Your Best 22 After The Trade Period

[_Mike_]

You'd rather me predict the future ?

Had you have said that we didnt win the grand final in reliance of all of our key position players, although both Roughead and T Boyd were very effective on the day then I would agree.

what you are doing is predicting that our KPP composition next year will be poor. Which is basically predicting the future.

 

[Trav 20]

Had you have said that we didnt win the grand final in reliance of all of our key position players, although both Roughead and T Boyd were very effective on the day then I would agree.

what you are doing is predicting that our KPP composition next year will be poor. Which is basically predicting the future.

Are you reading what I wrote, or trying to interpret what I wrote.

The spine listed was poor and I articulated why. I didn't go any further than give an opinion on one spine that was put before me.

Roughead and Boyd were instrumental in the Grand Final win, but that is a very separate argument to a spine that was listed for a round 1, 2017 team.

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

SAINTS 2017
Dempster. NBrown. Geary.
Savage. . Carlisle. Roberton
Billings. . Acres. Reiwoldt
Weller. Bruce. K.Stevens
Gresham McCartin. Membrey

Hickey. J.Steven. S.Ross

Montagna Dunstan Newnes Steele

 

[aussierulesrules]

SAINTS 2017
Dempster. NBrown. Geary.
Savage. . Carlisle. Roberton
Billings. . Acres. Reiwoldt
Weller. Bruce. K.Stevens
Gresham McCartin. Membrey

Hickey. J.Steven. S.Ross

Montagna Dunstan Newnes Steele

I'm pretty confident that Armitage will get a game!

 

[_Mike_]

Christ that is a good team.

Dunkley and Clay Smith walk into every other team in the comp.

Poor spine.

But yes, they won a flag as an outnumber at the contest side.

Where is it poor?

Adams
Murphy
Boyd
Cloke
Roughead

This was the spine.

Implies from your previous post that we won a flag with that spine

You have a very good team and may have an adequate spine, but the spine of Adams, Murphy, Boyd and Cloke is rubbish.

to then go on to say the above.


Basically, our KPP setup is far from the best going around however you steered the discussion on team composition to focus on KPP's. Our team structure doesnt solely rely on KPP's and our midfield and backline depth more than makes up for inadequacies on KPP stock,

 

[Trav 20]

Implies from your previous post that we won a flag with that spine



to then go on to say the above.


Basically, our KPP setup is far from the best going around however you steered the discussion on team composition to focus on KPP's. Our team structure doesnt solely rely on KPP's and our midfield and backline depth more than makes up for inadequacies on KPP stock,

You're selectively quoting. I was at pains to point out that I was commenting on the spine in the specific post. You know, the one with Cloke. I don't see a medallion around his neck.

Clearly, I was referencing a post for a round 1, 2017 team.

The "yes, but they won a flag"... comment was in case anyone wanted to infer they couldn't win another flag with that spine. In other words the inference was they're not overly reliant on a spine.

Note: The poster I responded to said "Christ that is a good team." The spine didn't and still doesn't look good to me.

The "this was the spine" comment was addressing the quoted post and possible team for round one nest year and not the Grand Final team sans Cloke (obvious I would have thought).

I even go on to note in that second post:

Now, you may have other players to go into the spine and the spine may not appear as was suggested in the particular team that was quoted. I merely commented on the team layout that was referenced.

My comments had nothing to do with the GF side. Why would they in a thread about round 1, 2017 with Cloke in it ?

 

[_Mike_]

My comments had nothing to do with the GF side. Why would they in a thread about round 1, 2017 with Cloke in it ?

Would have been simpler to leave it out of the discussion in the first place to avoid crossed wires

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

I'm pretty confident that Armitage will get a game!

Saints 2017 has fantastic depth now

Emgergency Team
Gilbert Goddard. Webster
DMacKenzie, BWhite. BRice
Eli Templeton NOK. Minchington
NWright. TLee NFreeman
JSinclair JHolmes. LPierce

BLonger, Armitage, Lonie

Im sure Armitage will be in team.
IMO thats the best balanced team we have. Id rather kstevens height, seb ross, Dunstan and Steele. But yes he could be ahead of any of those four. Probably is. Anyway great problem to have. We have no more excuses. Finals or its a failure.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Luke Hodge on the bench?????

 

[aussierulesrules]

Saints 2017 has fantastic depth now

Emgergency Team
Gilbert Goddard. Webster
DMacKenzie, BWhite. BRice
Eli Templeton NOK. Minchington
NWright. TLee NFreeman
JSinclair JHolmes. LPierce

BLonger, Armitage, Lonie

Im sure Armitage will be in team.
IMO thats the best balanced team we have. Id rather kstevens height, seb ross, Dunstan and Steele. But yes he could be ahead of any of those four. Probably is. Anyway great problem to have. We have no more excuses. Finals or its a failure.

Some of them may be ahead of him if he plays like he did this year again, but according to the club review of his season the other day, he went into this year off practically no preseason, so I'd be expecting him to return to much closer to his best if he has a relatively full preseason this time around and stays relatively injury free.

 

[Trav 20]

Would have been simpler to leave it out of the discussion in the first place to avoid crossed wires

How were the wires crossed ?

It's as though you read 10 things, one of which could be interpreted the way you did and the other 9 clearly about the post I was responding to.

I recommend taking things on face value.

Especially as you would have read my response to another Bulldog's fan, which also made things clear.

Even one you quoted you cherry picked and left out comments that made it clear I was talking about a team cited as being a great round 1, 2017 team.

Your comments border on the disingenuous.

 

[Blues90]

Harry McKay = If he is in the 22, Phillips goes out. Needs more time still.
Ciaran Byrne = Absolutely.
Liam Sumner = Possibly, but no certainty.
Dale Thomas = Recent performances don't say so.
David Cuningham = If it was to replace someone like Graham, Boekhorst or Buckley, then it wouldn't hurt. But he needs more time.
Blaine Boekhorst = Nah!
Kristian Jaksch = Far from it.

Casboult and Rowe have to play. They are our only available players in the positions they play.
Wright is almost a near lock for us.
Buckley and Armfield in 22 would depend on how the new players affect the team structure, but their chances are fairly good given deficiencies down forward.
As for Graham, well he can play but he isn't meeting standards according to supporters. So Cuningham for him wouldn't hurt us.

Cuningham is a definite was our best pressure point player after just three games

 

[Blues90]

Not taking the piss but will Palmer actually be best 22 for the blues?

He is but graham is not neither is buckley

 

[kangaspurs]

Who the f%#$ is Vickers-Willis

Haha fair question.

He's a mid size/3rd tall type defender who was good in the VFL this year - in his second year on the list after suffering a season ending shoulder injury mid way through his first - and who most believe should have made his AFL debut. We need someone to fill that role after Firrito's retirement and he's the most natural replacement. Had some really good games in a VFL side that struggled a bit, with his best performance, as I understand it, probably coming against Footscray when he completely shut Stringer out of the game after he had been dropped.

 

[ChrisRyanSaints]

Some of them may be ahead of him if he plays like he did this year again, but according to the club review of his season the other day, he went into this year off practically no preseason, so I'd be expecting him to return to much closer to his best if he has a relatively full preseason this time around and stays relatively injury free.

I actually like the team the afl site chose.
Maybe ive gone early with acres billings and gresham taking the responsibility for midfield. In any event VERY EXCITED

Dempster. NBrown. Geary.
Savage. . Carlisle. Roberton
Newnes. . Ross. Reiwoldt
Weller. Bruce. Billings
Gresham McCartin. Membrey

Hickey. Armitage. JSteven.

Montagna Dunstan Acres Steele

 

[Mitchell54]

Ryan Burton will be best 22 at Hawks from Round 1 onwards provided he is fit. He's a star in the making.

Yeah. He makes the team. I realised i put in Mitchell twice!! I was craving seeing the headline Mitchell madness next year with Sammy and Tommy smashing it up side-by-side!!
Burton replaces the Mitchell which is on the bench

 

[jdz101]

I love it how posters quote the media and suggest a "spine" is actually relevant position-wise in modern football other than looking up players on a team sheet.

 

[Trav 20]

I love it how posters quote the media and suggest a "spine" is actually relevant position-wise in modern football other than looking up players on a team sheet.

Spine, key position players, it all means the same. I'm surprised that needed explaining.

There's no doubt the Dogs reshaped history to a certain extent with a dearth of quality key position players. Dogs play an outnumber at the contest brand with unrelenting pressure that served them well.

But a couple of things...

The Dogs won in a year with no standout footy team/s, which is very unusual.

And there's no guarantee that recipe works again.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I actually like the team the afl site chose.
Maybe ive gone early with acres billings and gresham taking the responsibility for midfield. In any event VERY EXCITED

Dempster. NBrown. Geary.
Savage. . Carlisle. Roberton
Newnes. . Ross. Reiwoldt
Weller. Bruce. Billings
Gresham McCartin. Membrey

Hickey. Armitage. JSteven.

Montagna Dunstan Acres Steele

Yep, it is exciting indeed, there were some who have been best 22 for us for the last couple of years who I expect will probably be better with another preseason under their belts next year that I wasn't able to squeeze into my 22 for next year and another few more who would have walked into our team a couple of years ago, who also missed out.

Will be nice to have more than just the 4 go through the centre square for a change, too and to have some actual quality height in defence for the first time since about 2011!

Will be interesting to see what changes those additions allow us to make the gameplan, too. Hearing that we'll press higher up the ground, for one.

 

[jdz101]

Spine, key position players, it all means the same. I'm surprised that needed explaining.

There's no doubt the Dogs reshaped history to a certain extent with a dearth of quality key position players. Dogs play an outnumber at the contest brand with unrelenting pressure that served them well.

But a couple of things...

The Dogs won in a year with no standout footy team/s, which is very unusual.

And there's no guarantee that recipe works again.

What recipe? Consistently beating your opponent in the contest, spreading well from said contest, and then exploiting mismatches in your forward line caused by multi-talented footballers that can both play forward and midfield?

I'd say that's a fairly timeless recipe to win football games.

West coast probably have your vision of an ideal spine, and yet got comprehensively shat on by that recipe at home in a final. Same with geelong who went in with a very tall, key position oriented football team with their prelim, and got blown off the park.

It might be time to rethink your formula for football being played in 2017 and beyond.

The dogs would have been a standout football team during the year if they had a full compliment of players to choose from but they were decimated by injury. Once 85% of those pieces returned to play together in the finals, the rest is history.

The 2017 list is the best and deepest list the Bulldogs have put together in the 19 years I've followed them.

St kilda have also made great improvements to theirs by the looks.

Collingwood will be the most interesting team in 2017 as they haven't really got a discernible depth of structure but there is reasonable talent there. Could go one of two ways. No middle ground.

 

[_Mike_]

Your comments border on the disingenuous.

Perhaps, more so to the point that a team doesn't have to have a great spine to be successful although your analysis of "poor" spine in reflection is your opinion. I'll reserve the judgement of average in contrast.

As I responded to another poster, we don't play set positions and rotate through changing players so our list is less reliant on having a set number of KPP's to fulfill a role

 

[aussierulesrules]

St kilda have also made great improvements to theirs by the looks.

Our depth is certainly starting to look the best it has in I'd say a good 10 years (it was very good in the Grant Thomas years) and WAY better than it was during the Ross Lyon years. Just need to add some real creme to the top and next year ought to be a big chance to do that, with a huge amount of cap space available and at least 3 first rounders as trade currency, to get anyone we want across the line if they nominate us. Or to use in what's being talked up as a strong draft.

 

[Trav 20]

What recipe? Consistently beating your opponent in the contest, spreading well from said contest, and then exploiting mismatches in your forward line caused by multi-talented footballers that can both play forward and midfield?

I'd say that's a fairly timeless recipe to win football games.

West coast probably have your vision of an ideal spine, and yet got comprehensively shat on by that recipe at home in a final. Same with geelong who went in with a very tall, key position oriented football team with their prelim, and got blown off the park.

It might be time to rethink your formula for football being played in 2017 and beyond.

The dogs would have been a standout football team during the year if they had a full compliment of players to choose from but they were decimated by injury. Once 85% of those pieces returned to play together in the finals, the rest is history.

The 2017 list is the best and deepest list the Bulldogs have put together in the 19 years I've followed them.

St kilda have also made great improvements to theirs by the looks.

Collingwood will be the most interesting team in 2017 as they haven't really got a discernible depth of structure but there is reasonable talent there. Could go one of two ways. No middle ground.

The outnumber, high pressure and fast spread is time honoured and will always serve finals teams well.

Having mediocre talls won't, hence the recipe comment.

I'm not sure a full complement of players would have made you a heap better, but we'll never know. It seems the game-plan is very role based and players become almost (I did say almost) interchangeable.

My formula doesn't need changing. It's very much based on the way the Dogs play their footy, but with better talls. Afterall, if Stevie J plays the GWS wins and you lament not having better talls. If your Mother was your Uncle and all that I know.

The mediocre talls didn't cost you a flag in a very unusual year with no real standout/s.

I'm hardly making outlandish claims.

 

[old55]

Spine, key position players, it all means the same. I'm surprised that needed explaining.

There's no doubt the Dogs reshaped history to a certain extent with a dearth of quality key position players. Dogs play an outnumber at the contest brand with unrelenting pressure that served them well.

But a couple of things...

The Dogs won in a year with no standout footy team/s, which is very unusual.

And there's no guarantee that recipe works again.

Tremendous credit to the Dogs - they thoroughly deserved to win a hard fought flag. They won it on the back of fanatical attack at the contest built on the back of McCartney and then perfected by Beveridge who is an absolute genius man manager. I agree with Trav20 that the Dogs took full advantage of a year when there was no stand-out team - I think Ross Lyon would have a couple of flags if the quality of the opposition fell another way. They are very hard to win at any time.

Like the Lyon style, the Dogs' game plan is high attrition and it's very hard to maintain from a physical point of view and a motivation point of view - players have to be at 100% commitment to the contest 100% of the time. It will be fascinating to see what happens in 2017 and beyond.

 

[parsons nose]

Here's mine(including Roughy):
B: Stratton Brand Gibson
HB: Burgoyne Frawley Birchall
C: Hartung Mitchell Smith
HF: Poupolo Roughead Rioli
F: Bruest Gunston Vickery
Foll: McEvoy JOM Hodge
Int: Duryea T.Mitchell Shiels Whitecross

emg: Fitzpatrick Howe Burton

Unlucky: Lovell, Sicily, Pick 88(this guys a pretty solid player, i can feel it), Hardwick, Stewart, Litherland

Sis is best 22. His return last season was good for someone playing their first full season. And his deficiencies are easily rectified.