Prediction Your 2020 Best 22 (Post Trade Period)

[Jeremias]

...they’ve put Martin on bench. I think this is wrong. He needs to be named on the field first up. You don’t put an experienced recruit on good money on the bench for round 1. Maybe swap jack and Martin.

Given how quickly they rotate, I’m not sure it matters who is named on the bench.

We’re not in the 90s any more - players named on the bench generally find their way onto the field in the first minute or two.

 

[spry]

Plowman Jones Newman
Simpson Weitering SPS

Murphy Cripps Setterfield
Kreuzer Ed Walsh

Martin McGovern Cuningham
Betts Casboult Kennedy

IC: Jack | Newnes | Gibbons | Dow
EM: Williamson | Fisher

is my guess assuming Harry/Marchbank are unavailable

Amazing running power here! Gibbo and Newnes off the bench. What 4th quarter fade outs?

Secretly I like Kennedy out of the square, with gov, our now crafty smalls and cas as backup ruck. Less talent - better balance.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[JuddgementDay]

These teams with 8 on the bench should be made null & void

The hardest part of best 22, is the last 4 or so players - i.e. who to leave out, which is bloody difficult!

 

[JustaBattler]

Amazing running power here! Gibbo and Newnes off the bench. What 4th quarter fade outs?

Secretly I like Kennedy out of the square, with gov, our now crafty smalls and cas as backup ruck. Less talent - better balance.


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I forgot to include Docherty so SPS goes to bench and Gibbo drops out and maybe Fisher edges out Dow. As you say - Carlton will probably be a a genuine 4 quarter football side in 2020...I'm super excited about the next couple of years

I like Kennedy in forward line - hard to match up against - especially with Harry/Levi and McGovern running around - not to mention Cunningham Martin Betts...if he plays he would be good for 25 - 30 goals in the year ..

 

[CJMB]

Would we want both plow and Marchy against tigers with their small forward brigade

FF: Lynch 199
CHF: Riewoldt 193
3rd/resting ruck: Nankervis 199 / Soldo 204
Mid/medium: Caddy 186 / Martin 187 / Edwards 182
Small flank: Rioli 179
Small deeper: Higgins 177 / Castagna 181


They're not that small anymore. Since the 2017 flag team - which was small out of necessity rather than design - they've added 2 bloody big blokes to their structure: Lynch at FF and Soldo as a 2nd ruck.

 

[Jeremias]

If both are in our best side, they play, regardless of size.

Plowman and Marchbank are both in our best side and should therefore play every game, if fit.

Did we ever see Richmond drop one of Rance, Grimes or Astbury because they’re coming up against a smaller forward line?

 

[no. 4]

My Round 1 team (no Charlie Curnow)
Full Backs:
Plowman: steps up in games where we are under the pump. Top 3 in BnF says he is valued by the coaches.
Jones: not many key defenders in the league that can stop the elite full forwards. A big season could see him in All Australian contention.
Weitering: turned the corner last season. He could push for All Australian top 40.
Half Backs:
Petrevski-Seton: needs to become more consistent. His best is probably in the top 5 in the team but needs to impact games more often.
Marchbank: probably the most skillful defender but needs to get on the park more than the last few seasons.
Docherty: co-captain and will add footy smarts to the backline. Not expecting his All Australian form straight away though.
Centre:
Walsh: will get time in the centre but on the wing to start games will suit him for another season or two.
Cripps: co-captain and MVP. First picked.
Setterfield: seems to be having a big preseason. Showed promising signs in the last month of last season.
Half Forwards:
Martin: a big in. Will rotate between half forward and the wing.
McGovern: can dominate if he remains fit.
Cunningham: very classy when he is in form.
Full Forwards:
Betts: comes in to be a leader and a threat around goals.
McKay: needs to step up to a 50+ goal a season player now.
Casboult: his form late last season plus Charlie's injury enables him to play Round 1.
Rucks:
Kreuzer: simply the number one ruckman.
Murphy: getting on but plays his best when in the middle. Will spend time up forward.
E. Curnow: has the runs on the board. It's up to others to take the position in the middle from him.
Bench:
Fisher: needs to develop more consistency so that his best and worse isn't as great as it has been over the past couple of seasons.
Kennedy: big fan of his but needs to get on the park for a whole season to show his capabilities. In just ahead of Gibbons.
Dow: big year for him.
Simpson: an important leader.
An apology to Newman who I am a fan of but couldn't see him ahead of anyone in the back 6. Could push out Kennedy on the bench.

 

[Ald Gardiner]

I forgot to include Docherty so SPS goes to bench and Gibbo drops out and maybe Fisher edges out Dow. As you say - Carlton will probably be a a genuine 4 quarter football side in 2020...I'm super excited about the next couple of years

I like Kennedy in forward line - hard to match up against - especially with Harry/Levi and McGovern running around - not to mention Cunningham Martin Betts...if he plays he would be good for 25 - 30 goals in the year ..

If Harry doesn’t get up early in the season, I’d definitely like to see Matty K coming out of the goal square. He did play CHF as a junior IIRC and I was impressed with his forward savvy last year, he could be a revelation at FF

 

[JustaBattler]

If Harry doesn’t get up early in the season, I’d definitely like to Matty K coming out of the goal square. He did play CHF as a junior IIRC and was impressed with his forward savvy last year, he could be a revelation at FF

The trick with Kennedy will be to try and get him up against blokes of similar height - where I would back him to win the contested mark. The only knock I have on him is question marks about fitness and leg speed which will be answered come JLT. His straight kicking, smarts around the contest and ball winning capability have to be weighed up against how often his lack of speed might be a negative against faster defenders.

Makes him a good foil though - because he has to be 'looked after by defenders...I rate him higher than SOJ as a goal kicking forward- he has to be able to do his share of hard running though.

 

[Bamboo Harvester]

For what its worth, thats why Pitto becomes one of our most valuable recruits....if Krooz goes down again, he's our back up ruckman.

TDK then becomes our back up tall forward if big H doesn't come up, and we're looking for another tall option. Got a feeling he'll get game time this year, and also got a feeling he'll shine when he gets the chance.

 

[FRUMPY]

For what its worth, thats why Pitto becomes one of our most valuable recruits....if Krooz goes down again, he's our back up ruckman.

TDK then becomes our back up tall forward if big H doesn't come up, and we're looking for another tall option. Got a feeling he'll get game time this year, and also got a feeling he'll shine when he gets the chance.

If Casboult's form drops to a point he needs to be dropped, then i see TDK taking his role as forward who rucks a bit

 

[HaydossJ]

Settled on this side for round one, until the Marsh series starts.

B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering Simpson

C: Walsh Cripps Newnes

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: SPS Setterfield Gibbons 4th

Last on the interchange to be the best performer in the Marsh series from Dow, JSOS, and Kennedy. Would love to squeeze LOB and Williamson into the 22, but equally happy for them to build form and confidence in the VFL and place pressure on those playing similar roles at AFL level.

 

[Earls Smother]

Settled on this side for round one, until the Marsh series starts.

B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering Simpson

C: Walsh Cripps Newnes

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: SPS Setterfield Gibbons 4th

Last on the interchange to be the best performer in the Marsh series from Dow, JSOS, and Kennedy. Would love to squeeze LOB and Williamson into the 22, but equally happy for them to build form and confidence in the VFL and place pressure on those playing similar roles at AFL level.

Reckon that's about where it sits as of now. Marchbank would have to be in the mix for that last spot.
If Tiggers have Riewoldt, Lynch and resting ruck, we may need tall support. Also an in-game injury to a tall needs coverage.
The weather may actually decide that last spot.

 

[Stamos]

Settled on this side for round one, until the Marsh series starts.

B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering Simpson

C: Walsh Cripps Newnes

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: SPS Setterfield Gibbons 4th

Last on the interchange to be the best performer in the Marsh series from Dow, JSOS, and Kennedy. Would love to squeeze LOB and Williamson into the 22, but equally happy for them to build form and confidence in the VFL and place pressure on those playing similar roles at AFL level.

Fish not even competing for the last spot?

 

[HaydossJ]

Fish not even competing for the last spot?

Forgot Fisher RIP

 

[Accidental genius]

I think fisher is a wait and see. for someone of his talent he needs to do more imo.

 

[JuddgementDay]

It is increasingly obvious, and maybe we are better served with listing Best 22 vs RD1 22, as they can be quite different, e.g. injuries & experience influence the RD1

 

[HaydossJ]

Reckon that's about where it sits as of now. Marchbank would have to be in the mix for that last spot.
If Tiggers have Riewoldt, Lynch and resting ruck, we may need tall support. Also an in-game injury to a tall needs coverage.
The weather may actually decide that last spot.

Yep Marchbank definitely in consideration depending on matchups and his fitness.

 

[JustaBattler]

I think focusing on Richmond in round one is a very good 'noise remover' in conversation versus hypotheticals about future availability of theoretical best in a theoretical world.

TLDR?

I want to smash the tuggers and bring normality back to opening game result after too many years of brave losses and season ending injuries to Carlton players. Release the mongrel!

 

[Earls Smother]

Fish not even competing for the last spot?

Yeah he forgot, then I forgot to remember!
Fish obviously in the mix for that last posi. The only others I could see coming out of Haydoss' original 21 are Newman and/or Gibbons. Maybe Cuners if his preseason went downhill from here, but we don't want that happening as his speed is vital.

 

[HyphensBack]

I am basing my Best 22 purely on what I have read on BigFooty - it might lack a bit of credibility

2020 Best 22 is listed and Round 1 guys are listed in brackets:
Newman Jones Plowman
Docherty Weitering Williamson
Walsh Setterfield SPS
Martin C Curnow (Kennedy) Cuningham
McGovern McKay Betts

Kruezer Crippa Murphy

IC: Simpson E Curnow Gibbons Casboult

Emergencies:
Defense - went with mobility and skills
Marchbank - unlucky but with his injuries I just feel he may be beaten by others

Midfield - went with harder bodies
Dow - reckon at the moment Ed and Gibbo have the wood over him due to running tank but maybe he will surprise
O’Brien - SPS, Willo and Doc need to be in the team and that forces us to play a defensive winger
Pittonet - maybe
Forward
Fisher - might get the wing spot but like Willo at her ansd SPS sliding to wing

Magoos Best 22 team:
Poulson BenSOS Goddard
Stocker Marchbank Macreadie
Cottrell Newnes O'Brien
J Silvagni Kennedy Philps
Lang. TDK Owies

Pittonet Dow Fischer

IC: Kemp (M/F) Finbar O'Dwyer (?) Josh Honey (F/M) Fraser Phillips (F/M) Sam Ramsay(F?)

 

[Kreuz Control]

Ok here's my round One 22.


B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering Simpson

C: Walsh Cripps Setterfield

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: SPS, Newnes, Gibbons, SOS


Have been tossing up Fish v Newnes but think Newnes gets first crack in my 22 (at this very early stage)
I think having SOS in is important as he's a true utility that can play on each line, and I think having someone like that in the 22 is gold in case if injury.

Obviously a few are a little unlucky but, unfortunately, that's the way it's going to be going forward, it's impossible to fit them all in.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Ok here's my round One 22.


B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering Simpson

C: Walsh Cripps Setterfield

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: SPS, Newnes, Gibbons, SOS


Have been tossing up Fish v Newnes but think Newnes gets first crack in my 22 (at this very early stage)
I think having SOS in is important as he's a true utility that can play on each line, and I think having someone like that in the 22 is gold in case if injury.

Obviously a few are a little unlucky but, unfortunately, that's the way it's going to be going forward, it's impossible to fit them all in.

Very similar to my line of thought.

Though I'll add that giving Kennedy the nod over JSOS doesn't necessarily reduce our flexibility.

Mid goes down, Kennedy can play mid, or Cunners/Martin can play mid and Kennedy can fill the gap forward.

Ruck or KPD goes down, Casboult covers them and Kennedy plays as an undersized FF.

I'm really curious to see how Matty fits into things during the Marsh series. I still think he's lurking on the fringe, but it really wouldn't take much to rocket him into the starting lineup.

And maybe the VFL squad benefits from having someone like JSOS down there, directing the forward structures and spending some extra time on the ball? Think he's a potential future leader, and that might be a good place for him to be given more responsibility.

Also having a hard time splitting Fisher and Gibbons.



B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering SPS

C: Walsh Cripps Newnes

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: Simpson, Setterfield, Gibbons/Fisher, SOS/Kennedy


Definitely think it's going to end up being Simmo's last year, gut feel. Maybe if we crack the 8, he wants to go around again in case 2021 is the big one. Will be curious to see how his selection is handled later in the year though, particularly if his form drops off, or if others are knocking down the door.

 

[Kreuz Control]

Very similar to my line of thought.

Though I'll add that giving Kennedy the nod over JSOS doesn't necessarily reduce our flexibility.

Mid goes down, Kennedy can play mid, or Cunners/Martin can play mid and Kennedy can fill the gap forward.

Ruck or KPD goes down, Casboult covers them and Kennedy plays as an undersized FF.

I'm really curious to see how Matty fits into things during the Marsh series. I still think he's lurking on the fringe, but it really wouldn't take much to rocket him into the starting lineup.

And maybe the VFL squad benefits from having someone like JSOS down there, directing the forward structures and spending some extra time on the ball? Think he's a potential future leader, and that might be a good place for him to be given more responsibility.

Also having a hard time splitting Fisher and Gibbons.



B: Plowman Jones Newman

HB: Docherty Weitering SPS

C: Walsh Cripps Newnes

R: Kreuzer Murphy Curnow

HF: Cuningham McKay Martin

F: McGovern Casboult Betts

INT: Simpson, Setterfield, Gibbons/Fisher, SOS/Kennedy


Definitely think it's going to end up being Simmo's last year, gut feel. Maybe if we crack the 8, he wants to go around again in case 2021 is the big one. Will be curious to see how his selection is handled later in the year though, particularly if his form drops off, or if others are knocking down the door.

I had the same problem splitting the four same players as you, what a great position to be in. Another thing for me is the joy I have seeing Cas in the team, especially after his fantastic 2019. I know when Charlie comes back there is another tough decision to make (well maybe not) but love seeing the big lug get his chance to back it up.

 

[Matty411]

With all of the uncertainty and discussion around what will be our Best 22 come Round 1, perhaps we need to rethink and re-frame the discussion.

Rather than a Consensus 22... perhaps we need to separate our list into 3 groups.

1. Consensus Best 18 players - based on CJMB and his outstanding 2020 Consensus thread, we can safely put the following players into this bracket.

a. Backs - Lachie Plowman, Liam Jones, Sam Docherty, Jacob Weitering
b. Forwards - Mitch McGovern, Harry McKay*, Jack Martin, Eddie Betts
c. Midfielders - Sam Walsh, Patrick Cripps, Will Setterfield, Matthew Kreuzer, Ed Curnow, Marc Murphy

This gives us 14 safe players who are as much of a lock for round 1 as any AFL player right now. I will disclaim this saying that its an assumption based on group think, past best 22 spots and 2019 form. I believe Martin was brought in to play seniors and seems to be impressing on the track. Setters may be at the base of this group, but 97% of us gave him a start in our midfield and I was one of those. With a full preseason, he'll shine in 2020.

2. In the conversation - based on highly-rated and well-performing preseason players, these are the guys who'll be in the conversation based on Teague's recent comment i.e. “We’ve probably got 28-30 guys where if we to play tomorrow and they were in our team, we’d be pretty excited.”

I've broken into to 2 x sub-categories of 'probables' vs 'possibles' in true preseason style.

a. Probables - Kade Simpson, Sam Petrevski-Seton, Levi Casboult, Caleb Marchbank*, Nic Newman, David Cuningham, Zac Fisher
b. Possibles - Jack Silvagni, Matthew Kennedy, Jack Newnes, Michael Gibbons, Tom Williamson, Paddy Dow, Lochie O'Brien, Liam Stocker, Darcy Lang

I'm personally pretty comfortable with the 7 guys listed in my 'probables' list, which would take us to 21 players. But I know we can all make a case (strongly for some) for at least 2 of the 'possibles' - particularly up forward. Only concern if this were used to pick best 22 is that the 'probables' list is very back-heavy so it'll be interesting to see how Amos and Teague set us up at the start of the year. Hence the definition of 'probables'.

This list takes us up to 30 players, which is right on the money when it comes to Teague's comment. If the Round 1 side and emergencies are made up of these 30 players, few of us will be unhappy or surprised.

3. Developing, injured or not up to speed - these are the guys who round out the list and - for various reasons - won't be playing Round 1, with my take on the rationale.

• Charlie Curnow (already ruled out due to injury)
• Brodie Kemp (LTI)
• Tom De Koning (behind Kreuz, Cas and Harry for a spot)
• Marc Pittonet (behind Kreuz in pecking order)
• Harrison Macreadie (not ready, still in/out of recovery group)
• Cameron Polson (not up to speed, being trialled down back)
• Sam Ramsay (could surprise and would be my pick as a bolter from this crop)
• Sam Philp (not ready, still green)
• Josh Honey (developing and could play games in 2020 but not R1)
• Ben Silvagni (not ready)
• Finbar O'Dwyer (still a way off)
• Fraser Phillips (not ready, still green)
• Matthew Owies (showing nice signs but not ready)
• Hugh Goddard (behind a few others in pecking order)
• Matthew Cottrell (developing and could play games in 2020 but not R1)

Thoughts, Bluebaggers?

*I'm assuming Harry is fit and plays Round 1, with Charlie and Kemp the only guys ruled out at this stage.
*Marchy is still building back to full fitness and may not start the year in seniors, but is squarely in our best mix