Your all time aussie test squad (of 18)

[cricketnut14]

Batting lineup (top 6 with test average over 50) since 1970, bowlers with over 300 test wickets...

Hayden
Hussey
Labusagne
Ponting
G Chappell
Smith
Gilchrist
Johnson
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

not sure how marnus can sneak in ahead of border or s.waugh at this stage of his career.

 

[Monjike]

not sure how marnus can sneak in ahead of border or s.waugh at this stage of his career.

He is a number 3 and has a better average but I know what you mean...

 

[cricketnut14]

He is a number 3 and has a better average but I know what you mean...

i reckon there's a bloke called Ponting that may be able to handle the #3 position though

 

[Monjike]

i reckon there's a bloke called Ponting that may be able to handle the #3 position though

Point taken. Incidentally after 18 tests Marnus has an average of over 60 and 1888 runs, Waugh had 673 runs at 29 after 18 tests.

 

[cricketnut14]

Point taken. Incidentally after 18 tests Marnus has an average of over 60 and 1888 runs, Waugh had 673 runs at 29 after 18 tests.

then why isn't voges in your side as well ?

so longevity was only part of your criteria for the bowlers ?

end of the day it's your squad, i was just throwing it out there.

 

[Monjike]

then why isn't voges in your side as well ?

so longevity was only part of your criteria for the bowlers ?

end of the day it's your squad, i was just throwing it out there.

They had to be under 35 on debut...

 

[BGman]

Point taken. Incidentally after 18 tests Marnus has an average of over 60 and 1888 runs, Waugh had 673 runs at 29 after 18 tests.

Yes. Tuggar was Test cricket's slowest starter. But look at his career end. After '89 Ashes he was a juggernaut. Has to be in our best ever 18.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

Point taken. Incidentally after 18 tests Marnus has an average of over 60 and 1888 runs, Waugh had 673 runs at 29 after 18 tests.

S Waugh was originally picked as a "plug the gaps" no-rounder and didn't even start to become a true batsman until 1988/89 with the 90s against the West Indies. (Bowling fell away from an average of around 30 to around 40 in the years not long after that.)
Its not really an equivalent comparison, IMO. And then there's the longevity, Lab may well be a long term player. But that's not proven yet.

 

[Gough]

S Waugh was originally picked as a "plug the gaps" no-rounder and didn't even start to become a true batsman until 1988/89 with the 90s against the West Indies. (Bowling fell away from an average of around 30 to around 40 in the years not long after that.)
Its not really an equivalent comparison, IMO. And then there's the longevity, Lab may well be a long term player. But that's not proven yet.

I always got the impression he was initially selected as a project player with his talent being evident but nobody was quite sure what to do with him. That there was such a dearth of talent in the mid 80s meant he probably got his call up a little earlier than otherwise too.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

I always got the impression he was initially selected as a project player with his talent being evident but nobody was quite sure what to do with him. That there was such a dearth of talent in the mid 80s meant he probably got his call up a little earlier than otherwise too.

Yeah, there was definitely a bit of that. And his ODI form kept in him in the Test team at times when perhaps he would not have survived. There was much less of a selection split between the two formats in those days.

 

[Monjike]

Yeah, there was definitely a bit of that. And his ODI form kept in him in the Test team at times when perhaps he would not have survived. There was much less of a selection split between the two formats in those days.

Ok, Steve Waugh gets in...as the concussion sub!

 

[Mikevk123]

1. Langer
2. Hayden
3. Ponting
4. Smith
5. Clarke
6. Hussey
7. Gilchrist
8. Warne
9. Johnson
10. Cummins
11. McGrath

12. Martyn
13. Katich
14. Lee
15. Harris
16. Watson
17. Lyon
18. Haddin

 

[JackFlash]

M.Hayden
J Langer
R.Ponting (C)
S.Smith
G.Chappell
A.Border
A.Gilchrist
S.Warne
D.Lillee
J Thomson
G.McGrath

D. Walters
S. Waugh
D. Boon
R. Marsh
M. Johnson
P. Cummins
N. Lyon

Players i have seen ..

 

[Bletch]

Gonna give two squads, one all-time, the other just what I've seen (since mid-70s or so). I'm going to leave out current players, as I think it's fair to wait and see after their career is done.

Genuine all-time squad:

Openers	Middle-Order	Wicket-Keepers	Quicks	Spinners
M. Hayden	D. Bradman	A. Gilchrist	D. Lillee	S. Warne
R. Simpson	G. Chappell	I. Healy	K. Miller	B. O'Reilly
W. Ponsford	R. Ponting		F. Spofforth	H. Trumble
	A. Border		A. Davidson
	S. Waugh		G. McGrath

Used the "x-factor" slot on a 3rd spinner here. Most of the rest picked themselves. Hardest to leave out was Clarrie Grimmett, but would have to push out Warne or O'Reilly. If including current players, Smith and Cummins would be worth consideration. It's a very flexible squad, and likely with Miller at 7 and Gilly at 8, it's going to be a hard batting line-up to dismiss. Border/Waugh/Chappell/Simpson all offer part-time bowling flexibility. Or leave out a specialist and play an extra bowler. Confident this would be more than a match for any other country's squad.


Since 1972:

Openers	Middle-Order	Wicket-Keepers	Quicks	Spinners
M. Hayden	R. Ponting	A. Gilchrist	D. Lillee	S. Warne
J. Langer	G. Chappell	I. Healy	G. McGrath	S. MacGill
I. Redpath	S. Waugh		B. Reid
	A. Border		R. Harris
	M. Hussey		J. Thomson
	X-Factor: M. Waugh

Hayden and Langer clear stand-outs for the opening slot. Went for Redpath (averaged 53 as an opener) over the likes of Katich, Taylor and Slater. Partly because he provides a right-hand option. Obviously Warner would be a candidate if I'd not ruled him out, purely on his record, but still not sure I'd pick a 3rd leftie. Middle-order five were very easy to pick, as were the keepers. Only Smith would get a run if current players were included. Lillee and McGrath clear stand-outs for the quicks, but gets more difficult after that. Likes of Johnston, Alderman, Gillespie, Reiffel, McDermott, Hughes, Lee, Hogg, Walker could all lay a claim to a spot. But I went with a pair of glass cannons in Reid and Harris, who were both outstanding when they were fit. And then Thommo to scare the bejeezus out of the opposition. Warne and MacGill the clear options for spinners. If I were to include current players, Cummins would be a certainty, and Lyon, Starc and Hazelwood all a chance.

Finally, picking an X-Factor player was a little trickier here. Could do what I did in the previous squad and add an offie - would be May or Mallett. But this squad doesn't have a genuine all-rounder, where the other squad had Miller. Really, none of the candidates for an all-rounder belong in this squad imho (likes of Watson, O'Donnell, Gilmour... it's a stretch! Oh, for another Keith Miller!!) So instead, I added a batting x-factor, and went with Mark Waugh. Could easily have been Michael Clarke, Ian Chappell, Damien Martyn or Andrew Symonds to fill this role.

 

[cricketnut14]

Since 1972:

Openers	Middle-Order	Wicket-Keepers	Quicks	Spinners
M. Hayden	R. Ponting	A. Gilchrist	D. Lillee	S. Warne
J. Langer	G. Chappell	I. Healy	G. McGrath	S. MacGill
I. Redpath	S. Waugh		B. Reid
	A. Border		R. Harris
	M. Hussey		J. Thomson
	X-Factor: M. Waugh

great all time squad and would be hard to beat.

the above side from 1972 - another great squad.

i think if we are picking an XI from then until now (with current players excluded), then 9 spots take care of themselves

M.Hayden
xxxxxxxx
R.Ponting
G.Chappell
A.Border
S.Waugh
A.Gilchrist
S.Warne
xxxxxxx
D.Lillee
G.McGrath

its an opening position and the 3rd quick which could throw a blanket over a number of candidates.

 

[cricketnut14]

Genuine all-time squad:

Openers	Middle-Order	Wicket-Keepers	Quicks	Spinners
M. Hayden	D. Bradman	A. Gilchrist	D. Lillee	S. Warne
R. Simpson	G. Chappell	I. Healy	K. Miller	B. O'Reilly
W. Ponsford	R. Ponting		F. Spofforth	H. Trumble
	A. Border		A. Davidson
	S. Waugh		G. McGrath

would've loved to seen your list of all time players who you didn't see.

 

[Bletch]

would've loved to seen your list of all time players who you didn't see.

Sure, why not

Pre 1972:

Openers	Middle-Order	Wicket-Keepers	Quicks	Spinners
R. Simpson	D. Bradman	WAS. Oldfield	K. Miller	B. O'Reilly
W. Ponsford	V. Trumper	ATW. Grout	R. Lindwall	H. Trumble
W. Lawry	AL. Hassett		A. Davidson	C. Grimmett
	RN. Harvey		C. Turner
	S. McCabe		F. Spofforth

Opening pair were pretty clear picks, and for the third opener I've picked Lawry over Woodfull to provide a left-handed option. Morris also in the discussion.

Not too many issues picking the middle-order 5. I've left out Dougie Walters, who could have been picked just on his pre-72 form, but given it's really about "who I didn't see" then he misses out. Sure, I saw Simpson when he made his comeback, and I've picked him, but his comeback wasn't as an opener, so well, my rules Norm O'Neill, Bob Cowper, Charlie Macartney worth consideration too.

Keepers were far more difficult to decide. Effectively comes down to 7 players that spanned the period from the start of test cricket in 1877 till 1966. Blackham, Kelly, Carter, Oldfield, Tallon, Langley and Grout. Towards the end of that period and up until my cutoff at 1972, there were also the likes of Jarman, Taber and a young Rod Marsh. No-one else in that 95 year period played 10 or more matches. Not one century amongst keepers over that period, and none that averaged over 25 with the bat (playing more than 5 matches - not counting Marsh). In the end I've plumped for Bert Oldfield, possibly the best batsman of the group of seven, and perhaps the best up to the stumps; and Wally Grout, who racked up nearly twice the amount of dismissals as any other candidate, and perhaps the best all-round keeper of the lot. But it's a hard one to judge.

Pretty happy with the selection of the quicks, don't really feel there's anyone unlucky to miss out on a spot here. On reflection, perhaps I should have considered Charlie Turner for a spot in my "all-time" list. His record is impeccable, albeit on uncovered pitches.

Again I've gone for three spinners (using up the x-factor slot). Grimmett was unlucky to miss the all-time list, and earns his spot here.

If I was to leave out a spinner and look for a pure X-factor player, perhaps Jack Ryder would earn a spot. He averaged over 50 with the bat, and was a handy bowler. By all accounts if WWI hadn't come along at the wrong time, he may well have played test cricket as a bowler. Perhaps second to only Miller as an all-rounder.

 

[Bletch]

great all time squad and would be hard to beat.

the above side from 1972 - another great squad.

i think if we are picking an XI from then until now (with current players excluded), then 9 spots take care of themselves

M.Hayden
xxxxxxxx
R.Ponting
G.Chappell
A.Border
S.Waugh
A.Gilchrist
S.Warne
xxxxxxx
D.Lillee
G.McGrath

its an opening position and the 3rd quick which could throw a blanket over a number of candidates.

Agreed. I'd prob go with Langer and Bruce Reid to round out the 11, but by no means set on it.

 

[juss]

Would be very interested to compare the test team to the All time ODI and T20I teams to see which players excelled across all/one format.

 

[the_interloper]

Hayden
Ponsford
Bradman
Smith
Ponting
Miller
Gilchrist
Warne
Johnson
Lillee
McGrath

Chappelli
Border
Waugh S
O'Reilly
Lindwall
Healy
Benaud

There ya go, I didn't look at anyone else's lists either. The third seamer was interesting, I wasn't sure who to go for, happy with Johnson though.

I reckon Lyon is stiff to miss, he might play for a while yet though so he'd be hard to leave out of a squad soon I'd say.

 

[eth-dog]

Would be very interested to compare the test team to the All time ODI and T20I teams to see which players excelled across all/one format.

Post 2000 ODI 15:

Gilchrist (+)
Hayden
Ponting
Clarke
Symonds
Hussey
Watson
Lee
Warne
Bracken
McGrath

Smith
Warner
Hogg
Starc

 

[cricketnut14]

Agreed. I'd prob go with Langer and Bruce Reid to round out the 11, but by no means set on it.

Warner & Cummins may well be on track to fill those 2 spots once they are done and dusted.

Smith will probaby edge out one of Border/S.Waugh too.

 

[Bob Neil]

From my lifetime of watching cricket…
3 openers
Hayden
Slater
Boon
5 middle order bats
Ponting
Chappell (Greg)
Smith
Border
Clarke
2 wicket keepers
Gilchrist
Healy
2 spinners
Warne
Lyon
5 quicks
Lillee
McGrath
Cummins
Johnson
Gillespie
1 player of your own choice/wildcard
Hussey

 

[Seedsfan]

Warner & Cummins may well be on track to fill those 2 spots once they are done and dusted.

Smith will probaby edge out one of Border/S.Waugh too.

Cummins yes Warner no way

 

[Kyptastic]

Post 2000 ODI 15:

Gilchrist (+)
Hayden
Ponting
Clarke
Symonds
Hussey
Watson
Lee
Warne
Bracken
McGrath

Smith
Warner
Hogg
Starc

Pretty much the 07 World Cup side that starting XI.

Does Warne deserve to be in front of Hogg on a purely post 2000 basis? Hoggy has a better average and strike rate post 2000, whilst is only 0.1 behind on economy.