Why Jason Cloke is a hack.

[Wiggins]

My points about Cloke were not abuse at all. They are facts.

The facts are

He is extremetly slow.
He is a terrible kick.

These facts are not debated by anyone. The question I raised, which was before last weeks game, was where do you play him now that he is not allowed to roam loose in defence?

Malthouse thought it was wise to play him on Goodes which was totally ridiculous and very costly. He couldn't match strides with Jonathan Brown, what hope did he have against Goodes?

I understand that he is a committed player and others in the past with limited skills and lacking pace have had good careers.

The problem with Cloke is that his skills are so poor and he is so slow, that he is unable to compete. He is not up to AFL level. Take out the games he has played loose in defence and he has been nothing but a liability to the team. Now that he cannot play loose he will continue to be a liability to the team.

We shall see how he goes against the crows.

 

[understudy]

Originally posted by Wiggins


We shall see how he goes against the crows.

ah no we wont!

 

[FIGJAM]

Originally posted by Wiggins
My points about Cloke were not abuse at all. They are facts.

The facts are

He is extremetly slow.
He is a terrible kick.

These facts are not debated by anyone. The question I raised, which was before last weeks game, was where do you play him now that he is not allowed to roam loose in defence?

Malthouse thought it was wise to play him on Goodes which was totally ridiculous and very costly. He couldn't match strides with Jonathan Brown, what hope did he have against Goodes?

I understand that he is a committed player and others in the past with limited skills and lacking pace have had good careers.

The problem with Cloke is that his skills are so poor and he is so slow, that he is unable to compete. He is not up to AFL level. Take out the games he has played loose in defence and he has been nothing but a liability to the team. Now that he cannot play loose he will continue to be a liability to the team.

We shall see how he goes against the crows.

All just your opinion Wiggins, but you always fail to recognise his qualities. You either have a vendetta against the kid, or you are ignorant to football.

You can't seriously tell me that against the Bulldogs last season, when he earned three Brownlow votes, that he was not up to AFL standard or in fact the best player on the ground.

Cloke is not playing against Adelaide, because they have only two tall forwards due to Stevens and Burton (plays tall) being out. Otherwise Cloke would be in.

 

[Wiggins]

I don't think you've read any of my posts figjam. Cloke played loose in defence in that Bulldog game and that party is now over.
So where do you play him? Not on a man as he gets killed. Trent Bartlett gave him a bath on the weekend when he played for Williamstown. That's right, Trent Bartlett!

I found this little story........................................

The out-of-touch Cloke, dropped to recapture some form, lined up for Williamstown in the Seagulls' four-point win over a spirited Tasmania at Point Gellibrand Oval.

With no suitable match-up, Cloke, who suffered a minor ankle sprain in a first-quarter marking contest, lined up on a number of opponents throughout the match.

Although he finished with just six kicks and four marks and did not have a strong influence on the game, Gotch said he had been impressed with Cloke's endeavour.

"I'd say he'd come under consideration for next week," Gotch said.

"It's unfortunate, in the end he couldn't cope with (Trent) Bartlett and there wasn't a lot of good match-ups for him.

"So we had to play him on medium types and he got exposed a couple of times just in stoppages.

"But I thought his genuine intent was good and his workrate and his effort. It's hard to judge a game when you can't play on a direct opponent for the whole game, when you're on all different-sized players."

..........................................

If he cant find a suitable match up in the VFL, he certainly wont find one in the big league.

By the way Gotch is dreaming if he thinks Cloke deserves a re-call. Williamstown for a while yet.

 

[MGREG]

I wonder when that Troglodyte Ugle will post?

 

[hotpie]

Originally posted by Wiggins


The out-of-touch Cloke, dropped to recapture some form, lined up for Williamstown in the Seagulls' four-point win over a spirited Tasmania at Point Gellibrand Oval.

Its not really news that out of touch players get dropped to recapture form. Nor is it news that they sometimes spent quite a few weeks in the VFL before they gain a recall.

Cloke is only 21 and despite his lack of height and pace, will eventually turn in to the next Glenn Archer. His "honeymoon" is over - it happens to almost all second year players - but the boy will reinvent himself as a defender who can actaiullty man up. No prblems.

 

[knuckles]

Originally posted by hotpie
Its not really news that out of touch players get dropped to recapture form. Nor is it news that they sometimes spent quite a few weeks in the VFL before they gain a recall.

Cloke is only 21 and despite his lack of height and pace, will eventually turn in to the next Glenn Archer. His "honeymoon" is over - it happens to almost all second year players - but the boy will reinvent himself as a defender who can actaiullty man up. No prblems.

Wishful thing re the Archer comparison. Cloke can look very clumsy. Glenn never did. Plus GA was quick early on. Jason is doing the proverbial Rexy...'starting off slowly, then totally slacking off'

 

[Joel]

Originally posted by knuckles
Wishful thing re the Archer comparison. Cloke can look very clumsy. Glenn never did. Plus GA was quick early on. Jason is doing the proverbial Rexy...'starting off slowly, then totally slacking off'

****, do you ever say anthing positive? Sorry, but I haven't seen the positive side in you in quite a while.

 

[knuckles]

Originally posted by Joel
****, do you ever say anthing positive? Sorry, but I haven't seen the positive side in you in quite a while.

We will win this Sat!! Lonie, Bucks, Tazz, Pebs are all Guns!! Cole is gunna be a gun!!
There

 

[Joel]

Originally posted by knuckles
We will win this Sat!! Lonie, Bucks, Tazz, Pebs are all Guns!! Cole is gunna be a gun!!
There

Ahhhhhhh! That's better.

 

[MGREG]

WIGGINS + EGG = WIPE IT OFF YOUR FACE

 

[FIGJAM]

Originally posted by MGREG
WIGGINS + EGG = WIPE IT OFF YOUR FACE

Yeah, where is he now??

Will say some BS like "He had a slow player to match up on". Here's some news for you Wiggins, most clubs have a player he can match up on!!

Or excuse two, "He played loose in defence". To be honest I have been upset that our structure has been tampered with by Malthouse, in not playing a loose man in defence!

Great game Clokey and keep sticking it up the ignorant doubters!!

 

[Joel]

Gooooo Clokey!

Wiggins, where are you?

 

[Wiggins]

Are you guys for real?

I am more then ready to accept Cloke if he is worthy, but that game was not proof of anything. In a comprehensive thrashing of a team anyone can look okay.

His major problems which are skill and extreme lack of pace are still there to see and will never go away.

Last year i was on my own in thinking that Cloke was a hack and not up to it. This year it is closer to 50/50. The trend is my friend and will continue to be.

You cant be that slow and that poor a kick and be any good.

Further proof that i am correct is magpie greg is of an oppsing view. He has not been right about one thing regarding football yet, and i dont think he is about to turn it around now.

 

[Babylove]

Okay, I think that Cloke is a good player, who is only going to improve (he is, after all only in his SECOND year of AFL football).
And I disagree about him lacking skills. I think he has a lot of skills, particularly in defence (which is where he generally plays).

Secondly, Wiggins, I have been reading your negativity, and I can't understand it. If Mick Malthouse thinks he's a good player then that is good enough for me.
Perhaps, you should be focusing your energy on positive things about Collingwood, rather than the negativity.

 

[MGREG]

Originally posted by Wiggins
Are you guys for real?

I am more then ready to accept Cloke if he is worthy, but that game was not proof of anything. In a comprehensive thrashing of a team anyone can look okay.

His major problems which are skill and extreme lack of pace are still there to see and will never go away.

Last year i was on my own in thinking that Cloke was a hack and not up to it. This year it is closer to 50/50. The trend is my friend and will continue to be.

You cant be that slow and that poor a kick and be any good.

Further proof that i am correct is magpie greg is of an oppsing view. He has not been right about one thing regarding football yet, and i dont think he is about to turn it around now.

Funny, I was thinking the same thing about you Ugle.

Nice and polite on here arent you Mr. Racist.

GO away or I will say a word that always scares the pants of you

WISBEY!

Run away arse clown.

 

[Joel]

Originally posted by Wiggins
Are you guys for real?

I am more then ready to accept Cloke if he is worthy, but that game was not proof of anything. In a comprehensive thrashing of a team anyone can look okay.

His major problems which are skill and extreme lack of pace are still there to see and will never go away.

Last year i was on my own in thinking that Cloke was a hack and not up to it. This year it is closer to 50/50. The trend is my friend and will continue to be.

You cant be that slow and that poor a kick and be any good.

Further proof that i am correct is magpie greg is of an oppsing view. He has not been right about one thing regarding football yet, and i dont think he is about to turn it around now.

You are an idiot. He played fantastic last year (in his first year), he has suffered a form lapse this season but looks to be regaining form. The thing you don't understand is that players gain confidence from those types of matches, i.e. against lower sides. He will be good.

 

[Wiggins]

Its not lack of confidence or form that is his problem, but that he is no longer allowed loose in defence. If he is allowed loose in defence i am happy to have him in the team. And that gets back to my original question in this thread. Where do you play him if not loose in defence? His ability is not suited to any other position.

Nobody has answered this. Personal insults and exclamations that he is a good player regardless, have not convinced me that i am wrong.

He won't be allowed loose in defence this week so we shall see where and how he plays. My guess is the bench after about 20 minutes of the first quarter.

 

[Jabso]

The way we used him against St. Kilda was good. Him not being the third man up to every contest, we are sort of rotating the 'loose man in defence' role regularly and Cloke was only peeling off his man when he thought it was best to.

 

[FIGJAM]

Originally posted by Wiggins
Nobody has answered this

I have. Like I said, yes, we recognise the same shortcomings that you see. Pace is a problem, as is his kicking skills at times. However, like I said, most teams have a player who Cloke can match up on...simple as that!

From us, we have Molloy. A perfect example.

Most clubs have a medium height, strong tall who isn't breathtakingly quick. Hamil is an example and is one of Cloke's many scalps.

So there's your question answered. Personally I see nothing wrong in playing a loose man in defence and almost by your own admission, he is the best man at it!

One day you should try to at least concede one or two attributes that Clokey has, then maybe you can earn some respect.

 

[carn_the_nmfc]

Geez you are harsh on Jason Cloke. I think that he is a really good player, it's just that he is down on form.

 

[hotpie]

Originally posted by goaldrush
Geez you are harsh on Jason Cloke. I think that he is a really good player, it's just that he is down on form.

Get off our boards

 

[FIGJAM]

Originally posted by goaldrush
Geez you are harsh on Jason Cloke. I think that he is a really good player, it's just that he is down on form.

I'd take suzi's opinion over Wiggins' anyday!

 

[Perty4]

Originally posted by goaldrush
Geez you are harsh on Jason Cloke. I think that he is a really good player, it's just that he is down on form.

Simple minds at work. Finished the crossword puzzle yet?

 

[Jabso]

Cloke's opponent's goals since getting dropped - 1.
So much for Cloke being a loose man in defence and crap if he is forced to man up.