Analysis Why are we s**t?

[Lore]

The bold part is worth discussing.

At the end of 2019 when the succession plan was put in place it wasn’t supposed to be a team on training wheels according to those in charge. They still had the place held together with sticky tape and expected him to walk in and take it up a level, had their heads too far up the proverbial to really assess where we were at in a holistic manner.

The s**t inevitably hit the fan 12 months later, and then they wanted Worsfold as a mentor and when he noped it put Sheedy as a mentor from his position as a board member.

I wouldn’t be halfway surprised if there’s a bit of mentoring coming from outside the club too, possibly links with Dimma or something like that (certainly when they were both on coaches night on 360 a couple of months ago there was something Dimma suggested would be reasonable in particular circumstances and which Essendon wasn’t known for, which Truck responded to in an interesting manner and then we did it the next week — I feel like it was a run-with role in the middle or something like that).

A new director of coaching would I think need to be from that sort of experienced coaching background in order to support the system we have now— which is why I kind of wonder if the rumour of Clarkson being at Tullamarine had something to do with our departing director of coaching. If so then they’re at least looking for the right sort of thing even if he wasn’t the right person for it.

 

[brain taylor]

Meanwhile, amongst all of this, our young team, starving for solid direction, is looking at our coach and wondering when he's going to stop being coached and start coaching them.

the young players (along with guys like laverde and redman) are the ones actually showing some kind of buy-in and trying to exhibit the traits truck wants though. it's our senior "stars" that don't want to run defensively or tackle.

Personally never thought it was right to have a coach on training wheels trying to teach a team on training wheels.

i agree with this though

 

[Kyptastic]

We spoke about a lot of these issues on our Don The Stat Mid Season review, you can listen to it here on Apple: and Spotify:

 

[yodellinhank]

He did not even know all his players in the last couple of years. He was done with us.

Some of them were pretty forgettable though you must admit.

 

[brutus76]

The serenity that was THE BYE was glorious. Back to reality and the Essingsh*tness this week

 

[owen87]

The serenity that was THE BYE was glorious. Back to reality and the Essingsh*tness this week

McGrath and Stringer both injured; Bye Round 1 - Essendon 0

 

[windyhill]

So sheedy has stirred everything up again, and all the hate is flowing again for all the wrong reasons. We used to be hated because we were ******* good. Thanks kevin.

 

[Ati Tude]

So sheedy has stirred everything up again, and all the hate is flowing again for all the wrong reasons. We used to be hated because we were ******* good. Thanks kevin.

The hate will never subside. Nothing to do with Sheedy's latest stuff, but gives people the chance to beat their chest again.

If we ever do get back to being good and win a flag, it will be payback big time at all the nuffies on this site. If we are hated now when we are crap, imagine what a cesspit this place will be once we are good. It will be like Lord of the Flies with us running around going crazy at all the haters.

 

[Call Me Cake]

For the good of Bigfooty's servers we must not reach #17.

 

[Albertross]

So sheedy has stirred everything up again, and all the hate is flowing again for all the wrong reasons. We used to be hated because we were ******* good. Thanks kevin.

We haven't been hated because we were good for a looong time, and when we were, it actually was thanks to Sheeds.

Nothing but a laughing stock for the last 15-20 years and plenty of oppo supporters are happy to dance in our grave, drugs saga or not.

I have no problem with what he said, the 150th has been a shambles anyway, so it's not like he's destroyed the party.

 

[citizen-erased]

For the good of Bigfooty's servers we must not reach #17.

Imagine how insufferable we'll be

Like tigers, hawks, doggies and one half a season blues fans all rolled into one

 

[Lore]

Mr Mojo Risin tangential to our earlier discussion in the non-Essendon thread, I got the win-loss records for every season since 1897 off afltables and mapped our captains and coaches roughly against it (from Wikipedia not counting caretakers)…

Top 10 worst years by win percentage:

1933
2016 - Suspensions
2006 - Sheedy’s last
2022 - This year so far
1971
1915 - War
1921
1918 - War
2015 - Saga
1970

Worst win percentage to make finals was 2009, we won 45% of our games and played with 10 wins from 22 games. We lost of course.

Best win percentage to miss finals was 72% in 1963, won 13 games out of 18 played that year. It was a top 4 finals system that year, we were in a three way tie for 3rd place and 137.5% wasn’t enough in the end. It’s actually interesting because first and second were only ahead by a draw that year, their percentages were both worse than ours!

We have had five premiership coaches for 14 flags between them: Jack Worrall, Sid Barker, John Coleman, Dick Reynolds and Kevin Sheedy. The first two flags were either coachless or the coach was not recorded.

They coached 66 seasons altogether between the five of them, with an average win percentage of 63%. The remaining 59 seasons have an average win percentage of 48% by way of comparison.

Two thirds of our seasons have resulted in a win percentage above 50.

Of the 37 seasons that had a win percentage below 50, 10 of them occurred in the 21st century. Over represented by about double compared to our historical position, but indicative of a period where we’ve been pretty much bog average compared to other teams.

 

[Mr Mojo Risin]

Mr Mojo Risin tangential to our earlier discussion in the non-Essendon thread, I got the win-loss records for every season since 1897 off afltables and mapped our captains and coaches roughly against it (from Wikipedia not counting caretakers)…

Top 10 worst years by win percentage:

1933
2016 - Suspensions
2006 - Sheedy’s last
2022 - This year so far
1971
1915 - War
1921
1918 - War
2015 - Saga
1970

Worst win percentage to make finals was 2009, we won 45% of our games and played with 10 wins from 22 games. We lost of course.

Best win percentage to miss finals was 72% in 1963, won 13 games out of 18 played that year. It was a top 4 finals system that year, we were in a three way tie for 3rd place and 137.5% wasn’t enough in the end. It’s actually interesting because first and second were only ahead by a draw that year, their percentages were both worse than ours!

We have had five premiership coaches for 14 flags between them: Jack Worrall, Sid Barker, John Coleman, Dick Reynolds and Kevin Sheedy. The first two flags were either coachless or the coach was not recorded.

They coached 66 seasons altogether between the five of them, with an average win percentage of 63%. The remaining 59 seasons have an average win percentage of 48% by way of comparison.

Two thirds of our seasons have resulted in a win percentage above 50.

Of the 37 seasons that had a win percentage below 50, 10 of them occurred in the 21st century. Over represented by about double compared to our historical position, but indicative of a period where we’ve been pretty much bog average compared to other teams.

You're awesome Lore.

I think this loosely fits what I was getting at, that aside from Sheedy we have been that poor club since post 60s, not the entire time. Prior to the 70s we had generally been a consistently good team aside from the war years and a period in the 30s.

After the 60s we've been s**t the 25 years either side of Sheedy's 27 years.

Even including Sheedy in the level playing field AFL era, post the salary cap moratorium that we benefited from we've never built another good team. I don't buy into many who laugh at Sheedy as a man who's past it and that we should ignore and in the same breath idolise Neil Balme. But it does beg the question how well he would have done having to run a club on a level playing field from the beginning. Regardless I think he being on the board is the least of our issues. In fact we'd probably be better off dumping Campbell and Dodoro and getting Sheedy to do both their roles, not that I'd advocate for that either lol.

I think it's Dan26 if I remember correctly who suggests our move to Docklands is a bigger part of this than we'll accept (sorry to tag you Dan if I'm mistaken). If nothing else it is symbolic of the arrogance of our leadership that we can do whatever we want and we'll be good because we're a big club. You could suggest the saga was another symbol of this but I believe that's far more complicated and know there's plenty of accounts that all or most clubs were doing the same or similar things. However let's not go down that rabbit hole because we'd be better off as a club to accept our faults and improve from them.

Which brings me back to the wish we could have periodic external reviews paid for by membership money (via constitutional change) for the members. Full and frank reviews and transparent accountability are often the best way to get optimal performance, if everyone buys in. At the very least they can cause existing employees to pull their finger out and improve because they have nowhere to hide and if they have nothing to hide, they have nothing to fear.

Side note: 2007 was Sheedy's last year. I'll never forget his and Hird's last game where Lucas went nuts in the last quarter kicking 7 goals and nearly dragging us over the line causing West Coast to miss top 2 and have to play Port in Adelaide in their Qualifying Final.

 

[Dan26]

I think it's Dan26 if I remember correctly who suggests our move to Docklands is a bigger part of this than we'll accept (sorry to tag you Dan if I'm mistaken). If nothing else it is symbolic of the arrogance of our leadership that we can do whatever we want and we'll be good because we're a big club.

Yes I was the one who brought that up.

What staggers me is the fact that the MCG was being redeveloped starting in 2003, which surely the club must have been aware of. It had been mooted for a while that the old Ponsford and Olympic stands would get pulled down, which would have given the club the corporate facilities that they claim was the reason for moving to Docklands.

It's not that I hate Docklands. I don't. It's just that certain big Melbourne clubs have an identity and that identity is at the MCG. Ourselves, Richmond, Collingwood - it's where we belong.

We also had such a good team, and were generating such big crowds at the MCG at the time of the move. Imagine if Collingwood, after winning the 2010 premiership decided they would be playing most home game at Docklands from that point on. Their fans would riot. Can you imagine Collingwood making that decision? That's what we did. It's astonishingly stupid when you really think about it

Graham McMahon wan an arrogant S.O.B and I blame him totally for the move. He was a stubborn man. It has fed into a lack of ambition, and in my opinion a lack of identity which is so important for a big Melbourne club having already moved from their spiritual home of Windy Hill.

It's fine for a club like the Bulldogs or Kangaroos to have an identity at Docklands. They are different to us. It's almost impossible for a huge Melbourne club like us to forge an identity there. We just don't belong, in exactly the same way that Richmond and Collingwood don't belong there.

 

[owen87]

Yes I was the one who brought that up.

What staggers me is the fact that the MCG was being redeveloped starting in 2003, which surely the club must have been aware of. It had been mooted for a while that the old Ponsford and Olympic stands would get pulled down, which would have given the club the corporate facilities that they claim was the reason for moving to Docklands.

It's not that I hate Docklands. I don't. It's just that certain big Melbourne clubs have an identity and that identity is at the MCG. Ourselves, Richmond, Collingwood - it's where we belong.

We also had such a good team, and were generating such big crowds at the MCG at the time of the move. Imagine if Collingwood, after winning the 2010 premiership decided they would be playing most home game at Docklands from that point on. Their fans would riot. Can you imagine Collingwood making that decision? That's what we did. It's astonishingly stupid when you really think about it

Graham McMahon wan an arrogant S.O.B and I blame him totally for the move. He was a stubborn man. It has fed into a lack of ambition, and in my opinion a lack of identity which is so important for a big Melbourne club having already moved from their spiritual home of Windy Hill.

It's fine for a club like the Bulldogs or Kangaroos to have an identity at Docklands. They are different to us. It's almost impossible for a huge Melbourne club like us to forge an identity there. We just don't belong, in exactly the same way that Richmond and Collingwood don't belong there.

From memory we got paid a truckload of money and given a sweetheart deal to go to the Docklands.

 

[Lore]

From memory we got paid a truckload of money and given a sweetheart deal to go to the Docklands.

Us and Carlton both

 

[boncer34]

Mr Mojo Risin tangential to our earlier discussion in the non-Essendon thread, I got the win-loss records for every season since 1897 off afltables and mapped our captains and coaches roughly against it (from Wikipedia not counting caretakers)…

Top 10 worst years by win percentage:

1933
2016 - Suspensions
2006 - Sheedy’s last
2022 - This year so far
1971
1915 - War
1921
1918 - War
2015 - Saga
1970

Worst win percentage to make finals was 2009, we won 45% of our games and played with 10 wins from 22 games. We lost of course.

Best win percentage to miss finals was 72% in 1963, won 13 games out of 18 played that year. It was a top 4 finals system that year, we were in a three way tie for 3rd place and 137.5% wasn’t enough in the end. It’s actually interesting because first and second were only ahead by a draw that year, their percentages were both worse than ours!

We have had five premiership coaches for 14 flags between them: Jack Worrall, Sid Barker, John Coleman, Dick Reynolds and Kevin Sheedy. The first two flags were either coachless or the coach was not recorded.

They coached 66 seasons altogether between the five of them, with an average win percentage of 63%. The remaining 59 seasons have an average win percentage of 48% by way of comparison.

Two thirds of our seasons have resulted in a win percentage above 50.

Of the 37 seasons that had a win percentage below 50, 10 of them occurred in the 21st century. Over represented by about double compared to our historical position, but indicative of a period where we’ve been pretty much bog average compared to other teams.

2006 was the year Lloyd started amazing and fell apart and so did our season.

2007 was Sheedy and Hirds last year.

 

[boncer34]

Us and Carlton both

From memory Carlton actually didn't get anywhere near as much as we did.

They moved coz Ian Collins was in charge of docklands and he made promises to the club he couldn't keep.

 

[Lore]

2006 was the year Lloyd started amazing and fell apart and so did our season.

2007 was Sheedy and Hirds last year.

A really good example of why writing such posts on a phone at 11.30 at night is not a good idea

 

[Lore]

From memory Carlton actually didn't get anywhere near as much as we did.

They moved coz Ian Collins was in charge of docklands and he made promises to the club he couldn't keep.

Either way the AFL got what they wanted, as is their wont.

 

[Dan26]

From memory we got paid a truckload of money and given a sweetheart deal to go to the Docklands.

And how did that work out for us?

 

[Lore]

And how did that work out for us?

I don't know how much it was but I reckon it might've funded the saga

 

[owen87]

And how did that work out for us?

Money wise? Probably quite well.

 

[Dan26]

Money wise? Probably quite well.

Do you honestly think it was the right thing to do? If you had the power of hindsight and had the power to make the decision, what would you have done?

 

[owen87]

Do you honestly think it was the right thing to do? If you had the power of hindsight and had the power to make the decision, what would you have done?

We don't have the power of hindsight though.

Club memberships at the time were half what they are today, the league wasn't quite the money making behemoth it is today, and we were offered an obscene deal to move to the Docklands.

From a #culture perspective maybe staying at the MCG would have been nice, but do you really think the on-field performance of the club is tied back to where we play?

Bulldogs are entirely based at Marvel instead of being part-timers like us and they won a Premiership.

If your argument is that the Docklands arrangement was reflective of an attitude of money being placed ahead of member access at the time, then sure.

An enormous amount has changed since that decision was made, the biggest issue for me is that Essendon (along with others) failed to migrate in to the fully professional era for over a decade.