Preview Who will finish higher - Sydney, GWS or Geelong

Who finishes higher in 2019?


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adammania9

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#27
I reckon the Giants are putting together some real scare and competitive edge, and I can definitely see them challenging all year long and even finish top two. After a poor 4-5-1 start, they went almost undefeated for the H&A season until injuries tore apart all progress in those last couple that took them out of top four contention. People will easily forget but GWS for the most part looked the second or third best side in the comp during the latter half of the year. I don’t think Shiel and Lobb are significant losses as they will be replaced without too much hassle.

I dig GWS in 2019, I reckon now that they’re catching many sleeping on them, they’ll get it together. Will need a fair injury run but.

The Catters have plenty of on-field talent and their best 22 has clearly improved again over the off-season. If they can alter their game plan to work out bigger grounds particularly the MCG, there’s no reason they can’t go very deep into September. The midfield needs to pick up some slack but - it’s close to the league’s best on paper but it seriously underperformed in 2018.

Sydney might make finals but I give them no chance at a premiership, and whilst the decline is a yearly expectation that never comes, I do think it is this year and they’ll miss the eight. They run a dry game plan with an unaddressed issue of a selected few players carrying some serious baggage every week. It’s not a very inspiring list they’re working with at the moment, and that finals loss to GWS embodies where the list stands compared to the league’s premiership contenders.
 

newblueo

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#28
How have the cats got stronger with no best 22 player other then dal coming in with Henderson Taylor.hawkins an co a year older.

Swans will be lucky to kick 10 goals a game but have some great youth so maybe a downward step next year.

Gws will be top 3 they have Hooper to cover the midfield loss.
 

owen87

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#29
GWS easily the most likely for me; all they need is a decent run with injury and a few gameplan tweaks and they're right in the mix.

Swans / Geelong relying on a lot more to go right, but history suggests not to write them off either.

If Ablett is firing, and they get their gameplan right, I can see Geelong improving even without new recruits.

Swans need some fairly big gameplan changes I believe, add that to some injury clouds over Menzel and Franklin, Kennedy not looking the player he was, and there's a lot of questions to answer.

It's an even comp currently, so there's about a dozen or so teams all potentially able to finish in the 8, and likely only 1 - 2 wins at most between finals and top 4.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#30
GWS easily the most likely for me; all they need is a decent run with injury and a few gameplan tweaks and they're right in the mix.

Swans / Geelong relying on a lot more to go right, but history suggests not to write them off either.

If Ablett is firing, and they get their gameplan right, I can see Geelong improving even without new recruits.

Swans need some fairly big gameplan changes I believe, add that to some injury clouds over Menzel and Franklin, Kennedy not looking the player he was, and there's a lot of questions to answer.

It's an even comp currently, so there's about a dozen or so teams all potentially able to finish in the 8, and likely only 1 - 2 wins at most between finals and top 4.
It might be more than 12. It would be interesting to know what's in Fagan or Lyons mind as they approach the season. Are they thinking push hard for finals or develop the playing group for future years is their priority.

Richardson must be thinking finals I think. Down year last year but they looked ready in 2017.

:straining: I'm just watching the replay of our draw at Etthiad on fix so I may be a but bullish on the Saints right now
 

owen87

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#31
It might be more than 12. It would be interesting to know what's in Fagan or Lyons mind as they approach the season. Are they thinking push hard for finals or develop the playing group for future years is their priority.

Richardson must be thinking finals I think. Down year last year but they looked ready in 2017.

:straining: I'm just watching the replay of our draw at Etthiad on fix so I may be a but bullish on the Saints right now
I think Freo and St Kilda are outside chances of finals at best based on 2018, Brisbane has the talent and a good gamestyle to watch but might be a year or two early for them to have the consistency not to drop a few games. Freo more likely due to at least having some kind of home ground advantage, and with a fit Sandilands + Fyfe kicking to Hogan & Lobb they have some semblance of a structure.

Saints plucked that one out of nowhere last year to steal a draw, they're not on the same planet as a firing GWS though.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#32
I think Freo and St Kilda are outside chances of finals at best based on 2018, Brisbane has the talent and a good gamestyle to watch but might be a year or two early for them to have the consistency not to drop a few games. Freo more likely due to at least having some kind of home ground advantage, and with a fit Sandilands + Fyfe kicking to Hogan & Lobb they have some semblance of a structure.

Saints plucked that one out of nowhere last year to steal a draw, they're not on the same planet as a firing GWS though.
With Freo and Brisbane I was thinking more what's in the coaches mind.

A coach could make short term decisions to win games, or concentrate more on the longer term playing structures.

With Lobb for instance, we often started him on the wing and used him as a get out option around the ground. That's more complicated to fit into your team structures I think. He needs mids/crumbers to hang off him if he cant mark.

On the other hand in a new playing group you could just plunk him forward and tell him try and catch it when it comes his way. He's pretty good at that. Small forwards are generally nearby in that case, and it might be a good short term option.
 

owen87

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#33
With Freo and Brisbane I was thinking more what's in the coaches mind.

A coach could make short term decisions to win games, or concentrate more on the longer term playing structures.

With Lobb for instance, we often started him on the wing and used him as a get out option around the ground. That's more complicated to fit into your team structures I think. He needs mids/crumbers to hang off him if he cant mark.

On the other hand in a new playing group you could just plunk him forward and tell him try and catch it when it comes his way. He's pretty good at that. Small forwards are generally nearby in that case, and it might be a good short term option.
I think Fagan is going long-term; putting together (roughly) the structure he wants to play moving forward.

Lyon who knows what he'll do. Lobb FF with Hogan CHF wouldn't be the worst forward-line in the world but probably wastes both their mobility a bit.

I think Fagan knows he's covered for a few years yet, so won't rush for short-term results. Ross (and Richardson) both need some signs of life this season I'd say.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#34
I think Fagan is going long-term; putting together (roughly) the structure he wants to play moving forward.

Lyon who knows what he'll do. Lobb FF with Hogan CHF wouldn't be the worst forward-line in the world but probably wastes both their mobility a bit.

I think Fagan knows he's covered for a few years yet, so won't rush for short-term results. Ross (and Richardson) both need some signs of life this season I'd say.
I think you might be right. The Lions are more on a path to create a winning playing group largely from scratch. Freo are trying more to fill holes to get back on top.

The lions might have the best long term prospects in that case but Freo might have more success next year.
 

owen87

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#35
I think you might be right. The Lions are more on a path to create a winning playing group largely from scratch. Freo are trying more to fill holes to get back on top.

The lions might have the best long term prospects in that case but Freo might have more success next year.
Fremantle are a weird one, their list isn't terrible but they seem to fall off a cliff each year. Sandilands with Darcy as backup is a solid ruck, Fyfe is a star and their young mids are quality (enough). I think it's between the ears with them a lot, they're playing a game plan that perhaps the players don't believe in?

I think Brisbane look genuinely a finals bound side in time, whether that's 1-2 years or 3-5 remains to be seen.
 

Joao

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#36
Fremantle are a weird one, their list isn't terrible but they seem to fall off a cliff each year. Sandilands with Darcy as backup is a solid ruck, Fyfe is a star and their young mids are quality (enough). I think it's between the ears with them a lot, they're playing a game plan that perhaps the players don't believe in?

I think Brisbane look genuinely a finals bound side in time, whether that's 1-2 years or 3-5 remains to be seen.
The players believe the game plan fine at home they just go to water on the road (except to Carlton). That is 100% between the ears. Maturity thing so will take time.

Also we have a habit of getting 60% of our quality senior players injured by the bye so that the poor kids fatigue trying to carry the load in the second half of the season.
 

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HairyO

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#39
The season percentage for all clubs is measured over 22 H/A games though. You could prove anything about any club by picking two.
Of you go then.

Find another team that had a similar % boost at the end of the year and see who they played.

Then middle of the year.

Then start of the year.

I bet you have a fair bit of success at the start, some in the middle, and none at the end.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#40
Of you go then.

Find another team that had a similar % boost at the end of the year and see who they played.

Then middle of the year.

Then start of the year.

I bet you have a fair bit of success at the start, some in the middle, and none at the end.
No need

The concept is absurd, I dont have any interest in proving anything.
 

Testekill

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#42
GWS and that's because the cracks are starting to form for Sydney & Geelong. Giants are the only ones that I don't think will slide
 

LukeParkerno1

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#43
GWS should easily finish higher. They should be aiming to win or go very close to doing that. Sydney and Geelong should be happy with a 5-10 finish, somewhere in that range.
 
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#45
Geelong and GWS poorly coached in my opinion.

Sydney with a poor to average list dotted with some superstars.
I'm no Chris Scott sympathiser, but when he took over at the end of 2010, the odds would of been long in us making 7 out of 8 finals series including a premiership..... So to call him "poor" is quite harsh I think..... On topic, I see all 3 teams playing finals again, with the Giants to be top 4, and the Cats & Swans to be 5-8.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#46
I'm no Chris Scott sympathiser, but when he took over at the end of 2010, the odds would of been long in us making 7 out of 8 finals series including a premiership..... So to call him "poor" is quite harsh I think..... On topic, I see all 3 teams playing finals again, with the Giants to be top 4, and the Cats & Swans to be 5-8.
The Cats have won the tactical battle against us for the last couple if years when you look at the details.
 
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#47
The Cats have won the tactical battle against us for the last couple if years when you look at the details.
True, we put alot of work into your running players, such as Whitfield, Kelly & Shaw....Kardinia Park's dimensions help us in that respect also..... I also think the heat Leon Cameron cops is unfair, it's been pretty clear that the giants ( and pies ) have had the worst injury run in the league over the past few years, and anyone who says injuries don't matter are naive to the extreme.
 

owen87

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#49
I'm no Chris Scott sympathiser, but when he took over at the end of 2010, the odds would of been long in us making 7 out of 8 finals series including a premiership..... So to call him "poor" is quite harsh I think..... On topic, I see all 3 teams playing finals again, with the Giants to be top 4, and the Cats & Swans to be 5-8.
The Cats have won the tactical battle against us for the last couple if years when you look at the details.
I'm not convinced Cameron is a particularly good coach; I think Clarkson with a GWS list would have won a premiership by now, as it seems to me that GWS rely heavily on the individual brilliance of the players instead of having them all work to a system the way Hawthorn really have lead the way doing.

I'd have Cameron in the middle tier of coaches (along with Worsfold) that get the job done without ever really being revolutionary. I also think the North Melbourne Scott is the better coach, Chris Scott has largely had a better list at his disposal along with a bit of luck having Dangerfield wanting to only come to Geelong.

Longmire I find really hard to evaluate. Sydney has great top-end talent, but also has huge holes, and never seems to have gotten the best from Franklin. But his record of finals appearances stands up pretty well.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#50
I'm not convinced Cameron is a particularly good coach; I think Clarkson with a GWS list would have won a premiership by now, as it seems to me that GWS rely heavily on the individual brilliance of the players instead of having them all work to a system the way Hawthorn really have lead the way doing.

I'd have Cameron in the middle tier of coaches (along with Worsfold) that get the job done without ever really being revolutionary. I also think the North Melbourne Scott is the better coach, Chris Scott has largely had a better list at his disposal along with a bit of luck having Dangerfield wanting to only come to Geelong.

Longmire I find really hard to evaluate. Sydney has great top-end talent, but also has huge holes, and never seems to have gotten the best from Franklin. But his record of finals appearances stands up pretty well.
Mmm

Clarkson is clearly the best coach in the comp. Comparing him with anyone flatters the other coach.

It really is time to move on from this silly perception of our list that it's way better than anyone else's. It's very good and the age profile is near perfect. It's no longer the expanded group of high draft picks on the way up it was in 2015-2016.
Leon has steered the ship through the rise from wooden spoonerers to contenders, in a period of rapid change. To me he'll do fine.

We have been beaten tactically by the cats the last couple of years, but I rate Scott highly. We also haven't yet played them in a final when the rubber really hits the road.

I also rate Longmire but we've beaten the Swans as pretty long shots, in both finals we've played.

I attended an insiders session in the lead up to the EF last year. Our defensive coordinator Tim Kelly was very confident, and predicted a 7 goal win. That was spot on. Remember the Swans beat us twice in the H/A rounds.

One if the things he said to look for was our guys zoning in our forward 50. The view was the Swans like to chip it around coming out if defence. Unlike our plan to seek a contest on the wings coming out, they would turn it over if forced to go long to a contest.

If you watched the game we didn't put much work into stopping Alir and he got lots of the ball early. We preferred to risk his intercepting and use Himmelburg aggressively seeking space. It didn't transition into forward 50 entries much though.

My point is we were all over the Swans tactically in that game.
 
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