WWE TV, Rumours and Discussion - Part VII

[Biggy_Boy]

I think one of the main reasons why we have less bigger stars is because we have no big heels anymore. Let's look at the biggest faces in recent years:

- Hogan: Savage, Andre/Heenen, Yoko, Piper
- Sting: nWo
- Austin: The Rock, Mr McMahon
- Cena: Edge, Orton, Punk
- Bryan: The Authority

There are no big heels anymore. There is no one that I want to see get beaten up. We no longer look at a heel and say "I wanna pay to see you get beaten up" we say "Oh gee that was good heel work". You can't have a big face without them overcoming a big heel.

The overall issue is that wrestling is not part of the current cultural zeitgeist, which means that it generates little interest from people outside the diehard fan sphere. With the availability of the internet becoming widespread, this means all those heavily invested fans have become 'smart' and there has been a lot of homogeneity of opinions formed. People don't want to feel they are getting 'worked', so they cheer and fawn over the heels as well, because they're still good ring workers or they think it's cool to like the character or whatever.

The fanbase that went to shows going "I hate this character. I want to see the babyface punch his head in." is gone. Now it's all about "wow, I can't wait to see the performance between these two fantastic workers. I don't really care who wins or loses."

 

[Cleavy]

The fanbase that went to shows going "I hate this character. I want to see the babyface punch his head in." is gone. Now it's all about "wow, I can't wait to see the performance between these two fantastic workers. I don't really care who wins or loses."

agree with this 100%

 

[Millky95]

The overall issue is that wrestling is not part of the current cultural zeitgeist, which means that it generates little interest from people outside the diehard fan sphere. With the availability of the internet becoming widespread, this means all those heavily invested fans have become 'smart' and there has been a lot of homogeneity of opinions formed. People don't want to feel they are getting 'worked', so they cheer and fawn over the heels as well, because they're still good ring workers or they think it's cool to like the character or whatever.

The fanbase that went to shows going "I hate this character. I want to see the babyface punch his head in." is gone. Now it's all about "wow, I can't wait to see the performance between these two fantastic workers. I don't really care who wins or loses."

I'll admit I am guilty of that. I cheer guys like AJ when he is a heel because he is my favourite.

But you'd think the powers at be (regardless of company) can use that knowledge though. I don't think WWE gives a * and I don't think AEW's "we have no heels or babyfaces" works

 

[Bomberboyokay]

The overall issue is that wrestling is not part of the current cultural zeitgeist, which means that it generates little interest from people outside the diehard fan sphere. With the availability of the internet becoming widespread, this means all those heavily invested fans have become 'smart' and there has been a lot of homogeneity of opinions formed. People don't want to feel they are getting 'worked', so they cheer and fawn over the heels as well, because they're still good ring workers or they think it's cool to like the character or whatever.

The fanbase that went to shows going "I hate this character. I want to see the babyface punch his head in." is gone. Now it's all about "wow, I can't wait to see the performance between these two fantastic workers. I don't really care who wins or loses."

WWE's faces have been hamstrung through the Linda Does Politics & Wage Supression Era. They have to hug and high five each other like they're best friends. CM Punk is probably the biggest non-Cena face and he did it. Was never going to become Austin or The Rock. People were 'smart fans' in 2005 but they still cheered wrestlers like Batista and Chris Benoit et al because they didn't have to do dorky things. Nerd crew fans and loss of general interest is the consequence of faces looking like chumps, not the cause.

 

[Cleavy]

WWE's faces have been hamstrung through the Linda Does Politics & Wage Supression Era. They have to hug and high five each other like they're best friends. CM Punk is probably the biggest non-Cena face and he did it. Was never going to become Austin or The Rock. People were 'smart fans' in 2005 but they still cheered wrestlers like Batista and Chris Benoit et al because they didn't have to do dorky things. Nerd crew fans and loss of general interest is the consequence of faces looking like chumps, not the cause.

these days they're all losers who have no friends.

 

[Rusty Brookes]

Aja Kong hitting a package piledriver in WWF in 1995!

That five minutes was more entertaining than anything I've watched on WWE for the past five years. Aja Kong was such a believable heel. I think I read that the spinning back elbow broke Asari's nose.

 

[Cleavy]

That five minutes was more entertaining than anything I've watched on WWE for the past five years. Aja Kong was such a believable heel. I think I read that the spinning back elbow broke Asari's nose.

correct. rumour goes that this match caused them to shelve the women's division. they had planned to do Alundra Blayze vs Aja Kong at the Royal Rumble.

 

[ptrg]

just listened to Talk Is Jericho today with JR, and they talk about just this.

JR was an advocate for bring in the 5’9 to 5’11ers (But admitted the goal was to just get in 5’11ers but had to undersell it to Vince).

He explained as we all know Vince loves the body builder look, but if you have one of them as a baby face, you need monster heels. And they are notoriously bad at working.

But he talked about so many bang on points - investment in character, wins and losses mattering, matches not going through the motions or looking like a duet ballet (half the wwe roster cough cough), no stupid 50/50 bookings. Make stars!

The bloke simply gets it, and imo is a great get by AEW. He’s responsible for putting so much of wwfs dream run roster together, and even more responsible for keeping it together despite Vince’s meddling (his story about Austins demands is great)

Him and Jericho IMO just get it. His best line was near the end when trying to explain how weird Vince is. He’s living in his own version of never never land like Michael Jackson did. And for that reason he will not and cannot ever give up control.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Copied from my Facebook profile verbatim and want to get your thoughts.

If there are inaccuracies, please point them out.




Been having a think about it.

In November 2005, when Eddie Guerrero died, 2 of the non La Familia close to Latino Heat were Batista and Rey Mysterio.

Let's be creative here.

How could we turn the then face of Smackdown in Batista from a baby face into a heel and have him draw heat against a dead set peach of a baby face?

November 2005 was when Eddie died at 38 years old.

That's also the starting point of this.

So, in January of 2006, Batista is forced to relinquish the World Heavyweight Title because of injury and Smackdown hosts a tournament to see who succeeds The Animal.

Kurt Angle, at that stage, is very much part of Raw and is coming off a smoking hot feud with John Cena and Raw General Manager Eric Bischoff, who is at the peak of his heelish powers, is also at the centre of the Angle-Cena feud. (The Michael Cole of 2010-11 would've revelled in this.)

Suddenly, Angle is back on Smackdown and claims the now vacated World Heavyweight Title and this sets up Kurt Angle vs Mark Henry at the 2006 Royal Rumble.

That's my tangent out the way.

/

Here's the plot with subplots.

So Batista finds himself out of action.

He returns at 2006 edition of The Great American Bash.

Friday Night Smackdown sees Batista cutting a promo which goes on for 15 minutes.
This is also a good opportunity for the fans to go to the toilet or do something important.

First half of the promo is dedicated to cheap pops and thanking the fans for their well wishes during his rehabilitation.
Second half of the promo, a tribute to his friend, Eddie Guerrero.

Batista absolutely with the crowd in the palm of his hands.

Rey Mysterio comes out and thanks Batista on behalf of La Familia.

This seed is planted and Batista and Rey become occasional tag team buddies for the next 4 months while Batista challenges King Booker for the title he vacated and Rey find himself in an angle involving Chavo Guerrero where the point of the Mysterio-Chavo angle is that Chavo and Vickie Guerrero, Eddie's wife at the time of his death, are angry at Rey for dining out on the tribute to Eddie.

They are also annoyed that Rey inserted himself into the delivering of the Hall of Fame speech he did alongside Chavo and Chris Benoit.

To them, and the greater Guerrero, that's insulting to anyone who knew Eddie.

Like 2005, Rey's son Dominick is in a Guerrero related angle with Mysterio. (One year and still same custodial issues.)

To add some spice to this little angle, Rey continues to wear Eddie's "I'm Your Papa" t-shirt (which you could've gotten at WWEShop.com.)

This feud goes on for 3 months.

When this feud is done, you start to see tensions show themselves between Rey Mysterio and Batista but we, the fans, are not allowed to know why we're supposed to see tensions and we're told to be suspended in belief with regards to what is going on and, thus, is telling us to normalise the tension-less happenings.

Gradually, the tensions become more and more public until, the first Smackdown of November 2006, Batista completely loses it and turns heel and attacks Rey Mysterio simply for coming out to the ring.

This marks a return to heeldom for Batista since January-February 2005 when Batista was in Evolution.

Because Dave was a heel from his WWE debut with Reverend D-Von in 2002 just before Judgment Day until the lead-up to Wrestlemania 21, this becomes, effectively, his first heel turn.

The 2nd Friday of November, Batista cuts a promo and explains his actions.

He starts off by saying that what he did is nothing to do with the fans and that the fans have no right to understand his actions and that they're not worthy of his time.

He then talks about why he attacked Rey Mysterio (which will lead up to Survivor Series 2006) and draws some pretty loud boos.

He states that the reason why he attacked Rey was because Rey wasn't in the hotel when Eddie died and that it was his fault that Eddie died. (This guarantees the loudest boos in the Ruthless Aggression era.)

He goes on to say that, had Rey been in the same hotel that Eddie stayed in the year before, same apartment even, Eddie would've been alive.

The weeks before this, Batista reclaims the World Heavyweight Title from King Booker which presents the perfect Survivor Series main event.

Batista (C) vs Rey Mysterio in a Texas Ballrope match. (The same match that Eddie "lost" his WWE Title to Bradshaw at The Great American Bash 2004.)

This feud lasts until Backlash 2007 where Batista and Rey, in a Last Man Standing match, fail to get up at the 10 count.

That's the idea behind a feud that would've been money.

 

[Senor M]

Copied from my Facebook profile verbatim and want to get your thoughts.

If there are inaccuracies, please point them out.




Been having a think about it.

In November 2005, when Eddie Guerrero died, 2 of the non La Familia close to Latino Heat were Batista and Rey Mysterio.

Let's be creative here.

How could we turn the then face of Smackdown in Batista from a baby face into a heel and have him draw heat against a dead set peach of a baby face?

November 2005 was when Eddie died at 38 years old.

That's also the starting point of this.

So, in January of 2006, Batista is forced to relinquish the World Heavyweight Title because of injury and Smackdown hosts a tournament to see who succeeds The Animal.

Kurt Angle, at that stage, is very much part of Raw and is coming off a smoking hot feud with John Cena and Raw General Manager Eric Bischoff, who is at the peak of his heelish powers, is also at the centre of the Angle-Cena feud. (The Michael Cole of 2010-11 would've revelled in this.)

Suddenly, Angle is back on Smackdown and claims the now vacated World Heavyweight Title and this sets up Kurt Angle vs Mark Henry at the 2006 Royal Rumble.

That's my tangent out the way.

/

Here's the plot with subplots.

So Batista finds himself out of action.

He returns at 2006 edition of The Great American Bash.

Friday Night Smackdown sees Batista cutting a promo which goes on for 15 minutes.
This is also a good opportunity for the fans to go to the toilet or do something important.

First half of the promo is dedicated to cheap pops and thanking the fans for their well wishes during his rehabilitation.
Second half of the promo, a tribute to his friend, Eddie Guerrero.

Batista absolutely with the crowd in the palm of his hands.

Rey Mysterio comes out and thanks Batista on behalf of La Familia.

This seed is planted and Batista and Rey become occasional tag team buddies for the next 4 months while Batista challenges King Booker for the title he vacated and Rey find himself in an angle involving Chavo Guerrero where the point of the Mysterio-Chavo angle is that Chavo and Vickie Guerrero, Eddie's wife at the time of his death, are angry at Rey for dining out on the tribute to Eddie.

They are also annoyed that Rey inserted himself into the delivering of the Hall of Fame speech he did alongside Chavo and Chris Benoit.

To them, and the greater Guerrero, that's insulting to anyone who knew Eddie.

Like 2005, Rey's son Dominick is in a Guerrero related angle with Mysterio. (One year and still same custodial issues.)

To add some spice to this little angle, Rey continues to wear Eddie's "I'm Your Papa" t-shirt (which you could've gotten at WWEShop.com.)

This feud goes on for 3 months.

When this feud is done, you start to see tensions show themselves between Rey Mysterio and Batista but we, the fans, are not allowed to know why we're supposed to see tensions and we're told to be suspended in belief with regards to what is going on and, thus, is telling us to normalise the tension-less happenings.

Gradually, the tensions become more and more public until, the first Smackdown of November 2006, Batista completely loses it and turns heel and attacks Rey Mysterio simply for coming out to the ring.

This marks a return to heeldom for Batista since January-February 2005 when Batista was in Evolution.

Because Dave was a heel from his WWE debut with Reverend D-Von in 2002 just before Judgment Day until the lead-up to Wrestlemania 21, this becomes, effectively, his first heel turn.

The 2nd Friday of November, Batista cuts a promo and explains his actions.

He starts off by saying that what he did is nothing to do with the fans and that the fans have no right to understand his actions and that they're not worthy of his time.

He then talks about why he attacked Rey Mysterio (which will lead up to Survivor Series 2006) and draws some pretty loud boos.

He states that the reason why he attacked Rey was because Rey wasn't in the hotel when Eddie died and that it was his fault that Eddie died. (This guarantees the loudest boos in the Ruthless Aggression era.)

He goes on to say that, had Rey been in the same hotel that Eddie stayed in the year before, same apartment even, Eddie would've been alive.

The weeks before this, Batista reclaims the World Heavyweight Title from King Booker which presents the perfect Survivor Series main event.

Batista (C) vs Rey Mysterio in a Texas Ballrope match. (The same match that Eddie "lost" his WWE Title to Bradshaw at The Great American Bash 2004.)

This feud lasts until Backlash 2007 where Batista and Rey, in a Last Man Standing match, fail to get up at the 10 count.

That's the idea behind a feud that would've been money.

Cool Fan-Fiction---but wasn't Mysterio injured in October 2006 (the same time as your suggested feud)?

 

[Cleavy]

 

[Cleavy]

so Sasha and Bayley holding all the gold, sort of a female version of the Two Man Power Trip (HHH & Austin) from 2001?

 

[NSWCROW]

I get they wanted to have Asuka run to the back but we could've done without the whiny " Asukaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa " from kairi , made her look like a dickhead , she was the one who went Bayley first ffs.

Who writes this s**t ?


That said , 1st Raw i haven't fast-forwarded at all in ages.

 

[Xtreme]

I dont know why they let Sasha win ? She's out with an injury more oftrn than not!!

 

[Cleavy]

I dont know why they let Sasha win ? She's out with an injury more oftrn than not!!

may as well do something with her while she’s healthy, before she gets injured?

 

[Xtreme]

may as well do something with her while she’s healthy, before she gets injured?

Then they vacate the title only for Asuka to get it again!

 

[TradeDraft]

may as well do something with her while she’s healthy, before she gets injured?

and She normally loses the Title back at the PPV anyway

 

[Nugett]

That’s why when someone like HHH comes back for another match, it’s a big event.
Big physical presence, big entrance, better than good on the mic, powerful moves (as opposed to almost exclusively flippy sh*t). Not many going around that can tick those boxes.

I tend to disagree, the only power moves HHH does is the spine buster and pedigree, otherwise he’s just brawling.

The long entrances, I’d rather do a couple of loads of washing, do the housework, mow the lawns, go shopping and hopefully when I come back he has only just stepped into the ring. Same with the undertaker, I have better things to do with my time. long entrances may be some people’s thing, but certainly isn’t mine.

He is good on the mic, but I wouldn’t say he is great. Stone Cold, The Rock, Dusty Rhodes and CM punk were exceptional. MJF, Cody, Randy Savage, Jericho and Ric Flair were/are great . HHH is on the same level as Hulk Hogan and John Cena, able to sell a match, but lack that emotional connection by basically doing the same promo.

the only thing I will agree with you on is his look. All baucause some one looks good, it doesn't’ necessarily mean they are good.

 

[Cleavy]

apparently there's a Payback PPV scheduled for 1 week after Summerslam...

 

[Nugett]

apparently there's a Payback PPV scheduled for 1 week after Summerslam...

Does AEW have a PPV on that date?

 

[GWBogan]

Does AEW have a PPV on that date?

AEW's next PPV (All Out) takes place on September 5 over there.

 

[Nugett]

AEW's next PPV (All Out) takes place on September 5 over there.

well that PPV doesn’t make sense then, if it was on that weekend I’d be going Yep it’s a Vince thing!

 

[Cleavy]

well that PPV doesn’t make sense then, if it was on that weekend I’d be going Yep it’s a Vince thing!

most WWE ppvs don't make sense any more

 

[Cleavy]

WWE posts $43.8 million profit in its second-quarter earnings

On Thursday, WWE releases its second-quarter earnings report that was highlighted by the enormous profit they were able to manage amidst the pandemic.

www.postwrestling.com

apparently these numbers don't take into account the wrestlers being fired.

 

[TradeDraft]