Player Watch Will Hoskin-Elliott

[BEEG]

Just waiting to the “ joe the goose” comments…….

WHE tends to divide people, and by nature of the role can have bad days. But he’s been a valuable performer with skils that Collingwood has lacked at times. Remains best 22.

Another good game on the weekend.

I have said it multiple times in this thread not all players are superstars but I'll say this, I don't ever get nervous when this bloke has the footy.

Absolute class.

 

[Hong Kong Pie]

For his goal, around the 5:20 mark

 

[Piestid]

Yep surprisingly lack of praise given he kicked the matchwinning goal, making something from nothing!

Great to see him (and Sidebottom) coming back into form again.

Yeah I was going to say he and Sidey have been working together really well lately. They seem to find each other nearly as much as the Daicos bros.

 

[No SPIN]

Be great if he comes in and really looks the part from the get go. Like Marlion Pickett did a few years ago. Came in a immediately was one of the best players in the VFL. Carmichael looks a powerful unit. Does not look a winger's build to me but a big tank has got to be a huge plus

We will need more grunt in the midfield against the top teams, so he’s perfect to give Adams a chop out.
Adams, JDG, Carmichael, and Crisp could take on all comers. And let Pendles sit back to play mid if/when needed.
Don’t ask me who Carmichael replaces - that’s a hugely problematic question.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

People claim I’m too harsh on him. He just goes missing for too long.

He had 11 disposals and only 1 tackle in 86% game time.

I’m not allowed to compare him to Sidebottom, Lippa or Bianco since they all play different roles to him.

I don’t hate him or think he’s a bad player. He’s just in the bottom 6 most weeks. He’s replaceable.

Carmichael had more impact in 20 minutes than WHE had all game.

 

[gouki88]

People claim I’m too harsh on him. He just goes missing for too long.

He had 11 disposals and only 1 tackle in 86% game time.

I’m not allowed to compare him to Sidebottom, Lippa or Bianco since they all play different roles to him.

I don’t hate him or think he’s a bad player. He’s just in the bottom 6 most weeks. He’s replaceable.

Carmichael had more impact in 20 minutes than WHE had all game.

For what seems like the hundredth time, the coaches clearly think that we have nobody ready to come in and replace what WHE provides us in terms of his marking link play. None of the three you mentioned provide anything close to the marking he does

 

[Chrispiesssss]

For what seems like the hundredth time, the coaches clearly think that we have nobody ready to come in and replace what WHE provides us in terms of his marking link play. None of the three you mentioned provide anything close to the marking he does

He averages 4.5 uncontested marks a game. .3 contested marks.

Which afl player deserves to keep their spot based on their UNCONTESTED MARKS?

 

[cakewalk06]

People claim I’m too harsh on him. He just goes missing for too long.

He had 11 disposals and only 1 tackle in 86% game time.

I’m not allowed to compare him to Sidebottom, Lippa or Bianco since they all play different roles to him.

I don’t hate him or think he’s a bad player. He’s just in the bottom 6 most weeks. He’s replaceable.

Carmichael had more impact in 20 minutes than WHE had all game.

I honestly don't think he is going too bad and he has stepped up a couple of times this year at vital times. He has become more of a role player than anything else, not the x-factor player he was at GWS and early days with us. We can't judge players by their stats alone, or otherwise nearly every forward pressure player in the AFL will be dropped.
I like having him there lurking in the background with the capability of popping up with a crucial goal in a big game. I am not saying he is a star, but he is another cog in the wheel and I think has been doing his job.

 

[gouki88]

He averages 4.5 uncontested marks a game. .3 contested marks.

Which afl player deserves to keep their spot based on their UNCONTESTED MARKS?

According to Craig McRae, Justin Leppitsch, Brendon Bolton and Hayden Skipworth - WHE does.

We all know you irrationally dislike WHE. No need to bring it up after every game, no matter how well or poorly he actually plays

 

[Chrispiesssss]

I honestly don't think he is going too bad and he has stepped up a couple of times this year at vital times. He has become more of a role player than anything else, not the x-factor player he was at GWS and early days with us. We can't judge players by their stats alone, or otherwise nearly every forward pressure player in the AFL will be dropped.
I like having him there lurking in the background with the capability of popping up with a crucial goal in a big game. I am not saying he is a star, but he is another cog in the wheel and I think has been doing his job.

The occasional goal and uncontested marks isn’t enough for a potential top 4 team. He averages .5 goals per game.

For context, JC has kicked 3 goals in 2.25 games.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

According to Craig McRae, Justin Leppitsch, Brendon Bolton and Hayden Skipworth - WHE does.

We all know you irrationally dislike WHE. No need to bring it up after every game, no matter how well or poorly he actually plays

There’s nothing irrational about it. It’s only irrational because “other people disagree”.

“Irrational” is just a cop out.

I believe there are players within our list who could provide more than WHE. Simple.

 

[sideswipe]

There’s nothing irrational about it. It’s only irrational because “other people disagree”.

“Irrational” is just a cop out.

I believe there are players within our list who could provide more than WHE. Simple.

How about "irrationally fixated"?

 

[gouki88]

There’s nothing irrational about it. It’s only irrational because “other people disagree”.

“Irrational” is just a cop out.

I believe there are players within our list who could provide more than WHE. Simple.

Defend the position with any logical reasoning and it might not be irrational. Further to the irrationality is the obsession

 

[dardy33]

Heard fly say it's his defensive running is elite he covers the most km of any of our players and quite often covers the opposition's transition players allowing other mids to be more attacking

 

[manicpie]

It would be irrational to drop him. Sacrifices his own game for the good of our game plan. We all saw what he could do over the last month when obviously given more free reign. If we make the finals then I want as much experience as possible and that includes WHE.

 

[hellfire]

One thing I like about WHE is how he holds his width at contests. We're very guilty of having too many players getting sucked into the contest, and allowing the opposition and easy outlet. WHE knows his role and holds his width, which gives us an attacking option if we win the contest, or gives us some defensive coverage if we don't. His work-rate is elite up & down the ground.

 

[gouki88]

One thing I like about WHE is how he holds his width at contests. We're very guilty of having too many players getting sucked into the contest, and allowing the opposition and easy outlet. WHE knows his role and holds his width, which gives us an attacking option if we win the contest, or gives us some defensive coverage if we don't. His work-rate is elite up & down the ground.

Odds on someone calling him soft for doing so?

 

[mwhop]

I hadnt been to a game for a long time because of covid etc
but watching him live yesterday you really see he covers a lot of space and shuts down a lot of transition play
also spreads the opposition on transition to attack
much more valuable than he looks on tv

 

[Ugene41]

Yea happy to keep his experience in the team. We're playing enough inexperienced kids as it is (Bianco, McCreery, Naicos, Murphy, Johnson, Carmichael, Ginnivan) when we're now seriously challenging for finals. Need that steadying influence and we know that he can impact when he has more freedom in his role.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

One thing I like about WHE is how he holds his width at contests. We're very guilty of having too many players getting sucked into the contest, and allowing the opposition and easy outlet. WHE knows his role and holds his width, which gives us an attacking option if we win the contest, or gives us some defensive coverage if we don't. His work-rate is elite up & down the ground.

He touches the ball 11 times a game and 3 of them are kicks off the ground and 1 was holding the ball. He literally runs up and down the ground invisible.

 

[MyManLynch]

He touches the ball 11 times a game and 3 of them are kicks off the ground and 1 was holding the ball. He literally runs up and down the ground invisible.

Which makes him impossible to tackle.

 

[hellfire]

He touches the ball 11 times a game and 3 of them are kicks off the ground and 1 was holding the ball. He literally runs up and down the ground invisible.

Are you one of those supporters that yells out "kick it long!" and "man up!"? Work rate & positioning are critical to a winger/flanker - he is rated 'elite' for intercept possessions & 1%ers (and above average for inside 50s), and as someone else mentioned above, his work rate helps to quell attacks because he works hard to get back into space. The game is about more than every player racking up touches.

I'm not saying he played well yesterday, he didn't, I'm saying he shouldn't be dropped because he is important to our structure and he has been solid overall this year.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Are you one of those supporters that yells out "kick it long!" and "man up!"? Work rate & positioning are critical to a winger/flanker - he is rated 'elite' for intercept possessions & 1%ers (and above average for inside 50s), and as someone else mentioned above, his work rate helps to quell attacks because he works hard to get back into space. The game is about more than every player racking up touches.

I'm not saying he played well yesterday, he didn't, I'm saying he shouldn't be dropped because he is important to our structure and he has been solid overall this year.

I understand it’s not all about touches. He has a had a good/above average game maybe 4-5 times this year. Every other game he’s in our bottom 6 players.

 

[gouki88]

I understand it’s not all about touches. He has a had a good/above average game maybe 4-5 times this year. Every other game he’s in our bottom 6 players.

Unsubstantiated claim

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

I understand it’s not all about touches. He has a had a good/above average game maybe 4-5 times this year. Every other game he’s in our bottom 6 players.

I know you're really anti WHE....

And TBH, so am i.
I've been very strong on him not being good enough earlier in the year.
Its not his possessions or numbers that get me.
He is slow mind and constantly holding the ball up when our gameplan demands you take it on.

But more than this, it's his failure to take his 'moments'.

Our team this year is built on moments. When they come, you take them.
He burnt us over and over earlier in the year by not taking his moments.
But he had a few weeks where he took them (that pickup against GC, the goal at the end etc).

Now, having said all that.....

i also came to the conclusion earlier in the year that our list profile and depth suggests we have no-one else to play his role.
No one runs as hard and can switch fwd / wing with Jaicos / Sidey.
So until we have that, he's going to keep getting a game unless we want to change up our structure.

Its on the young guys to step up (Henry is the one that can play this role if he builds his tank to run 14+km a game)

So whilst i think its getting closer....WHE is going to keep getting games due to what he provides structurally.