WHERE ARE WE AT? WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?

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Roverjg

Club Legend
Sep 18, 2014
2,810
3,452
Surf Coast
AFL Club
Collingwood
Sydney once again showing how playing a bunch of kids can lift the older guys to lift their intensity and ferocity around the footy and make footy exciting. They are so bloody good to watch and you can tell they are loving their footy. Time to clean out the oldies, bring in some youth and enthusiasm and just see what happens I reckon! They’ll surprise us
They have had 6 top 20 picks in the past 5 years. Their first three picks in 2020 (4, 5, + 32) have played every game so far this year and have had a significant impact. What's more is their tops draft picks over the past 5 years are still at the club.
 

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stormskye

Premiership Player
Sep 24, 2019
3,785
5,188
AFL Club
Collingwood
They have had 6 top 20 picks in the past 5 years. Their first three picks in 2020 (4, 5, + 32) have played every game so far this year and have had a significant impact. What's more is their tops draft picks over the past 5 years are still at the club.
And they aren’t paying players to play for other teams 😬
 

Roverjg

Club Legend
Sep 18, 2014
2,810
3,452
Surf Coast
AFL Club
Collingwood
We are a middle (8-12) of the road team. Our coaching panel is obstinate and lacks innovation, motivation and flexibility.

You need look no further than our crablike ball movement, which over the past 18 months has been picked apart by the better teams. Our players do not have the disposal skills to play the possession based game Buckley persists with.

Our list profile is poor and our skill level falls away sharply. There has been no rhyme nor reason to our team selections over the past 2 years. Poor performing players continue to get games When they are dropped it is only for one game despite lack of form.

Buckley is coaching for his future. We are unlikely to see many youngsters unless there are injuries or Bucks is told his contract wont be renewed and he bloods more youngsters.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

No SPIN

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 14, 2009
6,322
5,125
Vic
AFL Club
Collingwood
The club has had a rebuild over the last couple of years, from the President down.
The only position of power not rebuilt is the most important regarding our on field performance.
We have stuck with a coach who’s game plan continues to be “keep the opponent to a low score“. Despite the rule changes that promote the forward half, we are stuck with a plan that promotes the back half.
Looking across the competition it is obvious that those who are leading have adapted to the new paradigm of “scoring is king”.
We are a dour side. We play unexciting footy. It’s so unattractive that I don’t watch live anymore, the iPad has the Foxtel stream playing, but it’s sitting on my side table while I watch something more exciting. (Sometimes that’s NRL)
We have talent, no denying that. The way we exploit that talent is the question.
Are we a team that has looked at, then exploited the new rules? Or are we a team playing 2020 AFL?
From the little I have seen, the answer is firmly in the latter.
The club has had a rebuild over the last couple of years, from the President down.
The only position of power not rebuilt is the most important regarding our on field performance.
We have stuck with a coach who’s game plan continues to be “keep the opponent to a low score“. Despite the rule changes that promote the forward half, we are stuck with a plan that promotes the back half.
Looking across the competition it is obvious that those who are leading have adapted to the new paradigm of “scoring is king”.
We are a dour side. We play unexciting footy. It’s so unattractive that I don’t watch live anymore, the iPad has the Foxtel stream playing, but it’s sitting on my side table while I watch something more exciting. (Sometimes that’s NRL)
We have talent, no denying that. The way we exploit that talent is the question.
Are we a team that has looked at, then exploited the new rules? Or are we a team playing 2020 AFL?
From the little I have seen, the answer is firmly in the latter.
A dour game plan doesn’t kick 16 goals like we did last week.
 

Collingwood2022

Debutant
Mar 25, 2021
94
94
AFL Club
Collingwood
Play kids and they do well
Indeed! However Buckley as has been the case throughout the bulk of his coaching career, is conflicted. Does he play the kids to get games into them for 2022 onwards and risk some beltings? Or does he not? He really is now stuck in no man's land because this current team is close to full strength and yet is still middle of the table. I think they are actually playing quite attractive footy and yet are 1/2. This dilemma will be a true test of his character (i) coach/play for the immediate now which will not be good enough in any event or (ii) do a Tony Shaw and groom for the future which he will likely not be a part of.

Watch this space.
 

sr36

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 20, 2009
22,535
30,828
Vietnam
AFL Club
Collingwood
Mate, I've played different sports all my life. I assure you the higher the grade you compete against the quicker you improve. The exemption are the players who are never going to improve. Those players should never be on our list.
Works for some. Others just become conservative beige footballers who don't take the game on because survival mode can do that.
 
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Collingwood2022

Debutant
Mar 25, 2021
94
94
AFL Club
Collingwood
We are a middle (8-12) of the road team. Our coaching panel is obstinate and lacks innovation, motivation and flexibility.

You need look no further than our crablike ball movement, which over the past 18 months has been picked apart by the better teams. Our players do not have the disposal skills to play the possession based game Buckley persists with.

Our list profile is poor and our skill level falls away sharply. There has been no rhyme nor reason to our team selections over the past 2 years. Poor performing players continue to get games When they are dropped it is only for one game despite lack of form.

Buckley is coaching for his future. We are unlikely to see many youngsters unless there are injuries or Bucks is told his contract wont be renewed and he bloods more youngsters.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app
Wholeheartedly agree here.
 

ride56

Enforcer
Dec 14, 2014
212
152
AFL Club
Collingwood
WTF is going on here?, the amount of wish for bringing in unused kids for 'development' is insane. Not just this thread, all threads on the Pies board.

Development means developing where you develop best - not the top elite standard, so yes VFL, 2nd tier, develop the kids there. They're not fargin robots, throwing them in the cauldron in 'hope' for a miracle season is akin to throwing them under the bus. Throw em in too early and you could damage their confidence permanently.

Do we really wanna do that?

Look I get the frustration of looking at floating aimlessly mid table for years coz all of our so so hacks aren't getting better but getting older, and yes that means accepting we've thrown another window out the window, time for a regen I get it. But what some are suggesting is throwing the baby out with the bathwater type desperation.

I know it's not much and it really burns but the one positive we can look forward to IS game development and player development, that means give the kids time to flourish in the magoos and the ones experiment with game - that's most simplistic way I can put it. And the quickest way to get back to contention.

I couldn't catch the game last night coz I was flying home from work at the time, the result is we lost, meh don't care SO LONG AS the game and structure of our team is moving in a positive direction. - I'll watch the replay and give my two bob on the right thread.
So we persist with established players that cannot seem to handle the AFL, and we leave our potential top end talent to instead become top end VFL talent. Makes perfect sense, thanks for setting us straight
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,483
7,083
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Pines Football Club
So we persist with established players that cannot seem to handle the AFL, and we leave our potential top end talent to instead become top end VFL talent. Makes perfect sense, thanks for setting us straight
Have a look at our list, the reason we keep playing the types that contribute little is because we don't have anyone else.

Our list balance is old and too young (inexperienced) with few in between.

That is the fault of the club, best direct your displeasure there.

Throwing untried rookies into the heat of the top level could damage their confidence permanently, better to develop them in the twos, let em shine there. When they grow there then you can throw em to the wolves and see how they go.
 

ride56

Enforcer
Dec 14, 2014
212
152
AFL Club
Collingwood
Have a look at our list, the reason we keep playing the types that contribute little is because we don't have anyone else.

Our list balance is old and too young (inexperienced) with few in between.

That is the fault of the club, best direct your displeasure there.

Throwing untried rookies into the heat of the top level could damage their confidence permanently, better to develop them in the twos, let em shine there. When they grow there then you can throw em to the wolves and see how they go.
Thats rubbish, you have top end talent sitting there and a number of guys that have been in the twos now for well over a year, let them have a crack. They can't do any worse than Callum and WHE. Everyone has stinkers but when you have guys like these two playing like sh*t and still getting a game in front of you, that would certainly dishearten and ruin your confidence even more. Have a backbone and back the kids in
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,483
7,083
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Pines Football Club
Thats rubbish, you have top end talent sitting there and a number of guys that have been in the twos now for well over a year, let them have a crack. They can't do any worse than Callum and WHE. Everyone has stinkers but when you have guys like these two playing like sh*t and still getting a game in front of you, that would certainly dishearten and ruin your confidence even more. Have a backbone and back the kids in
Look I'll concede that you maybe right when you're a young bloke who can't get a gig watching the likes of the hyphen, JT and co. get games and you don't.

My speculation is IF we didn't have covid and those young blokes had a season in the twos under the belt they'd be better prepared. That's how I'd go, I wouldn't be averse to choosing them to try and save the season I'd be averse coz they ain't prepared enough.

I'll also concede if they did have that season under their belt that Bucks may not pick them anyway. Not much we can do there but criticize.

Personally I wouldn't pick them coz they're not ready, not coz the others are not performing, but the cupboard is bare, and that fault lies with the club.
 

Pedro

Premium Platinum
Mar 15, 2003
9,549
7,576
Melb.
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Collingwood
So we persist with established players that cannot seem to handle the AFL, and we leave our potential top end talent to instead become top end VFL talent. Makes perfect sense, thanks for setting us straight
They haven't even played a VFL game yet, let alone be on the path to becoming top end VFL talent. The time will come for them. Henry an example of what happens when they play before they are ready. Lets hope a few of them knock the door down when they get to play a real game against real opposition. Its easy to look good in scratchies, but those who are ready will put their hands up in the next few weeks.
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,483
7,083
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Pines Football Club
Thats rubbish, you have top end talent sitting there and a number of guys that have been in the twos now for well over a year, let them have a crack. They can't do any worse than Callum and WHE. Everyone has stinkers but when you have guys like these two playing like sh*t and still getting a game in front of you, that would certainly dishearten and ruin your confidence even more. Have a backbone and back the kids in
They haven't even played a VFL game yet, let alone be on the path to becoming top end VFL talent. The time will come for them. Henry an example of what happens when they play before they are ready. Lets hope a few of them knock the door down when they get to play a real game against real opposition. Its easy to look good in scratchies, but those who are ready will put their hands up in the next few weeks.
I get that the new crew may not be ready to impact when it's too late i:e our best players are past it or retired.

That's totally the fault of the clubs list management, nothing else.

We all need to accept that our window is probably shut instead of hoping in desperation that all the new kids will just come in and impact in time to see out the careers of Sides, Howe and Pendles. It ain't gonna happen.

Again, if you wanna direct frustration, do it at the club. Won't achieve anything but at least here you can vent.
 

ride56

Enforcer
Dec 14, 2014
212
152
AFL Club
Collingwood
I get that the new crew may not be ready to impact when it's too late i:e our best players are past it or retired.

That's totally the fault of the clubs list management, nothing else.

We all need to accept that our window is probably shut instead of hoping in desperation that all the new kids will just come in and impact in time to see out the careers of Sides, Howe and Pendles. It ain't gonna happen.

Again, if you wanna direct frustration, do it at the club. Won't achieve anything but at least here you can vent.
It makes no sense that you think our window is shut and yet do not want to blood new players. And to top it off you tell us to vent at the club when you just know it achieves nothing. Wtf do you do with your life to be so meh???
 

ride56

Enforcer
Dec 14, 2014
212
152
AFL Club
Collingwood
They haven't even played a VFL game yet, let alone be on the path to becoming top end VFL talent. The time will come for them. Henry an example of what happens when they play before they are ready. Lets hope a few of them knock the door down when they get to play a real game against real opposition. Its easy to look good in scratchies, but those who are ready will put their hands up in the next few weeks.
Who hasn't played a VFL game yet? Please, tell me. Henry played one game of AFL and got dropped, I mean FFS, if they had of persisted he may have played awesome the next. Who's another that played first up.. Stephenson? How'd he go? What about Wills - how many VFL games did he play and get all ready for the big time until he dominated like you predicted?
 

Carringbush2010

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 6, 2016
11,483
7,083
Perth
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Pines Football Club
It makes no sense that you think our window is shut and yet do not want to blood new players. And to top it off you tell us to vent at the club when you just know it achieves nothing. Wtf do you do with your life to be so meh???
I'm all for blooding new players on the right platform i:e the twos. That's where they'll develop best.

Just coz they're not in the ones doesn't mean they can't develop.

Why is it so important to rush new players into the deep end? What will it achieve? Or are you just hoping for a hail mary that that will keep the window open?

The best we can hope for this year is game and player development, if you think we're still in flag contention that would only come by some miracle.

Time for a reality check rider.
 

ride56

Enforcer
Dec 14, 2014
212
152
AFL Club
Collingwood
I'm all for blooding new players on the right platform i:e the twos. That's where they'll develop best.

Just coz they're not in the ones doesn't mean they can't develop.

Why is it so important to rush new players into the deep end? What will it achieve? Or are you just hoping for a hail mary that that will keep the window open?

The best we can hope for this year is game and player development, if you think we're still in flag contention that would only come by some miracle.

Time for a reality check rider.
You are hypocritical and you can't even see it. Read over what you re saying. Also, not once have I mentioned being in flag contention, reality swung past you a while ago
 

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