Your best team - who misses out

fronkalicious

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Apr 10, 2008
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We’ve had 9 games, 2 retirements and another Morris knee injury. Nearing the half way mark of the season, I’m keen to know what everyone’s best team looks like. And more importantly, who misses out.

Here’s mine:

FB: Wood Trengove Crozier
HB: JJ. Cordy. Williams
C: Hunter Macrae Richards
HF: Mclean Schache Wallis
FF: Greene Naughton Cavarra
R: English Bonti Libba
IC: dunkley, Daniel, smith, suckling

Who misses out?
Lloyd
Gowers
Lipinski
Dale
Duryea
Jong
Hayes
Dickson

Some things I like:

2 Rucks - convinced we would have beaten Collingwood had we played 2. Trengove was awesome in defence against Richmond. He was awful last year back, but between him playing some ruck, defence and bench, and English rotating ruck, forward and bench, I think it works.

2 key forwards - granted Schache isn’t a traditional CHF, and he has toughness issues, we’ve played our best footy over the last 2 years with him at CHF.

1 genuine small forward - I don’t know how good cavarra is, but I know having a quality, goal-kicking small forward is essential in 2019. He’s the only one we have.

1 genuine medium - I like Lloyd and think he’s been good for us. I’m happy to have him in the side. But I think greene is a better lead, mark, goal type, and that’s what we need desperately.

Gowers, hayes, young, Roberts........nah. Come on beveridge. Seriously.

I like dale and lipinski for their class, but prefer legit forwards (greene and cavarra) over mid/forwards.

So what line up do you want to see??
 

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Dogforever

Rookie
Oct 26, 2018
24
34
Lorne Vic
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Western Bulldogs
B: Crozier Trengove Cordy
HB: Wood Lew Young Johannisen
C: Hunter Dunkley Suckling
HF: Wallis Bontempelli McLean
F: Greene Naughton B.Smith
Foll: English Macrae Liberatore
I/C: Daniel Richards Williams Lloyd

Left out: Gowers Jong
Lipinski Hayes
Schache Dickson
Dale Lach Young
Duryea

Morris to be included when fit.

Points: Cordy not tall enough for KPD
Bontempelli given a free pass to venture anywhere he wants.
Lipinski, Lach Young, Dale Schache and West all close to selection depending on VFL form.
 

_M_16_

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Nov 26, 2009
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We’ve had 9 games, 2 retirements and another Morris knee injury. Nearing the half way mark of the season, I’m keen to know what everyone’s best team looks like. And more importantly, who misses out.

Here’s mine:

FB: Wood Trengove Crozier
HB: JJ. Cordy. Williams
C: Hunter Macrae Richards
HF: Mclean Schache Wallis
FF: Greene Naughton Cavarra
R: English Bonti Libba
IC: dunkley, Daniel, smith, suckling

Who misses out?
Lloyd
Gowers
Lipinski
Dale
Duryea
Jong
Hayes
Dickson

Some things I like:

2 Rucks - convinced we would have beaten Collingwood had we played 2. Trengove was awesome in defence against Richmond. He was awful last year back, but between him playing some ruck, defence and bench, and English rotating ruck, forward and bench, I think it works.

2 key forwards - granted Schache isn’t a traditional CHF, and he has toughness issues, we’ve played our best footy over the last 2 years with him at CHF.

1 genuine small forward - I don’t know how good cavarra is, but I know having a quality, goal-kicking small forward is essential in 2019. He’s the only one we have.

1 genuine medium - I like Lloyd and think he’s been good for us. I’m happy to have him in the side. But I think greene is a better lead, mark, goal type, and that’s what we need desperately.

Gowers, hayes, young, Roberts........nah. Come on beveridge. Seriously.

I like dale and lipinski for their class, but prefer legit forwards (greene and cavarra) over mid/forwards.

So what line up do you want to see??
I like this team, but I'd swap Cavarra for Dale. Cav isn't proven at AFL level at all. Dale has some x factor and there is already two smalls in that line up, he will give us a second medium capable of marking.
 

Mantis Toboggan

All Australian
Mar 24, 2018
667
1,269
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
We’ve had 9 games, 2 retirements and another Morris knee injury. Nearing the half way mark of the season, I’m keen to know what everyone’s best team looks like. And more importantly, who misses out.

Here’s mine:

FB: Wood Trengove Crozier
HB: JJ. Cordy. Williams
C: Hunter Macrae Richards
HF: Mclean Schache Wallis
FF: Greene Naughton Cavarra
R: English Bonti Libba
IC: dunkley, Daniel, smith, suckling

Who misses out?
Lloyd
Gowers
Lipinski
Dale
Duryea
Jong
Hayes
Dickson

Some things I like:

2 Rucks - convinced we would have beaten Collingwood had we played 2. Trengove was awesome in defence against Richmond. He was awful last year back, but between him playing some ruck, defence and bench, and English rotating ruck, forward and bench, I think it works.

2 key forwards - granted Schache isn’t a traditional CHF, and he has toughness issues, we’ve played our best footy over the last 2 years with him at CHF.

1 genuine small forward - I don’t know how good cavarra is, but I know having a quality, goal-kicking small forward is essential in 2019. He’s the only one we have.

1 genuine medium - I like Lloyd and think he’s been good for us. I’m happy to have him in the side. But I think greene is a better lead, mark, goal type, and that’s what we need desperately.

Gowers, hayes, young, Roberts........nah. Come on beveridge. Seriously.

I like dale and lipinski for their class, but prefer legit forwards (greene and cavarra) over mid/forwards.

So what line up do you want to see??
I don’t understand how you can have Cavarra and Greene in your ‘best team’? One of them has shown some promising glimpses, the other has never played a game at AFL level. I’d much rather take Lloyd or Dale at the moment. At least they have shown they can cut it.

I’m not one for these fantasy team discussions. There are too many variables. Does a proven player miss out due to poor form? Does an untried player get in because of potential?

Cavarra gets the nod because he has a blank slate. Yet both Young’s are penalised because they were good enough to get a game and showed how tough it can be for a first year player.
 

Dogsman16

Norm Smith Medallist
Oct 19, 2012
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FB: Wood, Le Young, Crozier
HB: Daniel, Cordy, Suckling
C: JJ, Macrae, Hunter
HF: McLean, Naughton, Bontempelli
FF: Dale, English, Lloyd
R: Trengrove, Dunkley, Libba
Int: Smith, Wallis, Williams, richards
 

dogwatch

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I think I need to see a bit more before I can make some calls on certain players. What I’d pick right now could change significantly over the next month, even the next 10 days.

Greene - I really rated him last year but he’s barely played a competitive game this year. Will he continue to improve (as he needs to) or will he stagnate or regress like Lynch and maybe Williams seem to have done?

Lipinski - tearing it up in the twos but can he reproduce that form in the seniors? The next couple of weeks should tell us a lot about that.

Williams - looked like he’d be 200 gamer toward the end of 2018 but seems to have lost his way (or at least fallen out of favour) this year. Recent VFL form has been good so like Lipinski let’s see if he can bring that to the seniors. It’s still unclear to me whether he should be developed as a midfielder or a defender.

Dale - injury ruined much of his 2018 season but his form was so-so before that. He was better in 2017 IIRC. Has looked very good in recent VFL games. I’d want to see him show that in the seniors before I’m fully on board. Needs to be kicking goals and providing assists IMO.

Cavarra - claimed by some as the answer to our small forward problem (crumbing goals, tackles, defensive work) nearly his whole season has been ruined by injury. Looks like he’ll only get about 7-8 games in starting at VFL level, so that’ll make it hard to press claims for a senior game. We might have to wait until 2020 to know whether he’ll make it.

West - not in our thinking so far but if he follows the usual first year trajectory he could be right in calculations in 4-6 weeks time.

Webb - I don’t think he’ll make it long term but would like to give him the chance after recovering from his serious neck injury. His early season VFL form has been good but he has never been convincing at AFL level.

Vandermeer - a Smokey who is starting to show some form in the VFL. Has pace to burn and I think he is reported to have good disposal (?) Two attributes we are crying out for.

Others in the frame - Dickson (looks gone to me but won’t write him off just yet), R Smith (re-made as a small forward?), Lachie Young (shows promise, needs to re-find form).
 

Next Waiting

Premiership Player
Jan 19, 2014
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I don’t understand how you can have Cavarra and Greene in your ‘best team’? One of them has shown some promising glimpses, the other has never played a game at AFL level. I’d much rather take Lloyd or Dale at the moment. At least they have shown they can cut it.

I’m not one for these fantasy team discussions. There are too many variables. Does a proven player miss out due to poor form? Does an untried player get in because of potential?

Cavarra gets the nod because he has a blank slate. Yet both Young’s are penalised because they were good enough to get a game and showed how tough it can be for a first year player.
I agree. Take a player like Jongy for example. He can't be picked at the moment because he has no exposed form and no match fitness. Realistically he's not in selection contention till after the bye.

But project forward to September and let's say we make it. Will be match fit, have exposed form and probably in contention. MC will be looking for hard nosed players who will absolutely fight to the death, risk personal injury for the team and selflessly play a role if given one. That is finals. Jongy, and players like him, will always be in the mix. But in May....
 

dogwatch

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I agree. Take a player like Jongy for example. He can't be picked at the moment because he has no exposed form and no match fitness. Realistically he's not in selection contention till after the bye.

But project forward to September and let's say we make it. Will be match fit, have exposed form and probably in contention. MC will be looking for hard nosed players who will absolutely fight to the death, risk personal injury for the team and selflessly play a role if given one. That is finals. Jongy, and players like him, will always be in the mix. But in May....
Good point about Jong. Should have added him to my list. Always fringe, but always a chance at his best.
 

Mattdougie

Brownlow Medallist
Jun 29, 2013
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Someone please explain to me what they see in Williams?
 

Next Waiting

Premiership Player
Jan 19, 2014
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Good point about Jong. Should have added him to my list. Always fringe, but always a chance at his best.
If we make finals, and it's a big if no doubt, but let's say..... we'll have a few selection headaches if we're spared our usual injury crisis. We will probably be a bit thin in the KP stocks...but we were last time as well.
 

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Yojimbo

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 14, 2012
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Someone please explain to me what they see in Williams?
Great size, very good in the air, can run and carry and gain metres. No where near his sweet spot in terms
of games played (Around 34). Can kick a goal and over distance and his best football is ahead of him.

Wait until he gets to 70 games MD, not many are stars from day one mate.

Pick 48: Bailey Williams (34)
2018: Ben Jarvis (0)
2017: Oskar Baker (1)
2016: Darcy Cameron (1)
2015: Bailey Williams (34)
2014: Matthew Goodyear (2) Gone
2013: GWS (pass)
2012: Dean Kent (72) Melb/Stk
2011: Jordan Murdoch (117) Geel/GC (GF Sprint Winner)
2010: Alex Browne (11) Gone
2009: Jesse Crichton (18) Gone
2008: Nicholas Heyne (3) Gone
 
Last edited:

fronkalicious

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 10, 2008
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Cavarra and Greene in your best 22 :think:

I want some of whatever you're smoking
I have no idea if Cavarra is a legit AFL small forward. I know 2 things though:

1. You absolutely need one in 2019 AFL footy.

2. I know for sure Dale, Lipinski, gowers, dunkley etc arent. And I’m entirely sick of playing midfielders as forwards.

Same mentality with Greene. He leads, marks and kicks goals. Is he a long term solution? No idea. But again, I’ll take him over the hybrid mid/forwards that haven’t worked for us.
 

fronkalicious

Brownlow Medallist
Apr 10, 2008
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sydney
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I don’t understand how you can have Cavarra and Greene in your ‘best team’? One of them has shown some promising glimpses, the other has never played a game at AFL level. I’d much rather take Lloyd or Dale at the moment. At least they have shown they can cut it.

I’m not one for these fantasy team discussions. There are too many variables. Does a proven player miss out due to poor form? Does an untried player get in because of potential?

Cavarra gets the nod because he has a blank slate. Yet both Young’s are penalised because they were good enough to get a game and showed how tough it can be for a first year player.
No, both Young’s miss out because I have players better than them in the positions they play. Kinda simple.
 

Mattdougie

Brownlow Medallist
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Quick. Can break a tackle. Excellent kick. Looks disturbingly like my younger brother.

I’m hoping that in a few hours you’ll be well on board with him.
Excellent kick?

So I’m watching the wrong bloke turn it over time and time again am I?

I simply don’t get it, he isn’t bad but nowhere near the wraps some have on him

If we could get a 2nd rounder for him from Adelaide it would be daylight robbery
 

Mantis Toboggan

All Australian
Mar 24, 2018
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Excellent kick?

So I’m watching the wrong bloke turn it over time and time again am I?

I simply don’t get it, he isn’t bad but nowhere near the wraps some have on him

If we could get a 2nd rounder for him from Adelaide it would be daylight robbery
Agree to disagree then. I’ll be sick if we trade him.
 

BRWB

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Oct 7, 2012
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I have no idea if Cavarra is a legit AFL small forward. I know 2 things though:

1. You absolutely need one in 2019 AFL footy.

2. I know for sure Dale, Lipinski, gowers, dunkley etc arent. And I’m entirely sick of playing midfielders as forwards.

Same mentality with Greene. He leads, marks and kicks goals. Is he a long term solution? No idea. But again, I’ll take him over the hybrid mid/forwards that haven’t worked for us.
If Cavarra and Greene were fit I'd be playing them as well. Greene is just about our most natural fwd only behind the cooked Dickson and Cavarra is our only quick sm fwd. List gaps aren't only the keys. Taryn Thomas on our list would be a thing of beauty.
 

dogwatch

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Ok I said I want more time on a whole bunch of players but in response to the OP and acknowledging some “known unknowns” here’s my best 22 after Round 10. I’m leaving Duryea, Cavarra and Morris out of consideration due to injury.

Defence
Wood Cordy JJ
Daniel Naughton Crozier

Midfield
Hunter Bont Macrae
English Dunkley Libba

Forwards
Lloyd Trengove BSmith
Wallis Gowers LewisYoung

Bench: Suckling, McLean, Lipinski, Williams

Close but need to find better form:
Schache
Dale
Lachie Young
Hayes
Dickson
Richards

Returning from injury - might get there soon:
Greene
Jong

Aspiring, maybe not far off:
West
Vandermeer

Aspiring but a fair way off:
Sweet
Khamis

Break glass in case of emergency:
Roberts
Webb
Lynch
Porter
RSmith

It’s far from an ideal team but we have far from an ideal list many of whom are in far from ideal form.

Some key considerations in the chosen 22:
1. Naughton is more value to us and his own career playing in defence.
2. There are 5 talls if you include Cordy. Not something you’d expect to see in a Beveridge team but I’m sick of seeing us with no aerial presence, being out marked, outrucked and having no viable target when we have to kick long. In fact I’d have 6 talls if we had a touch more quality. Can’t be any worse than what we saw against Norf.
3. Gowers is back but as a third forward target with any two of Trengove/ Young/ English (whoever isn’t taking their turn in the ruck).
4. The side lacks pace but that’s just a reflection of the list. The fastest players not picked are out of form (Richards, Dale, Hayes, Lynch) just finding form after injury (Jong) or yet to prove themselves (Vandermeer). So be it - sow’s ears can’t become silk purses.
5. I was tempted to put Dickson in but I think he’s in terminal decline and it’s best to play the kids with our season all but shot.
 

hoianbulldog

Premiership Player
Mar 2, 2006
4,642
4,763
Hoi An, Vietnam. I am off the grid.
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
We’ve had 9 games, 2 retirements and another Morris knee injury. Nearing the half way mark of the season, I’m keen to know what everyone’s best team looks like. And more importantly, who misses out.

Here’s mine:

FB: Wood Trengove Crozier
HB: JJ. Cordy. Williams
C: Hunter Macrae Richards
HF: Mclean Schache Wallis
FF: Greene Naughton Cavarra
R: English Bonti Libba
IC: dunkley, Daniel, smith, suckling

Who misses out?
Lloyd
Gowers
Lipinski
Dale
Duryea
Jong
Hayes
Dickson

Some things I like:

2 Rucks - convinced we would have beaten Collingwood had we played 2. Trengove was awesome in defence against Richmond. He was awful last year back, but between him playing some ruck, defence and bench, and English rotating ruck, forward and bench, I think it works.

2 key forwards - granted Schache isn’t a traditional CHF, and he has toughness issues, we’ve played our best footy over the last 2 years with him at CHF.

1 genuine small forward - I don’t know how good cavarra is, but I know having a quality, goal-kicking small forward is essential in 2019. He’s the only one we have.

1 genuine medium - I like Lloyd and think he’s been good for us. I’m happy to have him in the side. But I think greene is a better lead, mark, goal type, and that’s what we need desperately.

Gowers, hayes, young, Roberts........nah. Come on beveridge. Seriously.

I like dale and lipinski for their class, but prefer legit forwards (greene and cavarra) over mid/forwards.

So what line up do you want to see??
Smith on the bench an lloyd out.

Greene and Cavarra starting?

Interesting take on where we are at.
 

Yojimbo

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 14, 2012
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I don't have a best team at the moment, the balance and experience demographic is way out and
no for the negative people it is not any bodies fault, it is just a result of a lot of factors that could
and equally could not be controlled. If you are sitting in the proverbial barbed wire canoe you may
as well paddle furiously up s**t creek, but the balance between gifting games to players and
rewarding form is a difficult one. If you are sitting on a deck chair on the titanic it does not matter
if you have the special comfy cushion when the boat sinks.
 

hoianbulldog

Premiership Player
Mar 2, 2006
4,642
4,763
Hoi An, Vietnam. I am off the grid.
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I don't have a best team at the moment, the balance and experience demographic is way out and
no for the negative people it is not any bodies fault, it is just a result of a lot of factors that could
and equally could not be controlled. If you are sitting in the proverbial barbed wire canoe you may
as well paddle furiously up s**t creek, but the balance between gifting games to players and
rewarding form is a difficult one. If you are sitting on a deck chair on the titanic it does not matter
if you have the special comfy cushion when the boat sinks.
Deep stuff.
 

DelRe

Club Legend
Jan 29, 2017
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Having Cavarra - a player who has never played a senior game - in a best 22 is illogical. It’s really just saying I hope he turns out to be a good player. What happens if he plays and turns out to be below expectations, you then just re-write the best 22 again?
 

Optimistic Dog

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FB: Wood, Le Young, Crozier
HB: Daniel, Cordy, Suckling
C: JJ, Macrae, Hunter
HF: McLean, Naughton, Bontempelli
FF: Dale, English, Lloyd
R: Trengrove, Dunkley, Libba
Int: Smith, Wallis, Williams, richards


You could debate a few positions but lets say this our best team. To highlight how far we are away lets compare this to the pies who I think have the best list and see how many dogs would be in their best team.

Midfield including ruck and wing. Only the Bont and Macrae next best Hunter but would not make it
Forwards None I think all the pies are better
Defence Crozier Maybe Caleb and JJ would be close and Naughton if he payed in his correct position.


So I would only give 3 of our players a game in the pies best 18 and maybe another 1 or 2 on the bench.

We need to get a lot right in trades and drafts in the next few seasons to get back to the top.
 
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