Why boycotting Israel matters

[AM]

shame the Palestinian leaders have rejected peace at every turn in history. From being offered 97% of the land they wanted (rejected and turned to terror), Gaza (Israel uprooting it’s own people to have over to the Palestinians only to get terror) or even way back to 1948 when the land was divided for Jews and Palestinians (who they called themselves Arabs then) whereby the Jews accepted but the Palestinians rejected and along with Arab neighbours declared war on the Jews/Israel.

The Palestinians don’t actually want to live side by side with Israel because they keep rejecting land for peace. They want Israel wiped off the map and 100% of the land for themselves

whats that famous Palestinian chant? From the river to the see... doesn’t leave much room for Israel.

Israel is here to stay, the only way forward is for the Palestinians to accept it. Now a lot have, Arab Israelis enjoy full rights of citizenship and are treated better in Israel than Arabs are treated in Arab countries. Not everything the Israeli gov do is perfect, as no governments are perfect. But compared to the terrorists hamas or the deep corrupted fatah in west bank that draw out billions in aid for their pockets and Abbas whose in what his 12th year if a 4 year run (which make bibi’s corruption look like nothing).

You’ve trotted this hogwash out before in this thread. The so called offers by the oppressors were designed to fail as has been dealt with many times before in this thread.

STILL NO DETAILED RESPONSE TO HUMAN RIGHTS LAWYER EMILY SCHAEFFER OMER-MAN’S TELLING ADDRESS TO THE UN SECURITY COUNCIL ON 9 MARCH LAST YEAR SETTING OUT HER FIRST-HARD EXPERIENCE OF THE HORRIFIC TREATMENT DEALT OUT TO PALESTINIANS ON A DAILY BASIS . Easier to wash, rinse, repeat the occupiers propaganda.

 

[AM]

With friends like the UAE who needs enemies

A UAE deal is nothing more than a pre-election stunt by the serial liar and his friend who is frantically dodging corruption charges. However, I’m not sure Biden is any better than the serial liar when it comes to doing the right thing for the oppressed.

 

[strauchnyy]

You’ve trotted this hogwash out before in this thread. The so called offers by the oppressors were designed to fail as has been dealt with many times before in this thread.

STILL NO DETAILED RESPONSE TO HUMAN RIGHTS LAWYER EMILY SCHAEFFER OMER-MAN’S TELLING ADDRESS TO THE UN SECURITY COUNCIL ON 9 MARCH LAST YEAR SETTING OUT HER FIRST-HARD EXPERIENCE OF THE HORRIFIC TREATMENT DEALT OUT TO PALESTINIANS ON A DAILY BASIS . Easier to wash, rinse, repeat the occupiers propaganda.

AM, now now, where do I begin.

You have:

- countlessly ignored my direct questions in this thread I’m just about every post ranging from all sorts of FACTUAL injustices pushed by the Palestinian terror machine

- consistently remained silent or otherwise deflected direct questions

- when you have responded, you have instead, in your words, rinsed washed and repeated the BIASED OME SIDED PROPAGANDA opinion based articles as facts. the very definition of white Noise

- you have been unable to call out terror committed by the Palestinians, condoned atrocities, corruption, anti semetism, committed by the Palestinians

- I have destroyed you in every direct discussion, in which you have ALWAYS resorted to name calling, and again, via posting OPINIONS as facts

- I have called out Injustices committed by the Israeli government. I have called out the settlement expansion as wrong, showing unbiased. Conversely you have done the opposite a d supported, 100% one side And are incapable of understanding the situation.

I will gladly view your propaganda and pull it apart , as I’ve done with every bit of drivel you’ve posted. But you have not done the same to me. You have not answered any of my direct questions. Why should I give you the respect? You’re a troll. A brainwashed Israel hating bigot.

go back and read my posts. Go back and respond to my questions.. I’ve given up/gotten bored of responding to your biased opinions long ago. Others have done this too. Go respond to my questions andI’ll watch your propaganda video. How dare you out of all posters get on your high horse, when you’ve been embarrassed at every discussion discussion point. Unbelievable

in response to your post,HOW was giving the Palestinians their own land in 1948 designed to fail?

how was giving Palestinians territory in the West Bank designed for fail (when offered 97% of the West Bank)? The Palestinians have NEVER been given land to run themselves, what an opportunity to run and start a state. Whilst Jews took the opportunity, Instead they rejected and resorted to terror - FACT.

every time the Palestinians have been offered land for peace they have rejected - FACT

Palestinian terrorists who succeed in murdering Jewish civilians receive a salary by the Palestinian leadership - FACT

Hamas admits to using human shields - FACT

Martyrdom is celebrated and streets are named after Palestinian terrorists who murder women and children - FACT

Billions in aid have been diverted from the Palestinian people by their corrupt leaders To instead be used to build terror tunnels to conduct terrorism against Israeli civilians while Palestinian people suffer - FACT

Israeli arab citizens are treated with full rights and better than what they’d get in Palestinian Territories - FACT

I could go on but yawn. Israel are not perfect, both sides must come together and realise both are here to stay and most Israelis and Palestinians want peace. Both leaders are corrupt. But blindly following one side is by your definition Hogwash

 

[AM]

AM, now now, where do I begin.

You have:

- countlessly ignored my direct questions in this thread I’m just about every post ranging from all sorts of FACTUAL injustices pushed by the Palestinian terror machine

- consistently remained silent or otherwise deflected direct questions

- when you have responded, you have instead, in your words, rinsed washed and repeated the BIASED OME SIDED PROPAGANDA opinion based articles as facts. the very definition of white Noise

- you have been unable to call out terror committed by the Palestinians, condoned atrocities, corruption, anti semetism, committed by the Palestinians

- I have destroyed you in every direct discussion, in which you have ALWAYS resorted to name calling, and again, via posting OPINIONS as facts

- I have called out Injustices committed by the Israeli government. I have called out the settlement expansion as wrong, showing unbiased. Conversely you have done the opposite a d supported, 100% one side And are incapable of understanding the situation.

I will gladly view your propaganda and pull it apart , as I’ve done with every bit of drivel you’ve posted. But you have not done the same to me. You have not answered any of my direct questions. Why should I give you the respect? You’re a troll. A brainwashed Israel hating bigot.

go back and read my posts. Go back and respond to my questions.. I’ve given up/gotten bored of responding to your biased opinions long ago. Others have done this too. Go respond to my questions andI’ll watch your propaganda video. How dare you out of all posters get on your high horse, when you’ve been embarrassed at every discussion discussion point. Unbelievable

in response to your post,HOW was giving the Palestinians their own land in 1948 designed to fail?

how was giving Palestinians territory in the West Bank designed for fail (when offered 97% of the West Bank)? The Palestinians have NEVER been given land to run themselves, what an opportunity to run and start a state. Whilst Jews took the opportunity, Instead they rejected and resorted to terror - FACT.

every time the Palestinians have been offered land for peace they have rejected - FACT

Palestinian terrorists who succeed in murdering Jewish civilians receive a salary by the Palestinian leadership - FACT

Hamas admits to using human shields - FACT

Martyrdom is celebrated and streets are named after Palestinian terrorists who murder women and children - FACT

Billions in aid have been diverted from the Palestinian people by their corrupt leaders To instead be used to build terror tunnels to conduct terrorism against Israeli civilians while Palestinian people suffer - FACT

Israeli arab citizens are treated with full rights and better than what they’d get in Palestinian Territories - FACT

I could go on but yawn. Israel are not perfect, both sides must come together and realise both are here to stay and most Israelis and Palestinians want peace. Both leaders are corrupt. But blindly following one side is by your definition Hogwash

You’ve done little more the re-publish AIPAC propaganda throughout this thread. Here we go again.

I’ve repeatedly drawn attention to the oppression and occupation, not from my perspective but from those honourable peace loving Jewish folk around the world. Countless organisations who live the experience. Fairly much your only real acknowledgement has been to criticise some settlers calling them nutters. Not vehemently condemning them mind you or acknowledging they operate with IDF help as I’ve shown and Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man has reaffirmed.

I’ve repeatedly asked you and others to address specific issues raised by those who live in the area from individuals like Antony Loewenstein and Gideon Levy through to the former soldiers who now form Breaking the Silence.

You twist and turn, obfuscate, repeat the same propaganda. That’s why I’ve focussed on nailing you on the scathing first-hand account by American Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man’s in her address to the UN on 9 May last year asking you to go through it and tell us where she is wrong and why. Each time you duck and dive further illustrates you as an empty vessel merely re-publishing AIPAC propaganda.

 

[strauchnyy]

You’ve done little more the re-publish AIPAC propaganda throughout this thread. Here we go again.

I’ve repeatedly drawn attention to the oppression and occupation, not from my perspective but from those honourable peace loving Jewish folk around the world. Countless organisations who live the experience. Fairly much your only real acknowledgement has been to criticise some settlers calling them nutters. Not vehemently condemning them mind you or acknowledging they operate with IDF help as I’ve shown and Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man has reaffirmed.

I’ve repeatedly asked you and others to address specific issues raised by those who live in the area from individuals like Antony Loewenstein and Gideon Levy through to the former soldiers who now form Breaking the Silence.

You twist and turn, obfuscate, repeat the same propaganda. That’s why I’ve focussed on nailing you on the scathing first-hand account by American Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man’s in her address to the UN on 9 May last year asking you to go through it and tell us where she is wrong and why. Each time you duck and dive further illustrates you as an empty vessel merely re-publishing AIPAC propaganda.

cut your falsehood AM.

let’s give you a chance.

you just said I posted propaganda. Right? Ok. Now tell me then, which one of the facts in my above post is propaganda. Which one?

All are facts. So which one is not true?

No deflecting this time. If you want to continue with your utter BS, and continue to hide behind your ‘propaganda blah blah’ rhetoric then you better well back it up. If you claim I’m being false than you need to back it up. I’m calling you out for it this time, for all to see. Which one of the facts are “propaganda”?

Go on, I challenge you.

 

[AM]

cut your falsehood AM.

let’s give you a chance.

you just said I posted propaganda. Right? Ok. Now tell me then, which one of the facts in my above post is propaganda. Which one?

All are facts. So which one is not true?

No deflecting this time. If you want to continue with your utter BS, and continue to hide behind your ‘propaganda blah blah’ rhetoric then you better well back it up. If you claim I’m being false than you need to back it up. I’m calling you out for it this time, for all to see. Which one of the facts are “propaganda”?

Go on, I challenge you.

My falsehood. What a laughing stock you are.

A dozen or more times I've asked you to go through the first-hand account by Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man she gave to the UN Security Council on 9 May 2019 on the appalling treatment of Palestinians. A good deal of it addresses your recycled AIPAC PR. Still waiting, waiting, waiting..........

Your response is no more than look-over-here stuff. Despite most of your recycled propaganda having already been trashed by the good, right thinking, genuine Jewish peace seekers I've quoted in this thread I'm prepared to go over them again when you respond to my dozens of requests made over many months of you going through Emily's scathing authoritative account and point-by-point telling us where she is wrong and why.

Or change your username to "Duck-n-dive" as a true reflection of your thorough going indoctrination.

 

[strauchnyy]

My falsehood. What a laughing stock you are.

A dozen or more times I've asked you to go through the first-hand account by Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man she gave to the UN Security Council on 9 May 2019 on the appalling treatment of Palestinians. A good deal of it addresses your recycled AIPAC PR. Still waiting, waiting, waiting..........

Your response is no more than look-over-here stuff. Despite most of your recycled propaganda having already been trashed by the good, right thinking, genuine Jewish peace seekers I've quoted in this thread I'm prepared to go over them again when you respond to my dozens of requests made over many months of you going through Emily's scathing authoritative account and point-by-point telling us where she is wrong and why.

Or change your username to "Duck-n-dive" as a true reflection of your thorough going indoctrination.

You’re deflecting again! Proof right here you have NFI.

I call out facts

you call it propaganda

I ask you which of my facts are propaganda

you deflect, because you know the facts are facts.

tell me which facts are untrue from my post and I’ll watch your propaganda opinion based video.

I expect you to deflect, because you cannot argue against at them and you hide behind your rhetoric you coward. You brainwashed Israel hating bigot.

 

[AM]

You’re deflecting again! Proof right here you have NFI.

I call out facts

you call it propaganda

I ask you which of my facts are propaganda

you deflect, because you know the facts are facts.

tell me which facts are untrue from my post and I’ll watch your propaganda opinion based video.

I expect you to deflect, because you cannot argue against at them and you hide behind your rhetoric you coward. You brainwashed Israel hating bigot.

Still running scared straughnyy. Still no response to the Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man detailed exposition on what’s occurring in the occupation and oppression. The facts are there in Emily’s address - why the running scared. For too long you’ve posted AIPAC propaganda and when I’ve posted responses from people with lived experience exposing the lies and half truths you’ve moved to more propaganda. That’s why I’m nailing you on this one. The longer you avoid the facts in Emily’s address the more you look like a mindless re-publisher. Some might say schmuck.

As for your risible nonsense about facts. I quote the lived experience of people in the occupied territory like Gideon Levy, with examples of the inhumanity. You re-publish propaganda from a sofa in oz. I quote the lived experience of people in the occupied territory like Antony Loewenstein, with examples of the inhumanity. You re-publish propaganda from a sofa in oz. I quote the lived experience of people with first-hand experience of the oppressed folk in the occupied territory like Rabbi Jill Jacobs, with examples of the inhumanity. You re-publish propaganda from a sofa in oz. I quote the lived experience of people like Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man (remember the address to the UN with dozens of illustrations that you run from over and over and over........) showing the examples of inhumanity. You re-publish propaganda from a sofa in oz. And countless others.

I quote from the lived experiences of organisations like Rabbis 4 Human Rights, Breaking the Silence, T’ruah, If Not Know. All That’s Left. And a truckload of others. You dress-up AIPAC propaganda and attempt to sell it as ‘fact’.

straughnyy would love these “facts”

Either do as I’ve asked dozens of times over many months and actually address the facts of the oppression and inhumanity in Emily’s UN address or continue to be shown to be as someone who runs from the truth.

 

[AM]

Following is a webinar involving Palestinian Human Rights Lawyer, Dianna Buttu, and Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaefer Omer- Man, ( who recently won the 2020 Victor J Goldberg prize for peace and richly deserved) For all with an open mind which, of course, excludes straughnyy.




Why is straughnyy refusing to answer the questions in Emily’s May 9 UN address?

 

[Zidane98]

Following is a webinar involving Palestinian Human Rights Lawyer, Dianna Buttu, and Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaefer Omer- Man, ( who recently won the 2020 Victor J Goldberg prize for peace and richly deserved) For all with an open mind which, of course, excludes straughnyy.




Why is straughnyy refusing to answer the questions in Emily’s May 9 UN address?

I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve here. Most outsiders have acknowledged that Israel are doing some pretty reprehensible stuff in Palestine right now. Of that there is no doubt.

You lose all credibility when quoting things like Breaking the Silence though which you know is not a reliable source.

Breaking the Silence Gets Failing Grade in Channel 10's Fact-Check

At the core of the controversy surrounding Breaking the Silence is the question as to whether itstestimonies are reliable. An investigative reportby 'Hamakor,'Israel's Channel

www.camera.org

Consistently publishes allegations that are simply untrue. Worse, the group has political links to BDS and its goals are political.


I'm betting you already knew this but continue to recycle garbage like this.


It is also quite telling that you seem to have less of a problem with Hamas and its treatment of its own people, rocket attacks on Israel and openly encouraging martydom in suicide attacks. To you your attitude seems to be "yeah but you can't blame them".


It is pretty clear you've got some extreme views on this topic and the only thing that would please you is the complete removal of Israel & all Jews in the area that was the former British mandatory of Palestine.


To me, any attempts at peace are not going to work if either side holds each other solely responsible - eg your attitude.

Following is a webinar involving Palestinian Human Rights Lawyer, Dianna Buttu, and Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaefer Omer- Man, ( who recently won the 2020 Victor J Goldberg prize for peace and richly deserved) For all with an open mind which, of course, excludes straughnyy.




Why is straughnyy refusing to answer the questions in Emily’s May 9 UN address?

At least she is able to do this in Israel unlike her counterparts in Palestine

Palestine: Dangerous escalation in attacks on freedom of expression

Freedom of expression is under attack in the West bank as Palestinian authorities clampdown on dissent in the media. So far six journalists have been arrested and 29 websites have been shut down under the controversial Electronic Crimes Law. Read the full story and the report.

www.amnesty.org

Not that we'd know about it going off your posts, this sort of stuff is fine by you in Palestine it seems.

Granted, she has valid points about the current situation in West Bank. Israel really need to be totally out of there and any Jeiwsh residents should be free to remain if they are happy to live under Palestinian rule (no different to Arab Israelis living in Israel). They have no right to impose on the life of Palestinians even if they believe it to be justified due to security reasons.

What I find disturbing is your total one sided view on the matter which borders on extreme. You brush off Hamas use of human shields, promotion of martyrdom and rocket attacks as "you can't blame them". Extremist views like yours will ensure this conflict goes on for decades. A solution requires compromise on both sides (Israel to unilaterally hand over land to Palestine, allow a link between Gaza/West Bank) and Palestine to cease all attacks on Israel and/or its citizens.

 

[AM]

I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve here. Most outsiders have acknowledged that Israel are doing some pretty reprehensible stuff in Palestine right now. Of that there is no doubt.

You lose all credibility when quoting things like Breaking the Silence though which you know is not a reliable source.

Breaking the Silence Gets Failing Grade in Channel 10's Fact-Check

At the core of the controversy surrounding Breaking the Silence is the question as to whether itstestimonies are reliable. An investigative reportby 'Hamakor,'Israel's Channel

www.camera.org

Consistently publishes allegations that are simply untrue. Worse, the group has political links to BDS and its goals are political.


I'm betting you already knew this but continue to recycle garbage like this.


It is also quite telling that you seem to have less of a problem with Hamas and its treatment of its own people, rocket attacks on Israel and openly encouraging martydom in suicide attacks. To you your attitude seems to be "yeah but you can't blame them".


It is pretty clear you've got some extreme views on this topic and the only thing that would please you is the complete removal of Israel & all Jews in the area that was the former British mandatory of Palestine.


To me, any attempts at peace are not going to work if either side holds each other solely responsible - eg your attitude.


At least she is able to do this in Israel unlike her counterparts in Palestine

Palestine: Dangerous escalation in attacks on freedom of expression

Freedom of expression is under attack in the West bank as Palestinian authorities clampdown on dissent in the media. So far six journalists have been arrested and 29 websites have been shut down under the controversial Electronic Crimes Law. Read the full story and the report.

www.amnesty.org

Not that we'd know about it going off your posts, this sort of stuff is fine by you in Palestine it seems.

Granted, she has valid points about the current situation in West Bank. Israel really need to be totally out of there and any Jeiwsh residents should be free to remain if they are happy to live under Palestinian rule (no different to Arab Israelis living in Israel). They have no right to impose on the life of Palestinians even if they believe it to be justified due to security reasons.

What I find disturbing is your total one sided view on the matter which borders on extreme. You brush off Hamas use of human shields, promotion of martyrdom and rocket attacks as "you can't blame them". Extremist views like yours will ensure this conflict goes on for decades. A solution requires compromise on both sides (Israel to unilaterally hand over land to Palestine, allow a link between Gaza/West Bank) and Palestine to cease all attacks on Israel and/or its citizens.

I find your workarounds intriguing 'Zidane'. Despite much of it recycled nonsense like the smearing of Breaking the Silence. It's not the first attempt here to do so cos the first-hand evidence of soldiers who have witnessed the occupation and brutally is hard to rebut, so smearing is the go-to response. It's been raised before in this thread and hit out of the park.

One can only attribute you and others need to write workarounds rather than deal with the dozens of requests I've made to go through the compelling address of Israeli Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man to the UN Security Council on May 9 last year and explain to us point-point where she is wrong and why to the fact what she said is irrefutable. So please either respond to my repeated requests or ,if you aren't up to the task, you could acknowledge she is right in every respect. Please no more whataboutisms. Much of which has been dealt with here anyway.

 

[Zidane98]

I find your workarounds intriguing 'Zidane'. Despite much of it recycled nonsense like the smearing of Breaking the Silence. It's not the first attempt here to do so cos the first-hand evidence of soldiers who have witnessed the occupation and brutally is hard to rebut, so smearing is the go-to response. It's been raised before in this thread and hit out of the park.

One can only attribute you and others need to write workarounds rather than deal with the dozens of requests I've made to go through the compelling address of Israeli Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man to the UN Security Council on May 9 last year and explain to us point-point where she is wrong and why to the fact what she said is irrefutable. So please either respond to my repeated requests or ,if you aren't up to the task, you could acknowledge she is right in every respect. Please no more whataboutisms. Much of which has been dealt with here anyway.

Sorry but your absolutely wrong with this post and everything you post in general. It is clear you believe this isa one sided issue - which it clearly isn't. Your views are frighteningly similar to Hamas rhetoric which is disturning. What Hamas do is worse and a bigger issue than Israel's actions, sorry it just is and thats a fact. Theres a reason why Hamas is a declared terrorist organisation by international authorities. Thats on them, not Israel. Again, it is telling that you do not raise this as an issue.

 

[AM]

Sorry but your absolutely wrong with this post and everything you post in general. It is clear you believe this isa one sided issue - which it clearly isn't. Your views are frighteningly similar to Hamas rhetoric which is disturning. What Hamas do is worse and a bigger issue than Israel's actions, sorry it just is and thats a fact. Theres a reason why Hamas is a declared terrorist organisation by international authorities. Thats on them, not Israel. Again, it is telling that you do not raise this as an issue.

Views similar to Hamas! What a load of arrant nonsense. And offensive too. As I’ve written ad infintum here I’ve, for the most part, drawn on the views of humanitarian Jewish folk and organisations. Countless numbers of them. A few of whom I’ve once again referenced in a recent post.

There was a time when I thought there were some seeds of humanitarianism in you. However, it turns out you’re fundamentally just another apologist for extreme Zionism.

It’s tedious showing you and your fellow apologists what is occurring on a daily basis in Gaza and the West Bank from people who live in the area and witness first-hand the oppression and brutality only to get practiced propaganda smearing genuine, caring people with lived experiences like those of Breaking the Silence.

That is why I’ve flushed you apologists out by asking a simple question of you. It relates to Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man’s testimony to the UN Security Council. You know, the Human Rights lawyer who was awarded the 2020 Victor J. Goldberg Prize for Peace in the Middle East. Perhaps another person who has Hamas tendencies in your odd closed mind.

So I once again I ask you or other propagandists to go through the compelling testimony of Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man made to the UN Security Council on 9 May last year and tell us point-by-point where she is wrong and why.

Until you do no one should pay any attention to your practiced propaganda

 

[Zidane98]

Views similar to Hamas! What a load of arrant nonsense. And offensive too. As I’ve written ad infintum here I’ve, for the most part, drawn on the views of humanitarian Jewish folk and organisations. Countless numbers of them. A few of whom I’ve once again referenced in a recent post.

There was a time when I thought there were some seeds of humanitarianism in you. However, it turns out you’re fundamentally just another apologist for extreme Zionism.

It’s tedious showing you and your fellow apologists what is occurring on a daily basis in Gaza and the West Bank from people who live in the area and witness first-hand the oppression and brutality only to get practiced propaganda smearing genuine, caring people with lived experiences like those of Breaking the Silence.

That is why I’ve flushed you apologists out by asking a simple question of you. It relates to Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man’s testimony to the UN Security Council. You know, the Human Rights lawyer who was awarded the 2020 Victor J. Goldberg Prize for Peace in the Middle East. Perhaps another person who has Hamas tendencies in your odd closed mind.

So I once again I ask you or other propagandists to go through the compelling testimony of Human Rights lawyer Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man made to the UN Security Council on 9 May last year and tell us point-by-point where she is wrong and why.

Until you do no one should pay any attention to your practiced propaganda

Your an absolute nutter, nobody is saying sheis wrong and Isrsel need to GTFO out of West Bank.

You are nothing but a Hamas extremist apologist who clearly cannot bring himself to even accept that a declared terrorist orgamisation (a fact, and not declared by Israel either) is jointly responsible for the appalling conditions that residents in Gaza experience under their watch.

 

[Zidane98]

And from a former Hamas member:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/son-of-hamas-leader-calls-the-militant-movement-a-racist-terror-organization/2019/07/04/7dc9f84e-9e42-11e9-9ed4-c9089972ad5a_story.html%3foutputType=amp

Seems that the everyday Gazans hold Hamas responsible for their misery.

 

[AM]

Your an absolute nutter, nobody is saying sheis wrong and Isrsel need to GTFO out of West Bank.

You are nothing but a Hamas extremist apologist who clearly cannot bring himself to even accept that a declared terrorist orgamisation (a fact, and not declared by Israel either) is jointly responsible for the appalling conditions that residents in Gaza experience under their watch.

Always interesting when posters start shouting invective. In the early days I thought your display of a little concern for the oppression and occupation had a degree of genuineness. Some testing has shown you to be little more than a shouting opprobrious apologist. Reprising lies and half truths about the countless progressive people and organisations who actually live the experience and who I’ve quoted so often. Like your smear of former IDF soldiers from Breaking the Silence.

I do wonder whether you’ve actually viewed Emily’s address to the UN. If you have you certainly haven’t comprehended it. You say there’s nothing in it with which you disagree, yet there a comments she made which contradict much of the propaganda you’ve reprised, I assume from the comfort of your home in Australia.

If you totally agree with Emily’s position you’d be agreeing that policy of Israel is to force Palestinians off the land which has been theirs since Adam was a toddler brutally and in defiance of International Law and that Israel is wilfully pursuing a policy of apartheid. Among many other things.

Then there’s the webinar in which Emily takes the view that the main focus of the progressives should be on boycotts rather than annexation, particularly targeting the EU which is Israel’s major market. Again, something with which your commentary shows you do not agree. Shush, but Israel has employed that policy on numerous occasions itself.

As for your continued offensive drivel about Hamas, I’ve had disagreements with their approach and have stated them. Arafat too. It’s just you don’t comprehend very well or it doesn’t suit your agenda to remember.

 

[Zidane98]

Always interesting when posters start shouting invective. In the early days I thought your display of a little concern for the oppression and occupation had a degree of genuineness. Some testing has shown you to be little more than a shouting opprobrious apologist. Reprising lies and half truths about the countless progressive people and organisations who actually live the experience and who I’ve quoted so often. Like your smear of former IDF soldiers from Breaking the Silence.

I do wonder whether you’ve actually viewed Emily’s address to the UN. If you have you certainly haven’t comprehended it. You say there’s nothing in it with which you disagree, yet there a comments she made which contradict much of the propaganda you’ve reprised, I assume from the comfort of your home in Australia.

If you totally agree with Emily’s position you’d be agreeing that policy of Israel is to force Palestinians off the land which has been theirs since Adam was a toddler brutally and in defiance of International Law and that Israel is wilfully pursuing a policy of apartheid. Among many other things.

Then there’s the webinar in which Emily takes the view that the main focus of the progressives should be on boycotts rather than annexation, particularly targeting the EU which is Israel’s major market. Again, something with which your commentary shows you do not agree. Shush, but Israel has employed that policy on numerous occasions itself.

As for your continued offensive drivel about Hamas, I’ve had disagreements with their approach and have stated them. Arafat too. It’s just you don’t comprehend very well or it doesn’t suit your agenda to remember.

You conveniently fail to acknowledge the fact that Palestine were twice offered up to 97% of the current territory in peace agreements only to knock it back. Thats a fact that you continue to hide from.


There is never going to be a peace process until Hamas is removed as they openly declare they want Israel and its people destroyed and also openly encourage terrorism. Nothing they do is justified and any of the good Gazans that do attempt to stand up to them are arrested, tortured etc. You really should be directing your anger at the Iranians and extremidts in Qatar for supporting them.


Also your quoting of Breaking the Silence is laughable. You lnow yourself that the organisation is political in its aims and that most if its testimony is exagerrated propagamda. Not that it seems to bother you of course.

 

[Not Important]

https://www.ohchr.org/EN/HRBodies/HRC/RegularSessions/Session44/Documents/A_HRC_44_60.pdf

 

[Zidane98]

Breaking the Silence (Shovrim Shtika) » ngomonitor

Breaking the Silence makes sweeping accusations based on anecdotal, anonymous, and unverifiable accounts of often low-ranked soldiers. These “testimonies” lack context, are politically biased, and erase the complicated reality in the West Bank. In addition, they reflect a distorted...

www.ngo-monitor.org

Pretty telling. BRS linked to anti-israel activists. Politicsl links to BDS.

Questioned has to be asked of those who cite BTS as a reliable source and try to paint the IDF in its entirety in the same mould. Like any large army (including our own army) theres always going to be a few that do the wrong thing.

 

[AM]

You conveniently fail to acknowledge the fact that Palestine were twice offered up to 97% of the current territory in peace agreements only to knock it back. Thats a fact that you continue to hide from

Once again this extreme rightist re-writing of history has been dealt with and dispatched in this thread. Every so-called offer by Israel was so vague and with had so many caveats they were designed to fail.

The Myth of the Generous Offer

The seemingly endless volleys of attack and retaliation in the Middle East leave many people wondering why the two sides can't reach an agreement. The answer is simple, according to numerous commentators: At the Camp David meeting in July 2000, Israel "offered extraordinary concessions" (Michael...

fair.org

Even Robert Malley, Clinton’s Special Assistant for Arab-Israeli Affairs who was present said:

“Had any member of the US peace team been asked to describe Barak's true positions before or even during Camp David - indeed, were any asked that question today - they would be hard-pressed to answer."

“There were no written offers, no maps presenting exactly what it was that Israeli claimed to have offered”

The reality of Camp David - the proposals were so vague that it was difficult to reach agreement on what they actually were.

The Partition gifted Israel 55% of Palestinian land for a Jewish state, even though Jewish folk owned less than 7% of the land

Had Israel been content with that and established the State of Israel within those borders the likelihood is there would be peace now. But virtually from day one using their power and influence and superior weaponry Israel went about occupying more and more Palestinian land. And it continues today.

There is never going to be a peace process until Hamas is removed as they openly declare they want Israel and its people destroyed and also openly encourage terrorism. Nothing they do is justified and any of the good Gazans that do attempt to stand up to them are arrested, tortured etc. You really should be directing your anger at the Iranians and extremidts in Qatar for supporting them.

More one sided closed mind repetition straight from the AIPAC song book.

For every comment you make about the intentions of Hamas I’ve posted posted numerous comments about the desire for the destruction of Palestine by not only Israeli PMs but cabinet ministers too. From Golda Mier and before. Including some in the present Netanyahu regime. Which I’ve also quoted in this thread. Once again you shoot from the hip.

Oh, and while we’re on oppressive regimes and bed mates, seems Israel is quite happy to be mates with and trade with the international disgrace that is Saudi Arabia.

Also your quoting of Breaking the Silence is laughable. You know yourself that the organisation is political in its aims and that most if its testimony is exagerrated propagamda. Not that it seems to bother you of course.

Despite me having spoken in favour of the former IDF soldiers who form Breaking the Silence and their courage in providing first-hand accounts of the brutality carried out by a regime you support you claim I know “its testimony is exaggerated propaganda” Your arrogance is something to behold.

The reason the extreme rightists you support seek to discredit BtS is because it is so effective. Real life accounts from a myriad – and growing – number of former IDF soldiers are threatening. Hell, what if people who were caring and compassion actually found out the truth.

But it’s the way you extreme rightists work. Gideon Levy, Antony Loewenstein and Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man – among countless others - have been pilloried too. As have many of the other countless caring, compassionate organisations I’ve quoted. Including T’ruah The Rabbinical Call for Human Rights. It’s the way you extreme rightists roll. Discredit. Discredit. Discredit..........

Israel's New McCarthyism

Inside the well-organized campaign against Israel's progressive community.

prospect.org

Military's attack on "Breaking the Silence" is groundless, given its refusal to investigate events in Operation Cast Lead

In light of the Israeli military's attack against the credibility of the soldiers' testimonies issued by “Breaking the Silence”, B'Tselem has urgently sent the Minister of Defense copies of letters previously sent to the judge advocate general, in which the organization reported grave suspicions...

www.btselem.org

How Breaking the Silence Inspires My Pro-Israel Advocacy

Breaking the Silence, the organization of former Israeli soldiers who speak about their experiences serving in the occupied Palestinian Territories, has recently come under heavy attack from right-wing forces in Israel’s government and society. As a pro-Israel, pro-Palestinian activist and...

forward.com

Your capacity to keeping jumping all over the place when nailed would be funny if not so sad.

Still no response to my request to go through Israeli Human Rights Lawyer, Emily Schaeffer Omer – Man’s UN Security Council Address showing us point- by –point where she is wrong and why. You just slipped in a one liner along the lines of it seems okay. Then, despite my illustrating the hypocrisy of the one liner by pointing out where your posts have contradicted Emily’s first-hand account you move on to other matters reprising more rightists propaganda and in the process become abusive.

I guess going through the UN Address would show your contradictions writ large so better to run and pivot to whataboutism.

Breaking the Silence (Shovrim Shtika) » ngomonitor

Breaking the Silence makes sweeping accusations based on anecdotal, anonymous, and unverifiable accounts of often low-ranked soldiers. These “testimonies” lack context, are politically biased, and erase the complicated reality in the West Bank. In addition, they reflect a distorted...

www.ngo-monitor.org

Pretty telling. BRS linked to anti-israel activists. Politicsl links to BDS.

Questioned has to be asked of those who cite BTS as a reliable source and try to paint the IDF in its entirety in the same mould. Like any large army (including our own army) theres always going to be a few that do the wrong thing.

NGO Monitor. LOL A a rightist dummy organisation for the Israel government.

"The organization has been criticized by academic figures, diplomats, and journalists who have said that NGO Monitor's research and conclusions are driven by politics, that it does not examine right-wing NGOs, and that it puts out misleading information.

https://www.972mag.com/what-is-ngo-monitors-connection-to-the-israeli-government/

 

[Zidane98]

Youre in full propaganda mode. Those maps are incorrect and you know it. The facts are Abbas said the decision to not accept the partition deal was a mistake and should have been accepted. The leader of Palestine's words, not mine.

You have more of a problem with Israel then you do with a declared terrorist organisation - that's telling to an outsider.

Which comes back to the fact that you arent intetested in peace. Your hatred of Israel is clear in everything you post which is full if discredited propaganda.

 

[Zidane98]

As for Breaking the Silence

The problem with Breaking the Silence

To treat soldiers' testimonies of the exception as reality is misleading, and particularly problematic when outsiders use them to vilify Israel.

www.google.com

A favourite source of yours to quote.


Also

Breaking the Silence Gets Failing Grade in Channel 10’s Fact-Check

In an Op-Ed in the Israeli Walla news site, Goren and Rom argued that while they did not think BtS was intentionally lying, the organization's vetting process was "superficial and not strict enough." In their opinion, BtS would be more credible were it present the soldiers’ accounts as...

camera-uk.org

 

[Zidane98]

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

Once again AM spreading blatant propaganda about peace proposals.

Palestines own leader acknowledges Palestine was wrong to reject UN 181 and declare war on Israel along with fellow Arab nations.

2008 peace proposal which offered 93% complete withdrawal out of West Bank also refuted

PA rejects Olmert's offer to withdraw from 93% of West Bank

Abbas rep.: Proposal a 'waste of time'; PM intent on reaching deal during his remaining time in office.

www.google.com

Claims that peace proposals were not fair are simply not true. Palestune actually cited UN resolution 181 when applying for statehood in 1988.

As for the ridiculous map posted above:

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

Theres a very clear, extreme rhetoric here on display by AM . It helpls nobody to continuously cite anti-Israeli propaganda. This is a two sided conflict that wont ever be resolved if such attitudes persist and the citizens of Palestine deserve better.

 

[AM]

Youre in full propaganda mode. Those maps are incorrect and you know it. The facts are Abbas said the decision to not accept the partition deal was a mistake and should have been accepted. The leader of Palestine's words, not mine.

You have more of a problem with Israel then you do with a declared terrorist organisation - that's telling to an outsider.

Which comes back to the fact that you arent intetested in peace. Your hatred of Israel is clear in everything you post which is full if discredited propaganda.

Once again you not only display your arrogance but ignorance too. The maps are not incorrect.

I really shouldn’t dignify your obtuse comment about my hatred of Israel but just to illustrate its utter stupidity, by extension you’re also saying that the people I quote extensively here hate Israel too. That would be Gideon Levy who lives there by choice and love of the place. Antony Loewenstein who moved there from Oz for love of the place. Emily Schaeffer Omer-Man whose work involves regular visits there. You know the same Emily who addressed the UN Security Council and whose telling comments you run away from despite being asked to go through them point-point countless times. Of course, that would further expose you to being the extreme rightest reciter of AIPAC propaganda you are. Well just to remind those who have assimilated Emily’s address, near the finish Emily said: As an Israeli who cares deeply about my country and its future.....” What hatred she must have for the place. Just three of an enormous number of genuine caring humanitarian Jews I’ve cited often and who, in your warped mind, apparently ‘hate’ Israel.

Then there are organisations like the Rabbis 4 Human Rights. The JVP Rabbinical Council who said “Our message is simple: This is not what human beings do to one another. And we will not stand idly by as our neighbors' blood is shed” B’Tselem – The Israeli Information Centre for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories. T'ruah: The Rabbinic Call for Human Rights. Jewish Voice for Peace which is about justice, equality, and dignity. Bend the Arc another Israeli advocacy organisation. Gisha who promote the rights guaranteed by international and Israeli law. If Not Now a transformative Jewish organisation.
Just a few of the innumerable progressive Jewish organisations I’ve cited repeatedly who also, in your warped mind, apparently ‘hate’ Israel.

These people and organisations seem to have no trouble with Breaking the Silence. Many link BtS on their twitter feeds. BtS is no more than a huge number of former IDF soldiers recounting their experiences. Of course, telling the truth can’t be allowed in the sad repressed extreme rightist world in which you dwell. So the recourse is to discredit as you embarrassingly attempted to do by way of citing a front organisation for the Israel government. It’s dodgy sources like that where so much of your material comes from - we get that.

Had you assimilated anything in this thread you’d know I’ve spent time working on a Kibbutz. I have many Jewish friends. Admittedly progressives because they can see past propaganda. But my oldest friend is quite orthodox, once having been a Cantor and although we aren’t on the same page a lot of the time thankfully he doesn’t have a closed mind who only spouts hype as you do.

As I’ve also said quite a few times before I can’t understand why a people who have been through so much are acting the way they are in the Middle East. One would think there would be a strong humanitarian streak running through at least those who matter. Clearly, that isn’t the case as the often appalling, unconscionable, brutal treatment of a people who have little by a major power who has it all demonstrates.

The hatred of the Palestinians and the corruption at the top of the Israel government and fellow travelers are there for all to see. Bibi’s son was removed from Facebook for hateful posts. His wife has been found guilty of corruption. He’s facing major corruption charges and although he said he wants his day in court he’s using all his influence to ensure the charges are never heard. And several ministers have expressed a desire to dismantle Palestine. To put it mildly. There’s history too – Olmert.

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

Once again AM spreading blatant propaganda about peace proposals.

Palestines own leader acknowledges Palestine was wrong to reject UN 181 and declare war on Israel along with fellow Arab nations.

2008 peace proposal which offered 93% complete withdrawal out of West Bank also refuted

Claims that peace proposals were not fair are simply not true. Palestune actually cited UN resolution 181 when applying for statehood in 1988.

As for the ridiculous map posted above:

Theres a very clear, extreme rhetoric here on display by AM . It helpls nobody to continuously cite anti-Israeli propaganda. This is a two sided conflict that wont ever be resolved if such attitudes persist and the citizens of Palestine deserve better.

My remarks about the peace process are from Robert Malley, Clinton’s Special Assistant for Arab-Israeli Affairs who was part of the process – ie he was there Not from dubious AIPAC propaganda.

Many publications support what Malley has said. As far as what can be gleaned from the sketchy proposal that was designed to fail.

All those of an independent mind know there are two sides. One has all the power, wealth, military might and influence and who sees financial and strategic benefits in continuing with the unlawful inhumane occupation and continued brutal theft of land. With the support and succor of people like you who are little more than apologists for a ruthless, immoral, unconscionable regime.

Fortunately, there is an ever-growing number of thoughtful, humane, caring Jewish folk who see the wrong and who are concerned that the current path will lead to Israel becoming a pariah state. Rather than hate they care.

Sadly uninformed closed mind campaigners like you who just reprise the extreme right propaganda, often from dodgy sources, are the problem, not the solution.

 

[Spitty_the_alpaca]