Prediction Who’s back when?

[SumTingWong]

Would it not be fairer to say his contested and clearance work is a clear strength rather than he "gets the occasional clearance?" I think most of us who try to follow the VFL team as closely as possible understand his limitations on the spread at this point, but that is one element of his game and only one element of the sport. It could be he will eventually be more suited to a Caddy type forward/mid role so his 2 goals yesterday were encouraging in that regard. And it could yet be he improves this season, especially if he gets more accustomed to playing a role tailored to his current strengths. That your language to describe his limitations is very strong and your language to describe his strengths is very casual seems to betray a certain bias on your part. Having said that, as things stand I think you are correct he won't be produced at AFL level this season. I disagree that the claim he could play this year is farcical though, he is a talented kid and all sorts of twists and turns can occur for team and player yet.

What is the most clearances he's had in a game?

 

[Bojangles17]

Played against basically a suburban side.

Wneren t several coburg midfielders lentini, Dickson podnajski who all played yesterday talked up pre mid season draft , strange all being from a bottom side BUT true

 

[Meteoric Rise]

What is the most clearances he's had in a game?

16 disposals, five tackles, three centre clearances & five clearances

“Was a bull inside and extracted the ball on numerous occasions, but just couldn’t get much outside ball, so he’ll be working on complementing his game in that manner.”

13 disposals, four tackles & three clearances

“He came back after being a carry-over (player) last week and played as an inside ‘mid’, good around the contest, eight contested possessions of his 13 (disposals), three clearances. We just need to get him to spread to the outside to get involved in that part of the game.”

19 disposals, nine handball receives, four tackles & five inside-50s

“Learning every week, while playing consistent footy.”

18 disposals, seven clearances & three tackles

“Improves every week. His defence is really standing out. Big-bodied, seven clearances led the team, and played a really important role in our defensive structure.”

18 disposals, 15 contested possessions, seven tackles & four clearances

“Looks a real promising player for us. A big, strong inside midfielder. A lot of handballs on the day - 18 disposals on the day, 12 of those handballs - high tackle numbers again with seven. His ability to break the game open in the third quarter was critical to the outcome. He’s playing some great footy.”

18 disposals, 11 contested possessions, five clearances & six handball receives

“A strong body, he started the game really well. His 18 disposals, 11 contested, were a feature, as well as five clearances. It was really pleasing to see him play to his strengths.”

11 disposals, three handball receives, one clearance.

“We tried Riley at half-back for the first half and he did okay. He learnt a few lessons in positioning which will be good for his development and then he went on-ball in the second half.”


Seven is the answer as best I can find. His clearance numbers are not prolific, but they are strong enough and of course they don't tell you the whole story of his input around clearances. The comments include "big bodied 7 clearances led the team" "his ability to break the game open in the 3rd quarter was critical to the outcome" "was a bull inside, and extracted the ball on numerous occasions." He had 15 contested possessions in one game and this is very high. So all indications are the hierarchy are pleased with this part of his game.

The above are his published stats for 7 matches only. I have left out the match where he was ill v Cats, Coburg stats not published yet and he was carryover player v Box Hill, that in itself suggesting it is far from farcical to claim he could play at AFL level this season.

 

[TigermanM2]

He has shown absolutely nothing to suggest he will be a player let alone play this year. He's so far off it it's not funny.

Well he might as well just pack it in then. What’s he played? 9 VFL games?

 

[SumTingWong]

Well he might as well just pack it in then. What’s he played? 9 VFL games?

Do you work for the Herald Sun? If you bothered to ask me or read the rest of my posts I have stated quite clearly that he has plenty if time on his side to make it. Now toddle off.

 

[SumTingWong]

16 disposals, five tackles, three centre clearances & five clearances

“Was a bull inside and extracted the ball on numerous occasions, but just couldn’t get much outside ball, so he’ll be working on complementing his game in that manner.”

13 disposals, four tackles & three clearances

“He came back after being a carry-over (player) last week and played as an inside ‘mid’, good around the contest, eight contested possessions of his 13 (disposals), three clearances. We just need to get him to spread to the outside to get involved in that part of the game.”

19 disposals, nine handball receives, four tackles & five inside-50s

“Learning every week, while playing consistent footy.”

18 disposals, seven clearances & three tackles

“Improves every week. His defence is really standing out. Big-bodied, seven clearances led the team, and played a really important role in our defensive structure.”

18 disposals, 15 contested possessions, seven tackles & four clearances

“Looks a real promising player for us. A big, strong inside midfielder. A lot of handballs on the day - 18 disposals on the day, 12 of those handballs - high tackle numbers again with seven. His ability to break the game open in the third quarter was critical to the outcome. He’s playing some great footy.”

18 disposals, 11 contested possessions, five clearances & six handball receives

“A strong body, he started the game really well. His 18 disposals, 11 contested, were a feature, as well as five clearances. It was really pleasing to see him play to his strengths.”

11 disposals, three handball receives, one clearance.

“We tried Riley at half-back for the first half and he did okay. He learnt a few lessons in positioning which will be good for his development and then he went on-ball in the second half.”


Seven is the answer as best I can find. His clearance numbers are not prolific, but they are strong enough and of course they don't tell you the whole story of his input around clearances. The comments include "big bodied 7 clearances led the team" "his ability to break the game open in the 3rd quarter was critical to the outcome" "was a bull inside, and extracted the ball on numerous occasions." He had 15 contested possessions in one game and this is very high. So all indications are the hierarchy are pleased with this part of his game.

The above are his published stats for 7 matches only. I have left out the match where he was ill v Cats, Coburg stats not published yet and he was carryover player v Box Hill, that in itself suggesting it is far from farcical to claim he could play at AFL level this season.

If his best attribute i.e. clearances is not elite then he has a very long way to go. You criticised me for being casual on his best attributes i.e. clearances. Seems to me I was right? If this side of his game was at least bordering on elite then I would concede I was being a little harsh, but as it seems his strongest part of his game is average at best I think you can agree I was pretty accurate with my initial assessment. Can it be summed up with he has an OK inside game and virtually no outside game? If so it would be way too early to play him in the seniors.

 

[TigermanM2]

Do you work for the Herald Sun? If you bothered to ask me or read the rest of my posts I have stated quite clearly that he has plenty if time on his side to make it. Now toddle off.

"He has shown absolutely nothing to suggest he will be a player let alone play this year. He's so far off it it's not funny."

This is exactly what you posted and I responded. Nothing in it saying he had time on his side. Irrespective of how you tried to navigate around this with further posts (which I saw later BTW) it was a ridiculous post. Full stop. Don't like feedback then too bad.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

If his best attribute i.e. clearances is not elite then he has a very long way to go. You criticised me for being casual on his best attributes i.e. clearances. Seems to me I was right? If this side of his game was at least bordering on elite then I would concede I was being a little harsh, but as it seems his strongest part of his game is average at best I think you can agree I was pretty accurate with my initial assessment. Can it be summed up with he has an OK inside game and virtually no outside game? If so it would be way too early to play him in the seniors.

The coaches do tend to be even handed in the coaches' notes each week, naturally erring on the side of encouraging the player. If you refer to those he has won fairly consistent praise for his clearance work. Really though we need to lump the two things together, clearances and contested possessions. He is strong at winning contested ball situations. I can actually identify with him as a footballer because I think he has a similar limitation to what I suffered myself. If I had to go and get the ball in two way situations I got lost. If the ball was funnelled through me, say at full back or full forward or because I was playing on the main opposition target or ball-getter I was in my element. I see a bit of similar disorientation in Collier-Dawkins when the ball is buzzing about, but when it is brought into his zone he is very powerful.

Whether he is defined as "elite" by Champion Data or whoever, because he gets x number of clearances or y number of contested possessions is not something I want to be relying upon to judge the value of a footballer. There are clearances and clearances. And there are clearance assists, where a lot of his tackles for instance might both stop an opposition clearance and create a Richmond clearance. I am convinced both by my eyes and by the coaches' notes he is strong in contested situations. I am not convinced by either your casual description of him getting "the occasional clearance"(you have rightly conceded you were being a little harsh, well done,) or your later contention that his "clearance is not elite" in judging this stronger part of his game as having a long way to go(to achieve AFL standard.)

I am as yet uncertain whether they have the right role for Collier-Dawkins in the midfield. If his ability to read two way play doesn't improve he may be better as a forward and defender or as a tagger, or occupying other certain strategic positions in the formation where the ball is more likely to be funnelled through him. But I think they are correct to exhaust the line of enquiry as to whether he can be a classic inside midfielder first.

Would you now concede that if it was farcical to claim he may play at AFL level this year then he would never have been used as a carryover(emergency) player v the Hawks?

 

[SumTingWong]

"He has shown absolutely nothing to suggest he will be a player let alone play this year. He's so far off it it's not funny."

This is exactly what you posted and I responded. Nothing in it saying he had time on his side. Irrespective of how you tried to navigate around this with further posts (which I saw later BTW) it was a ridiculous post. Full stop. Don't like feedback then too bad.

My post was spot on. You have NFI what you're talking about. Give me as much feedback as you like.

 

[SumTingWong]

The coaches do tend to be even handed in the coaches' notes each week, naturally erring on the side of encouraging the player. If you refer to those he has won fairly consistent praise for his clearance work. Really though we need to lump the two things together, clearances and contested possessions. He is strong at winning contested ball situations. I can actually identify with him as a footballer because I think he has a similar limitation to what I suffered myself. If I had to go and get the ball in two way situations I got lost. If the ball was funnelled through me, say at full back or full forward or because I was playing on the main opposition target or ball-getter I was in my element. I see a bit of similar disorientation in Collier-Dawkins when the ball is buzzing about, but when it is brought into his zone he is very powerful.

Whether he is defined as "elite" by Champion Data or whoever, because he gets x number of clearances or y number of contested possessions is not something I want to be relying upon to judge the value of a footballer. There are clearances and clearances. And there are clearance assists, where a lot of his tackles for instance might both stop an opposition clearance and create a Richmond clearance. I am convinced both by my eyes and by the coaches' notes he is strong in contested situations. I am not convinced by either your casual description of him getting "the occasional clearance"(you have rightly conceded you were being a little harsh, well done,) or your later contention that his "clearance is not elite" in judging this stronger part of his game as having a long way to go(to achieve AFL standard.)

I am as yet uncertain whether they have the right role for Collier-Dawkins in the midfield. If his ability to read two way play doesn't improve he may be better as a forward and defender or as a tagger, or occupying other certain strategic positions in the formation where the ball is more likely to be funnelled through him. But I think they are correct to exhaust the line of enquiry as to whether he can be a classic inside midfielder first.

Would you now concede that if it was farcical to claim he may play at AFL level this year then he would never have been used as a carryover(emergency) player v the Hawks?

Nope. Neither you nor I have any idea as to whether this was a token gesture or genuine. Agree to disagree on this one.

 

[TigermanM2]

My post was spot on. You have no idea what you're talking about. Give me as much feedback as you like.

Hahaha, and you do? So far from spot on. Delusional in fact.

 

[Tiger_Of_Old]

Wneren t several coburg midfielders lentini, Dickson podnajski who all played yesterday talked up pre mid season draft , strange all being from a bottom side BUT true

I think so.But didn't get picked.
If he backs this up then fine.