Who will be better in 2026? Geelong or Gold Coast.

[Scotland]

People picking combined 22s rarely have much of a clue.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Is this on some sort of perceived talent thing or something else? Im confused, as you have the likes of Waterman and Yeo in there, but don't have Baker, despite being your highest rated player last year.

IF it's on actual performances of a combined side like that person was alluding, it's laughable.


Zuhaar would have won West Coasts goal kicking last year by almost 20 goals, but 1 game Dovaston from our own side would be ahead of him?

Like Duusma is selected and Simpkin who averaged 23 disposals a game and kicked 15 goals isnt...

If it's on talent, I'd have a few players ahead of even the North players you have listed.

I'd need to understand the criteria tbh.

I was referencing 2026, so the combined side playing tomorrow, and I think the combined side still misses the 8.

 

[SSSSSS]

Is this on some sort of perceived talent thing or something else? Im confused, as you have the likes of Waterman and Yeo in there, but don't have Baker, despite being your highest rated player last year.

IF it's on actual performances of a combined side like that person was alluding, it's laughable.


Zuhaar would have won West Coasts goal kicking last year by almost 20 goals, but 1 game Dovaston from our own side would be ahead of him?

Like Duusma is selected and Simpkin who averaged 23 disposals a game and kicked 15 goals isnt...

If it's on talent, I'd have a few players ahead of even the North players you have listed.

I'd need to understand the criteria tbh.

Bit of column A bit of column B. Mainly vibes, I haven't really given it too much thought.

I don't think Zuurhaar has the tank/workrate to play as a modern high half forward. I'd have Waterman ahead of him as that third tall. I am a big believer in Lachy D, I think he's a Dylan Moore clone. He'll be a 20 disposal 1 goal a game type player IMO rather than a pure small forward.

Simpkin is basically a whipping boy at North and I wouldn't want a bloke with his kicking skills to play on the outside. I could put him on the bench as a rotation instead of Hewett but I think there's enough mids on the bench as it is.

I'd replace Baker for Yeo. Baker on the HBF. FOS on the bench.

 

[Sphynx]

I was referencing 2026, so the combined side playing tomorrow, and I think the combined side still misses the 8.

Win now omissions from our side are definitely Parker, Zurhaar, Darling, Simpkin and Stephens then.

If I'm winning tomorrow and a gun to my head, it's Larkey, Trembath and Waterman/Darling also.

 

[Sphynx]

Bit of column A bit of column B. Mainly vibes, I haven't really given it too much thought.

I don't think Zuurhaar has the tank/workrate to play as a modern high half forward. I'd have Waterman ahead of him as that third tall. I am a big believer in Lachy D, I think he's a Dylan Moore clone. He'll be a 20 disposal 1 goal a game type player IMO rather than a pure small forward.

Simpkin is basically a whipping boy at North and I wouldn't want a bloke with his kicking skills to play on the outside. I could put him on the bench as a rotation instead of Hewett but I think there's enough mids on the bench as it is.

I'd replace Baker for Yeo. Baker on the HBF. FOS on the bench.

Zurhaar kicked just under 40 goals last season...


I agree Simpkin is a whipping boy at times, but if kicking skills are a pre-requisite Harley Reid, Hewett and Ginbey belong absolutely nowhere near it.

Hewett was statistically one of the worst ball users and decision makers in the entire league last season.

 

[SSSSSS]

Zurhaar kicked just under 40 goals last season...


I agree Simpkin is a whipping boy at times, but if kicking skills are a pre-requisite Harley Reid, Hewett and Ginbey belong absolutely nowhere near it.

Hewett was statistically one of the worst ball users and decision makers in the entire league last season.

I think you can forgive the kicking skills of someone in the coal face like Harley or a stopper in Ginbey. Poor kicking as a wingman or on a flank is pretty unforgiveable.

 

[Doashuey]

Bit of column A bit of column B. Mainly vibes, I haven't really given it too much thought.

I don't think Zuurhaar has the tank/workrate to play as a modern high half forward. I'd have Waterman ahead of him as that third tall. I am a big believer in Lachy D, I think he's a Dylan Moore clone. He'll be a 20 disposal 1 goal a game type player IMO rather than a pure small forward.

Simpkin is basically a whipping boy at North and I wouldn't want a bloke with his kicking skills to play on the outside. I could put him on the bench as a rotation instead of Hewett but I think there's enough mids on the bench as it is.

I'd replace Baker for Yeo. Baker on the HBF. FOS on the bench.

Long would be the first one out IMO. Aside from being horribly injured, he has been a fringe player who has some great footy IQ but doesnt hit the scoreboard near enough for a FP.

 

[Sphynx]

I think you can forgive the kicking skills of someone in the coal face like Harley or a stopper in Ginbey. Poor kicking as a wingman or on a flank is pretty unforgiveable.

I’m not talking about disposal efficiency and the advanced stats already take into account contested situations and the difficulty of using it in there.

All 3 of them are horrible users by foot in any scenario in any position on the ground. They aren’t particularly good decision makers (I.e their execution is explained by their attacking ball use) either.

Hewett had a massively negative retention rating which is a measure against AFL average. So by definition his kicks are retained at a much lower rate than the average AFL kicking the ball in the same situation.

He had a massively negative threat rating also, meaning anytime he kicks the ball he actually prevents or breaks down West Coast scoring chains if he’s involved, not facilitates it.

 

[SSSSSS]

Long would be the first one out IMO. Aside from being horribly injured, he has been a fringe player who has some great footy IQ but doesnt hit the scoreboard near enough for a FP.

Unfortunately I don't really think either side are brimming with talented small forwards.

I've liked Long from what I've seen of him but he does seem to be made of glass.

 

[SSSSSS]

I’m not talking about disposal efficiency and the advanced stats already take into account contested situations and the difficulty of using it in there.

All 3 of them are horrible users by foot in any scenario in any position on the ground. They aren’t particularly good decision makers (I.e their execution is explained by their attacking ball use) either

Simpkin isn't getting picked ahead of any of Reid, LDU, Wardlaw, Powell, Sheezel for CBA time. Could even add the likes of FOS who saw a lot of on ball time on the weekend. I like him a lot - reminds me of Bartel, just plug him anywhere and he'll do well.

If I'm trying to build a side to be competitive enough whilst developing the future I'd be moving away from him - whether in the guts or on the outside. Which is why I didn't have him in my initial combined 23.

 

[Doashuey]

I’m not talking about disposal efficiency and the advanced stats already take into account contested situations and the difficulty of using it in there.

All 3 of them are horrible users by foot in any scenario in any position on the ground. They aren’t particularly good decision makers (I.e their execution is explained by their attacking ball use) either

I've seen you make reference to these advanced kicking stats in other threads. Can you share where you find these please?
I expect that they may also be skewed somewhat by the team's ability to not f**k up the possession chain- something that we are quite adept at and the teams ability to provide good options by having good structures (we do not). So I suspect that these aspects may impact the disposal efficiency of players in poor teams.
Anyway, be good to have a look at them.

 

[Doashuey]

Unfortunately I don't really think either side are brimming with talented small forwards.

I've liked Long from what I've seen of him but he does seem to be made of glass.

Newton is showing early signs of being more than handy as a FP.
Milan Murdoch has been on the list 2 weeks and killed it- 22 possessions, 14 contested, 8 score involvements, 2 goals, 4 clearances and 5 tackles. Not a bad debut, one to watch.

 

[SSSSSS]

I think what the combined side demonstrates that is there is plenty of talent on both lists (both proven and unproven). The problem is both sides have a really crap bottom 6-10. North's improved a lot. The Eagles is still dire.

 

[Sherbert99]

Gold Coast by a mile.

Geelong are still dependent on a 33 year old and a 36 year old. Not good enough to contend for the foreseeable future.

 

[stallon]

B: Ginbey Edwards Archer
HB: FOS Comben McCarthy
C: W. Duursma Sheezel McKercher
HF: Curtis Shanahan Dovaston
F: Waterman Larkey Long

Foll: Xerri H. Reid LDU

I/C: Powell Wardlaw Yeo Hewett Trembath

If I had to give it a go for a combined best 23 on talent/form I'd have the above. Maybe swap one of the mids on the bench for a runner/utility (Hewett being the weakest of the bunch and first to go).

10 WCE players. 13 NM players, with a few more senior players for North (as you'd expect).

Youve missed Hough, Starcevich, Baker
Honestly it probably should be 5 or 6 out of 7 defenders selected from the Eagles

Trembath vs CDT vs Archer Reid, Archer and CDT are better rucks, CDT is the most talented by far, but Trembath has shown arguably more due to being in a slightly better performing side. Id put CDT, as there is already 3 other KPFs in the side anyway.

Drop Archer for Hough
Drop Hewett and Long for Baker and Starcevich
Put Yeo into that hff spot, Dovaston/Curtis to the forward pocket

 

[stallon]

It's a stupid binary discussion.

Sheezel (Wardlaw/Cadman really) vs Ginbey and Hewett is fair game. We either do the trade and have picks 9 and 14, or we don't and have pick 3. Even if we do get Sheezel let's not pretend he's transformed North. 68 games almost 2000 possessions, 12 wins.

I agree, I dont rate Sheezel as highly as a lot do. Hard to show much more as a more outside leaning player in a midfield that hasnt really clicked yet

Trading pick 3 as part of the Baker deal was dumb at the time, is dumb today and will be dumb for the rest of time. Picks 15 and 17 is simply not enough for pick 3, regardless of how we used them. A decent list manager would've brought in Baker and kept pick 3, or brought in Baker and gone to the draft with more than pick 15.

Yes we took unders, but whether it was a good or bad trade in the final result will be determined in years to come, we dont know right now

 

[stallon]

I think what the combined side demonstrates that is there is plenty of talent on both lists (both proven and unproven). The problem is both sides have a really crap bottom 6-10. North's improved a lot. The Eagles is still dire.

The eagles bottom 6(its more like 10-12) in the named 22 each week is now just kids, its not shit players anymore

Dire isnt the right word

 

[Scotland]

I agree, I dont rate Sheezel as highly as a lot do. Hard to show much more as a more outside leaning player in a midfield that hasnt really clicked yet

It's rare that any one young player is fortune changing. Even Harley Reid was dominant in some of his first 5-10 games but had second year blues sponsored by Hungry Jack's and we still suck.

Yes we took unders, but whether it was a good or bad trade in the final result will be determined in years to come, we dont know right now

Nah we know now. If Allan turns out to be a good pick at 16 great, but that doesn't justify trading pick 3 for magic beans. We could have had pick 3 and traded into the pick 15-20 range if we wanted to. Also the spectre of Murphy Reid being pick 17 is always going to hang over the whole thing,

 

[stallon]

Nah we know now. If Allan turns out to be a good pick at 16 great, but that doesn't justify trading pick 3 for magic beans. We could have had pick 3 and traded into the pick 15-20 range if we wanted to. Also the spectre of Murphy Reid being pick 17 is always going to hang over the whole thing,

We dont know lmfao you think Jagga and Bo are the complete product already?
Bo could be better than Jagga in a few years

Shit happens clubs dont absolutely nail every pick, and Murphy Reid could be close to his peak already while Bo is a few years away.

 

[Scotland]

We dont know lmfao you think Jagga and Bo are the complete product already?
Bo could be better than Jagga in a few years

Shit happens clubs dont absolutely nail every pick, and Murphy Reid could be close to his peak already while Bo is a few years away.

It. Is. Not. Jagga. Vs. Bo.

It's pick 3 vs pick 15 and pick 17. Not even an academy club accumulating points is doing that trade.

 

[SSSSSS]

It. Is. Not. Jagga. Vs. Bo.

It's pick 3 vs pick 15 and pick 17. Not even an academy club accumulating points is doing that trade.

I still have NFI how your team green lighted that trade.

The pick swap North did which cost them a first rounder last year was also another doozy.

 

[Del239335]

Gold Coast by a mile.

Geelong are still dependent on a 33 year old and a 36 year old. Not good enough to contend for the foreseeable future.

You're probably right about them finishing higher than us this year. However, I still expect us to contend for premierships in both the present and near future and if we get Zak Butters then look out.

 

[Scotland]

I still have NFI how your team green lighted that trade.

The pick swap North did which cost them a first rounder last year was also another doozy.

The fan reaction when it was mooted was a mixture of anger and disbelief. Most thought it was a BigFooty special yet here we are.

 

[Sherbert99]

You're probably right about them finishing higher than us this year. However, I still expect us to contend for premierships in both the present and near future and if we get Zak Butters then look out.

Doubt it.
If you regularly rely on a 33 year old and a 36 year old to pull you over the line, and have the worst rucks in the comp, it generally doesn't bode well for contending.

 

[stallon]

It. Is. Not. Jagga. Vs. Bo.

It's pick 3 vs pick 15 and pick 17. Not even an academy club accumulating points is doing that trade.

Look at the final result of it, not just the picks from pre-draft...