Who has the better youth, Hawthorn or Collingwood?

Who has the better youth, Hawthorn or Collingwood?

  • Hawthorn

    Votes: 80 57.6%
  • Collingwood

    Votes: 59 42.4%

  • Total voters
    139

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Pessimistic

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We should take our senior players off shortly.
From memory, the coaches had said during the week that the last 3 quarters were going to be mainly the new kids/VFL players.

Kreuger is hard at it. Maybe a young key forward to work with....

Hard to make out who was who as you could only tell the player in possession because commentary.

I’d sy if the last three periods were seconds level. the hawks boys did alright. But of course the ‘star’ was in the first half


You could argue the top end of Collingwood should be way better than hawks cos they get paid way more.

In the end hawks had a lot more scoring shots, but there were obvious periods where the pies were so much cleaner, which wins games most of the time

In the end the format worked better than 2 distinct games cos both teams could tailor game time for individual players
 
Last edited:

Rusty Beam

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I didn't know much about the pies but I think you have done very well with the Lipinski trade on face value. He was very good.

Very pleased with Lipinski’s performance. Particularly as an inside mid, rather than a wing (which I believe was originally the plan in his recruitment).

He was the dominant midfielder in the VFL last year playing that role and it looks like training reports about him excelling in it so far through the summer are spot on. Fills and absolute gap in the list age demographic too.
 

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master bate

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One preseason game is always an overreaction more than anything but that game had me thinking a lot more about coaches than young players.

Collingwood looked completely reinvigorated with a coach who can teach attacking ball movement for the first time in a decade.

I don't think their lists are similar and the Pies might be more in need to keep drafting but it reminded me of Essendon turning things around big time last year and suddenly a bunch of Bombers between 22-24 all looked so much better playing a proper brand of footy. I think that's the hope for the Pies, that their players in that similar age range start to show that maybe they don't need a full rebuild.

More week than not in 2021 the Hawks were competitive with a solid midfield and defensive game that kept them in games. As long as their senior players are all having shockers they'll probably get back to that and then a better judgement can be made on their kids.
 

VinnieB

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One preseason game is always an overreaction more than anything but that game had me thinking a lot more about coaches than young players.

Collingwood looked completely reinvigorated with a coach who can teach attacking ball movement for the first time in a decade.

I don't think their lists are similar and the Pies might be more in need to keep drafting but it reminded me of Essendon turning things around big time last year and suddenly a bunch of Bombers between 22-24 all looked so much better playing a proper brand of footy. I think that's the hope for the Pies, that their players in that similar age range start to show that maybe they don't need a full rebuild.

More week than not in 2021 the Hawks were competitive with a solid midfield and defensive game that kept them in games. As long as their senior players are all having shockers they'll probably get back to that and then a better judgement can be made on their kids.
I agree with the most part except that we really don’t have many in that 22-25 age range (which is why we went out and grabbed Lipinski and Krueger). Although that 25-28 we do have quality players.
So many under under 21, that another couple of seasons will bring them closer to that range. In the interim, another draft or 2 and trading for more players should fix that.
 

VinnieB

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How could anyone predict that Hawthorn posters would post in a thread discussing Hawthorn?

Pure nuff genius, guys.
Love to see the ratio of Hawthorn member posts v Pies member posts.
Pie fans obviously aren't overly fussed.
Me, I just love getting a rise out of the Hawk cheerleaders "LOL"
 

kirbatron

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some good youth on display for both clubs

didnt watch whole game but from what I saw

really like ginnivan, diacos bros, Bianco, Henry

for us
newk, MacDonald. ward looks ok.
 

VinnieB

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some good youth on display for both clubs

didnt watch whole game but from what I saw

really like ginnivan, diacos bros, Bianco, Henry

for us
newk, MacDonald. ward looks ok.
Out of interest, I know many Hawk fans are very excited about Reeves, however, what did you think about Lynch's ruck work in comparison?
 

hawkman

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Out of interest, I know many Hawk fans are very excited about Reeves, however, what did you think about Lynch's ruck work in comparison?
Hard to tell. Reeves was dominated by Grundy, Lynch didn't really go against Grundy but went against weaker rucks
 

kirbatron

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Out of interest, I know many Hawk fans are very excited about Reeves, however, what did you think about Lynch's ruck work in comparison?

Reeves looks to have a neater approach & decent tap work. Lynch has a stronger body & better competitiveness at this stage.

How do you rate Lynch as a developing ruck?
 

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VinnieB

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Reeves looks to have a neater approach & decent tap work. Lynch has a stronger body & better competitiveness at this stage.

How do you rate Lynch as a developing ruck?
I think he has promise. Would have liked to keep him but he needs to play regular senior footy and won’t unless Grundy’s injured. He is a nice tap ruckman and has a relatively good leap. He also is quite a strong runner. Not sure how he went in the 2km time trial at the Hawks but at Collingwood he was well up there.

He could improve his marking around the ground though. If he had that, he probably would have been given more opportunities.

But in the VFL he would have his fair sure of 20+ disposal games. So I’m unsure whether Reeves will be the clear cut 1st choice ruckman. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a competitive battle between the 2.

If you watch his game against Melbourne you’ll see he has potential.
 

Guardian Hawk

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Out of interest, I know many Hawk fans are very excited about Reeves, however, what did you think about Lynch's ruck work in comparison?

As already highlighted, Grundy taught Reeves a bit of a lesson. But it is of note that Reeves was the starting ruck in the A side and Lynch was in the B side (suggesting that may be the pecking order to date). Also, given the hiding we were copping at the centre bounce, Lynch was deployed early against Grundy as well to give us a look at the difference. Which, to be honest, really made no difference at all.

Whilst they were both well beaten by Grundy, the actual hit outs were more 50/50 with Grundy v Reeves than Grundy v Lynch. Grundy's dominance of Reeves was more the stoppage work after the hit out - which was a general team dominance anyway (Hawthorn struggled in the centre in general, often not getting the clearance even when they got hand on it first thanks to great pressure and more refined stoppage work from the Pies). In other words, they were both well beaten by Grundy but I felt more confidence in Reeves ability to compete in the actual ruckwork than I did for Lynch.

Lynch may have more of an influence in around the ground and follow up work but that was hard to tell from this contest as neither were particularly influential in the first half hiding whilst Lynch was influential in the last 3 periods but that was (a) up against Darcy Cameron (and others) instead of Grundy and (b) within the context of a dominant side (in a lower standard) rather than a dominated side.
 

Pessimistic

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"I feel genuinely sorry for Hawk fans that their biggest highlight of 2022 will be a grainy, poorly captured practice game from February, that they'll need to commence at the halfway mark".

You seem to be taking the preseason game hard. Again finding ways to convince yourself how well you went, while finding ways to knock the Pies performance. You did well quarters 5 and 6, which I'm sure you can take into the season. Although it may be you are unlikely to play a team fielding collectively approx 200 games between them v 900 games from the Hawks.

It was sheils Hardwick Howe lynch and Phillips. The latter two actuall in Collingwood VFL recently. In period 5 and 6
 

aussierulesrules

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Against Richmond today, Josh Ward had 29 disposals (2nd-most on ground), 19 contested possessions (most on the ground by 6!), a game-high 9 intercept possessions, equal-game high 6 clearances, 6 score involvements and 421m-gained.

All from just 67% game time!

Looks like they’ve got a Walsh/Brayshaw type there.
 

Nutjob

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Against Richmond today, Josh Ward had 29 disposals (2nd-most on ground), 19 contested possessions (most on the ground by 6!), a game-high 9 intercept possessions, equal-game high 6 clearances, 6 score involvements and 421m-gained.

All from just 67% game time!

Looks like they’ve got a Walsh/Brayshaw type there.

Let’s wait for the real stuff before we label him in the Walsh category. He did play well though.


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Nutjob

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And yet, as expected, a quick look through your posting history tells me you've already likened JHF to Gary Ablett Snr.

Wow, you must have some spare time on your hands

It might be a bit difficult for you to comprehend champ, but there is a difference between Ward being the next Walsh and JHF having a similar playing style to Ablett snr. Please quote me on any post where I remotely suggest JHF will be as good as Ablett snr.


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Wow, you must have some spare time on your hands

It might be a bit difficult for you to comprehend champ, but there is a difference between Ward being the next Walsh and JHF having a similar playing style to Ablett snr. Please quote me on any post where I remotely suggest JHF will be as good as Ablett snr.


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Did you not realise when you posted what you did regarding Ward, that it takes one click to search for posts from you that mention the word “JHF”?
 

chopflop

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If daicos is streets ahead of Ward he will be pretty darned good.

That was an elite performance for a zero gamer.
 

Freomaniac

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1. Young Key Forwards - actually Kreuger is a forward but couldn't break into the Geelong forward line and so they played him in a couple of games in defence. However, The Pies attempted to get him previously as a forward. McMahon is a 19 year old key forward we recruited in the 2020 draft. Assuming we are bottom 3, there are highly talented key forwards in this draft.
2. Dean has been recruited as a key defender and is likely to play in Round 1. Begg was recruited as a key position player (defender or forward). Not sure why we are desperate for key defenders given Moore's age.
3. If you think your defenders are comfortably ahead of IQ, you should watch IQ more often. Also Ruscoe will be the best of the lot.
4. Poulter??? Probably has the lowest ceiling of our midfielders. Macrae tracking like his brother. McInness will be the interesting one. Highly rated (injured in 1st year), 192cm quick midfielder who may even play off half back. Also, watch out for Arlo Draper. This kid looks like a ripper and may well be a steal.
Daicos has been said to be one of the best young talents to come out of the draft over the past decade. You've already capped his ability??? Callum Twomey will tell you all about it.
5. I'm surprised you have forgotten Ginnivan as a small forward. Kicked 3 goals against you in his 2 or 3rd game.

As we have said, the Hawks 'youth' have a few years on the Collingwood kids, who were largely recruited in the 2020 draft. When they hit 22/23yrs of age like many of your better players, I'd be disappointed if a few of them weren't showing far more.

The Pies are building. We are 1 year into it. Hopefully we do it properly and build a team to win a premiership, and not just make up the numbers in the 8.
Nathan Kreuger was a solid player before he was picked up by thw cats.

Yep I am going to be slightly biased.

Kreuger did come from my SANFL club south Adelaide Panthers.

Played in the ressies and under 18s in the 1st half of that SANFL season. Then played a bunch of senior games in the 2nd half of the season, including that elim final loss to North Adelaide roosters.

I just think geelong was the wrong club to get him at the time. Crows might of been an ok choice at the time or any bottom 6 club in 2018