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RedmanWasHere

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footyfan1978

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Terry Daniher absolutely flushed Gavin Brown in the '90 GF. Then landed two on Starcevich after he marked at half forward.
'89 GF was full of them. Hocking on Platten, Dipper took out a few of Hocking's teeth and he got straight up, Yeates' knee on Dermott when he was on the ground.
Long on Simmonds was scary.


Been a while since there's been a good brawl in a Grand Final too, kind of miss them.
If Lynch swing had only connected ... Should have seen an eye doctor the next week. Not even close to connection.
 

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footyfan1978

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Sam Newman on World Of Sport the next day was very clear - Steven Hocking.
Thanks mate.

I still remember another game against Melbourne where Matthews did something to a Melbourne player and basically the whole 17 other players of Melbourne team came after him at once. The thing was, in these times they did not use as many camera's so a lot of stuff is both off the ball and off camera and certain players used that to their advantage if they were full on into thuggery.

Has to be said though. Matthews lived and died by the sword. He expected to be whacked back but must have backed himself to protect himself better than his own victims. To be honest most of the football I felt as a little kid was cleaned up in my time. It was more the 1960's and 1970's the full on thuggery was in vogue. However compared to today's cleaner game we tend to look at 1980's as being like the 70's and 60's but it was certainly well on way to being cleaned up. That is why people like Brereton would get 10 weeks. Ugliest game I actually watched live was the 1987 game between Sydney and Carlton on Friday night at SCG. Greg Williams and Rhys-Jones were determined to put each other out of action for months and from memory achieved their aim. Do not think they ever forgiven each other.
 

La Vache

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Ugliest game I actually watched live was the 1987 game between Sydney and Carlton on Friday night at SCG. Greg Williams and Rhys-Jones were determined to put each other out of action for months and from memory achieved their aim. Do not think they ever forgiven each other.
I think I remember that game. I reckon Diesel got 6 weeks for knocking out Rhys-Jones in the middle of a pack but copped it right back later in the match.
The whole second half felt a bit sordid watching the entire match teetering right on the edge of chaos.

But for some reason my recollection is of a later season, possibly early 90's. Unless there was another match like it, entirely possible.
 

benji2

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I think I remember that game. I reckon Diesel got 6 weeks for knocking out Rhys-Jones in the middle of a pack but copped it right back later in the match.
The whole second half felt a bit sordid watching the entire match teetering right on the edge of chaos.

But for some reason my recollection is of a later season, possibly early 90's. Unless there was another match like it, entirely possible.
In 1992 the two became teammates, though Rhys-Jones retired during the season.

Lots more sniping in the 70s and 80s (especially up until 1986 and trial-by-video) no doubt about it.

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk
 

footyfan1978

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In 1992 the two became teammates, though Rhys-Jones retired during the season.
Don't think they did. As a Carlton supporter do not remember Rhys-Jones and Williams ever playing together. Rhys-Jones probably had retired by 1992 but cannot remember exactly when he ended.
They really did not like each other so I doubt they would even tolerate each other on the same team.
 
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andrew coombs

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Don't think they did. As a Carlton supporter do not remember Rhys-Jones and Williams ever playing together. Rhys-Joens probably had retied by 1992 but cannot remember exactly when he ended.
They really did not like each other so I doubt they would even tolerate each other on the same team.
The difference between Rhys- Jones and Williams was that when Diesal decided to whack someone, they well and truly stayed whacked. It was the same with Matthews. Rhys - Jones belted plenty of blokes but rarely did more than annoy them. He copped some huge paybacks ( Jeffries,Banks,Williams) but never complained which is something I admired about him. I have spoken to him heaps of times and he is a really good bloke with great footy knowledge . Not surprised though that he and Williams didn't get on. Williams is a bit of a grudge holder.
 

pazza

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Thanks mate.

I still remember another game against Melbourne where Matthews did something to a Melbourne player and basically the whole 17 other players of Melbourne team came after him at once. The thing was, in these times they did not use as many camera's so a lot of stuff is both off the ball and off camera and certain players used that to their advantage if they were full on into thuggery.

Has to be said though. Matthews lived and died by the sword. He expected to be whacked back but must have backed himself to protect himself better than his own victims. To be honest most of the football I felt as a little kid was cleaned up in my time. It was more the 1960's and 1970's the full on thuggery was in vogue. However compared to today's cleaner game we tend to look at 1980's as being like the 70's and 60's but it was certainly well on way to being cleaned up. That is why people like Brereton would get 10 weeks. Ugliest game I actually watched live was the 1987 game between Sydney and Carlton on Friday night at SCG. Greg Williams and Rhys-Jones were determined to put each other out of action for months and from memory achieved their aim. Do not think they ever forgiven each other.
Peter Giles.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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Toughest player ever had to be protected from an 18 or 19 year old Steve hocking
Arguably Old CEO Hocking's hit on Matthews breaking his nose was just as bad. Matthews was expecting retribution but got blindsided. People will argue he deserved it so who cares but it was still a weak act. Matthews never whinged though. He was a thug but he copped his fair share back like Dermie.
 
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AlwaysHawks15

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The difference between Rhys- Jones and Williams was that when Diesal decided to whack someone, they well and truly stayed whacked. It was the same with Matthews. Rhys - Jones belted plenty of blokes but rarely did more than annoy them. He copped some huge paybacks ( Jeffries,Banks,Williams) but never complained which is something I admired about him. I have spoken to him heaps of times and he is a really good bloke with great footy knowledge . Not surprised though that he and Williams didn't get on. Williams is a bit of a grudge holder.
They don't get on because Williams sniped him and than squealed to the umps when David came after him a bit later for retribution. Lost a heap of respect for him as a result. At least own up to dirty acts not pretend they didn't happen.
 

jezza1435

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Arguably Old CEO Hocking's hit on Matthews breaking his nose was just as bad. Matthews was expecting retribution but got blindsided. People will argue he deserved it so who cares but it was still a weak act. Matthews never whinged though. He was a thug but he copped his fair share back like Dermie.
Yes, and Matthews hit was so courageous.
 

Partridge

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Loved him as a player but Ablett's on Dipper was a snipe. Dipper dished it out himself but still I didn't like it.
I've never understood this. I'm guessing fans thinking this were either very young then or weren't around.

By the standards of 1989 what Ablett did wasn't unusual. If you dropped into the hole of a leading forward you could expect some contact. And you only need to watch the reaction of the other Hawthorn players who are all around Ablett. None of them remotely remonstrated, and remember that was a pretty physical game.
 

Partridge

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Nothing wrong with it all. Just an observation that these threads tend to recycle the same incidents and lead to the same tired old arguments. Yep, the O'Dea hit was terrible and can never be justified but every club had at least one very nasty player in the 70s who had no qualms about taking a player out. Stan Magro for the Pies was hardly a shrinking violet. Every club has had and will continue to have players that are nasty. Noting it was the modus operandi of Yabby Jeans means nothing as it was the modus operandi for all clubs.
I think there is definitely a sliding scale of how bad hits can be. Roughly speaking I find three levels (I do mean roughly too):

  1. Shirtfronts. These days plenty would warrant suspension but in the past are lot of these were legal (from memory, the ball had to be within 5 metres in the past). That would cover some classics - Stan Magro on Jesaulenko, Brereton on Van der Haar, a few of Worsfolds, plus my all time favourite of Ray Card on Keith Greig.
  2. Voluntary / Involuntary arms / elbows. Frequently in or around the play, some were malicious, some were just clumsy and stupid. This would cover Lockett on Caven (and McKenna), Ablett on Bardsley. You can watch the Caven one, Lockett is doing not much more than pushing him off. Problem was he was twice the size. Ablett on Bardsley late in his career was similar. Both raised the arm for sure, but to me they were dumb fend offs more than malicious attempts to kill players.
  3. Genuine king hits. These are obviously the worst. This would be Matthews on Bruns, O'Dea on Greening, Neale on Hudson, Balme on Southby, Brereton on Frawley (broke his jaw behind play and got six weeks for it, it's rarely mentioned), Hall on Staker and so on. Nowhere near the ball (or sometimes play), the player would not have known what was coming. If you want to use the word cowardly these ones define it. And sometimes it is just a brain freeze. I'm convinced Andrew Gaff is not a dirty player, but his brain left his body for one moment. The serial offenders on the other hand, different story.
And before the "well don't just defend Geelong players" lines start, I'll happily concede our worst offenders, and to me I've always thought there were worse than Ablett in his era. Hocking was worse, and Damian Bourke was much worse. Ablett had a frontier justice mentality for sure, and if you kept scragging him off the ball he was likely to do something about it (Garry Lyon, Peter Dean). But if you didn't the majority of his bumps were fair. None of Bourke's were - taking out Justin Madden at Waverley in 1987 a mile off the ball a good example. It always mystifies me when a Carlton supporter cites Milburn / Silvagni as the worst thing they've seen. It's not even the worst from a Geelong player between those two clubs.

Anyway, I'm signing off with Ray Card's immortal moment. Around 1 minute 50 in...



Love the commentary. "The result of a fair charge". And it was called play on!
 

Partridge

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I've not been around as long as a lot of the other posters but all anti-hawthorn bias aside, that Hodge hit was the most disgusting act (alongside Brian lake attempted murder of petrie) I've seen. He could have broken his neck and absolutely should have got more time and had to explain himself and officially apologise to wingard. Made me sick watching it at the time and this guy gets a gig with 7, loved by the media, and ambassador for Toyota major afl sponsor. Great example to set to kids
I've got nothing against Hodge per se (there were way, way worse players than him), but it's the hypocrisy by the media that pisses people off I would imagine. Certainly does me. Whether it's "good bloke" Hodge, and how they looked the other way in his latter years when he was clear he was being hidden on the field (getting utterly destroyed by Martin in the 2019 Qualifying Final but still adored by his commentary mates), or how Bruce would try and suck Matthews off every chance he got, you name it.

Actually there is a much worse example than Hodge - Campbell Brown even having a job in the media - considering he got sacked from Gold Coast for breaking Steven May's jaw - says all you need to know about them. And that's after he got four weeks for kicking a Melbourne player in the face (which ended his final season).

Go a long way to find a more thoroughly overrated "tough guy" than him.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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I've got nothing against Hodge per se (there were way, way worse players than him), but it's the hypocrisy by the media that pisses people off I would imagine. Certainly does me. Whether it's "good bloke" Hodge, and how they looked the other way in his latter years when he was clear he was being hidden on the field (getting utterly destroyed by Martin in the 2019 Qualifying Final but still adored by his commentary mates), or how Bruce would try and suck Matthews off every chance he got, you name it.

Actually there is a much worse example than Hodge - Campbell Brown even having a job in the media - considering he got sacked from Gold Coast for breaking Steven May's jaw - says all you need to know about them. And that's after he got four weeks for kicking a Melbourne player in the face (which ended his final season).

Go a long way to find a more thoroughly overrated "tough guy" than him.
As if Hodge was directly playing on Dusty in that final. Bloke was 35. Don't let your hatred of the guy get in the way of facts.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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I've got nothing against Hodge per se (there were way, way worse players than him), but it's the hypocrisy by the media that pisses people off I would imagine. Certainly does me. Whether it's "good bloke" Hodge, and how they looked the other way in his latter years when he was clear he was being hidden on the field (getting utterly destroyed by Martin in the 2019 Qualifying Final but still adored by his commentary mates), or how Bruce would try and suck Matthews off every chance he got, you name it.

Actually there is a much worse example than Hodge - Campbell Brown even having a job in the media - considering he got sacked from Gold Coast for breaking Steven May's jaw - says all you need to know about them. And that's after he got four weeks for kicking a Melbourne player in the face (which ended his final season).

Go a long way to find a more thoroughly overrated "tough guy" than him.
Brown did alot of dirty sh*t agree with that but he would straight up punch anyone in their face as well. There's a difference between cheap dirty stuff and a bloke who is a genuine psycho who acted irrationally which Brown did quite a few times. Mad dog Muir did alot of cheap stuff as well but he could go toe to toe with anyone.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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Not sure there’s been any worse than Clarkson in London.
Was shocking I agree. But again he got belted multiple times directly after that incident from behind. Ends shouldn't justify the means. Johnston came in from 20 odd metres away with a swinging forearm. Could have easily done the same amount of damage.
 

Partridge

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As if Hodge was directly playing on Dusty in that final. Bloke was 35. Don't let your hatred of the guy get in the way of facts.
Watch the third quarter. Standing next to him is generally a good sign.

And it's not hatred of Hodge - which I already said. I just hate hypocrisy and I despise commentators who play favourites. Don't care who it is.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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Watch the third quarter. Standing next to him is generally a good sign.

And it's not hatred of Hodge - which I already said. I just hate hypocrisy and I despise commentators who play favourites. Don't care who it is.
Yeah standing next to him than peeling off. Hodge at the end of his career is never a good match-up for Dusty. How that takes away from how good he was during his peak has me confused. Bontempelli out marked him once in a final as well he must be miles better too.
 

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