YES it's frustrating but..

[jmac70]

Let's just say that type of 'volcanic' off season behaviour exacts a price on injuries, rehab and longevity

Haw and Geel champions go to mid 30's.. ours barely got to 30 and a few cast offs are still struggling with fitness and form

The irony is that Swanny is still playing at an elite level and could go on beyond 2016. He must just have good genes.

 

[domin8tors]

I look at our two best players being the wrong side of 27. What happens when they are gone?

same thing that happens when Hawks best players are the wrong side of 30. Aka hodge and Mitchell. other players step up

 

[domin8tors]

He is very good, but to be elite he needs to do it for 3 + years. Imo

Yeah agreed Elite gets used to much. you can be an A grade player but Elite. Judd was elite, Swan elite. Selwood elite. not bontempelli or Harley Bennell. etc.

 

[Mame]

and you think that's changed by getting rid of a few players? you think the ones that are there now aren't volcanic?

I do. Travis Cloke said on AFL Game Day on Sunday that the environment is the best it's been while he's been at the club. I've heard other players say this too, even Swanny has shared similar sentiments.

 

[Collingwoodity]

Not one young player in the league is elite, you need to play 100+ top end games to be concideree elite.
The way you posted came across that our youngsters are average at best, when in reality the list in 2-3 years projects to be very very good

Nah. This is not quite correct imo.

Ollie Wines, Wingard, Cameron, Treloar, Parker, Ellis and Gaff are elite.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

I'd rather be old and good as opposed to young and suck. "Hard work and experience" will never be a substitute for genuine talent.

"At least we're not Carlton" is a shit attitude. Our attitude should be "Why aren't we like Hawthorn?".

 

[DaVe86]

Nah. This is not quite correct imo.

Ollie Wines, Wingard, Cameron, Treloar, Parker, Ellis and Gaff are elite.

I think we get carried away with stuff like this, but for the sake of argument I reckon the term 'elite' is probably reserved for about 5-10 players in the game.

I think the kids you mentioned are either playing, or have played, elite football, but are yet to become elite players.

Gaff is the finest example. His footy right now is elite, but it was only last year where people thought he was a dud who couldn't break a tag. He has taken his game to an elite level this year, but will only become an elite player once he backs it up.

Anyway, it matters little. Pendlebury is an elite player, but has been carrying injury so isn't really playing at an elite level. Gaff may not yet be an elite player, but is playing at a high level.

It's all about getting your players to peak at the same time.

But that's my 2 cents anyway

 

[The Magnificent Seven]

COLL: 23yr 10mth

CARL: 25yr 6mth

It could be worse

We could be Carlton

We have to wait that long for a flag?

 

[Soaring Magpie]

Nah. This is not quite correct imo.

Ollie Wines, Wingard, Cameron, Treloar, Parker, Ellis and Gaff are elite.

Nah... Do it for more than 1 or 2 years and then you can be concidered elite.
There is only 10-15 players in the league who are genuinely elite.
The players you mention have the makings of becoming elite but not there yet.
Elite is mentioned far to easily by the media!!

 

[Old Spice]

Anyway, our team is young and inexperienced. Only fatties and numpties think that pre-seasons and experience doesn't matter. You just have to want to win and there it is. You want as many players as you can get with at least 3 seasons or 50 games pumped into them.

 

[Robroy22]

I'd rather be old and good as opposed to young and suck. "Hard work and experience" will never be a substitute for genuine talent.

"At least we're not Carlton" is a shit attitude. Our attitude should be "Why aren't we like Hawthorn?".

You do realise that in 2010....Hawthorn and everyone else was saying "Why aren't we like Collingwood?"

 

[Robroy22]

I'd rather be old and good as opposed to young and suck. "Hard work and experience" will never be a substitute for genuine talent.

"At least we're not Carlton" is a shit attitude. Our attitude should be "Why aren't we like Hawthorn?".

You do realise that in 2010....Hawthorn and everyone else was saying "Why aren't we like Collingwood?"

 

[DrDavoren]

COLL: 23yr 10mth

CARL: 25yr 6mth

It could be worse

We could be Carlton

Age profiles prove nothing, out of interest what was our profile in 2010 surely wouldn't be much more..

 

[Mame]

Age profiles prove nothing, out of interest what was our profile in 2010 surely wouldn't be much more..

In isolation, maybe not, but they are part of the picture. The expansion clubs prove that. How did Gold Coast go in their first year? They had the best player in the comp.

Meanwhile clubs like the Dogs are benefiting from drafting well after nearly 4 years in the bottom 4 and a new coach who built upon what McCarthy started.

And the game has changed since 2010. It's not as intense due to the sub-rule and rotation caps. Every Premier since has had a lot of 30+ players.

 

[DrDavoren]

In isolation, maybe not, but they are part of the picture. The expansion clubs prove that. How did Gold Coast go in their first year? They had the best player in the comp.

Meanwhile clubs like the Dogs are benefiting from drafting well after nearly 4 years in the bottom 4 and a new coach who built upon what McCarthy started.

Hope their guys like playing for less as Boyd deal may cause trouble in a year or two when players want more money.

 

[Mame]

Hope their guys like playing for less as Boyd deal may cause trouble in a year or two when players want more money.

Maybe. Thought Port would make top 4 this year though.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

You do realise that in 2010....Hawthorn and everyone else was saying "Why aren't we like Collingwood?"

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Also, no, Hawthorn weren't asking that. Hawthorn had won the flag in 08 then had an injury ravage 2 years, so I doubt they looked at us with envy wondering why they couldn't be more like us. Hawthorn are a club that has clearly demonstrated a genuine path that they're on that produces results.

 

[Pie eyed]

You

At Hawthorn maybe.

You got a Hawk in your bedroom or something???
Your knocking off the wrong bird Jmac.

 

[AJH073]

What a pointless post. Comparing ourselves to Carlton in any way is not going to get us anywhere. They are shit

 

[northpie]

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Also, no, Hawthorn weren't asking that. Hawthorn had won the flag in 08 then had an injury ravage 2 years, so I doubt they looked at us with envy wondering why they couldn't be more like us. Hawthorn are a club that has clearly demonstrated a genuine path that they're on that produces results.

ed that is not true. Coll ran a gameplan that every one in the competition eventually tried to replicate. Listen to Matt scarlett's comments after the prelim final.
The Coll side for the first half of 2011 was the most dominant side Coll has had in my lifetime. Unfortunately we started to get worked out and came back to the rest of the comp, and that dominance only lasted for 12 rounds. Not surprised wit your view given you seem to support whoever we play each week

 

[northpie]

Prelim final of 2010

 

[doodles98]

What a pointless post. Comparing ourselves to Carlton in any way is not going to get us anywhere. They are shit

and the point of your post was to point out how pointless his post was which by my reckoning makes your post doubly pointless and now this post is triply pointless.

 

[Anzacday]

and the point of your post was to point out how pointless his post was which by my reckoning makes your post doubly pointless and now this post is triply pointless.

What was the point again?

 

[Robroy22]

Not sure what that has to do with anything. Also, no, Hawthorn weren't asking that. Hawthorn had won the flag in 08 then had an injury ravage 2 years, so I doubt they looked at us with envy wondering why they couldn't be more like us. Hawthorn are a club that has clearly demonstrated a genuine path that they're on that produces results.

So their clearly defined path took them out of contention for the next three years until they got back to a Granny in 2012? Interesting.....

They have had "Once in a generation players" (Franklin, Rioli, Hodge) along with absolute GUNS (Roughy, Mitchell, Lewis, Burgoyne) for all of Clarko's reign. In the same time we've had Pendles, Clokey and Swanny as our upper bracket and Sidebottom, Thomas, Beams and Reid as our next level.

Yes the Hawks had a rough trot with injuries in 2009....but no worse than our 2011-2013...in fact ours have been longer and to more important players (Don't see any Ben Reid's on the Hawthorn list??)

Don't get me wrong, I love the way the Hawks play, but if all our "genuine" plans had have come off in the last 2-3 years we'd be a lot further advanced than we appear to be and supporters wouldn't be questioning quite so vehemently.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

So their clearly defined path took them out of contention for the next three years until they got back to a Granny in 2012? Interesting.....

They have had "Once in a generation players" (Franklin, Rioli, Hodge) along with absolute GUNS (Roughy, Mitchell, Lewis, Burgoyne) for all of Clarko's reign. In the same time we've had Pendles, Clokey and Swanny as our upper bracket and Sidebottom, Thomas, Beams and Reid as our next level.

Yes the Hawks had a rough trot with injuries in 2009....but no worse than our 2011-2013...in fact ours have been longer and to more important players (Don't see any Ben Reid's on the Hawthorn list??)

Don't get me wrong, I love the way the Hawks play, but if all our "genuine" plans had have come off in the last 2-3 years we'd be a lot further advanced than we appear to be and supporters wouldn't be questioning quite so vehemently.

They made the prelim in 2011 and were unlucky not to roll us. In the end, even WITH their dip due to injuries they've jumped straight up and won 2 more flags. I understand our situation is unique in the handover situation, but that was 4 years ago now. It wouldn't be seen as so much of an issue if we didn't get progressively worse which each season Bucks has coached us.

In the end, we're starting to head down quite a derailed path.

We shouldn't be comparing ourselves to Carlton. That brings us down to a disgusting level we shouldn't be even thinking about.