Science/Environment Wuhan Coronavirus (COVID-19) - HCQ doesn't work - Part 3

owen87

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I was hoping for a more Victoria-specific response. Having an interest in aviation, my understanding is that Sydney airport is generally the busiest in Australia. According to this source, Brisbane had the busiest airport in the month of June, followed by Sydney:


So by all means hold Trump and Bojo accountable for their own nations, but I'm seeking a reason, any reason, for Victoria's spectacular failure (outside of incompetence of the Andrews government.)

Other states seemed to manage hotel quarantines and aged care facilities quite well in comparison, being proactive instead of reactive.
So even though you've been provided a number of reasons, you'll continue to ask for reasons, because the reasons you've been given aren't what you wanted?

How about, instead, you just tell us what you want the reasons to be?
 

FireKrakouer

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So even though you've been provided a number of reasons, you'll continue to ask for reasons, because the reasons you've been given aren't what you wanted?

How about, instead, you just tell us what you want the reasons to be?
I've been given reasons of "but Scomo" followed by "but Trump". I'm talking about Victoria, and our death rate being ten fold that of the larger population of NSW. Feel free to contribute.
 

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owen87

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I've been given reasons of "but Scomo" followed by "but Trump". I'm talking about Victoria, and our death rate being ten fold that of the larger population of NSW. Feel free to contribute.
As I said, why don't just just tell us your acceptable reasons, to save people providing you a myriad of responses which you'll ignore and keep posting the exact same thing.
 

FRUMPY

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and for the record, any melbournian doing the back roads run into country victoria is a completely utterly selfish twat

this behaviour is a big reason country vic was locked down in the first place, and border towns in kind punished by SA/NSW

if you're thinking of doing it, please dont.
*unless you have a permit, then please continue to 'spread' the virus
 

Ned_Flanders

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*unless you have a permit, then please continue to 'spread' the virus
those with permits are either working in the local area, or have family there. that should indicate some kind of ties and actually giving a sh*t (and making sure you manage the risks accordingly)

idiots who decide to go to Orbost for a break while waiting for test results are the problem here, because they dont give two fu**s about anyone in regional victoria as their own needs always take priority
 

FRUMPY

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those with permits are either working in the local area, or have family there. that should indicate some kind of ties and actually giving a sh*t (and making sure you manage the risks accordingly)

idiots who decide to go to Orbost for a break while waiting for test results are the problem here, because they dont give two fu**s about anyone in regional victoria as their own needs always take priority
Pretty easy for a boss or a self employed person to write himself a permit to go anywhere i would have thought.

Anyone who is waiting for test who goes anywhere is an idiot. 99.99% of people who travel are not in that category, even without a permit.
 

SaintsSeptember

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Pretty easy for a boss or a self employed person to write himself a permit to go anywhere i would have thought.

Anyone who is waiting for test who goes anywhere is an idiot. 99.99% of people who travel are not in that category, even without a permit.
Easy to write it , but also easy to call bullshit and check.

Fred Dork , Electrician from Nunnawadding, fishing rods in back, self signed work permit. ..
Office Fatpork. Thinks to himself..." .hmmmm, I reckon we has plenty of lectricians in Bairnsdale ".

Actually the Morwell area had a fairly bad spreader who was a permitted worker.
My gos, is was that he knew he had been diagnosed with Covid, and continued to work and visit several local businesses repeatedly.

I would suggest that if you are stupid enough to break the rules AND there is a clear link to you causing someone's business to close, or someone to suffer poor health, then Slater and Gordon will be coming to see you.
If you inadvertently spread the virus while following the rules, you are probably covered legally.
 

FireKrakouer

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As I said, why don't just just tell us your acceptable reasons, to save people providing you a myriad of responses which you'll ignore and keep posting the exact same thing.
As I voted for Dan at the last election (you'll understand that the opposition were non existent) I'm grasping at straws here seeking a reason for Victoria's failure.

As I said, the 2 responses so far have been "but Scomo" and "but Trump". I'd truly value any explanation as to why Victoria's figures are ten fold that of a larger state with a larger population and busier airport. Please, won't someone at least try? It can't all be the fault of the Andrews administration, surely?
 

Abers

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As I voted for Dan at the last election (you'll understand that the opposition were non existent) I'm grasping at straws here seeking a reason for Victoria's failure.

As I said, the 2 responses so far have been "but Scomo" and "but Trump". I'd truly value any explanation as to why Victoria's figures are ten fold that of a larger state with a larger population and busier airport. Please, won't someone at least try? It can't all be the fault of the Andrews administration, surely?
It’s either “Victorians are selfish”, “bad luck” or some combination there of.
 

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CD Xbow

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Yes just strange that they aren't as enthusiastic on reporting nightly updates about Europe's escalating cases, as they were with the US a few weeks ago.
I've seen many reports in different media about escalation in Europe, so your speculation is not correct.
I have seen WHO predicting significant further escalation
The unfolding disaster in India, Brazil and closer to home, in Indonesia, I've seen articles about them, too.

I still see the US is still the worst in the world, despite it's wealth. Mr Trump remains confused and keeps on lying. Can't fix stupid.
 

yebiga

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A former Treasury economist quit last week so that he could speak out against the state’s management of the COVID-19 infection. This is what he has to say. https://www.afr.com/policy/economy/...aign=nc&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1600242122
It's firewalled but if you quickly click x to stop loading you will likely get around it.

I'm tempted to say it's a brilliant piece but honestly, he is only saying what commonsense said from the get-go. Having lately worked within the Victorian Government gives his piece more gravitas. The yes-minister culture typical of bureaucracies has permeated like a fart in a doona across the whole country.
 

medusala

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I've seen many reports in different media about escalation in Europe, so your speculation is not correct.
Much of it is due to false positives based on increased testing. The media of course wont tell you that. Hospitalisations have barely increased in a number of countries.

I have seen WHO predicting significant further escalation
I wouldnt take their word on anything.

I still see the US is still the worst in the world, despite it's wealth.
Incorrect.
 

FireKrakouer

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Lebbo73

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if Golden Sky likes to call people who would like to save lives and halt the spread of the virus "CovidCrazies", then surely its appropriate to call him and his ilk names:
"MassMurdering"
"CovidKillers" seems just as fair.
This is one truly clueless post. You don’t lock down 99.9% of the population to save 0.1% of the population. You lock down the 0.1% as long as they agree to it and the rest of us carry on as usual. We’ve already determined that the virus isn’t any more dangerous than the flu. Death rates are showing this and plenty of evidence has been provided to back this up. You just refuse to accept this.
 

medusala

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The UK's response has been pathetic in turn, making things much worse elsewhere.
Amazing how one keeps reading this sort of comment over and over. It makes very little or no difference what countries do policy wise unless you have an extreme example like Australia / NZ which are islands and cut themselves off. The stats are very clear on this and has been demonstrated in numerous studies. Even the WHO acknowledges this.

Lockdowns have been hopelessly ineffective and should never have been implemented. To state the UK should have locked down earlier etc is to ignore the EVIDENCE. Yes the UK has been useless precisely because they believed an absurd totally exaggerated model showing horrendous results (you would think they would have learned from the BS climate crowd and their "models".

This is a great vid and explains why some countries are affected more than others and differently. Basically due to a) seasonality and b) excess deaths or lack of due to flu in previous winters. b) largely explains why UK, Spain and Sweden suffered badly and why others like Norway and Hungary havent.

have you seen this Dry Rot

 

Clems Knee

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This is one truly clueless post. You don’t lock down 99.9% of the population to save 0.1% of the population. You lock down the 0.1% as long as they agree to it and the rest of us carry on as usual. We’ve already determined that the virus isn’t any more dangerous than the flu. Death rates are showing this and plenty of evidence has been provided to back this up. You just refuse to accept this.
My post was clearly about Golden Sky’s name calling. That is stupid and a poor reflection on the (lack of) intelligence of that poster.

As for your post, you think the lockdown is to protect 0.1%? That’s really clueless. The fatality rate is probably 6-10 times that. On top of that, the very high transmission rate of this virus means that the health system will quickly collapse with uncontrolled transmission (we have seen aged care homes and hospitals suffering from lack of health staff in 3 states in the past few weeks).
The population of Victoria are being locked down to protect a sizeable minority at the least. It’s also being locked down to enable a situation where the whole of Australia can open up. And then the Nation's economy will be able to recover.

What will stop Australia’s recovery is subverting behaviour by selfish people, people exhausted by the lockdown and the deliberate agitation of the extreme right wing.
 
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medusala

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On top of that, the very high transmission rate of this virus means that the health system will quickly collapse with uncontrolled transmission (we have seen aged care homes and hospitals suffering from lack of health staff in 3 states in the past few weeks).
It didnt come close in Sweden or the UK and Australia has a far superior healthcare system to the UK.

What will stop Australia’s recovery is subverting behaviour by selfish people, people exhausted by the lockdown and the deliberate agitation of the extreme right wing.
humour.
 

parsons nose

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Amazing how one keeps reading this sort of comment over and over. It makes very little or no difference what countries do policy wise unless you have an extreme example like Australia / NZ which are islands and cut themselves off. The stats are very clear on this and has been demonstrated in numerous studies. Even the WHO acknowledges this.

Lockdowns have been hopelessly ineffective and should never have been implemented. To state the UK should have locked down earlier etc is to ignore the EVIDENCE. Yes the UK has been useless precisely because they believed an absurd totally exaggerated model showing horrendous results (you would think they would have learned from the BS climate crowd and their "models".

This is a great vid and explains why some countries are affected more than others and differently. Basically due to a) seasonality and b) excess deaths or lack of due to flu in previous winters. b) largely explains why UK, Spain and Sweden suffered badly and why others like Norway and Hungary havent.

have you seen this Dry Rot

I look at the British Prime Minister and I look at the average Joe walking around Melbourne and health wise I don’t see any difference between him and 50% of the average Joes. And COViD put him into ICU. There’s nothing abstract about the idea that the situation he found himself in, could apply to large swathes of the general population. And whilst the restrictions are onerous, I’d prefer that to suffering Boris’s fate. And I’m sure I’m not alone on that front.
 

William Wonka

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As I voted for Dan at the last election (you'll understand that the opposition were non existent) I'm grasping at straws here seeking a reason for Victoria's failure.

As I said, the 2 responses so far have been "but Scomo" and "but Trump". I'd truly value any explanation as to why Victoria's figures are ten fold that of a larger state with a larger population and busier airport. Please, won't someone at least try? It can't all be the fault of the Andrews administration, surely?
I can provide you with part of the answer.

The figures are obviously far greater than any other state because VIC had a small (on the global scale) outbreak.
The reason for the outbreak was not hotel security guards (NSW, WA and SA have them too) nor was it their behavior (again all states had breaches- NSW even had a few guards catch it).
The reason Vic had a true outbreak is it got seeded into the wrong community.
A community with huge families, language barriers, shitloads of crims, lots of abattoir workers and a culture of blokes kissing each other hello.
Add to this a religious festival at just the wrong time and we arrive at where we are now.

Ahhh you say but NSW has the same communities!
This is true.
Why they haven't had the same outbreak (yet) could be down to any number of factors.
 

CD Xbow

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Amazing how one keeps reading this sort of comment over and over. It makes very little or no difference what countries do policy wise unless you have an extreme example like Australia / NZ which are islands and cut themselves off. The stats are very clear on this and has been demonstrated in numerous studies. Even the WHO acknowledges this.

Lockdowns have been hopelessly ineffective and should never have been implemented. To state the UK should have locked down earlier etc is to ignore the EVIDENCE. Yes the UK has been useless precisely because they believed an absurd totally exaggerated model showing horrendous results (you would think they would have learned from the BS climate crowd and their "models".

This is a great vid and explains why some countries are affected more than others and differently. Basically due to a) seasonality and b) excess deaths or lack of due to flu in previous winters. b) largely explains why UK, Spain and Sweden suffered badly and why others like Norway and Hungary havent.

have you seen this Dry Rot

This is rubbish. He's a chemical engineer who promotes high fat diets? He has frequently quoted data relating to the issue which has not been real. Not a great start. The statement lockdowns are ineffective is simply wrong. Lot's of strong data for showing lockdowns are very effective at reducing spread, if you believe otherwise you are an idiot. I'm sorry I couldn't get past 4.20.
 

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