Zorko is now our best player

[Toffee Lion]

Has Rockliff's year really been as bad as people are saying? It seems as though if he isnt clear best on ground for us he played a bad game. He has had three, 3 vote games and should poll in at least 2 more. His only real poor games have been against Essendon, Sydney and WCE. What happenned to all the heros wondering what was wrong with Redden earlier in the year after multiple poor games? He has bounced back and no doubt Rockliff will.

The issue I find with Rocky this year is he starts the game slower, Probably because Voss starts him in the forward line.

 

[policegetthatman2]

If you think this is about who has had the best career then you've misunderstood the thread.

No worries. I agree that Zorko has been our best since the second week of his debut. If he didn't have injury set backs at the start of the year and subsequently played every game of the year, I would have no issues if he won the best and fairest.

 

[possum8]

I would rate him in the top 5. His pressure acts, tackling and the fact he wants to win the ball outweighs his average kicking. If he can improve his kicking over the preseason he will be probably our 1st or 2nd best. Rich i believe is our best but only because his kicking is so lethal.

 

[Dom PC]

Calling somebody a fool is a personal attack and is often taken personally.

Im sorry and I don't not want anyone taking this personally... but being called a fool in the context I said should not be taken personally. Thats just being melodramatic and ridiculous on a public forum. If Kerry OT wants to be all oversensitive then I take personal offense to the passive agressive response I recieved. Anyways, if it helps Kerry move on with his/her life then I'm am sorry for any "personal" offense taken from my "fool" comment.

 

[Haso]

Im sorry and I don't not want anyone taking this personally... but being called a fool in the context I said should not be taken personally. Thats just being melodramatic and ridiculous on a public forum. If Kerry OT wants to be all oversensitive then I take personal offense to the passive agressive response I recieved. Anyways, if it helps Kerry move on with his/her life then I'm am sorry for any "personal" offense taken from my "fool" comment.

Yeah fair enough, appreciate your argument. Best practice in future though would be to play the ball more and the man less.

 

[Lionheart Penno]

Biggest test for the Zorkonaut will be next season in IMO. Much more attention from the opposition in their matchup meetings no doubt and this can only help the progresson of our 3 R`s with less tagging coming their way. Mind you he will hopefully have a full pre season this time without the hip issue providing more time to squeeze out any technical issues with his kicking. This will lead to a smart player with an even greater fitness base leading to possibly more time in the middle. Cant wait for his improvement but certainly not our 'Best' player right now. Happy to go with any of our R's on that front.

 

[pauldrc]

Only behind Redden ($446,000) at $440,500 and just ahead of Rocky at $440,200 in DT also.

This could easily be our top 3 in the B & F, with perhaps Merrett, Rich and Hudson thereabouts as well....

 

[acuguy]

Stocka- you have got to be kidding!!!! Marc Murphy, what drugs are you on. Rocky hasn't got the pace or line breaking ability of a Murphy.

Someone said before that opposition coaches have worked Rocky out. I agree, he is an easy player to tag because he doesn't have an elite in and under game ala Black, Kennedy or Mitchell and he doesn't have the leg speed to break tags ala Murphy.

He isn't a clone of Ling physically, but Ling had a lot of limitations athletically but also had a hell of a lot of football sense. He turned himself into a running machine who could lock down on the best onballer but hurt them with his goal kicking and ability to win the pill. I think this is where Rocky will have the greatest impact for our midfield going forward into the future.

 

[PTizzle]

I think Rocky has plenty of footy sense and he has had some elite calibre games. The test for him is consistency.

I've been pretty happy with his year. He has had a few down games but has also played the best games of his career this season imo.

For such a young player to have a game like he did against the Dogs is pretty special.

 

[MSB ROYS]

He has the best name for sure!

 

[Lace Out]

More than you could ever expect.

Hopefully being a mature ager will preclude second year blues.

 

[Stocka]

Stocka- you have got to be kidding!!!! Marc Murphy, what drugs are you on. Rocky hasn't got the pace or line breaking ability of a Murphy.

No need for the histrionics, Nino. I was comparing Rockliff to Murphy (and Dal Santo) on the basis of consistency of performance and a propensity to go missing or be tagged out of games, not styles of play. Keep up with the pace, old son!

Mind you, I'd have to disagree that Rockliff isn't a line-breaker. I think he's shown a reasonable capacity in this aspect of the game without necessarily being someone who could be consisdered an elite.

Someone said before that opposition coaches have worked Rocky out.

Ah, you'll find that was me...

Might be easier if you just nod and agree and occasionally post a reply consisting of "+1" to any of my comments in future, to save this sort of confusion, Nino!

 

[Stocka]

Has Rockliff's year really been as bad as people are saying? It seems as though if he isnt clear best on ground for us he played a bad game. He has had three, 3 vote games and should poll in at least 2 more. His only real poor games have been against Essendon, Sydney and WCE.

Rockliff's season has been down on what he produced last year, which I suppose is a bit disappointing, given that it could have been expected that he might have continued to take his game to yet another level.

I haven't heard/read anyone say that his season has been "bad", but rather that it has been of a lesser standard than what people feel he is capable of producing.

Although he hasn't necessarily had too many "bad" games, there have also been a number of games in which he's made his stats look better in the second half or final quarter of games, after having had less of an impact early. This has been a bit frustrating for me as a supporter, given that it is pretty clear that Rockliff can have a massive influence on games when he is up and about early, such as the game against Western Bulldogs.

Although Rockliff doesn't write the articles, part of me has wondered at times if some of the positive press about him might have affected how he's gone this year, given that I seem to recall him putting in a few below average games soon after having positive articles written about him. This could be an entire coincidence, though.

What happenned to all the heros wondering what was wrong with Redden earlier in the year after multiple poor games? He has bounced back and no doubt Rockliff will.

If a player puts in a month or so of football below their own standards, then it's likely that supporters will have a few questions as to what is going on. Nothing wrong with that, in my opinion.

 

[POBT]

I've been disappointed in both Redden and Rockliff. Neither seems to be a better footballer than last year. At their age, I expected some more improvement but I think they have stagnated to an extent. They are both good footballers but I reckon there would be at least 25 better midfielders in the comp.

In fact, let me list them in no particular order: Watson, Ablett, Swan, Pendlebury, Beams, Bartel, Selwood, Thompson, Dangerfield, Priddis, Kerr, Shuey, Fyfe, Kennedy, Jack, Judd, Murphy, Mitchell, Boyd, Dal Santo, Hayes, Cotchin, Deledio, Swallow, Rich.

And I've left out another 15-20 for whom you could at least mount a sensible argument are better than our boys- eg the likes of Zaharakis and Sidebottom.

That's not to say that Rocky and Redden have been poor or that they aren't entitled to a year of consolidation or that they are being held back by the fact that they don't get a lot of support from their teammates. My only point is that, after elevating themselves to the rank of "very good" over the past two seasons, they have not taken the step in 2012 that the likes of Dangerfield, Jack, Rich, Cotchin, Shuey, Kennedy have.

 

[Hollow Knight]

That's not to say that Rocky and Redden have been poor or that they aren't entitled to a year of consolidation or that they are being held back by the fact that they don't get a lot of support from their teammates. My only point is that, after elevating themselves to the rank of "very good" over the past two seasons, they have not taken the step in 2012 that the likes of Dangerfield, Jack, Rich, Cotchin, Shuey, Kennedy have.

Dangerfield and Cotchin were drafted in 2007, Kennedy in 2006 and Jack in 2005.

Rocky and Redden were both drafted in 2008 (albeit Rocky as a top ager, and Redden a bottom ager) so I think it's fair to give them another year before we start worrying about their development path. I remember saying at the start of the year that Redden and Rocky's super 2011 seasons were ahead of what you'd expect from second year players and that they'd be forgiven for consolidating in 2012.

 

[POBT]

Dangerfield and Cotchin were drafted in 2007, Kennedy in 2006 and Jack in 2005.

Rocky and Redden were both drafted in 2008 (albeit Rocky as a top ager, and Redden a bottom ager) so I think it's fair to give them another year before we start worrying about their development path. I remember saying at the start of the year that Redden and Rocky's super 2011 seasons were ahead of what you'd expect from second year players and that they'd be forgiven for consolidating in 2012.

I'm not worried. But I think it is reasonable to have expected incremental improvement from them, given their age and the games under their belts. I don't see them as having produced anything more than they did last year. That's a little disappointing - you'd like to see players improve year by year. Their improvement doesn't have to be linear, of course, but I am just making the point that, I expected them to be at least a little better than last year and they probably aren't.