- Oct 19, 2017
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No one has yet explained how exactly North going backwards in 3 years is somehow indicative of them having a list of high potential. Literally the reverse so far has shown to be true.
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Worst list in the AFL at present?
- Thread starter Wormkilla
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They aren't in their prime missing the 8
- Oct 19, 2017
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If you deflect the criticism of the Saints list to Norf 2 or 3 more times, maybe everyone will start rating the Saints list
Subject : Worst list in the AFL at present?
Wow. I wonder why we're all in here commenting.
Must be a big mistake that I bring up North.
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No issue with you bringing up North. Just find it hilarious you trying deflect attention from the Saints to North. Made funnier by the fact both clubs have similar votes in the poll
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I see the saints list similar to north around 2013-2016 just lacking a few more truly elite players
- Jan 23, 2019
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No issue with you bringing up North. Just find it hilarious you trying deflect attention from the Saints to North. Made funnier by the fact both clubs have similar votes in the poll
I admit i read this thread and change my vote a bit. I was WCE, then after reading some old prick from Sydney's views I changed to North . Then on further reading I've changed my vote to the Saints.
So North and Saints locked on 37 votes.
The next vote will be a old fashioned 8 pointer as they say in footy circles. Or maybe a two pointer.
Our average list age is almost identical to North Melbourne. I guess the major difference between the two lists is that ours actually manages to win games of football.
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- May 19, 2017
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Cotchin has be Steele, both Captains and both are very good footballs.
Rance and Houli is Battle and Wilkie but Battle is still learning and developing, hopefully he takes the next step into what Rance used to be.
We don't have a Dusty.
Lynch and Riewoldt are King and Membrey.
It can't be the Saints. They are middle of the pack but have a few stars & now a good coach that might get them a few finals. Sure, they might not get a flag and then need to rebuild but I don't think the bar should be furthest away from a flag. Otherwise it could potentially be Geelong or Richmond if things don't go right and a full rebuild is required in a few years (I know Geelong have been in that position forever).
Even then, I think WC has still got it by a mile. The lack of talent 20-26 is staggering & if the last few drafts and the next few drafts aren't massive home runs, they'll have no stars to lead them. I recon it would be the hardest list to take on despite the club riches at their disposal. I am also starting to think that Simmo might need to be moved on sooner rather than later so hard decisions can be made with club favourites. A 2 year deal for Nic Nat at his age is amazing in the context of his output.
Yeah ok. I don't really rate most of that list. I only really agree that King has the potential of a Lynch or Reiwoldt.
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I don’t think Saints have the worst list they are around the middle somewhere.
Average age is a bit of a nothing stat in isolation if it’s higher with no scope for improvement it’s an issue but north do at this stage have some grounds to think improvement will come, sure it isn’t guaranteed.
But yeah I don’t rate the saints as the worst.
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Saints have King that’s the massive difference
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Going into 2017 Tigers had an AA and multiple Coleman winning key forward (Riewoldt). 2 x AA midfielders (Martin and Cotchin). And a multiple AA key defender widely regarded the best in the comp. (Rance).
Obviously others stepped up from nowhere, but they were the unknowns.
Who are the Saints current elite players going into 2023? Steele. They have Sinclair but he’s a flanker. King has potential to be but he’s injured and hasn’t got there yet.
Even the Demons going into 2021 had Petracca, Oliver and Gawn as AA and bonafide stars.
Saints desperately need Marshall and King to step up and become elite.
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North had brown who kicked 60 goals a year for three years straight.
But I agree King is a great piece and to expand on my comment further, north lacked at least one perhaps two additional game breaking mids, I see similarities with the saints, not saying that your mids are bad or anything but you just need that extra bit to push them to a genuine contender
Well King is well on the way, and unfortunately Marshall has been playing injured for possibly all of the last two seasons.
In 2021 he struggled with plantar fasciitis over the preseason and then missed the opening rounds with it, then in his first game of the year he ruptured it during the game, and carried that for the remainder of the year.
Then last year he seemed to still be hampered with it for most, if not all of the season. I was at one game sitting close to the fence and Ro was hobbling around something shocking.
Did the 3km time trial on day one of preseason though, so hopefully that’s a really good indication that he’s finally injury-free.
Prior to those two seasons he’d come 2nd and 3rd in the previous two B&F’s, at 23 and 24yo.
The other thing that has held him back is not playing consistently in what is by FAR his best position.
Since Ryder was going so well in the ruck Ro has played mainly forward, and he’s not much better than serviceable there. Whereas he impacts games far far more when playing no.1 ruck.
He could easily explode this year, if he’s finally injury-free and back to playing what is by far his best/most preferred role.
- Oct 18, 2016
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No such thing as a slider, just incorrect mock drafts.
Oh I’m happy to give it time, however the amount of Saints supporters talking up their 22 draft haul requires checking. Sliders slide for a reason.
On top of injuries and being played out of position preventing Marshall from really stepping up and being considered “elite” or “A-grade”, we also have a number of other young highly talented guys who have had injury slow them down significantly, just when they looked set to really break out, which is a big part of the reason why those of us who follow St Kilda rate our list a lot higher than those with only a passing interest.
Gresham was another one who looked set to really explode, after finally getting AFL fit and after a couple of years in the midfield, but he’s since copped long-term injuries in each of the last 3 seasons.
Top 7 pick Hunter Clark was coming top 5 in our B&F early on in the 2021 season, before a series of huge knocks in the year-and-a-half since have really taken the wind out of his sails.
Top 8 pick Nick Coffield came 5th in our B&F at 20yo, in the year we finished 5th, and all reports from preseason last year was that he was absolutely killing it in match sim, and was primed for a big breakout year, then he did his ACL and missed the season.
Last year top 20 pick Jack Higgins was kicking bags of goals to start the year and was high up in the coaches votes, before a number of concussions took the wind right out of his sails. Finally looks like he has an AFL body this preseason and was the standout in pre-Christmas training.
So on top of Marshall, that’s 4 guys who were all drafted in the first round of their respective drafts who haven’t really had their proper “breakout” season yet, due to injury, which is a big part of the reason we’ve stagnated in the last two seasons.
Get most if not all of those guys fully fit and injury free and we would improve considerably, and wouldn’t be close to having the worst list in the comp.
We have after all been just one win outside the finals in each of the last two seasons- off brutal draws each time- despite those 5 highly talented guys not really progressing, for the aforementioned reasons.
Gresham was another one who looked set to really explode, after finally getting AFL fit and after a couple of years in the midfield, but he’s since copped long-term injuries in each of the last 3 seasons.
Top 7 pick Hunter Clark was coming top 5 in our B&F early on in the 2021 season, before a series of huge knocks in the year-and-a-half since have really taken the wind out of his sails.
Top 8 pick Nick Coffield came 5th in our B&F at 20yo, in the year we finished 5th, and all reports from preseason last year was that he was absolutely killing it in match sim, and was primed for a big breakout year, then he did his ACL and missed the season.
Last year top 20 pick Jack Higgins was kicking bags of goals to start the year and was high up in the coaches votes, before a number of concussions took the wind right out of his sails. Finally looks like he has an AFL body this preseason and was the standout in pre-Christmas training.
So on top of Marshall, that’s 4 guys who were all drafted in the first round of their respective drafts who haven’t really had their proper “breakout” season yet, due to injury, which is a big part of the reason we’ve stagnated in the last two seasons.
Get most if not all of those guys fully fit and injury free and we would improve considerably, and wouldn’t be close to having the worst list in the comp.
We have after all been just one win outside the finals in each of the last two seasons- off brutal draws each time- despite those 5 highly talented guys not really progressing, for the aforementioned reasons.
- Jul 15, 2022
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Billings McKenzie also are important that missed large junks of the season
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Yeah Billings was coming top 2 in our B&F early in 2021 and looked like he might finally live up to his potential, but then a week after Marshall did his, he also ruptured his plantar fascia on game-day, and played out the year hobbled by that injury, and hardly training. Then injury kept him to just 8 games last season.
While Mackenzie was coming 3rd in our B&F early last season, before missing the last 10 games with injury.
Jack Hayes another one. Started the year terrifically last season then did his ACL in R5 and missed the rest of the season.
Ben Paton another one. Was terrific down back for us in 2020 at 22yo as one of the best young small defenders in the comp, then broke his leg the following preseason and missed all of 2021 as a result. Will hopefully be right back to full-fitness by now.
And of course Zak Jones was a very important piece of our midfield in 2020 and 21, but then whatever mental health issues he had last year clearly took a huge toll on him, as he was an absolute shadow of his former self once he returned to the team from R8 onwards.
Obviously if all these type injury issues continue we’ll be in some trouble, but if we start to get a better run with them then we could improve significantly.
We have been absolutely cruelled with the “fixture” and injuries in the past 2 years. No one wants to hear about that though, which is fair enough, as all clubs have their issues.
It is fact though and we’re due a bit of luck.
It is fact though and we’re due a bit of luck.
That's fair. I just see the Saints as furthest from seriously challenging for a flag because I think it needs a total overhaul. It's far from the worst list at present. I have you guys in that 8th-12th range for the next few years before dropping off. If you can nail a few drafts in a row it can change pretty quickly though.
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“Great space”.
You’re right they lack forward structure and luck with injury.
But you conveniently left out “talent” in your assessment.
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“Great space”.
You’re right they lack forward structure and luck with injury.
But you conveniently left out “talent” in your assessment.
Won one less game than Carlton last season with a much tougher fixture.
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