Who are a bunch of w***ers

[CJH]

Noticed in the Herald Sun that they had their 2001 'Team' photo published.

They had all the usual suspects there including Sheahan, Healy, Poulter etc as well as the photographers and the work experience kids.

But get this. They were unable to get the real James Hird or Wayne Carey so have the cut outs of them in the photo.

It looks completely pox!

------------------
TigerFury.net - Independant Richmond Tigers website

 

[vanders]

you cant blame hird or carey for not being there, who would wanna be anywhere near sheahan!!

 

[TigerTank]

They are all cardboard cut-outs.

Except that's the real Mike Sheahan.

 

[Darky]

I noticed it too - thought my eyes might fave failed me for a sec.

The cardboard cut-outs would have a bit more footy nous than Shite Mike though!

 

[Darky]

While sort of on the topic, I also got the much-awaited Age footy season's guide. Last year's was a good one, with individual player profiles of a couple of lines each.
This year's is crap - a one page article by Rohan "Thanks Mr Sheedy for letting me wash your car and scrub your toilet" Connolly is the total* extent to which this paper has explored the possibilities for the year.

* Note : The articles by Robert "supercoach with a 47% win record" Walls, and Caroline "my father and husband have media connections so now I work for a newspaper" Wilson weren't read because their opinions don't count. Hang on... so why did I read Connolly's?

 

[Dan24.]

Robert Walls is a *******. The guy is typical of so many media personalities who derive their opinions from what they have been told, rather than their own logic. His opinion basically mirroe public perception and "myth" rather than any facts.

I remember when hwe took over as coach of Richmond in 1996, he said a line which I found pathetic. He said : "I think as a club, we may have to take a step backwards in order to go forwards"

This was a club which had finished 3rd on the ladder the previous season after missing the finals competely from 1983-94. They had one of the youngest lists in the competiton, and this guy stuffed up the club !

You never have to take a step back to go forwards. Never. There were 42 players on Richmonds list in 1996, most of them young. There were enough good players to build a team around.

Compare his attitude to Denis Pagan. Denis took over a club that had not made the finals for 6 years and had just suffered a 150 point loss in a pre-season match. They were f*cked! Denis promptly led the Roos to half a game off top spot in his first year(with the best percentage) and 7 consecutive preliminary finals followed.

If Robert Walls had taken over as coach of the Kangas in 1993 instead of Pagan, he probably would have said: "I think we neeed to go backwards in order to go forwards, so 1993 will be a rebuilding year for us.

Basically, all teams have to constantly rebuild every year as players come and go, but clubs should never ever seek to go backwards in order to go forwards. Clubs and coaches in particular should always be looking forward, expecting and demanding success. This is why Sheedy has been such a great coach.

I read with interst Walls' ranking of the top 50 players. He ranked Whitnall ahead of Lloyd. Now, I have no problem with this as it's his opinion, but I did have a problem with his reasoning. Walls said that Whitnall gives off far more goals than Lloyd. Was Walls aware the Mathew Lloyd was Essendon leading kick getter in 2000? It wasn't the usual midfielder who had this honour, but the full-forward, Matthew Lloyd. This means that Lloyd had about 300 kicks that weren't goals. Presuming there weren't too many clangers, most of those kicks would have gone to a teammate to set up a goal, or keep possession. But Robert Walls seemed blissfully unawre that Matthew Lloyd was Essendon leading kick winner.

I also laugh at his prediction of the Kangaroos to finish 9th. He reckons this because: (quote in todays Age) "The Kangaoos may slip back some in order to give themselves a chance to surge forward in latter years"

Well, I'm sure Denis Pagan will ensure another top 4 finish (as usual) and make a fool out of Robert Walls again.

Can any tiger fans recall his tenure at Tigerland. What do you gus think of him?

 

[TigerTank]

Umm, I can't really disagree with any of that Damn, I mean Dan 24!

It would would appear that your level of commonsense and reason is inversely proportional to the post count listed in the top right corner.

The Kangaroos/Richmond comparison is a fair call, as is the Lloyd v Whitnall situation. Lloyd is also, IMO, greater value to EssN'Sync than Hird or Fletcher.

Do yourself a favour Dan. Stay unregistered.

------------------
TT - Obligatory bad-tempered Richmond supporter

 

[Dan24.]

TT,

Because I often say stuff like : "Essendon are the best team", or "Hird is the best player", I get accused of being biased.

But calling Essendon the best team (or Hird the best player for that matter) isn't really a biased call, given that they went 24-1. I reckon I see enough footy each year to be accurately objective.... more or less. My club loyalty doesn't affect how I write, unless I am "stirring"

Anyway, I'm going to re-register again next week, but I will lose my post count.

Still debating on whether to register as Dan24, or Dan25. Think I might go for Dan25.....you know, a fresh start

 

[kevin sooky]

I hated Robert Walls as a footballer b/c he was an ankle tapper.

However, as a football expert I rate him way ahead of any of the tripe Danny24 1/2 puts up.

Of course Whitnall is better than Lloyd, at the moment. Of course he gives off more goals. he does play CHF....and Lloyd has yet to obtain any myotonic fibres in his chest cavity.

Walls was an innovator as a coach, Pagan has no innovations except kick it to Carey. Pagan didnt have to say "one step back..." etc b/c Schimma had already done that for him for 3 years.

Walls went to Richmond when it was in turmoil over the exit of Northey. No one could have succeeded in that environment and no one has since Walls left anyway.

Give me Robert Walls over Blight any day. It is really due to Robert Walls that Brisbane has had success in the last 5 -6 years. That is something Pagan et al couldnt do. Pagan had the players when he went there, otherwise he couldnt have gotten to the finals so quickly. Walls had shit when he went to Carrara in 1991.

 

[Dan24.]

Sooky,

Walls has FIVE consecutive losing seasons at Brisbane, including a 10-12 1995 year in which they fluked 8th. I mean, how much time does he need? He had half a decade! Walls intorduced the huddle from kickouts - hardly rocket science.

I suppose you're going to credt Blights success at Adelaide on Robert Shaw are you? I suppsoe Sheedys success at Essendon was due to Barry Davis. Hell, why nort credit Blights success at Geelong in 1989 on the 1988 coach John Devine !

Walls was a loser at Brisbane (didn't have much to work with admittedly), and was a loser at Richmond. Plenty of clubs can be successful after internal troubles. Carlton had one of the most turbulent off seasons ever in 1980 and they won the 1981-82 Grand Finals !

Your sarcastic reply to Pagans game plan (i.e kick it to Carey) does you no justice. Pagan has introduced the mathemtaically perfect game plan, whereby percentage probabilitis determine their sucess. The Kangaroos routinely have the least number of possessions, yet the most number of goals. He has defined the word "efficiency". They are the miost accurtare kicking team in the competiton, not because they kick accuratley, but because they kick their goals from in front. They never lead to pockets, and often they lead back toward goal, rather than the traditional "run away from goal to lead"

The Kangaroos always kick it long, and they always centre the ball. The often kick long into space, where their players run onto the loose ball. They NEVER waste the ball. It's got nothing to do with Carey. Denis coached the under 19's into 9 consecutive Grand Finals. There is a turnover of players every 2 years at that level, so the playing list changed year after year. Yet he kept getting them into the Grand Final. He then went to Essendon reserves for a year and coached another premiership, before his 8 years at the Kangaroos. The man is a genius.

Make no mistake, if Pagan had went to Fitzroy in 1993 instead of North, Fitzroy would be where North are now, and the Roos would probably have merged or folded.

As for you choosing Walls over Blight - get real. Blight has coached 5 Grand Finals in 9 full seasons. Yeah, he's a bit of a loony, but he knows how to get results - immediate results too. His players play with flair and confidence, and he keeps it simple.

Robert Walls was a vastly overrated coach. He coached one premiership with a team that anyone could have done it with. Blight and Pagan have taken over underachieving lists and made strawberrys out of shit.

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

The best analysis of Robert Walls is to look what happened when he and John Northey swapped jobs.
Brisbane went from 8th (having just scraped in) to a prelim final under Northey
Richmond went from 3rd to 9th in the same year under Walls.
I will never give him any credibility after he persisted with his theory of St Kilda trading Harvey, Burke & Loewe. Such a move would destroy the club, and disenfranchise every single supporter.

 

[Seth]

Originally posted by Dan24.:
TT,

Still debating on whether to register as Dan24, or Dan25. Think I might go for Dan25.....you know, a fresh start

Why not Dan12. You know, you're age. Stay unregistered Dan for all our sakes.

------------------
The future is black and white.

 

[Dan24.]

Originally posted by Hit The Boundary Saints:
The best analysis of Robert Walls is to look what happened when he and John Northey swapped jobs.
Brisbane went from 8th (having just scraped in) to a prelim final under Northey
Richmond went from 3rd to 9th in the same year under Walls.
I will never give him any credibility after he persisted with his theory of St Kilda trading Harvey, Burke & Loewe. Such a move would destroy the club, and disenfranchise every single supporter.

Ah yes. I forgot about that one. How could anyone forget Robert Walls comments that it would be beneficial for the Saints to get rid of their 3 best players. I suppose you agree with that too Sooky?

 

[Macca19]

Originally posted by Dan24.:
Sooky,

I suppose you're going to credt Blights success at Adelaide on Robert Shaw are you?

I believe Shaw was the catalyst. You look at the players he bought to the club, and its half of the Premierships sides. Koster, Ellen, Jarman, Vardy, Bond, Goodwin, Johnson, Eccles, James, Caven, Edwards, McCartney. Thats a fair load of talent right there.
You have to attribute a fair lot of that premiership success to him

 

[kevin sooky]

Northey inherited a team that took Walls 5 years to assemble and get experience. And Northey took them to the bottom of the ladder.

Walls took a wooden spoon team in 1980 which was crap and got them into the finals in 81, 83 and 84.

Pagan's game plan would not work w/o Carey. We saw that at the end of last year and it will continue this year. The plan was very efficient against Essendon and Melbourne.

Blight is a looney. With Geelong he did lift them and the only time they even got close to aflag was when they played a team with 13 fit men. If Blight was really good he should havw won three flags with the Cats with the talent he had at his disposal. That's the difference. Walls only had talent at his disposal at CArlton and coached 2 GF teams and 1 PF team. Blight had the talent at his disposal AND the benefit of a crappy finals system at Adelaide. They are the least succesful team through a season that has ever won a flag.
He wont be succesful at St. Kilda. It is a certainty unless they get good new players not just new players. Save for Hamill, the others are hacks or as Jack Dyer would say, good ordinary players.

Sheedy got rid of players that played in flags. The team did nto fall apart. Walls was advocating a simialr thing. Loewe is past it but he will be worth less in a trade at the end of 2001 than he was in 1999. Does Sheedy miss Olarenshaw and Calthorpe or Kickett or did he miss Hawker?

That is the only way to move ahead where the salary cap and draft are restricting open recruiting.

Basically Danny boy, your arguments are fatuous. I am a Walls fan. Th huddle isnt the only trhing he brought to the game. You belittle that development which came in when you were still in kinder, but if it was so obviouls, tell me why no other coach had thought of it. Walls was to his era what Wallace & co are to this era. Thinkers. I wish he were coaching at Collingwood instead of mediocre mick.

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

KS
Sheedy didn't get rid of 295 game club stalwarts and ex captains, nor dual Brownlow medallists. That part of your argument is fatuous.
I'll take Blight any day. Walls did invent the huddle, but that was 20 years ago. I suppose you think Tommy Hafey would still cut it as a league coach.

 

[Darky]

Trading a few experienced players out of a strong side is different to trading the three or four players that absolutely carried the rest to a Grand Final berth.

 

[kevin sooky]

Big Deal, they took them to a GF in 1997 for god's sake. So did Len Thompson and Wayne and Max Richardson and a few others. But Tommy got rid of them and produced a better team. Loewe IS PAST IT. Burke is on the down slide and so is Harvey. He didnt say get rid of all three. But you could get rid of one and improve the team. You have to give something to get something. If you give up a Wakelin you will always get your Callaghans or Lawrences, but they will not win a flag for you. Hamill is the only pick up the Aints have got of any value this year. They will not finsh higher than 12th fi that high. The messiah is flawed.

Another thing about Walls is when he speaks you can understand him. He makes sense. Whether you agree or not is naother thing. Blight only answers a qn with a qn. He is weird and over rated.

Pagan is over rated, but I would say a better coach than Blight.

Sheedy is away with the pixies now but has T. Daniher M. Harvey and R. Shaw to coach the team. Sheedy does the PR.

And to stick it up all the Walls knockers, he is making over $100K a year from the media, so someone else also values his opinions. So your fatuous anf flatulent arguments stink!

Tell me what has been Blight's great innovation for footy? High scoring and all out attack. That is not new. Hafey was doing it 30 years ago.

Blight is a dickhead who got 2 flags through a dicky finals system.

 

[The invisible mullet]

I think Kevin Sooky might be Robert Walls.

Noone else would defend his record. The funniest part of Walls' record is that Brisbane were having a shocker of a year until he announced he was leaving, they turned around boosted by the news and made the finals.

 

[CJH]

Originally posted by The invisible mullet:
I think Kevin Sooky might be Robert Walls.

Noone else would defend his record. The funniest part of Walls' record is that Brisbane were having a shocker of a year until he announced he was leaving, they turned around boosted by the news and made the finals.

Nope!

Walls would be calling everyone 'terrific' and also writing in short choppy sentences.

This is not his style!



------------------
TigerFury.net - Independant Richmond Tigers website

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

So Walls makes 100K in the media.
Blight make $1 million via coaching.

What would you rather do?

 

[Dan24.]

Sooky,

You're a strange one. You think Mick Malthouse is "mediocre", you think Sheedy is overrated, you think Pagan is overratted and you think Blight is overrated.

Yet, you think Robert Walls is the best of the lot of them? Um....are you okay?

The 4 coaches mentioned above have the 4 best winning ratios in the league of the current coaches. Walls is nowhere near them.

Let me tell you a bit about Adelaides flag in 1997. The finals system had NOTHING to do with it. They had to win 4 consecutive finals (which no one had ever done before) to win the flag. It's not as if they lost and were allowed to continue (eg Crows 98, Carlton 99).

But finals aside, Adelaide had the best percentage. This means, in for and against terminology, they were the best. They scored the best in relation to what the opposition scored in the whole competiton. Their overall win-loss record was 17-9, while St.Kilda went 17-8. And remember, Adelaide had a better percentage than St.Kilda. And Blight was in charge of the Adelaide team that was able to accomplish this.

And concerning Pagan.....mark my words - he is a freak. Simply the greatest coach of the modern era. In my opinion the greatest of all time. They guy has had success at every level. As proved by his under 19's records, the playing lists are irrelevant. He just knows how to win. Carey is a convenient excure for Pagan haters to use to belittle the great coach.

You're a strnage one Sooky. It's funny, people often give credit to coaches (eg Robert Shaw) who brought in some future premiership players. But at some stage a coach is going to have to put the wins on the board. Malthouse, Pagan, Sheedy and Blight are proven winners over a long period of time.

Robert Walls on the other hand, might be an eloquent speaker and a nice guy, but he's certainly not the best coach, I can assure you.

 

[CJH]

I posted this a while back as part of a general rant on the past management of the Richmond Football Club. It may be appopriate in this discussion.

Posted by CJH way back last year:

We have seen instances where the process for choosing a new coach has been very poor - or even non existent. It is not Robert Walls fault that we performed so badly, as he shouldn't have been there in the first place. The management acted with far too much haste and appointed him based on reputation alone without any proper consideration of whether he was right for Richmond. As it turns out, he wasn't.

------------------
TigerFury.net - Independant Richmond Tigers website

 

[Same Old's]

Originally posted by Hit The Boundary Saints:
So Walls makes 100K in the media.
Blight make $1 million via coaching.

What would you rather do?

What have salaries got to do with this argument.

 

[Hit The Boundary Saints]

Same Olds
Only put that in because Kevin Sooky said that Walls makes more than 100K for his media work. If that is an arguement, then the counter arguement is Blight's current salary.