WHERE ARE WE AT? WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?

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BIGNEDKELLY

Club Legend
Jul 23, 2013
2,852
3,951
AFL Club
Collingwood
The only one I disagree with is Roughead. He’s a solid defender with size and the ability to pinch hit in the Ruck in an emergency. He’s the type that you keep around while building a side. We have skilful talented backmen, he’s the rock. He played very well last night.
He took more marks last night than Tyler Brown took last season..
 

domus

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
6,370
8,722
Mooroolbark
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Mooroolbark footy club
Hi everyone, i thought i would just put it out there .
Buckley and the match commitee have been quite conservative in team selection for the first 3 rounds.
Do we persist with the same players finish between 8th to 11th roughly , with no chance of being an impact team in the finals IF we make it.
Also concerning many of the players in our team in the first 3 rounds due to age/form are heading at a downward spiral.
J Thomas, Mayne , WHE , Roughead ad Greenwood to that list he will get a game in the next week or 2.
Great servants like Pendels, Sidebittom Howe Elliot have peaked , and have 2 maybe 3 years left?
Its time in my opinion to reset asap , give players like Wilson Keane Tohill Rantall Bianco Ruscoe ganes .
I would give the first year players a few vfl ganes first, then eventually late April early May give them senior games also.
Many of the players being selected in the first 3 rounds are taking us no where its time to bite the bullet start a rebuild hopefully in 3 years time players Like Moore Grundy Daicos boys Quanor Kelly can take us to the promise land.
Personallly i think its a great time to rebuild players like Pendels Sidebittom Howe Elliot who still have something to offer can help the kids.
You lose credibility when you throw Roughead into your list of downhill skiers. He has been outstanding this year and was far better than the lavishly worshipped Moore last night.
 

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domus

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
6,370
8,722
Mooroolbark
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Mooroolbark footy club
It's bottom out and rebuild time. Bucks will hold this back a year sadly
We don't have to bottom out. We might "middle out" but the list we have is good enough to be competitive most weeks. Essendon and Carlton chose the bottom out route and their whole culture has a stink about it and has had for a number of years. If you want to go that route I think you are crazy. Nick Daicos walks in next year and I think the young crop we drafted this year has some real potential and hopefully two or three will be regulars by the end of this season.
 

mike123

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 13, 2013
29,812
26,360
AFL Club
Collingwood
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Juventus
I think that's the way to go anyway. There's a ridiculous amount of impatience going on here.

Would Sidey have had a better career if we debuted him before Round 7 of his draft year?
Would Quaynor be tracking any better if we played him from day dot?
First three games we’ve had a team pretty close to our best 22 and it’s not good enough. We’re not gonna get any better by persisting. People want us see us contending or working towards contending and we’re doing neither. The impatience is warranted.
 

Black_White

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 7, 2001
16,870
12,691
In the Pocket Rocket, lights ablaze!
AFL Club
Collingwood
The club has had a rebuild over the last couple of years, from the President down.
The only position of power not rebuilt is the most important regarding our on field performance.
We have stuck with a coach who’s game plan continues to be “keep the opponent to a low score“. Despite the rule changes that promote the forward half, we are stuck with a plan that promotes the back half.
Looking across the competition it is obvious that those who are leading have adapted to the new paradigm of “scoring is king”.
We are a dour side. We play unexciting footy. It’s so unattractive that I don’t watch live anymore, the iPad has the Foxtel stream playing, but it’s sitting on my side table while I watch something more exciting. (Sometimes that’s NRL)
We have talent, no denying that. The way we exploit that talent is the question.
Are we a team that has looked at, then exploited the new rules? Or are we a team playing 2020 AFL?
From the little I have seen, the answer is firmly in the latter.
 

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
22,465
30,677
Vietnam
AFL Club
Collingwood
Individual progression is not what the OP is on about. He is talking about a cultural shift toward rebuilding. Personally would love to see one or more youngsters play next week in place of underperforming players.
I don't really know what you mean. At the moment all we can do to rebuild is work out how best to develop our kids. If they are best developed in the VFL, play Mayne - if they're best developed in the AFL, play that kid.
 

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
22,465
30,677
Vietnam
AFL Club
Collingwood
First three games we’ve had a team pretty close to our best 22 and it’s not good enough. We’re not gonna get any better by persisting. People want us see us contending or working towards contending and we’re doing neither. The impatience is warranted.
Developing the kids is our short term hope. I just think it's a fallacy that kids develop quicker or better playing AFL. Some will, some will be better off playing VFL.
 

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Lip Gallagher

All Australian
Suspended
Nov 11, 2020
708
714
AFL Club
Collingwood
Hi everyone, i thought i would just put it out there .
Buckley and the match commitee have been quite conservative in team selection for the first 3 rounds.
Do we persist with the same players finish between 8th to 11th roughly , with no chance of being an impact team in the finals IF we make it.
Also concerning many of the players in our team in the first 3 rounds due to age/form are heading at a downward spiral.
J Thomas, Mayne , WHE , Roughead ad Greenwood to that list he will get a game in the next week or 2.
Great servants like Pendels, Sidebittom Howe Elliot have peaked , and have 2 maybe 3 years left?
Its time in my opinion to reset asap , give players like Wilson Keane Tohill Rantall Bianco Ruscoe ganes .
I would give the first year players a few vfl ganes first, then eventually late April early May give them senior games also.
Many of the players being selected in the first 3 rounds are taking us no where its time to bite the bullet start a rebuild hopefully in 3 years time players Like Moore Grundy Daicos boys Quanor Kelly can take us to the promise land.
Personallly i think its a great time to rebuild players like Pendels Sidebittom Howe Elliot who still have something to offer can help the kids.
Mate, the starting gun just sounded, we played like sh*t against the Dogs and a favourable umpire call hear and there we could've won.

Carlton aren't the rabble they once were, we got the job done against them.

Brisbane were a bloody good team without Daniher, Daniher beat Moore last night, IMO Brisbane are flag favourites, i'll back our boys to beat em at the G.

The sky is still above us, it isn't falling.
 

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
22,465
30,677
Vietnam
AFL Club
Collingwood
Mate, the starting gun just sounded, we played like sh*t against the Dogs and a favourable umpire call hear and there we could've won.

Carlton aren't the rabble they once were, we got the job done against them.

Brisbane were a bloody good team without Daniher, Daniher beat Moore last night, IMO Brisbane are flag favourites, i'll back our boys to beat em at the G.

The sky is still above us, it isn't falling.
I actually think Dogs should be flag favourites.
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,419
7,039
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
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Pines Football Club
The answer is if you’re good enough the earlier you’re played the better you become and the club reaps the benefit. That’s been the history of the last 120 years of Aussie Rules football, but by all means invent any number of reasons why we shouldn’t be selecting youth in the team, particularly at this junction when the team is treading water.
How about give the kids games when they've shown enough in the twos? Y'know to show they're possibly better at the top level than anyone in the 22 at the time?

How's that sound?
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,419
7,039
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
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Pines Football Club
WTF? We have too many holes weaknesses in our list.
Many of the 25 or 26 players Buckley persists with are in there late 20s or 30s and are just going on a downhill spiral.
Our perfomances since 2018 are getting worse, we have the most players 29 yrs and over, out of any afl team.
Do you really think we should persist with Mayne, Greenwood, WHE , Thomas , Madgen , Roughead? just to name a few.
Have these players have any upside?
If we play the kids we have enough experience in Howe Sidey, Pendels Elliot to show them the ropes.
Players like Grundy Moore and Adams also play leadership roles
That's a fault of our list management isn't it. The holes in our list, the late 20's and 30's you speak of.

Either either you can't throw green kids in the deep end on the hope that our seniors will just 'show em the ropes' - this is not 3rd divy suburb league.

Accept we've wasted our window, we're not in it anymore - best hope to develop the kids in the twos and develop game in the ones for future.

We don't know the 'upside' or not of these players, especially considering no footy in the twos last year.
 

Jelly Bean

Premiership Player
Dec 12, 2010
3,872
3,190
AFL Club
Collingwood
Would rather be bottom 4 than 7th to 12th
Usually yes, but this year we can't get the benefits of bottom 4 (e.g. the early draft pick), and the downside is that we are less attractive to free agents which we burned the list to accomodate. As has been pretty extensively covered, we may have really messed up this last offseason (increasingly so the lower we finish)
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,419
7,039
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Pines Football Club
Usually yes, but this year we can't get the benefits of bottom 4 (e.g. the early draft pick), and the downside is that we are less attractive to free agents which we burned the list to accomodate. As has been pretty extensively covered, we may have really messed up this last offseason (increasingly so the lower we finish)
We're less attractive to FA's regardless of ladder position, put yourself in their shoes, get signed to contract then nekminnit the club throws you under the bus. The club never learns - we're 3 games into a 7 year deal of a million bucks a year on a ruckman who seemingly is not fussed on winnin a flag or not.

So where do we go from here? Well us fans have to suck it up whatever the club throws at us I guess.

Buckle up, ain't gonna be pretty but at least not boring.
 

Buckley is my hero

Club Legend
Jul 13, 2007
1,211
1,183
Elwood
AFL Club
Collingwood
Developing the kids is our short term hope. I just think it's a fallacy that kids develop quicker or better playing AFL. Some will, some will be better off playing VFL.
Mate, I've played different sports all my life. I assure you the higher the grade you compete against the quicker you improve. The exemption are the players who are never going to improve. Those players should never be on our list.
 

Silky23

Club Legend
Feb 2, 2020
1,253
3,211
AFL Club
Collingwood
Sydney once again showing how playing a bunch of kids can lift the older guys to lift their intensity and ferocity around the footy and make footy exciting. They are so bloody good to watch and you can tell they are loving their footy. Time to clean out the oldies, bring in some youth and enthusiasm and just see what happens I reckon! They’ll surprise us
 

loki04

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 29, 2005
25,261
20,030
Adelaide
AFL Club
Collingwood
I think that's the way to go anyway. There's a ridiculous amount of impatience going on here.

Would Sidey have had a better career if we debuted him before Round 7 of his draft year?
Would Quaynor be tracking any better if we played him from day dot?
They still debuted year 1. Whether its rnd 1 or 15 they are getting experience.
 

loki04

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 29, 2005
25,261
20,030
Adelaide
AFL Club
Collingwood
Sydney once again showing how playing a bunch of kids can lift the older guys to lift their intensity and ferocity around the footy and make footy exciting. They are so bloody good to watch and you can tell they are loving their footy. Time to clean out the oldies, bring in some youth and enthusiasm and just see what happens I reckon! They’ll surprise us
Game plan helps.
 

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