Which team list would you least want?

Which team list would you least want?

  • Adelaide

    Votes: 145 21.3%
  • Brisbane

    Votes: 4 0.6%
  • Carlton

    Votes: 21 3.1%
  • Collingwood

    Votes: 5 0.7%
  • Essendon

    Votes: 114 16.7%
  • Fremantle

    Votes: 17 2.5%
  • Geelong

    Votes: 37 5.4%
  • Gold Coast

    Votes: 46 6.7%
  • GWS

    Votes: 3 0.4%
  • Hawthorn

    Votes: 41 6.0%
  • Melbourne

    Votes: 21 3.1%
  • North Melbourne

    Votes: 100 14.7%
  • Port Adelaide

    Votes: 18 2.6%
  • Richmond

    Votes: 15 2.2%
  • St Kilda

    Votes: 62 9.1%
  • Sydney

    Votes: 23 3.4%
  • West Coast

    Votes: 7 1.0%
  • Western Bulldogs

    Votes: 3 0.4%

  • Total voters
    682

bzparkes

Brownlow Medallist
May 2, 2006
10,706
6,639
AFL Club
West Coast
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East Fremantle
It’s only dumb according to you because it doesn’t align with your narrative that Richmond can’t travel. What’s your reasoning behind us not being able to travel when we slaughtered the team that finished second on the ladder by 50 odd points, at their home ground, in their tropical conditions?

We lost to Adelaide and GWS when we were missing a third of our best 22. We were also depleted when we played Freo and Port (who you lost to at home) away and we won both games. We gave Gold Coast the biggest reaming of their season up there while you guys could barely put them away on your home turf.

The Richmond can’t travel line is so boring. For some odd reason, you WCE fans just can’t accept that we’re a much better football team than you. You hide behind the travel excuse and try to convince yourselves that it affects us despite our results suggesting otherwise. It’s pathetic.
You're not a better team. I'm sure if we got gifted the draw you had we'd have won the flag in a canter.

But them's the brakes.
 

Freomaniac

Brownlow Medallist
May 3, 2007
18,496
8,722
AFL Club
Fremantle
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You finished 3 games outside of the 8. Every club loses a few close ones and deal with injuries. You finished where you deserved to finish

I do rate your backline, especially Pearce and Ryan. No problems there going forward

your midfield stinks though and Darcy isn’t a gun ruckman - yet. Fyfe carrying the midfield on his own wasting his prime years isn’t a good thing. Going forward I do like Brayshaw, but Cerra has shown little and you’re relying on Banfield, Crowden and Giro who have shown nothing to drastically improve.

you say your midfield is far from worst in the league, can you name 3 clubs with poorer midfields?

your forwardline is average and heavily reliant on hogan getting back to full fitness.

basically Freo are struggling to make finals in the short term and relying on kids who’ve shown little to nothing so far to get them there by the time Fyfe and Walters are nearly ready to hang up the boots
Again, Freo in 2019 got 9 wins and 13 defeats. On the surface, slightly better than the 2018 season if you only judge us on the win loss ratio.

but here is the bloody big difference.

Freo in 2018 lost 9 games by 50 points or more. And had a % of 74%. 4 of those 50 point defeats came before our bye which was round 14. So that was 2 3rds of the season. From rounds 15-23 we got hammered by 50 points 5 times. Mainly due to 2 reasons.

1. Injuries to experienced players
2. Playing more kids due to injuries to key players.

Dockers in 2019 only lost by more than 50 points. That was in the derby by 91 points. Even then that was until round 16, which was 2/3rds of the season gone.
The other heavy defeats was a 47 point loss to the dogs in round 19 and a 43 point loss to Port in round 23 when freos season was done.

Well at least you admit the Backline is decent.

The midfield stinks, to a degree. But I see there is some kids coming through. Darcy is a gun ruckman. Name 10 ruckman aged 23 or under better than him?

Mundy is 34, that worries me he carrys the load. Stephen Hill is 29, Conca is 27 years old. Fyfe is a star at 28 years. You say Fyfe carrying the midfield on his own is a bad thing. Well it seems that Fyfe is sadly going to follow the same path as Pav: Contending in finals again past his prime aged 31-34 years old.

I stand by the fact that freo doesnt have the worst midfield in the comp. You want me to name 3 clubs with poorer midfields? Easily. Gold coast, Carlton and North melbourne. No disrespect to those 3 though. Gold coast is hopeless, Yeah they beat us in round 2, but you are Judged by 22 games not 1 They finished below freo on the ladder. Carlton, yeah they Beat us last season without cripps. But freo had a very sloppy game. Again, they finished below us on the ladder.

I am a bit harsh on North. I dont see any A-grade mids. I see a few solid mids. they were extreme on both ends. One week they kick 1 goal vs Geelong, the next week they kick 23 goals vs Port. They finished above freo in 2019 but thats due to their shinboner spirit of guts and determinaton.



Brayshaw is solid. Banfield is a mature ager and was posting solid numbers in 2018 getting 17-20 disposals a game but went backwards in 2019. He needs to lift and improve along with Connor Blakely. Cerra will post decent numbers this year once Justin Longmuir gives him more time in the middle rather than on a flank. Crowden looks like another Role player. Giro plays on a half forward flank or on a wing. He too was getting 15-20 disposal games. Missed all of 2019 because of injury. Another year of development in Brayshaw, Banfield, cerra, corwden and Giro will help freo.

Freo made finals from 2012-15 because they had 3 excellent mids in Fyfe, Mundy and Barlow. They also had role playing mids in Suban, Clancee Pearce, Danyle pearce, tendai Mzungu tom sheridan, Cam sutclffe and Matt Deboer

You said Freos Foward is average and is Heavily Reliant on Jesse Hogan back to Full fitness.

I totally disagree. As I said, Freos KPF stocks are Hogan, Lobb, Tarberner, McCarthy, Cox and Dixon. As good as it is to have a 60 goal a season forward in hogan, having Lobb kick 30 and McCarthy kick 30 is also good too. Its rare to get a gun KPF that can kick 60 goals a season, but if you can win games from 2 solid 30 goal a season KPFs then thats fine. Walters, Matera and Switkowski are the smalls.

1st off..... Go look at round 1. Freo Kicked 21.15.141 to Norths 9.5.59. Hogan didnt play, he was suspended for getting drunk. Lobb was the FF, 2nd ruck and kicked a goal. Tarberner caused havoc on a forward flank. Cam McCarthy kicked 5 goals due to playing as a 2nd or 3rd tall as Lobb or Tarberner was double teamed, in which McCarthy was free.

The another stand out game was when freo beat GWS and kicked 16.10.106 to 11.16.82. Matera kicked 4, Walters, Hogan and Tabs kicked 3.

The next week, freo kicked 13.10.88 to the dogs 9.15.69. Hogan kicked 1 goal and 3 behinds. Matera kicked 5 straight.

Problem was Hogan, Taberner and Lobb were all injured in the 2nd half of the season. Imagine If Hogan, Tabs, Lobb and McCarthy are all fully fit for 22 games.

I dont think Freo is as weak as you make it to be. Champion data said freo had the worst list in 2017 and 2018 and finished 14th on both seasons.

I see freo falling short of a finals spot in 2020

then Freo get a 3-4 year finals run from 2021 until 2023 or 2024 then Hamling, Wilson, Fyfe, Hill, Lobb, Tarberner, Conca, Walters and Matera all retire after our 3-4 yers of finals.
 

Tenny

Team Captain
Jan 7, 2020
513
472
AFL Club
Richmond
You're not a better team. I'm sure if we got gifted the draw you had we'd have won the flag in a canter.

But them's the brakes.
Better forward line, midfield, defence, depth and game plan. You have better rucks.

Maybe next season don’t let sides like Port Adelaide and Hawthorn slap you at home, then your travel excuse might hold some credibility.
 

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RonnieRaven

Mature age recruit
Jun 12, 2018
352
394
AFL Club
Fremantle
TBH, interstate form is meaningless so long as Gil and Co continue to suck off Victorians. Wouldn't matter if Richmond got flogged by 100+ points every time they left the state, because their form at the MCG is good enough to make them a threat in finals regardless. They have one of the most enticing lists I'd say
They won the flag in 2017 5 times they had to hop on a plane for 1 win against the mite of the suns
Richmond won a higher percentage of games interstate than West Coast did last season. Your travel myth has been busted. Sorry.
in 2017 you guys had a 20% winning percentage and the 20% was the suns
 

BruceTempany14

Loving the Eagles and Cats Salt
Aug 4, 2016
497
1,197
AFL Club
Richmond
lol, the interstate thing is debunked, we are good away
maybe they can go with' you haven't beaten a side above you on the ladder' that's always a good one

or maybe ' you're gone if rance reiwoldt cotchin or martin don't play' i really enjoyed that one

or ' you wont win another flag after fluking 2017 ... ' that was really fun ,

Nothing like a bit of West Coast salt. Tastes beautiful , I think it should be a key ingredient in their humble pie.
 

telsor

Hall of Famer
Aug 29, 2004
31,046
28,673
AFL Club
Richmond
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Habs
They won the flag in 2017 5 times they had to hop on a plane for 1 win against the mite of the suns

in 2017 you guys had a 20% winning percentage and the 20% was the suns
Huh?

in 2017 Richmond beat...
Brisbane at the Gabba (rnd 4)
Port at Adelaide (rnd15)
GC at Metricon (rnd 19)


If you need to lie to make your argument work, it's a pretty poor argument.
 

DEVO

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 8, 2000
9,827
4,839
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North Melbourne
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I picked Geelong because it must be getting harder and harder each year to stay up or near the top. They have done extremely well with Free Agency selections but they have had little access to top end young talent and at some stage it has to hit them hard.
 

BruceTempany14

Loving the Eagles and Cats Salt
Aug 4, 2016
497
1,197
AFL Club
Richmond
Can we go back to discussing which team list we want the least?? There's plenty of threads to read about the Richmond/West Coast rivalry.

I want to read North Melbourne supporters melting because no one thinks they've got any future stars on their list.
Noted and apologies to all if offended.
 

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Engimal v3

Premium Gold
Sep 21, 2017
4,080
7,866
AFL Club
North Melbourne
teah, it would suck to have 2 brownlow medalists, dual norm smith medallist and a 3 time Coleman medalist on your list wouldn’t it

long live king Cripps
I'm talking about going forward, not about what's been achieved. I think even the most one-eyed Richmond supporter would agree that there's some very rough times ahead.
 

Tarkyn_24

Hall of Famer
Dec 23, 2006
32,392
30,053
AFL Club
Collingwood
Collingwood have four of their premiership 22 from 2010 playing for them in 2020, with Heath Shaw the only other player active in the competition. Taking it a stride further, you add only Thomas off the top of my head for players that were even on Collingwood’s list at that stage.

So from that, we can safely bound this activity in ten years into the future, at which point you’d have to refer to club characteristics (attractiveness as a destination, difficulty attracting players) over grounding them in any of their current list circumstances to determine likelihood of success. As such, there’s at most ten permutations of “successful sides” unless we start to consider near misses as success. So just under half the competition necessarily become very viable options.

The challenge then is to pick who will contend when. I think any side with legitimate prospects of winning this year’s flag can’t be the answer to the thread question given how different the landscape looks even across half a decade. Beyond that, I think you’d have to look at the promise on each list, under the microscope of a premise that they will manage to retain around 50% of their talent.

On the above I think Port Adelaide and Sydney strike me as the lists most unlikely to contend next year and also most unlikely to have their talent grow into genuine A grade players. But even then, Sydney have proven they’re astute at the trade table and always hang around the upper end of the ladder, and thus can regenerate a side. So even in answering thusly I’m not convinced they there’s any way to know that’s any better than what a darts at a dartboard approach would give you.
 

Proper Gander

Owl whisperer and secret agent
Feb 15, 2015
17,294
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Collingwood have four of their premiership 22 from 2010 playing for them in 2020, with Heath Shaw the only other player active in the competition. Taking it a stride further, you add only Thomas off the top of my head for players that were even on Collingwood’s list at that stage.

So from that, we can safely bound this activity in ten years into the future, at which point you’d have to refer to club characteristics (attractiveness as a destination, difficulty attracting players) over grounding them in any of their current list circumstances to determine likelihood of success. As such, there’s at most ten permutations of “successful sides” unless we start to consider near misses as success. So just under half the competition necessarily become very viable options.

The challenge then is to pick who will contend when. I think any side with legitimate prospects of winning this year’s flag can’t be the answer to the thread question given how different the landscape looks even across half a decade. Beyond that, I think you’d have to look at the promise on each list, under the microscope of a premise that they will manage to retain around 50% of their talent.

On the above I think Port Adelaide and Sydney strike me as the lists most unlikely to contend next year and also most unlikely to have their talent grow into genuine A grade players. But even then, Sydney have proven they’re astute at the trade table and always hang around the upper end of the ladder, and thus can regenerate a side. So even in answering thusly I’m not convinced they there’s any way to know that’s any better than what a darts at a dartboard approach would give you.
Tarks
 

Proper Gander

Owl whisperer and secret agent
Feb 15, 2015
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I tell ya what, if I have to spend one more minute watching Paul Roos and his uninspiring, ever unchanging hair on TV that’ll just about be curtains for me.

Make of that what you will.
I think I would least like to coach the Hawks. That's largely because I assume whoever has the job will have to drive out to Dingley at some point and I don't know how to drive. I have had two driving lessons about a decade ago, but they haven't yet sunk in. St Kilda would be closely following because I've never understood Moorabbin. I don't know what it is for and I think it could just be removed without anyone noticing overmuch.
 

Proper Gander

Owl whisperer and secret agent
Feb 15, 2015
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Tullamarine’s an issue but Adelaide’s fine?

Also I think coaching the Hawks could be fun, if only to entrench Clarkson’s legacy as a miracle worker.
I forgot about Adelaide. I often do. The other team I tend to forget frequently is West Coast. I don't know why. It made 2018 confusing when discussing the Grand Final. People are like "did you watch it" and I'm like "yeah I liked the bit where those guys kicked goals and stuff"
 

Tarkyn_24

Hall of Famer
Dec 23, 2006
32,392
30,053
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Collingwood
I forgot about Adelaide. I often do. The other team I tend to forget frequently is West Coast. I don't know why. It made 2018 confusing when discussing the Grand Final. People are like "did you watch it" and I'm like "yeah I liked the bit where those guys kicked goals and stuff"
Wow I’m so sorry that you lost all memory of those two wonderful football sides. The 2002 semi and 2018 preliminary finals are quintessential football viewing. :(
 

Proper Gander

Owl whisperer and secret agent
Feb 15, 2015
17,294
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Wow I’m so sorry that you lost all memory of those two wonderful football sides. The 2002 semi and 2018 preliminary finals are quintessential football viewing. :(
I don't really know what the issue is. For some reason I can see some AFL sides, regularly even, but my memory isn't capable of retaining them. I'm like Guy Pearce in that thing that I forget what it was called.
 

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