can contribute from day 1.

I think hawthorn currently showing how that approach doesn’t work

 

[La Dispute]

They haven't arrived yet. They beat the Bulldogs (which they won't) they have.

We have beaten them the past couple of years, and aren’t without a decent shot.

McKay really troubled them last time.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

We have beaten them the past couple of years, and aren’t without a decent shot.

McKay really troubled them last time.

I could see us winning 1 of our next 2 then losing to the Hawks in 3 weeks time. That’d be very Carlton.

 

[Milanista28]

Did pretty well today, if you bothered to watch.

He always kills us ffs.