Rumour Young players ask Gold Coast not to pick him in draft

[gcsunsfc]

Fair points you make that with Rugby League issues more families are choosing for their children to play footy and yes, this would create some new AFL fans. IMO this does not create enough new fans to base a new club on.

In the interest of remaining fair, I certainly didn't say 99% of Brisbane supporters are previous Fitzroy fans. You are being intentionally misleading. I call that dishonesty. You then broaden your false attribution and attempt to pin it on me as "my logic" and dribble on about Tasmania. Are you a politician or in Local Council by chance ?

If you would like to discuss GC Suns/Tasmania &/or AFL expansion, try being honest rather than devious.

Ha no politician

You said that on the GC (non traditional AFL state) that pre existing AFL fans who already have a team would not change their allegiance.
You also said that 99% of children who had parents that supported a pre existing team would follow that same team.
So the only reliable way to get fans is to bring new people to AFL which you suggest would not be sufficient numbers to base a club on.

Based on the above statements I don't understand how you believe Brisbane could have been a viable AFL proposition at time of inception .. but the Gold Coast is not.
Unless they brought a significant amount of Fitzroy fans across where do you suggest Brisbanes current membership numbers came from?
I mean the bears had <10,000 members for their first 10 years - I was one of them by the mid 90's
GC have had 11 - 13,000 members since inception despite despicable onfield performances. Following the trajectory of the Lions I believe this will rise with success.

I strongly disagree with your suggestion that local GC people with pre-existing teams wouldn't support the suns.
Our board (obviously a select population) is filled with people who had previous teams but are GCers through and through and have moved over to the Suns. As I mentioned, was a Brisbane member for 10+ years and still follow them closely but am a Gold Coaster at heart so when a team from my hometown was instituted - I found myself supporting them.

Report from this time last year showed now nearly 40,000 people involved in junior and grass roots level AFL on the GC and Northern NSW. Rates increasing by 25% annually.
15 new womens youth teams in 2017.
I don't know what a critical mass of new participants would determine sustainability but the above figures are certainly impressive.

In my opinion the Gold Coast certainly has the capability to support a local AFL team.
It is never going to be a 100,000 member Richmond type club - thats obviously unrealistic.
The goal of the AFL was to grow the game in an area of growing population. Whilst they have a lot more to do, they are achieving that currently.
I think with some success - which hopefully the club will begin to see over the next 5 years, the GC Suns can realistically expect ~18-20k members, to continue to bring in new supporters and to be a sustainable on and off field product.

So the population basis of the GC (~510,000 as per census 2011) and Brisbane 1.2 million in 1987 are different. So certainly there was bigger potential for new fans but I don't really see other than that how the current GC set-up is different to the original Bears set up.
I was too young to really know the climate at that time so perhaps there are other factors I'm to considering.

 

[Sprout]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-10-04/gold-coast-move-holds-no-fear-for-lukosius

"I think if I move away, I won't be 100 per cent ready for it. But I think I'll make the most of it and it would be good for my football."

That’s pretty blatant.

Short of saying, “I don’t want to go but if I have to I’ll be out the door in a couple of years anyway”, I don’t think he could have made the message any clearer.

 

[Ando727]

So 99% of Brisbane supporters are previous Fitzroy fans?

There are many new AFL fans which was the whole concept. Grow the game.

With rugby league issues more and more families are choosing for their children to play footy.

By this logic a Tasmanian team would have zero support as they aren’t introducing anyone to the game and people down there will already have teams they support.

Or, the more reasonable prediction would be that the parents changes the team they support, and the kids follow. Did that not occur to you?

I'm moving to Hobart in two weeks. I'll always support Melbourne, but if Tassie ever gets a team, I'll get a membership for them and they'll be my main team. I'll encourage my kid(s) to get onboard the local team so we can see them play regularly. It wouldn't make sense for me to do anything else. I'll follow both teams, and I'd kill to see a Melbourne flag, but it wouldn't make sense for me to be a member of MFC anymore if I'm in a different state with its own local team. I think you'd find that Tasmanians would be changing allegiances en masse if they got their own team. Not that I see this happening any time soon.

 

[gcsunsfc]

Or, the more reasonable prediction would be that the parents changes the team they support, and the kids follow. Did that not occur to you?

I'm moving to Hobart in two weeks. I'll always support Melbourne, but if Tassie ever gets a team, I'll get a membership for them and they'll be my main team. I'll encourage my kid(s) to get onboard the local team so we can see them play regularly. It wouldn't make sense for me to do anything else. I'll follow both teams, and I'd kill to see a Melbourne flag, but it wouldn't make sense for me to be a member of MFC anymore if I'm in a different state with its own local team. I think you'd find that Tasmanians would be changing allegiances en masse if they got their own team. Not that I see this happening any time soon.

Read the 4 post conversation between carnaroys08 and myself

What you have said is exactly my position. I fully agree with you.

Carnas original post said that Gold Coast would not be successful because

1. No Gold Coast local with an original team would change or additionally support Gold Coast.

In fact said that people who thought this could happen were delusional or on drugs

2. Only 1% if children would support a different team to their parents which I also think is completely incorrect.

It’s what I did with my team.
My dad a Collingwood supporter took me to the bears and then I continued to go as an adult as a lions fan whilst he supports Collingwood.

when Gold Coast came in - my hometown team. I started following them.

 

[Cleric]

Heating up where? Not mentioned anywhere.

Mentioned on trade radio a couple of times last week.

 

[SnusCG]

Mentioned on trade radio a couple of times last week.

Was also mentioned several time by Cal Twomey that it’s much more likely we take 2 SA kids than the King twins.

 

[masai]

St Kilda about to hit the Jack-pot if this is true.

How the hell are Gold Coast meant to get better if they have to put up with this bullshit? What a ****en baby, suck it up and do your best.

I’m from the old book of, go to team X, do 2 / 3 good years of your apprenticeship, then wander off to a “ pretty boy “ club.

In other words, go to where ever you are drafted, work your arse off and then at the end of your contract, reap the rewards of a good contract at your favoured club.

Positions on the AFL ladder, are like a merry go ground, they change regularly. Teams can be down and then pop up as premiership contenders.

Case in point, Nathan Buckley and that Brissie rabble. We all know what happened there.

 

[1970crow]

I'd be rating this rumour. Very much a case of being told in no uncertain terms that his career is on the line if he plays the Wingard game.

I'd say there's not much the AFL could do but no doubt they've been told to get a contradictory story out there quick smart. It's a terrible look for the AFL to have it reported that players are attempting to discourage clubs from drafting them.

 

[HairyO]

I'd say there's not much the AFL could do but no doubt they've been told to get a contradictory story out there quick smart. It's a terrible look for the AFL to have it reported that players are attempting to discourage clubs from drafting them.

I would think the penalty for draft tampering would be getting removed from the draft.

 

[DavyRed]

Sounds reasonable. I wonder if there is any footage of drafting gone wrong, I remember Simon Black shut himself in his wardrobe and cried, but it would be cool to see a live video one night of a draftee get picked by a club they don't want to go to, then turn red and start jumping around the room, flipping tables while shouting "Nope! No! No!"" then put their fingers in their ears and hold their breath

I have a hazy memory of footage showing Shannon Grant watching in front of the TV with his family when he was drafted by the Swans. The whole family, particularly his Dad, I think, absolutely spat the dummy when his name was called out. Apparently they’d specifically told the Swans not to draft him. They called the Swans every name under the sun if I remember rightly. Hilarious stuff!

 

[1970crow]

I would think the penalty for draft tampering would be getting removed from the draft.

Telling a club that you're a mummy's boy and don't see yourself enjoying being away from home isn't draft tampering. It's responding honestly to a question that recruiters are asking the draft nominees. Tampering would only come into play if one of the SA clubs encouraged him to answer a certain way to improve their chances of getting GC to trade one of their early picks. What you're choosing to believe is that a player can't answer a question posed to them. The player can simply refuse to go to the club anyway and sit out the year. Or they can choose to not nominate for the draft in that year. Would those actions also count as draft tampering to you? They effect the result of the draft more than telling a club you don't want to go there.

 

[Antares]

Telling a club that you're a mummy's boy and don't see yourself enjoying being away from home isn't draft tampering. It's responding honestly to a question that recruiters are asking the draft nominees. Tampering would only come into play if one of the SA clubs encouraged him to answer a certain way to improve their chances of getting GC to trade one of their early picks. What you're choosing to believe is that a player can't answer a question posed to them. The player can simply refuse to go to the club anyway and sit out the year. Or they can choose to not nominate for the draft in that year. Would those actions also count as draft tampering to you? They effect the result of the draft more than telling a club you don't want to go there.

If he goes and tells GC he has no interest in playing for them like the OP says, he should be banned from the draft. Whinge about it all you want, but if that was true, the AFL wouldn't stand for it.

He'll go to the Gold Coast.

 

[RUNVS]

Was also mentioned several time by Cal Twomey that it’s much more likely we take 2 SA kids than the King twins.

To me I see Gold Coast in a tough spot this year with picks 2 and 3

I mean look at Twomey's form guide

1. Walsh
2. Lukosius
3. Rankine
4. M.King
5. Smith
6. B.King
7. Rozee
8. Blakey

Now Walsh is out, as he is going to Carlton. Lukosius and Rankine are huge risks since there are strong rumours about them not wanting to leave South Australia. I would also discount the King twins because while both are promising selecting a 200cm+ player is too much of a risk for Gold Coast, as they need players who are almost certain to make it. Then you need to discount Blakey since he is going to the Swans.

That means the only players Gold Coast could possibly safely take with picks 2 and 3 are Smith and Rozee, neither of which are quite worthy of picks 2 and 3 this year based on Twomey's rankings.

 

[1990crow]

To me I see Gold Coast in a tough spot this year with picks 2 and 3

I mean look at Twomey's form guide

1. Walsh
2. Lukosius
3. Rankine
4. M.King
5. Smith
6. B.King
7. Rozee
8. Blakey

Now Walsh is out, as he is going to Carlton. Lukosius and Rankine are huge risks since there are strong rumours about them not wanting to leave South Australia. I would also discount the King twins because while both are promising selecting a 200cm+ player is too much of a risk for Gold Coast, as they need players who are almost certain to make it. Then you need to discount Blakey since he is going to the Swans.

That means the only players Gold Coast could possibly safely take with picks 2 and 3 are Smith and Rozee, neither of which are quite worthy of picks 2 and 3 this year based on Twomey's rankings.

Rozee and Smith are going to be jets IMO, doesn’t matter where they go.

 

[RUNVS]

Rozee and Smith are going to be jets IMO, doesn’t matter where they go.

Looking at the top 8 I really do think they are Gold Coast's only options. The King twins look very promising but so did Schache, Boyd, Patton, McCartin and Weitering. Gold Coast are not in the position to be taking risks. They need to be selecting players that are pretty close to certain bets.

 

[GreyCrow]

As much as people want to pontificate the King twins pose the same go home in 2 years issues that the Adelaide players

 

[1970crow]

If he goes and tells GC he has no interest in playing for them like the OP says, he should be banned from the draft. Whinge about it all you want, but if that was true, the AFL wouldn't stand for it.

He'll go to the Gold Coast.

No they wouldn't, they didn't ban Wingard and they won't ban him. Potential draftees are free to answer questions posed to them honestly. If they then refuse to go to the club they will sit out under the rules of the league. The most they can do is what they've done, which is get into the ear of his representation and tell them that they want a contradictory story out there because they're not happy with what's been reported. And I couldn't give a s**t either way, I take SFA interest in kids until they're drafted by the club and all I know of this kid is that he's from SA and will be going well before we get to pick. The AFL can't ban him, it's not draft tampering.

 

[Antares]

No they wouldn't, they didn't ban Wingard and they won't ban him. Potential draftees are free to answer questions posed to them honestly. If they then refuse to go to the club they will sit out under the rules of the league. The most they can do is what they've done, which is get into the ear of his representation and tell them that they want a contradictory story out there because they're not happy with what's been reported. And I couldn't give a s**t either way, I take SFA interest in kids until they're drafted by the club and all I know of this kid is that he's from SA and will be going well before we get to pick. The AFL can't ban him, it's not draft tampering.

Obviously you were too young to know about Brett Chalmers.

The AFL have discretion to block players from entering the draft, and if Lukosius is running his mouth off about having 0 interest in playing for GC, the AFL can and will make a statement, as much as that upsets you. Just because they don't always do it doesn't mean they can't, and with the Gold Coast in the position they are, the last thing they want to hear is promising players outright snubbing them in a national draft.

 

[MarkT2]

Obviously you were too young to know about Brett Chalmers.

The AFL have discretion to block players from entering the draft, and if Lukosius is running his mouth off about having 0 interest in playing for GC, the AFL can and will make a statement, as much as that upsets you. Just because they don't always do it doesn't mean they can't, and with the Gold Coast in the position they are, the last thing they want to hear is promising players outright snubbing them in a national draft.

The Chalmers issue was more about a specific club destination and their involvement. Saying you will leave after your contract us up is an entirely different matter and legally the AFL would not have a leg to stand on.

 

[Blue For Life]

I would do the same, the Gold Coast and Carlton are career killers where you have Sydney and Geelong developing later picked talent with ease.

Better than injecting our youth with steroids.

 

[Antares]

Sounds pretty happy to go to the Gold Coast to me.

 

[Aussie_boy]

What's the point of interviewing players if they're not allowed to say they'd rather stay home? Doesn't mean you can't still draft them.

 

[Beerfish]

Surely the kid can just say it in a round abouts sort of way
Eg:
GC-How do you think you'll go living out of home
JL-Terrible. Im very close to my family and would really struggle living away from home.

GC - Fantastic! You'll fit in beautifully!

 

[dave123]

I have no issue with a young draftee saying I dont want to go there ....it’s a football dead zone

Play infront of 12,000 fans in red and yellow

In the heat .......f..rk dat......

What’s the problem with a draftee ....saying no thanks ...

 

[Starburns_]

It's not draft tampering to say you don't want to go and will seek a trade out after your contract expires, that's just being open about your intentions. From there it's up to the club whether to take that on board or back themselves to change his mind over those 2 years.

Draft tampering would be if he threatened to not play if drafted, or if another club were involved in or was influencing the way he's dealing with the Suns.

Still, either way, if he's being deliberately confrontational with the Suns, good on them for at least making him and his manager sweat a bit by reporting it to the AFL.

Depends if its just Gold Coast he's said it to. If hes said the same to us, Saints, and Brissy for example there might be more to it. From memory Wingard only said it to GWS.

GWS had picks 1-5 that year and Port had 6, he didn't need to say it to anyone else.

Exactly right which is why all clubs should be welcome and inviting for the bottom age players.

If the image is so toxic the kids are worried their career is going to be DOA if they're drafted to GC there is a big problem and the AFL needs to launch a probe to fix it.

It's as much the managers (and the media ) playing the 'toxic' card. The culture is by no means great, but they're feeding the players the idea that it's irreparable.

said his brother's injury had opened up a place in attack for their representative sides, and he believed both could play in the same forward line together.

He admitted he had spent some time watching the draft order to see where picks would end up.

"It is hard not to think about who has which picks, but we're just trying to focus on what we're doing at the moment and see what happens," Ben said at Marvel Stadium on the opening day of this year's NAB AFL Draft Combine.

"I've started to get my head around [a move interstate] a little bit more, but I would rather stay in Melbourne with my family. But I'll go anywhere where I can play football."


The 18-year-old said it would be a dream to join the Saints.

"I'm a Saints supporter so it'd be great for me to end up there, but it's hard to tell at this stage so we'll see what happens," he said.

Saying "I'd like to stay in Melbourne, but I'll go anywhere to play football", likely in response to a question about how he'd feel about moving is not remotely the same as what has been alleged from Lukosius.