Why women play the rough/risky game of AF? How can we get more?/Improve the AFLW? Any barriers?

[Floghead2007]

Average score it's inaugural season was 32.9
Average score so far in it's sixth season is 32.0

I've watched a few games lately and the standard is terrible, I've watched entire quarters that had maybe one clean pass by foot. There's a couple of players in each team that know what they're doing but the rest are running around like headless chooks. The average crowd size has been about 1,800 this season. Not sure what viewership numbers are like but I find myself only watching because it's a 'so bad you can't look away' type thing. How will this league ever survive on it's own? This is an honest assessment, not trying to knock it for no reason, I just don't see how this succeeds considering where it's at in it's sixth season.

In my opinion, i think that maybe in another 7-9 years time when the girls coming through have played footy since they were 6-7yo's not 16-17yo's, it will start to improve
The mens game first few years were exactly the same, you just gotta give it some time

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. Female GR AF has had very strong growth around Australia since 2017- obviously directly linked to the AFLW's creation/very high profile in 2017.

On a long term basis, however, the high female AF injury rates, if they continue, may imperil this female growth- & possibly cause female comp. GR AF nos. to decline everywhere in Aust. It has previously been reported that serious knee injuries in the AFLW were up to 9 times cf the AFL: & AFLW concussions c. double the AFL. (But AFLW ACL injury rates are c. "4-6 times more likely" in 2022, cf AFL).

2021 AFLW Season.

ACL injuries were "at all-time low" in the AFLW 2021: the rate, per 1000 player hours, in the 2021 was 3.22- in 2020, it was 8.83, 2019 5.14.

The raw no. of AFLW overall general injuries are, unfortunately, on the increase. With more AFLW games per season, however, raw no. increases are inevitable- but pro rata per games played, there was BIG INCREASE in overall injuries.
The overall injuries' incidence (no. of new injuries per club, per season) in the 2021 AFLW was 11.1- in 2020, it was 7.0, 2019 6.8.

The no. of missed matches per club in the 2021 AFLW was 36.7- in 2020, it was 24.4, 2019 17.8. This is another, pro rata of games, very big rise- & their season is short.

AFLW CONCUSSIONS, disturbingly, are rising, per 1000 playing hours. In 2021, 8.27- in 2020, 4.76.
(An important mitigating factor is that there is a continuing more conservative approach to concussions/possible concussions now- so comparing previous years' rates of concussions has very limited efficacy).

"2021 AFLW Injury Report: ACLs at all-time low, concussions increase​

The AFL has released the fifth annual AFLW Injury Report for the 2021 NAB AFL Women's Competition
www.womens.afl"


It is a pity the article did not give reasons for the increases in injury rates (excluding ACL's; & concussions/new protocols) which are much greater, pro rata, than the increase in games.

I would like to see female injury rates, analyses etc. in GR female jnr & adult players.









2. 2022- AFLW ACL Injury Rates Up. abc.net.au 20.3.22 K. O'Halloran, who said

"While the exact ratio has fluctuated significantly, at one point in the early seasons, AFLW players were up to 9.2 times more likely than AFL men's players to injure their ACLs.

Since then, the ratio has broadly stabilised at anywhere between four and six times more likely.
Most promisingly, in 2021, ACL injuries in AFLW were at an all-time low.

In 2022, however, these types of injuries have, once again, trended upwards.

Professor Crossley warns that such figures need to be taken in context".

Prof. K. Crossley said

"They are small numbers and we just don't have enough years of data to know the true incidence.

'But if you look at basketball, volleyball, European handball … the rates are about two to two and a half times higher than men (all emphases, mine)' ".

Why AFLW players are more likely to injure their ACLs​

Gold Coast Sun Jacqui Yorston describes her ACL rehabilitation as the 'most painful thing I've ever been through'. Kate O'Halloran speaks to the experts on why AFLW players are sustaining injuries at higher rates than men.
www.abc.net.au


It is imperative to reduce, significantly, & asap, female AF injury rates- primarily for their long term physical & mental health (& financial wellbeing); but, also, to support & promote female GR AF, & its long term prosperity.










3.

Weak as piss.

No- "Lies, Damned Lies, & Statistics".

Your statistics are not complete, if they don't include, on the cooler (because of clouds!) days, how many were effected (before, or during the game) by wet weather, puddles etc. A slippery ball affects disposal efficiency= lower scoring. A wet, heavy ball cannot be kicked as far= lower scores.

And on the lower temperature days, were the matches affected by rain- or recent rain, so grounds are still wet: greasy ball affects ball disposal efficiency= lower scores.

In summer, generally, the hottest days are cloud- free. Cloud-free days, during the match, mean no rain. Overhead clouds usually reduce the heat of the sun- & also, obviously, clouds sometimes bring rain.

You did not reply to these issues I put to you- I assume you accept the veracity of my comments.
And also my comments on ice vests & fans on the bench, more breaks & water carriers, bigger bench, necessary because the heat is appaling- why?

By claiming the interchange etc slows down play, you implicitly acknowledge it reduces the "tiring effects of running on the world's largest playing surface" and therefore surrender [Non sequitur] the "it's not safe to play in this heat" angle.

No, you are being misleading (probably deliberately).

The "tiring effects" are amplified by the almost constant running; & increased tackling /bumping /pushing/collisions with greater force, in the almost horrific & constant big nos. around the ball etc; & playing in strong heat, on harder more dangerous grounds.
These features, incontrovertibly, reduce player safety, & create more injuries.

Why have you always totally ignored the dangers of playing in the hot sun, which create much harder grounds?

I (& many others) want more free-flowing play- a smaller bench, & much less interchange, which will force players to remain, for longer periods, in their positions.
Players will not have the "fresh legs" to run & flood all day ie the game is likely to open up after half time, become more free -flowing, less stoppages & ball-ups, & higher scoring.
This is what the AFL seeeks- these pre-2005 & very desired features of AF are in the AFL's The Charter Of The Game.

With fresh, "interchanged" legs & big bench, there many more players at the contest, for longer periods, & players are now (cf pre 2005) bumping /tackling/colliding/pushing harder (as L. Matthews, & others, have stated)= more collision injuriies since 2005.

At any stage in the competition's six-year history (pre-expansion, expansion 1, or expansion 2), on average the hottest days are the highest-scoring and the coldest days are the lowest-scorin

See my reply above, about your failure to include-on the cooler & cloudier days, rain-effected grounds= lower scoring.

You assume wrong. Your beloved Charter doesn't say it's a winter sport either.

Why do you not accept that AF is a winter sport?
Do you think it is safer for players, when they are playing in summer heat, & on harder grounds? And much higher skin cancer risks?

Following your logic, you seem to think AF is a better game if it is played 35 degrees heat; & better for the players? And better at 40 degrees?

It is not "[my ]beloved Charter". The Charter Of The Game has been introduced, & is still very strongly supported, by the AFL Commission, & AFL executives- & has overwhelming support from AF experts, MSM AF commentators etc.

Since 1874 (when Victorian Rules introduced the Holding The Ball Rule- to minimise the constant ugly tackling & stoppages- seen as very ugly also then!), the VFL & AFL etc. have desired/made Rule changes for AF to be, generally a free-flowing, attacking, high scoring game, characterised by many one-on-one contests.
They realised these features gave AF its maximum popularity & crowds- & they totally rejected rugby frequent "tackleball" & stoppages.

Are you concerned at the very high injury rates that female AF players are experiencing?
If so, in your 5K+ posts on BF, why is it so extremely rare for you to initiate posts on the topic of very high female injury rates?

 

[Teen Wolf]

Your statistics are not complete, if they don't include, on the cooler (because of clouds!) days, how many were effected (before, or during the game) by wet weather, puddles etc. A slippery ball affects disposal efficiency= lower scoring. A wet, heavy ball cannot be kicked as far= lower scores.

The statistics comprehensively refute your spurious claim that playing games in sub-25° increases scoring. But I'm happy for the seven people reading this s**t thread to decide for themselves.

Why do you not accept that AF is a winter sport?

Because it isn't described as a winter sport by the Charter Of The Game which has been introduced, & is still very strongly supported, by the AFL Commission, & AFL executives- & has overwhelming support from AF experts, MSM AF commentators etc.

Following your logic, you seem to think AF is a better game if it is played 35 degrees heat; & better for the players? And better at 40 degrees?

If your stance is higher scores = better footy, then yeah the stats suggest playing in 30-40° is ideal.

I personally have probably got as much enjoyment from watching low-scoring games as I have from watching high-scoring games.

Are you concerned at the very high injury rates that female AF players are experiencing?

No.

 

[owen87]

1. Female GR AF has had very strong growth around Australia since 2017- obviously directly linked to the AFLW's creation/very high profile in 2017.

On a long term basis, however, the high female AF injury rates, if they continue, may imperil this female growth- & possibly cause female comp. GR AF nos. to decline everywhere in Aust. It has previously been reported that serious knee injuries in the AFLW were up to 9 times cf the AFL: & AFLW concussions c. double the AFL. (But AFLW ACL injury rates are c. "4-6 times more likely" in 2022, cf AFL).

2021 AFLW Season.

ACL injuries were "at all-time low" in the AFLW 2021: the rate, per 1000 player hours, in the 2021 was 3.22- in 2020, it was 8.83, 2019 5.14.

The raw no. of AFLW overall general injuries are, unfortunately, on the increase. With more AFLW games per season, however, raw no. increases are inevitable- but pro rata per games played, there was BIG INCREASE in overall injuries.
The overall injuries' incidence (no. of new injuries per club, per season) in the 2021 AFLW was 11.1- in 2020, it was 7.0, 2019 6.8.

The no. of missed matches per club in the 2021 AFLW was 36.7- in 2020, it was 24.4, 2019 17.8. This is another, pro rata of games, very big rise- & their season is short.

AFLW CONCUSSIONS, disturbingly, are rising, per 1000 playing hours. In 2021, 8.27- in 2020, 4.76.
(An important mitigating factor is that there is a continuing more conservative approach to concussions/possible concussions now- so comparing previous years' rates of concussions has very limited efficacy).

"2021 AFLW Injury Report: ACLs at all-time low, concussions increase​

The AFL has released the fifth annual AFLW Injury Report for the 2021 NAB AFL Women's Competition
www.womens.afl"


It is a pity the article did not give reasons for the increases in injury rates (excluding ACL's; & concussions/new protocols) which are much greater, pro rata, than the increase in games.

I would like to see female injury rates, analyses etc. in GR female jnr & adult players.









2. 2022- AFLW ACL Injury Rates Up. abc.net.au 20.3.22 K. O'Halloran, who said

"While the exact ratio has fluctuated significantly, at one point in the early seasons, AFLW players were up to 9.2 times more likely than AFL men's players to injure their ACLs.

Since then, the ratio has broadly stabilised at anywhere between four and six times more likely.
Most promisingly, in 2021, ACL injuries in AFLW were at an all-time low.

In 2022, however, these types of injuries have, once again, trended upwards.

Professor Crossley warns that such figures need to be taken in context".

Prof. K. Crossley said

"They are small numbers and we just don't have enough years of data to know the true incidence.

Why AFLW players are more likely to injure their ACLs​

Gold Coast Sun Jacqui Yorston describes her ACL rehabilitation as the 'most painful thing I've ever been through'. Kate O'Halloran speaks to the experts on why AFLW players are sustaining injuries at higher rates than men.
www.abc.net.au


It is imperative to reduce, significantly, & asap, female AF injury rates- primarily for their long term physical & mental health (& financial wellbeing); but, also, to support & promote female GR AF, & its long term prosperity.










3.

No- "Lies, Damned Lies, & Statistics".

Your statistics are not complete, if they don't include, on the cooler (because of clouds!) days, how many were effected (before, or during the game) by wet weather, puddles etc. A slippery ball affects disposal efficiency= lower scoring. A wet, heavy ball cannot be kicked as far= lower scores.


You did not reply to these issues I put to you- I assume you accept the veracity of my comments.
And also my comments on ice vests & fans on the bench, more breaks & water carriers, bigger bench, necessary because the heat is appaling- why?




No, you are being misleading (probably deliberately).

The "tiring effects" are amplified by the almost constant running; & increased tackling /bumping /pushing/collisions with greater force, in the almost horrific & constant big nos. around the ball etc; & playing in strong heat, on harder more dangerous grounds.
These features, incontrovertibly, reduce player safety, & create more injuries.

Why have you always totally ignored the dangers of playing in the hot sun, which create much harder grounds?

I (& many others) want more free-flowing play- a smaller bench, & much less interchange, which will force players to remain, for longer periods, in their positions.
Players will not have the "fresh legs" to run & flood all day ie the game is likely to open up after half time, become more free -flowing, less stoppages & ball-ups, & higher scoring.
This is what the AFL seeeks- these pre-2005 & very desired features of AF are in the AFL's The Charter Of The Game.

With fresh, "interchanged" legs & big bench, there many more players at the contest, for longer periods, & players are now (cf pre 2005) bumping /tackling/colliding/pushing harder (as L. Matthews, & others, have stated)= more collision injuriies since 2005.




See my reply above, about your failure to include-on the cooler & cloudier days, rain-effected grounds= lower scoring.




Why do you not accept that AF is a winter sport?
Do you think it is safer for players, when they are playing in summer heat, & on harder grounds? And much higher skin cancer risks?

Following your logic, you seem to think AF is a better game if it is played 35 degrees heat; & better for the players? And better at 40 degrees?

It is not "[my ]beloved Charter". The Charter Of The Game has been introduced, & is still very strongly supported, by the AFL Commission, & AFL executives- & has overwhelming support from AF experts, MSM AF commentators etc.

Since 1874 (when Victorian Rules introduced the Holding The Ball Rule- to minimise the constant ugly tackling & stoppages- seen as very ugly also then!), the VFL & AFL etc. have desired/made Rule changes for AF to be, generally a free-flowing, attacking, high scoring game, characterised by many one-on-one contests.
They realised these features gave AF its maximum popularity & crowds- & they totally rejected rugby frequent "tackleball" & stoppages.

Are you concerned at the very high injury rates that female AF players are experiencing?
If so, in your 5K+ posts on BF, why is it so extremely rare for you to initiate posts on the topic of very high female injury rates?

You’ve become a meme at this point.

Mentions charter of the game, mentions lower interchange, complains about congestion, complains about scoring, complains about injury rates then conflates a whole heap of unrelated stuff.

Just another post by BBT using the same old tired talking points, refusing to reply to anything, refusing to use the quote function properly and quoting articles largely selectively and out of context to try to support his contention.

The only thing missing was mentioning tackleball.

 

[BringBackTorps]

The Australian 1.4.22

"This season of the NRLW has been a ratings bonanza, with an average audience of 59,000 , across kayoFoxtel Now and Foxtel Go (My emphases)".

Players are saying the standard of NRLW games is greatly increasing.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...e/news-story/66eef0dd0023309d4e1fa4780f545ac5


As nearly all NRLW games are played in ratings' dead time, early in the afternoon on Sat. & Sun., these are excellent national ratings for the NRLW- &, IIRC, outrate easily Foxtel's national ratings for AFLW games played in the same timeslots. The NRL would be very pleased (P. V'landys publicly mocked AFLW average ratings about 6 weeks ago).

AFLW average crowds (usually standalone), however, are much bigger (pre covid, c. 6k+)*. At the start of NRLW games, there is usually a very small crowd- a few hundred. As they are played as double-headers to NRL games, the crowd towards the end of the NRLW game is vastly larger.

The NRLW 2022 standalone GF, at Moreton Bay, had a crowd of 7855- adult tickets started @ $15.

The very strong ratings (cf other women's sports H & A comps.) for the NRLW show how strongly RL resonates in NSW & Qld.
The growth of female contact RL there will, very likely, slow the growth of female GR AF club & school comp. nos in NSW & Qld.- which are still growing very strongly, & female AF GR comp. nos. far outweigh female contact RL comp. nos. there.




*EDIT: It is now my understanding that the AFLW 2019 H & A crowds were about 4500.

 

[BringBackTorps]

As previously noted in this Thread (& in the Footy Industry Board Thread "What Are The Chances Of Footy Overtaking League In NSW & Qld."), GR AF clubs in the AF heartland of the Riverina have, disgracefully, been very poor in establishing & promoting female AF in the Riverina until 2021. There were AFL Riverina official policies of recognising the primacy of netball in the Riverina FNL.

(There are signs, however, of significant female AF growth there in 2022).

RL has seen its opportunities in the Riverina &, from 2021, planned to strongly promote female contact RL there.
This link is particularly pertinent, as it establishes the methodology of promoting GR female contact RL (applicable to other areas of NSW & Qld. also, where female contact RL is having significant growth).

Whilst GR female AF club & school comp. player nos. in NSW, ACT, & Qld. far outnumber now GR female contact RL club & school comp. player nos. in NSW, ACT, & Qld., it is very likely this gap will narrow in future years.
(Non-contact female Tag & Touch nos. are huge in NSW, ACT, & Qld.).


Tumut & Adelong Times 11.12.20

"Women’s tackle back on the agenda"​

By Jeff Hanson

D

"David Skinner is hoping he can get together a strong Riverina Bulls women’s team for the beginning of 2021, which will hopefully kick start women’s tackle growing in the Riverina. Pictured is the Riverina Bulls that won the Country Championships in 2019. Photo: Group 9 Rugby League.

NSW Rugby League looks to be the driving force behind a plan to make women’s tackle a permanent fixture in the Group 9 competition and the wider Riverina rugby league community from 2021 and beyond.
At this stage, Riverina is working hard to get a women’s tackle team together for the Country Championships in February and March next year, while 2021 is expected to be a big year for women’s tackle in this region with an end of season competition to commence after grand final weekend.

This will then be followed by the introduction of under 17s and 19s women’s tackle competitions that will run side-by-side with first grade, reserve grade, leaguetag and other age groups in 2022.
NSWRL Great Western and Southern Zone manager, David Skinner, explained that there was a clear plan to see women’s tackle part and parcel of Group 9, Group 20 and other Riverina rugby league competitions".

..."The initial plan is to see Group 9, Group 20 and other competitions hosting preseason women’s tackle competitions, before the focus shifts back to leaguetag for the 2021 regular season, with women’s tackle then back into the spotlight after 2021 competitions are completed.

A six-week competition would then ensue, before Group 9 clubs would then be required to supply under 17s and 19s teams in 2022".

Women’s tackle back on the agenda - Tumut and Adelong Times

NSW Rugby League looks to be the driving force behind a plan to make women’s tackle a permanent fixture in the Group 9 competition and the wider Riverina rugby league community from 2021 and beyond. At this stage, Riverina is working hard to get a women’s tackle team together for the Country...

tatimes.com.au

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. A. Meulendyks, a Western District 22 y.o. describes some of the reasons she enjoys playing GR AF.

" 'It's like nothing I've ever experienced before,' Ms Meulendyks said.

She is one of at least five women who play netball for Tyrendarra on a Saturday before lacing up their boots on a Sunday to play Aussie rules.

'The camaraderie on the field is like nothing else,' she said.

'I've played in really successful netball teams that have been headed by amazing coaches … and it still doesn't compare to a football field.

I can't explain it' ."


The article also mentions that several adult female teams, from Vic. rural areas, have folded this year, due to lack of nos.- allegedly due to lack of firm club support, & because some crucial women, who "drove" local female AF, left, & were not able to be replaced.

Is a lack of support leaving some country women's football teams to die?

Concerns are being raised about whether women's football clubs are being appropriately supported as clubs across regional Victoria are forced to fold.

www.abc.net.au

Overall, however, female club & school comp. AF player nos., at least until the 2020 covid season, have had very strong growth in Vic.






2. In contrast, Nagambie (pop. c. 2000), in nthn. Vic. is having much interest from potential females to establish the town's first women's team in 2023.

'Very, very keen': Overwhelming response to country women's footy team plan as all ages step up

Sick of travelling long distances to other places with women's football teams, women in the small Victorian town of Nagambie have decided to form their own.

www.abc.net.au

It is good to see the growth occuring in women's AF in nthn. Vic. as it has lagged other parts of the State (when comparing GR female nos. there, to the no. of male club & school comp. players in nthn. Vic.) in the growth of female AF.


Along both sides of the Murray River (ie inc. Riverina, in sthn. NSW), on a per capita basis, nos. of players drafted to the AFL are much overrepresented.

C. Atkinson & S. Lawson said
"...the areas surrounding the river are officially the most fertile breeding grounds for VFL/AFL talent".

Which locations have provided the AFL with the most talent and the best players?

From Warrnambool to Wangaratta, Dartmoor to Darwin, and Glenelg to Glenorchy, AFL players learn their trade in all corners of the country — but which region has provided the league with the best players? Cody Atkinson and Sean Lawson investigate.

www.abc.net.au

The opposite applies, however, with the AFLW- the Vic. Murray River adjoining area, & Riverina, are extremely poor for AFLW recruitment... almost non-existent.

 

[BringBackTorps]

The AFL has launched "Quickkick", an Australia-wide initiative, for women born between 1930(!) -1987, who want to learn the skills of AF. It is designed to be an entry-level program for women who may later wish to play female comp. AF.

http://aflmasters.com.au/quickkick/


"There has already been a large take up across the country, with more than 2,000 people signing up within days of QuickKick’s launch. Among them is a multiple Grand Slam tennis champion and a 73-year-old!.
Of the current registered participants, one third are from NSW or Queensland... (my emphases)".

(As c. 700 women, "within days of Quickkick's launch", joined from NSW & Qld., this is a very good result for non-heartland States, in such a short period.
Interestingly, in Sydney, WS & SS are the only clinics established- not NS, ES, North WS, & Inner WS, where GR AF is far stronger.
Newcastle & Wollongong, where AF is only a niche sport, were also chosen).

AFL Masters launches program for women over 35 - AFL NSW / ACT​

If you’re 35-year-old woman or older, who’s never played footy but always yearned for the opportunity, this could be your chance to get out on the park! AFL Masters has launched QuickKick, an entry level program held fortnightly in all…Read more ›

aflnswact.com.au

 

[BringBackTorps]

C. Baskaran is now a star in the U18 NAB League- previously, she was an elite middle distance runner, making National Finals.

She has switched to AF now. She greatly enjoys the team camaraderie of (big) AF female team nos, cf her "isolated, solitary" running training, & comp. individual events; & she also "loves" kicking the Sherrin.

Baskaran said

"The first training session, I loved it straight away, so many new people and the game and skills, I loved picking up the footy and having a kick...

Charlotte Baskaran was named captain of the 2022 NAB League Girls Team of the Year. Picture: AFL Photos

"My main event was the 400m, I went to Sydney to compete in the nationals and made the final in that race. I pretty much did a lot of the middle-distance events, the 800m as well, but my sprinting was also very good, so that's what helps me out on the field as well," Baskaran said.

..."(Re athletics) But I think being so individual, the training and repetitive running, that when I transferred over to footy, I loved the team environment and all the girls being there to support you.
Coming to footy training, I was always happy and smiling ready to see the girls and coaches."

AFLW Latest News - AFL.com.au/aflw

Latest breaking AFLW news from the official website of the Australian Football League.

www.womens.afl

 

[Cdog71]

C. Baskaran is now a star in the U18 NAB League- previously, she was an elite middle distance runner, making National Finals.

She played Auskick and was training with the Western Jets as a 13 yr old.

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. Dr A Karg Swinburne Uni 16.4.19

This is a brief academic analysis on how successful the AFLW has been at the end of its 3rd season.

Three years in, is the AFLW kicking goals?

The AFLW has come a long way in a short time. But amid calls for even faster expansion, more games and a longer season, it pays to remember that in footy you shouldn’t go too hard, too early.

theconversation.com

Despite still having free admission in 2019, & skill standards improving every year, national average crowd attendances dropped 25% in 2019. Analysis needs to be completed, to explain this drop.

It is possible the NRLW (which attracts far superior national ratings to AFLW, like-for-like early afternoon matches; but far inferior crowds) could soon be a major challenge for the success of the AFLW in NSW & Qld.
P. V'landys publicly mocked the AFLW ratings, vis-a-vis NRLW ratings, a few months ago.

NSW & Qld., however, still have far more female GR AF club & school comp. player nos., cf female GR contact RL club & school comp. player nos. in NSW & Qld.
Will this AF female GR primacy be changed?
Can/ how the AFLW ratings obtain much more popularity in NSW & Qld. (whose ratings are dwarfed by the NRLW)?





2.

She played Auskick and was training with the Western Jets as a 13 yr old.

Correct.
Baskaran said, after finishing Auskick, "there were no girls' teams" (?), so she started doing athletics- which she continued for 4 years, being an Australian Finalist in 400 mtr races.

The article explains her reasons for, eventually, switching permanently to AF.

 

[Teen Wolf]

Despite still having free admission in 2019, & skill standards improving every year, national crowd attendances dropped 25% in 2019. Analysis needs to be completed, to explain this drop.

That was for the home & away season. For H&A + finals, the 2019 average attendance increased from the previous year so maybe that needs to be analysed too. Then again, maybe anybody with a decent grasp of relevance wouldn't waste their time trying to reignite discussion about crowd figures from 2019.

the NRLW (which attracts far superior national ratings to AFLW, like-for-like early afternoon matches;

Riiiiight so your idea of like-for-like would be comparing ratings on a primary channel vs ratings on a secondary channel. Or comparing average ratings for a 16-game season to that of a 75-game season.

But grand final vs grand final TV ratings (AFLW 355k, NRLW 264k)... that's a bow too long to draw.

 

[HawkerHurricane]

South Bunbury Football club has withdraw it's undefeated Womens team from the competition after most of its team quit amid issues of racism/sexism

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-05-30/afl-racism-indigenous-round-wa-player-vilified-order-off-rule/101108910 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-01/regional-wa-afl-coach-maxwell-jetta-quits-racist-slur/101116884...

www.bigfooty.com

Here's an example of some barriers... this team of superstars have either requested transfers to opposing teams, or returned to their previous sport of choice (soccer) as a result of racism & sexism WITHIN the club!

 

[TWLS]

1. Dr A Karg Swinburne Uni 16.4.19

This is a brief academic analysis on how successful the AFLW has been at the end of its 3rd season.

Three years in, is the AFLW kicking goals?

The AFLW has come a long way in a short time. But amid calls for even faster expansion, more games and a longer season, it pays to remember that in footy you shouldn’t go too hard, too early.

theconversation.com

Despite still having free admission in 2019, & skill standards improving every year, national crowd attendances dropped 25% in 2019. Analysis needs to be completed, to explain this drop.

It is possible the NRLW (which attracts far superior national ratings to AFLW, like-for-like early afternoon matches; but far inferior crowds) could soon be a major challenge for the success of the AFLW in NSW & Qld.
P. V'landys publicly mocked the AFLW ratings, vis-a-vis AFLW ratings, a few months ago.

NSW & Qld., however, still have far more female GR AF club & school comp. player nos., cf female GR contact RL club & school comp. player nos. in NSW & Qld.
Will this AF female GR primacy be changed?
Can/ how the AFLW ratings obtain much more popularity in NSW & Qld. (whose ratings are dwarfed by the NRLW)?





2.

Correct.
Baskaran said, after finishing Auskick, "there were no girls' teams" (?), so she started doing athletics- which she continued for 4 years, being an Australian Finalist in 400 mtr races.

The article explains her reasons for, eventually, switching permanently to AF.

We really do not know what is going to happen up there in NSW - It is a wait and see attitude. Our Womens game has grown up there that is for sure however RL is the primary code in the Men. That situation must flow on to their Womens game eventually which is showing signs of getting their act together.

 

[Cdog71]

Touch Footy is still the biggest sport for girls in the school system in Bris

 

[briztoon]

Touch Footy is still the biggest sport for girls in the school system in Bris

Bigger than netball?

Or are you referring just to football codes?

 

[Cdog71]

Bigger than netball?

Or are you referring just to football codes?

Thanks.
Football

 

[BringBackTorps]

1. This is an academic Paper that, apparently, was used in the recent AFLPA submissions to the AFL, arguing for massive AFLW pay rises (It was successfull- 94% wage increase: minimum pay $34k, c. 40 players to be paid c. $100k, with allowances etc. Total $25m pa for the whole comp.!).

"...The next phase of the participation of women in football is approaching, and heralds an opportunity for women to (re)gain power within the sport.
In October 2019, thirty percent of women players rejected the proposed Collective Bargaining Agreement from the Australian Football League (AFL), with the underlying sentiment of wanting a stronger voice in the vision for the future of their game.

This paper examines how changing patrticipation rates in community football can transform the narrative of women’s football from one of subsidized welfare to women players being necessary for the survival of football (My emphases)".

Can anyone provide a full & detailed summary &/or the supporting GR data?

And how & why etc. "...changing participation rates in community football can transform the narrative...women players being necessary for the "survival" of (GR) football"?

‘Why now’ for AFLW? Providing a new affirmative narrative for women’s football in the post-Covid world​

As with many other male-dominated sports, for over a century of its history, Australian Rules Football organizations resisted and undermined women’s participation in the game. The first league for ...


Also, from theconversation.com

The AFL has consistently put the women's game second. Is it the best organisation to run AFLW?​

This systematic devaluing of those most invested in the AFLW isn’t new. It’s time to ask if the AFL is up to the task of running AFLW.








2.
Teen Wolf

From my post #480 above

"The Australian 1.4.22

This season of the NRLW has been a ratings bonanza, with an average audience of 59,000 , across kayoFoxtel Now and Foxtel Go (My emphases)".

Players are saying the standard of NRLW games is greatly increasing.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...e/news-story/66eef0dd0023309d4e1fa4780f545ac5

As nearly all NRLW games are played in ratings' dead time, early in the afternoon on Sat. & Sun., these are excellent national ratings for the NRLW- &, IIRC, outrate easily Foxtel's national ratings for AFLW games played in the same timeslots. The NRL would be very pleased (P. V'landys publicly mocked AFLW average ratings about 6 weeks ago)".

Why are Foxtel NRLW games easily outrating Foxtel AFLW games, comparing only like-for-like early Sat. & Sun. afternoon timeslots?

Then again, maybe anybody with a decent grasp of relevance wouldn't waste their time trying to reignite discussion about crowd figures from 2019.

Your comments are incorrect.
The AFLW is the driving force for the promotion of female AF, inc. the growth of female GR AF- its appeal must be maximised.

Season 2017 had sensational AFLW average crowds of c. 6500; season 2018, IIRC, c. 6000+ (both second in the world, for female stand-alone, non-international, domestic season comps.)

The 2019 AFLW Grand Final, at AO, had a crowd of 53,034; but the 2022A GF, also at AO, only had 16,712. Why such a big drop?

The "relevance" is that there is a pattern- 2019 H & A AFLW average crowds declined c. 25%, in 2019 only. Why such a big drop?


Season 2020 4 new teams. Total attendance 205,050- but an "inflated" average 4,458.
(The AFLW crowds, as usual, would have dropped considerably when the AFL commences- thus significantly lowering the 2020 AFLW crowd averages).

Only 46 games played, without covid restrictions- then final 2 Rounds, & the season, cancelled mid March, after covid restrictions were introduced.


From Wookie, re season 2021 average crowd 2,312, in decline (& 2020)
Attendance

"The 2021 AFLW season was the first to include paid ticketing for Adults (under 18s were still free, including finals). Attendance for the year totalled 157,231 at an average of 2,312 per game. This was about half the 2020 season average. Factors in this include the number of games affected by pandemic restrictions, as well as late rescheduling. The impact of having to pay to enter is not really quanitifable in these circumstances - 13 games were listed as sellouts under COVID restrictions".

Excluding the intro. of $10 entry cost for adults, & excluding covid-related transferring of games to "unfriendly" timeslots & locations, & other covid-related changes to the normal fixturing, are there other reasons for the decline?


Season 2022 Total attendance 144,271, average 1,924.
Far less interrupted directly by covid, average crowds again in decline.

There are, of course, more teams & more games in the AFLW in 2022, cf earlier years.
One would expect in 2022, raw crowd nos. to be at record highs (it was easy, in 2022, to social distance at AFLW games).

The AFLW added very big clubs West Coast & Richmond in 2020- St Kilda also, when successful, attracts good crowds; Geelong, a big club, in 2019.
Collingwood moved to Vic. Park, capacity c.12k- much bigger than tiny Olympic Park.

 

[Teen Wolf]

Why are Foxtel NRLW games easily outrating Foxtel AFLW games, comparing only like-for-like early Sat. & Sun. afternoon timeslots?

18 games involving 6 clubs all from the sport's heartland territory vs 75 games involving 14 clubs varying significantly in size/location/popularity. Keep inserting "like-for-like" where it doesn't fit (while ignoring the fairest comparison, ie grand final ratings), but nobody's dumb enough to fall for it.

Your comments are incorrect.
The AFLW is the driving force for the promotion of female AF, inc. the growth of female GR AF- its appeal must be maximised.

Season 2017 had sensational AFLW average crowds of c. 6500; season 2018, IIRC, c. 6000+ (both second in the world, for female stand-alone, non-international, domestic season comps.)

The 2019 AFLW Grand Final, at AO, had a crowd of 53,034; but the 2022A GF, also at AO, only had 16,712. Why such a big drop?

The "relevance" is that there is a pattern- 2019 H & A AFLW average crowds declined c. 25%, in 2019 only. Why such a big drop?


Season 2020 4 new teams. Total attendance 205,050- but an "inflated" average 4,458.
(The AFLW crowds, as usual, would have dropped considerably when the AFL commences- thus significantly lowering the 2020 AFLW crowd averages).

Only 46 games played, without covid restrictions- then final 2 Rounds, & the season, cancelled mid March, after covid restrictions were introduced.


From Wookie, re season 2021 average crowd 2,312, in decline (& 2020)
Attendance

"The 2021 AFLW season was the first to include paid ticketing for Adults (under 18s were still free, including finals). Attendance for the year totalled 157,231 at an average of 2,312 per game. This was about half the 2020 season average. Factors in this include the number of games affected by pandemic restrictions, as well as late rescheduling. The impact of having to pay to enter is not really quanitifable in these circumstances - 13 games were listed as sellouts under COVID restrictions".

Excluding the intro. of $10 entry cost for adults, & excluding covid-related transferring of games to "unfriendly" timeslots & locations, & other covid-related changes to the normal fixturing, are there other reasons for the decline?


Season 2022 Total attendance 144,271, average 1,924.
Far less interrupted directly by covid, average crowds again in decline.

There are, of course, more teams & more games in the AFLW in 2022, cf earlier years.
One would expect in 2022, raw crowd nos. to be at record highs (it was easy, in 2022, to social distance at AFLW games).

The AFLW added very big clubs West Coast & Richmond in 2020- St Kilda also, when successful, attracts good crowds; Geelong, a big club, in 2019.
Collingwood moved to Vic. Park, capacity c.12k- much bigger than tiny Olympic Park.

Would you also like to know why, despite pandemic and admission fee factors, both the 2021 and 2022 grand finals had bigger crowds than each of the 2017 and 2018 grand finals? What about the clear increase in membership and number of sponsors?

None of this stuff needs to be explained, if we're being sincere. It's all self-evident, and it's obvious you only want to emphasise the figures that you feel justify your terrible suggestions.