Which team out of Adelaide, North and Hawthorn has the better youth?

[TheBigHorne]

Sorry for the layout of this, a vertical list seemed excessive and again I said Arguably (inc the 3 in front of him) - Brayshaw, Cerra, Naughton, Bailey , Kelly, Balta , Taylor , Baker, Mihochek

(I have omitted Fritsch, De Koning, Rayner, Petty as i would put them on par in my opinion)

The definite easy calls would be Brayshaw and Naughton and i can understand arguments against the rest, i just rated KPP's a tad more

But I don't watch as many north games as others, so I might be well off

Brayshaw - Saying otherwise would be a terrible opinion, so good choice
Cerra - Highly debatable
Naughton - Agreed
Bailey - Debatable
Kelly - Slight agree to slight disagree
Balta - No
Taylor - Sure
Baker - No
Mihocek - No
Fritsch - Actually a 50/50
De Koning - No
Rayner - No
Petty - No

So LDU in my eyes would go around 4-7 in a 2017 re-draft.

 

[nelk boys]

4 first rounders in the next 2 drafts, how many you got?

Isn't your club 'unstable'? Heard a few clubs call you that.....

Can't wait for Sheezel to come home in two years........

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Brayshaw - Saying otherwise would be a terrible opinion, so good choice
Cerra - Highly debatable
Naughton - Agreed
Bailey - Debatable
Kelly - Slight agree to slight disagree
Balta - No
Taylor - Sure
Baker - No
Mihocek - No
Fritsch - Actually a 50/50
De Koning - No
Rayner - No
Petty - No

So LDU in my eyes would go around 4-7 in a 2017 re-draft.

The vertical list is an issue but I respect it

As i said, the definite picks were Naughton and Brayshaw

Happy to debate the rest

 

[Psicosis]

Isn't your club 'unstable'? Heard a few clubs call you that.....

Can't wait for Sheezel to come home in two years........

Don’t be so salty sweets, doesn’t suit you

 

[rye]

reading this thread you would think davies-uniacke is christ come again

 

[TDS7]

There is an interesting dynamic here, the longer North are bad for the better they will do in this poll.

I can already see the thread in 2028...

"They've only won 20 games in the last 8 years, but have a look at those budding superstars."

For what it's worth, I don't hate North and think LDU had a stellar second half of the year. Let's see if he can do it for a whole season before calling him the messiah, but I think he's got it in him to be consistently in the best 5-15 players in the league. Acknowledging I've got all the bias in the world, I'm still taking the Hawks to be the more successful team over the next decade.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Isn't your club 'unstable'? Heard a few clubs call you that.....

Can't wait for Sheezel to come home in two years........

Hawk fans and your sense of entitlement lol.

Thought you were in the box seat for Bruhn

 

[SSSSSS]

reading this thread you would think davies-uniacke is christ come again

North have a messiah complex.

First it was Dusty/Kelly/WAR CHEST.

Then it was JHF but now he's Judas.

Then it was Clarko.

Now it's LDU.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

The chances of any given player, whether that be Jai Newcombe or anyone else, ever reaching the level that LDU played at in the second half of this season are tiny. Not a slight on Jai, he'll be a very good footballer for a long time. He just almost definitely won't be as good as LDU.

...Newcombe just doesn't measure up. Nor do 99% of players in the league.

I think the above is where our 'difference of opinion' stems from.

You've stated many times that 99% of the AFL can't get near LDU's second half of the season. Let's unpack this. For this to be true, he really would need to have been the best player in the comp (ala Dusty 2017, etc) as you were not saying he was in the top 1% at the time, but that 99% will never get near that level at any point (i.e. in their careers). For him to be better than where 99% of where the competition will ever get to, he would really need to be far and away the best player in the comp for the period in question (which he clearly wasn't).

So, I'll cut you some slack and change it to the notion that he was better than 99% of the where the comp was for that brief period (2nd half of 2022). For that to be true, he would need to be in the top 6 or so players in the comp for the 2nd half of 2022.

If he spent half the year as a top 6 player as you suggest, he:

Would have made the AA squad of 44 (and likely the team). Reality is he was not close to either and never even discussed as unlucky.

When the media did their 'top 50 players of 2022', his name would have appeared at least somewhere in the teens or twenties (if he was top 6 for half the season). Fact is, not a single pundit had him anywhere in their top 50 or even listed as unlucky. None of us in the corresponding threads on here even mentioned him as a possible omission - not even the "North nuffies".

He would have been at least top 10 for coaches votes over that period. Fact is, he wasn't even close to the top 30. In fact, he was only named best on ground twice all year and maybe top 5 one other time.

He would have been up there for Brownlow votes for the 2nd half of the year but again he was not close. In fact, he again only got 3 votes twice for the whole season - the exact same 2 games recognised by the coaches and raised in here multiple times already to speak of his greatness.

Hell, if he was a top 6 player in the whole comp, playing for a team that won the wooden spoon with a 2-20, 50odd% record, he would have won the BnF by so much it wasn't funny. Now North supporters may say he should have won, but if he was genuinely a best 5 or 6 player in the comp level, it would never have even been close for him to have the possibility not to win by a massive margin.

What every metric clearly shows is that you have overrated him. He finished the season very well but he wasn't in the top 5 or 6 players in the comp for that period, which has been the basis for your belief that Newcombe ("and 99% of other players") will never get close to him.

 

[nelk boys]

Hawk fans and your sense of entitlement lol.

Thought you were in the box seat for Bruhn

No need to get nasty.

Premiership every decade kind of breeds success doesn't it?

 

[SSSSSS]

Hawk fans and your sense of entitlement lol.

Thought you were in the box seat for Bruhn

We were.

It all changed when Hopper jilted Geelong for the Tigers.

Will be an interesting sliding doors moment in the future.

Hopper to the Tigers instead of Geelong.
Bruhn to the Cats instead of Hawthorn.
Stephens to the Hawks.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

No, I was just pointing out how these awards are flawed. Apologies it should have been a reply to your previous post.

Is playing on a back flank easier when you run both ways?
And didn't you quote the Brownlow votes for the game I'm responding to? I never mentioned Newcombe receiving the 3 Brownlow votes againt the Pies. You did.

I think perhaps you have me mixed up with someone else Vin. Never belittled Daicos or mentioned Brownlow votes from that game.

 

[The 747]

I can already see the thread in 2028...

"They've only won 20 games in the last 8 years, but have a look at those budding superstars."

For what it's worth, I don't hate North and think LDU had a stellar second half of the year. Let's see if he can do it for a whole season before calling him the messiah, but I think he's got it in him to be consistently in the best 5-15 players in the league. Acknowledging I've got all the bias in the world, I'm still taking the Hawks to be the more successful team over the next decade.

Hmm well the question is which team has the better youth, not which team will perform better over the next 10 years. I know BF thinks youth=good but that is not how it works at all.

 

[HeHateMe]

North have a messiah complex.

First it was Dusty/Kelly/WAR CHEST.

Then it was JHF but now he's Judas.

Then it was Clarko.

Now it's LDU.

TT was being valued at more than pick 1 last offseason in the draft board.

 

[SSSSSS]

4 first rounders in the next 2 drafts, how many you got?

Wow you will have a whopping 1 whole extra first round pick between 2021 and 2023.

Only the most delusional Norfies are celebrating the absolute travesty of trading 2x Pick #1's for pick 2, 3 and 8 as a win.

 

[The 747]

TT was being valued at more than pick 1 last offseason in the draft board.

The whole Hawthorn list was being wildly overrated all summer on the main board.

 

[HeHateMe]

The whole Hawthorn list was being wildly overrated all summer on the main board.

All I ever hear is how we are going to spend the next 5 years in the bottom 4 and we are a shoe-in for the spoon.

 

[TheUnicorn]

2023 edition is now out!

Analysis - Which team out of Essendon, Adelaide, North and Hawthorn has the better youth?

Out of the 4 youngest teams in the competition which has the best young talent to take them forward?

www.bigfooty.com

such inclusive, much wow

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

The whole Hawthorn list was being wildly overrated all summer on the main board.

What? We were the favorites for the spoon on the main board last summer.

 

[The 747]

What? We were the favorites for the spoon on the main board last summer.

Nah, maybe on the Hawthorn board IDK but the main board was all hypey hype.

 

[Sky]

Brayshaw - Saying otherwise would be a terrible opinion, so good choice
Cerra - Highly debatable
Naughton - Agreed
Bailey - Debatable
Kelly - Slight agree to slight disagree
Balta - No
Taylor - Sure
Baker - No
Mihocek - No
Fritsch - Actually a 50/50
De Koning - No
Rayner - No
Petty - No

So LDU in my eyes would go around 4-7 in a 2017 re-draft.

De koning has a premiership and is a key position player. Your club would give us ldu for him without hesitation if it came down to it.

 

[Dockzy]

De koning has a premiership and is a key position player. Your club would give us ldu for him without hesitation if it came down to it.

He’s referring to Tom De Koning here not Sam

 

[rye]

He’s referring to Tom De Koning here not Sam

fun fact: de koning went to school with davies-uniacke (also hunter clarke)

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Nah, maybe on the Hawthorn board IDK but the main board was all hypey hype.

We were literally the favorites for the spoon on this very board.

Preview - 2022 Spoon (poll)

Who has the worst list in the AFL right now?

www.bigfooty.com

 

[The Nostradamus]

North have a messiah complex.

First it was Dusty/Kelly/WAR CHEST.

Then it was JHF but now he's Judas.

Then it was Clarko.

Now it's LDU.

We did in 2017/18 when we wanted dusty/kelly

Now it’s more we are excited about the collective youth

A midfield of LDU, Simpkin, Thomas, Phillips and Powell all first round picks plus Sheezel and Tsatas/wardlaw to come

Good bookends with McKay/Logue up one end and Larkey up the other

Need Comben and CCJ to come good and I have faith in both