Why can't North afford to bottom out?

Thats Wright

Premiership Player
Jan 16, 2011
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I feel your frustration. If such a thing exists, North are my second team so I'd like to see them do well. Wouldn't be looking to offer Brad Scott any contract extensions unless North are top 4 and winning finals in 2015-16. And hopefully your next president is stronger and more forthright than Brayshaw. Otherwise it's time for a cleanout and rebuild with a new coach, president and playing list. No more short-term fixes with recruiting old blokes or 'mini-rebuild' nonsense and limply floating around mid-table.
Yep, there's no accountability with Brayshaw.

In a way Brad has completely failed to be proactive, set standards or a premiership direction, because he hasn't had to.
As great as Brayshaw has been historically, hes a corporate logo of a human these days and incompetently fails to guide the club, both onfield and culturally.

Brad is merely an assistant type coach without the empathy, understanding, wisdom, or foresight to be successful. Amateur hour with a big mouth. He was hired to mouth off in a consumable fashion, but he'll never have success always working in hindsight.
His development/selection routine needs the Benny Hill soundtrack.
It's a disgrace that Brown and Wood are such low profile footballers. Dumont as well even though theres many inside mids.

The list is in good shape and it's such a waste of time entering finals with a team guided by a coach that turns the lights out before the game, calls off games and training because of rain and literally believes respect of his peers is more important than success.

Problem is, Brayshaw doesn't have high enough standards anymore either, but that's understandable considering his historical importance.

All Brad will be known for is wasting everyone's time with his hospital grade culture and spin.
 

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King Cold

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Nov 9, 2011
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2008 wants its thread back.

Pre Hobart, debt reduction, facilities, 18 teams.

Suggesting a couple of appearances in the bottom four is bottoming out, is a bit rich.
Are you trying to suggest that St Kilda and Western Bulldogs haven't bottomed out in recent times? :$
 

Thats Wright

Premiership Player
Jan 16, 2011
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North Melbourne
Are you trying to suggest that St Kilda and Western Bulldogs haven't bottomed out in recent times? :$
My attention span seems to be quite short, but have they?

All I can see is 2 teams joining North in mediocrity (for now) after a couple of lean seasons.

Carlton or Melbourne are much lower on the bottoming out scale, surely.

Fitzroy?

A decent coach goes a long way.

Malthouse has taken away the gloss of the human element of AFL coaching.

At the end of the day, unless you are Mick, the human touch has a lot to do with player development and success.
 

master bate

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Aug 13, 2006
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I doubt North would survive Melbourne's run from 2007-2013 but I don't say that as some kind of brag.

We had a 5 million dollar debt demolition in that stretch which came at just the right time. We also sold games to the NT (1 then now 2), as North have with Hobart.

North's real problem (and the Saints and probably Melbourne and the Dogs) is the inability to cash in when things turn for the better. North made a prelim last year but with only 2 Friday night games (and only hosting 1) they haven't been rewarded. They don't have a good deal at Etihad. They can certainly make their sponsors happy by winning but if they aren't getting any more exposure then they can't demand more sponsorship revenue.
 

blaisee

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There will be a growing push over the next decade or two that there are too many Victorian teams. If you're a small club, you certainly wouldn't want to be having a down period as those calls get louder.
The tassie Hawks have already relocated , nth are next
 

Scotland

TheBrownDog
May 5, 2006
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On this topic I reckon footy fans are actually smarter than they are given credit.

North fans don't want to see their team hovering around mid table going nowhere year after year.

Sure if they're a top 4 side then they'll get more fans through the gate and make more money, but I reckon a genuine rebuild could be sold to the supporters pretty easily. Modern footy fans love watching teams full of 21 year olds who look like they're trending upwards, and it's not like any team is going to go bankrupt with one or two down years since the TV rights deal has us locked in for another 3 or 4 years as we are and the AFL have more than enough money to hand out via CBFs, ASDs or any other mechanisms they have up their sleeve.
 

master bate

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 13, 2006
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On this topic I reckon footy fans are actually smarter than they are given credit.

North fans don't want to see their team hovering around mid table going nowhere year after year.

Sure if they're a top 4 side then they'll get more fans through the gate and make more money, but I reckon a genuine rebuild could be sold to the supporters pretty easily. Modern footy fans love watching teams full of 21 year olds who look like they're trending upwards, and it's not like any team is going to go bankrupt with one or two down years since the TV rights deal has us locked in for another 3 or 4 years as we are and the AFL have more than enough money to hand out via CBFs, ASDs or any other mechanisms they have up their sleeve.
Maybe smarter, but maybe greedy as well. North made a prelim last year and will likely get 12 wins or more and finals this year. The school of thought is if you aren't top 4 you can't win it but at the same time you have to dare to dream don't you?

North had their young team on the rise after the 2009 draft, it's just that team has stagnated. And it's not like they've done nothing. They've gone hard at free agency (or at least the ones they had a chance to get).

Their plan was probably that Wells finally reached elite consistent midfielder status (but instead went the other way). That one of Ziebell or Cunnington jumped up from solid to star. And that maybe they fluked a gun player from a draftee - Luke McDonald was rated a top 5 pick. If they turned in to Mundy and Fyfe all of a sudden North would be on to something.

When it's time to rebuild I think you have to go quickly and go hard for the rebuilding strategy. But I don't mind North having a crack at seeing the current list through for a couple of years with Freo, Syd and Hawthorn aging and the expansion sides not quite ready. There's a window for a non perfect premiership team (or at least grand finalist) and West Coast, Richmond and North have to be there abouts.
 

Thats Wright

Premiership Player
Jan 16, 2011
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Maybe smarter, but maybe greedy as well. North made a prelim last year and will likely get 12 wins or more and finals this year. The school of thought is if you aren't top 4 you can't win it but at the same time you have to dare to dream don't you?

North had their young team on the rise after the 2009 draft, it's just that team has stagnated. And it's not like they've done nothing. They've gone hard at free agency (or at least the ones they had a chance to get).

Their plan was probably that Wells finally reached elite consistent midfielder status (but instead went the other way). That one of Ziebell or Cunnington jumped up from solid to star. And that maybe they fluked a gun player from a draftee - Luke McDonald was rated a top 5 pick. If they turned in to Mundy and Fyfe all of a sudden North would be on to something.

When it's time to rebuild I think you have to go quickly and go hard for the rebuilding strategy. But I don't mind North having a crack at seeing the current list through for a couple of years with Freo, Syd and Hawthorn aging and the expansion sides not quite ready. There's a window for a non perfect premiership team (or at least grand finalist) and West Coast, Richmond and North have to be there abouts.
I don't think he's talking about throwing in the towel mid season.
 

SizeMatters

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North has always been an irrelevant club. Even when they had Duck running around and won those 2 cups. Should have merged with the Dogs years ago and save the AFL millions a year.
 

Bhoys Dont Cry

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North has always been an irrelevant club. Even when they had Duck running around and won those 2 cups. Should have merged with the Dogs years ago and save the AFL millions a year.
Very funny considering the current situation at the relevant Lions.
 

Bunk Moreland

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St Kilda and the Bulldogs are well located in terms of geography.

Melbourne have the original club and the MCC connection.

North have a smaller base and no real geographical heartland
Geography means nothing in Melbourne football and hasn't for decades.

All clubs play in the CBD. They don't belong to any area.

We've been hearing this entire western suburbs thing about the Bulldogs for 20 years now. FFS thy even changed their name. They haven't capitalised on it and they never will unless they play there and the locals can go to a game close by.

North have some issues but geography isn't one of them. It's a non issue.
 

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Scotland

TheBrownDog
May 5, 2006
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Maybe smarter, but maybe greedy as well. North made a prelim last year and will likely get 12 wins or more and finals this year. The school of thought is if you aren't top 4 you can't win it but at the same time you have to dare to dream don't you?

North had their young team on the rise after the 2009 draft, it's just that team has stagnated. And it's not like they've done nothing. They've gone hard at free agency (or at least the ones they had a chance to get).

Their plan was probably that Wells finally reached elite consistent midfielder status (but instead went the other way). That one of Ziebell or Cunnington jumped up from solid to star. And that maybe they fluked a gun player from a draftee - Luke McDonald was rated a top 5 pick. If they turned in to Mundy and Fyfe all of a sudden North would be on to something.

When it's time to rebuild I think you have to go quickly and go hard for the rebuilding strategy. But I don't mind North having a crack at seeing the current list through for a couple of years with Freo, Syd and Hawthorn aging and the expansion sides not quite ready. There's a window for a non perfect premiership team (or at least grand finalist) and West Coast, Richmond and North have to be there abouts.
I don't think North's list is premiership quality with or without Dal Santo / Waite / Higgins but that's not really relevant. They've put their eggs into the 2015/16 basket and that's their prerogative.

When these guys and Harvey, Wells, Petrie etc. finish up they'll need to reassess on where they're at. They can either go after some established players to try and stay in and around the 8 or they can go to the draft and even trade out guys they have that are 26+ to try and get some good picks. My point is that I don't think they'll go out of business if they have a bottom 4 season or two.
 

TwentyNine

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May 16, 2013
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Can't say I've ever heard someone suggest that North would fold if we happened to bottom out. I've heard people suggest North will fold constantly - just parrots looking for a cracker really - but never that it's tied to ladder position. Given that we've been making regular profits and breaking membership records with only a small amount of success lately, it doesn't make much sense to me.
 

King Cold

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My attention span seems to be quite short, but have they?

All I can see is 2 teams joining North in mediocrity (for now) after a couple of lean seasons.

Carlton or Melbourne are much lower on the bottoming out scale, surely.

Fitzroy?

A decent coach goes a long way.

Malthouse has taken away the gloss of the human element of AFL coaching.

At the end of the day, unless you are Mick, the human touch has a lot to do with player development and success.
St Kilda have been near the bottom for 3 years.

Western Bulldogs were near the bottom for 3 years before climbing back up the ladder this year.

I'd suggest they both bottomed out.
 

Thats Wright

Premiership Player
Jan 16, 2011
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What kind of club would actively seek to bottom out? o_O
Exactly. And even if we did we'd be bloody mediocre at it.

From an outsider you'd think how can North have the talent when Gibson plays every game.

Wood should have 20 games by now.

You need to somewhat bottom out when you've self destructed.

Bit like what malthouse did to Carlton.
 

Dazb86

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I doubt North would survive Melbourne's run from 2007-2013 but I don't say that as some kind of brag.

We had a 5 million dollar debt demolition in that stretch which came at just the right time. We also sold games to the NT (1 then now 2), as North have with Hobart.

North's real problem (and the Saints and probably Melbourne and the Dogs) is the inability to cash in when things turn for the better. North made a prelim last year but with only 2 Friday night games (and only hosting 1) they haven't been rewarded. They don't have a good deal at Etihad. They can certainly make their sponsors happy by winning but if they aren't getting any more exposure then they can't demand more sponsorship revenue.
A lot of the exposure problems is entirely out of the clubs hands.
 

Rod Stroker

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North has always been an irrelevant club. Even when they had Duck running around and won those 2 cups. Should have merged with the Dogs years ago and save the AFL millions a year.
Irrelevant would be when the AFL decides to use you as a guinea pig to trial 4 field umpires at one of your home games because no one gives a stuff about the result. That's irrelevant.

3 flags and 4 GF'S in a row, yet still one of the lowest membership bases in the comp and reliant on afl assistance to survive. What a joke of a club.
 

SizeMatters

Brownlow Medallist
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Irrelevant would be when the AFL decides to use you as a guinea pig to trial 4 field umpires at one of your home games because no one gives a stuff about the result. That's irrelevant.

3 flags and 4 GF'S in a row, yet still one of the lowest membership bases in the comp and reliant on afl assistance to survive. What a joke of a club.
How many times has your club almost been merged or relocated? Just remember one thing, the Bears didn't have to merge with the Roys... it was the other way around. What happened to the move to the Gold Coast? Your lot would rather base yourselves out of Ballarat? Which you have lost to the Dogs of all clubs!
 

Rod Stroker

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How many times has your club almost been merged or relocated? Just remember one thing, the Bears didn't have to merge with the Roys... it was the other way around.
Clueless. The AFL engineered that Fitzroy would merge with Brisbane by making the deal so attractive that Brisbane couldn't turn it down. All because the AFL didn't want Fitzroy to merge with North and make us even stronger as we'd just won the flag. Despite most Fitzroy fans wanting to merge with North to remain in Melbourne.
What happened to the move to the Gold Coast?
The AFL tried to ship us up there, we told them to get stuffed and have become stronger ever since.
Your lot would rather base yourselves out of Ballarat? Which you have lost to the Dogs of all clubs!
At no point have we ever wanted to based ourselves out of Ballarat.

You ignorance on this topic is laughable.
 

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