Preview Who will finish higher - Sydney, GWS or Geelong

Who finishes higher in 2019?


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Ian Dunross

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#51
I'm no Chris Scott sympathiser, but when he took over at the end of 2010, the odds would of been long in us making 7 out of 8 finals series including a premiership..... So to call him "poor" is quite harsh I think..... On topic, I see all 3 teams playing finals again, with the Giants to be top 4, and the Cats & Swans to be 5-8.
You make a good point. And this sounds churlish but one has to question how much credit for 2011 he deserves. He was on the record repeatedly during and after that season as saying he went into that campaign looking to learn, rather than to impose his will and strategy on a very successful group. Was that a players' flag rather than a coach's flag ala Joyce in 1991.

When I watch Geelong get towelled up in finals time after time one has to describe his coaching as poor.

I wish my club was losing finals with a "poor coach", I'd swap Scott for Richo. But at the same time, feels like Selwood, Danger, Duncan and co are being wasted.
 

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owen87

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#52
Mmm

Clarkson is clearly the best coach in the comp. Comparing him with anyone flatters the other coach.

It really is time to move on from this silly perception of our list that it's way better than anyone else's. It's very good and the age profile is near perfect. It's no longer the expanded group of high draft picks on the way up it was in 2015-2016.
Leon has steered the ship through the rise from wooden spoonerers to contenders, in a period of rapid change. To me he'll do fine.

We have been beaten tactically by the cats the last couple of years, but I rate Scott highly. We also haven't yet played them in a final when the rubber really hits the road.

I also rate Longmire but we've beaten the Swans as pretty long shots, in both finals we've played.

I attended an insiders session in the lead up to the EF last year. Our defensive coordinator Tim Kelly was very confident, and predicted a 7 goal win. That was spot on. Remember the Swans beat us twice in the H/A rounds.

One if the things he said to look for was our guys zoning in our forward 50. The view was the Swans like to chip it around coming out if defence. Unlike our plan to seek a contest on the wings coming out, they would turn it over if forced to go long to a contest.

If you watched the game we didn't put much work into stopping Alir and he got lots of the ball early. We preferred to risk his intercepting and use Himmelburg aggressively seeking space. It didn't transition into forward 50 entries much though.

My point is we were all over the Swans tactically in that game.
I use the Clarkson comparison to illustrate really; that system style of football which allows for 'lesser' players to come in and contribute meaningfully.

I think GWS has certainly had a rough injury list, but I also think there's a gap between what's been achieved and what the list is capable of, even with the players that have left over the past few season.

Is Cameron the guy to coach GWS for another 5 - 10 years? I don't believe so, in the same way I don't believe Worsfold is that coach for Essendon.

No doubt Cameron has played an influential role getting them to this point however, and isn't a bad coach in the way I see Richardson at St Kilda being.

I think Blake Caracella is going to be very hot property in the next couple of years.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#53
I use the Clarkson comparison to illustrate really; that system style of football which allows for 'lesser' players to come in and contribute meaningfully.

I think GWS has certainly had a rough injury list, but I also think there's a gap between what's been achieved and what the list is capable of, even with the players that have left over the past few season.

Is Cameron the guy to coach GWS for another 5 - 10 years? I don't believe so, in the same way I don't believe Worsfold is that coach for Essendon.

No doubt Cameron has played an influential role getting them to this point however, and isn't a bad coach in the way I see Richardson at St Kilda being.

I think Blake Caracella is going to be very hot property in the next couple of years.
I see no substance in your argument I have to say.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#55
Well put simply; do you see Cameron as the coach for GWS for the next 5-10 years?

edit: the best coach, not just happening to have his contract renewed a.k.a Ross Lyon.
I see no reason why not. Nothing's going to hapoen until his current contract ends after 2020. He was given generous exit clauses that raised eyebrows at AFL HQ. I dont think that's an accident, some of the press criticism has been stupid and the club wanted him feeling comfortable and not looking over his shoulder I think.

In 2020 it's time to step back and consider the future, and who is the right coach to lead us there. Right now it seems likely to me that's Leon. 2 years is a long time in the AFL though.
 

owen87

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#56
I see no reason why not. Nothing's going to hapoen until his current contract ends after 2020. He was given generous exit clauses that raised eyebrows at AFL HQ. I dont think that's an accident, some of the press criticism has been stupid and the club wanted him feeling comfortable and not looking over his shoulder I think.

In 2020 it's time to step back and consider the future, and who is the right coach to lead us there. Right now it seems likely to me that's Leon. 2 years is a long time in the AFL though.
See I look at Worsfold for us and think; "he's not the future" even though realistically he's done OK and has time on his contract. Maybe I'm underrating Cameron, but I wouldn't have thought he's the future for GWS either.
 

Ricketz

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#59
Of you go then.

Find another team that had a similar % boost at the end of the year and see who they played.

Then middle of the year.

Then start of the year.

I bet you have a fair bit of success at the start, some in the middle, and none at the end.
Dumbest argument I have read for a while. Why don't you save this crap for the bay?
 

Ricketz

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#61
So you couldnt find any other example where a team had a massive rise other than when Geelong faced 2 crap teams whos seasons were over.

Got it.
Mate, everybody else gets why your argument is idiotic. I don't need to explain it to you. If you want to keep making yourself look like an eight year old commenting on school footy, go for it.

;):thumbsu:
 

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Ricketz

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#62
Mate, everybody else gets why your argument is idiotic. I don't need to explain it to you. If you want to keep making yourself look like an eight year old commenting on school footy, go for it.

;):thumbsu:
Ahh **** it, it's really not that difficult.

Here you go, Geelong between the two games from round 6 we rose 13.1% (compared to 14.4% for r22-23). We played the Giants and Collingwood (shouldn't have to remind you that they were definitely not bottom 2 sides with nothing to play for).

But yeah, it doesn't count for the Hawks in round 18/19 (Blues/Dockers) simply because the Hawks were not good enough to take advantage and only improved their percentage by 8-9 over that two game stretch.

You really are not very good at this footy game.
 

RUNVS

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#63
To be honest I think Sydney, Geelong and Hawthorn would have been a more interesting comparison as all three were near the top of the pack a few years ago and now all three are rebuild ING in completely different ways.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#64
To be honest I think Sydney, Geelong and Hawthorn would have been a more interesting comparison as all three were near the top of the pack a few years ago and now all three are rebuild ING in completely different ways.
I actually get that comparison. All 3 have clung stubbornly to the top of the ladder as well.

Just not sure about the full rebuild, I think we have to wait and see. The fact all three played finals last year doesn't indicate bottoming out for a rebuild.
 

Shaz2012

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#67
I personally think your list is the weakest its been in a few years. Notwithstanding that next years list might actually be fit to play. But you'd be a brave man to suggest that 2019 is the year that GWS actually wins its first flag. Whats so different than every other year when you were supposed to win it? Media have been promising us that GWS is going to totally dominate the competition for the last 5 years.

As a general rule, GWS will make finals and disappoint. Sydney and Geelong will somehow make finals, but also have something about them that you just cant rule them out from going all the way.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#68
I personally think your list is the weakest its been in a few years. Notwithstanding that next years list might actually be fit to play. But you'd be a brave man to suggest that 2019 is the year that GWS actually wins its first flag. Whats so different than every other year when you were supposed to win it? Media have been promising us that GWS is going to totally dominate the competition for the last 5 years.

As a general rule, GWS will make finals and disappoint. Sydney and Geelong will somehow make finals, but also have something about them that you just cant rule them out from going all the way.
Will we go in heavy favourites in a GF and get our pants pulled down, then respond the following year by missing finals?
 

Cronin

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#69
IMO we've got the talent on paper to finish above both GWS and Sydney but if we play like we did last season then we'll miss the 8 and finish below both these teams; I pray to god that we change a lot over this preseason.
 

Shaz2012

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#70
Will we go in heavy favourites in a GF and get our pants pulled down, then respond the following year by missing finals?
I didn't say we had mental toughness either. You need a brand of footy that holds up in finals. We got smashed by Sydney in 2016. We could have written a book on how not to do it that game.

I think we got close last year, but we won both our finals last year at home. Its another level of mental toughness that we need to find to take that away to the MCG with an 80-20 split of 100,000 fans on the big occasion. Some clubs have shown they can do it. Sydney and West Coast have done it in recent memory. Brisbane did it under Mathews. I think GWS is in the boat of the Crows, Port, Freo where that mental toughness is more likely than not to be lacking. Prove it first and then be respected for it.
 

Isaac Cumming No 1

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#71
I didn't say we had mental toughness either. You need a brand of footy that holds up in finals. We got smashed by Sydney in 2016. We could have written a book on how not to do it that game.

I think we got close last year, but we won both our finals last year at home. Its another level of mental toughness that we need to find to take that away to the MCG with an 80-20 split of 100,000 fans on the big occasion. Some clubs have shown they can do it. Sydney and West Coast have done it in recent memory. Brisbane did it under Mathews. I think GWS is in the boat of the Crows, Port, Freo where that mental toughness is more likely than not to be lacking. Prove it first and then be respected for it.
It not actually possible for anyone to prove it for next year just yet, obviously. I 'm ok with rational discussion but you've just got a fantasy.
 

Toump Ass

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#72
GWS are a bit soft, and not sure how Shiel, Scully & Lobb leaving will affect them. Still the best of the three teams.

My guess is Scott will go the tank this season and get the pussies some nice draft picks (for once).

Sydney seem cooked to me- too much for too few.
 
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Thread starter #75
IMO we've got the talent on paper to finish above both GWS and Sydney but if we play like we did last season then we'll miss the 8 and finish below both these teams; I pray to god that we change a lot over this preseason.
Scarlett ringing the changes at the Cattery from what I hear.
 
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