Who has the better youth, Hawthorn or Collingwood?

[Northernsoul74]

Pies mids >>> Hawks mids

Pies forwards > Hawks forwards
Hawthorn defence >> Pies defence

Thoughts?

What’s so great about the Pies mids?

 

[HairyO]

It's funny, Hawthorn aren't even the most impressive of those three sides yet some supporters carry on like they are a year away from the 8.

Yet we are far more likely to win a final before Essendon does.

 

[HairyO]

It does if he's a top shelf superstar

Remember when Judd started at the Eagles, they went straight into the 8, then he went to Carlton and the same thing happened

Nothing to do with Cousins, Cox, Gardiner, Sampi, Hunter, McIntosh, Jakovich, etc.

And I think Carlton went in to the 8 because Essendon got booted

 

[VinnieB]

With North steamrolling the Hawthorn/Adelaide/North thread, I think it's time for these two sides to have their own poll.

Hawks - Day, CJ, Scrimshaw, DGB, Ward, Kozi, Lewis, Butler, McDonald, Worpel, Moore, Bramble, Brockman, Long, Jeka, Newcombe.

Pies - Daicos x2, Macrae, Reef, Henry, Bianco, IQ, Draper, McMahon, Ginnivan, Beau, Kreuger

Both sides have a lot of holes - Early stages of their rebuild & a long road ahead... Whos youth would you prefer?

what about Ruscoe, Lipinski and Dean? Kelly? Begg? Tyler Brown?
The interesting thing about what you have listed is that the Hawks have a few years already on the Pies and they are still very ordinary. A number of them seem to be 23 now or this season. CJ, Scrimshaw, Lewis (24 this year), Worpel, Moore, Bramble (24 this year). Apart from Day, no superstars here. Basic, solid 'citizens' at best.

 

[VinnieB]

Pies mids >>> Hawks mids
Pies forwards > Hawks forwards
Hawthorn defence >> Pies defence

Thoughts?

Ruscoe is very under-rated. Was finally played on the backline late in the season which is where he played in his draft year. His strength, composure with the ball and usage were excellent.

 

[Matrix10]

Hawthorn by a stretch from where I’m sitting.

Bit like Milne in the goal square with a minute to go , he was definitely on a couch

 

[Matrix10]

Pies mids >>> Hawks mids

What’s so great about the Pies mids?

Lipinski

 

[Matrix10]

what about Ruscoe, Lipinski and Dean? Kelly? Begg? Tyler Brown?
The interesting thing about what you have listed is that the Hawks have a few years already on the Pies and they are still very ordinary. A number of them seem to be 23 now or this season. CJ, Scrimshaw, Lewis (24 this year), Worpel, Moore, Bramble (24 this year). Apart from Day, no superstars here. Basic, solid 'citizens' at best.

You got me a tad excited, then you mentioned T Brown , totally deflated me

 

[Osho]

Judging by cheer squads, Hawks trim nubile Danielle has the Pies toothless Marge covered.

 

[WWSD]

With North steamrolling the Hawthorn/Adelaide/North thread, I think it's time for these two sides to have their own poll.

Hawks - Day, CJ, Scrimshaw, DGB, Ward, Kozi, Lewis, Butler, McDonald, Worpel, Moore, Bramble, Brockman, Long, Jeka, Newcombe.

Pies - Daicos x2, Macrae, Reef, Henry, Bianco, IQ, Draper, McMahon, Ginnivan, Beau, Kreuger

Both sides have a lot of holes - Early stages of their rebuild & a long road ahead... Whos youth would you prefer?

Hawthorn and Collingwood are likely to finish above North Melbourne on the ladder again. lol

Enjoy your holiday.

 

[Northernsoul74]

Lipinski

Sometimes I wonder if any Pies fan have actually seen Lipinski play before.

 

[VinnieB]

Joshua Ward! But nah one player doesn’t make a team better than the other especially if the rest of the talent ain’t close.

Ward was probably your club’s 5th choice. JHF and Daicos untouchable, and you tried to trade with GWS for Callaghan.

But as a typical Hawk fan, keep believing Ward was your club’s 1st choice if they had the number 1 pick in the draft.

 

[VinnieB]

Sometimes I wonder if any Pies fan have actually seen Lipinski play before.

Not saying he’s a star. Just listing the players the OP had of both sides that are considered ‘young’.

Either way I’m sure he will be make a contribution to our side.

 

[Yoda_]

what about Ruscoe, Lipinski and Dean? Kelly? Begg? Tyler Brown?
The interesting thing about what you have listed is that the Hawks have a few years already on the Pies and they are still very ordinary. A number of them seem to be 23 now or this season. CJ, Scrimshaw, Lewis (24 this year), Worpel, Moore, Bramble (24 this year). Apart from Day, no superstars here. Basic, solid 'citizens' at best.

Playing devils advocate here, the list of Collingwood's next gen of guys under 24 hasn't exactly set the world on fire either. IF anything, the Hawks top 3 / 4 have shown much more than Collingwoods top 2 / 3 under 24. Scrimshaw, CJ, Day seem well ahead of J.Daicos, C.Brown, with Isaac Quaynor the only guy in the conversation of those Hawks three.

Not to be detrimental to the topic, but every draftee that gets brought in is set to light the comp on fire so lets leave those 2021 draftees out of the conversation.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Ward was probably your club’s 5th choice. JHF and Daicos untouchable, and you tried to trade with GWS for Callaghan.

But as a typical Hawk fan, keep believing Ward was your club’s 1st choice if they had the number 1 pick in the draft.

Aww Vinnie, no one has even suggested this.

Hawks posters have simply said that they’re very happy with Ward.

 

[Rusty Beam]

what about Ruscoe, Lipinski and Dean? Kelly? Begg? Tyler Brown?
The interesting thing about what you have listed is that the Hawks have a few years already on the Pies and they are still very ordinary. A number of them seem to be 23 now or this season. CJ, Scrimshaw, Lewis (24 this year), Worpel, Moore, Bramble (24 this year). Apart from Day, no superstars here. Basic, solid 'citizens' at best.

I’m not getting this obsession with youth in these multiple threads. Most successful teams have significant age demographic spread across their list.

Regardless it’s also way too early to make predictions in relation to most of these players. Particularly those recruited in the last few years with the covid interruptions to the NAB league and their first years of VFL development.

It ends up being opinion (and a consequential pissing match) based on nothing other than bias.

For example (and not meant as a potshot) Will Phillips has been talked up in the other thread as a potential elite, yet statistically at this stage he is almost identical to a less exposed Finn Macrae.

 

[VinnieB]

Playing devils advocate here, the list of Collingwood's next gen of guys under 24 hasn't exactly set the world on fire either. IF anything, the Hawks top 3 / 4 have shown much more than Collingwoods top 2 / 3 under 24. Scrimshaw, CJ, Day seem well ahead of J.Daicos, C.Brown, with Isaac Quaynor the only guy in the conversation of those Hawks three.

Not to be detrimental to the topic, but every draftee that gets brought in is set to light the comp on fire so lets leave those 2021 draftees out of the conversation.

Yes, but as mentioned, most of the Collingwood youth is 20 and under. 9 players debuted in 2021. The Hawks have had the benefit of many of their ‘youth’ being 22-23 yr olds (a couple listed will be 24 this season). Josh Daicos and IQ are equal to their best at 22/23. Day looks a standout.

Don’t get me wrong, the Pies will be near the bottom which we need to be as if we are going to do the rebuild right, we need to bring in more top tier talent.

Hawks expect to push for finals with that list. They aren’t going anywhere. That’s why they were keen on unloading senior players for more early draft picks which they failed to get.

No surprise North are light years ahead of the Hawks in terms of young talent. They have used the draft and recruited to advantage. Probably knew exactly where they were. Hawks haven’t been able to admit how ordinary they are. And it looks like their fans are the same.

 

[VinnieB]

Aww Vinnie, no one has even suggested this.

Hawks posters have simply said that they’re very happy with Ward.

You need to speak with your mate

 

[StillAtLarge]

what about Ruscoe, Lipinski and Dean? Kelly? Begg? Tyler Brown?
The interesting thing about what you have listed is that the Hawks have a few years already on the Pies and they are still very ordinary. A number of them seem to be 23 now or this season. CJ, Scrimshaw, Lewis (24 this year), Worpel, Moore, Bramble (24 this year). Apart from Day, no superstars here. Basic, solid 'citizens' at best.

You're a bit harsh with your analysis I think. Scrimshaw and Moore are good footballers already who will only improve with the return of Sicily and Gunston. CJ showed a lot of promise last season (but may struggle as oppo teams seek to nullify his influence) while the jury is still out on the others. Yes, Day is probably the only potential 'superstar' but that says more about his rare talent than anything else.
Aside from Henry and N Daicos (who I'm yet to see play at any level) how many potential superstars do the Pies have on the list?

 

[TheUnicorn]

Essendon.

 

[Nutjob]

Hawthorn and Collingwood are likely to finish above North Melbourne on the ladder again. lol

Enjoy your holiday.

Maybe, but that’s because most of their good players are older. Finishing higher doesn’t make either team closer to a flag.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[VinnieB]

You're a bit harsh with your analysis I think. Scrimshaw and Moore are good footballers already who will only improve with the return of Sicily and Gunston. CJ showed a lot of promise last season (but may struggle as oppo teams seek to nullify his influence) while the jury is still out on the others. Yes, Day is probably the only potential 'superstar' but that says more about his rare talent than anything else.
Aside from Henry and N Daicos (who I'm yet to see play at any level) how many potential superstars do the Pies have on the list?

Not sure. The crop have only played about 10 games in their first season as we have only just commenced the rebuild. I dare say a couple more seasons near the bottom will give us the opportunity to bring in more elite top 3 talent.

I don’t expect miracles and I don’t expect to be moving up the ladder quickly. I hope we do the rebuild properly as there’s no need making finals and not having the team/talent to win the premiership.

I suppose the question is who has the better youth? Well I’d be disappointed if in 3 years time we were at where the Hawks are today in terms of players under 24.

By the way the age seemed to have moved from under 22 to under 24. I wonder why?

 

[freddy mercury]

Roos. Roos. Roos. So much Roos I feel like starting threads to gloat about the Roos youf.

100%

 

[The Nostradamus]

Pretty even tbh

Daicos would be my first player chosen but then I’d probably choose CJ then Day then quaynor

 

[HairyO]

Pretty even tbh

Daicos would be my first player chosen but then I’d probably choose CJ then Day then quaynor

Makes sense.
You lot do enjoy pinning all your hopes on a player yet to have even played a game.