The 2014 Attendance Thread
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It seems likely. Certainly the clubs involved believe so
This will come across as a stupid and naïve question so I apologise in advance but didn't want to start a new thread.
Whether it be on here, radio or television, I often hear people saying that Victorian club v non-Victorian club's attendance was low because of the very fact the game is against an "interstate" club, which puzzles me to a certain extent not least because of the readiness with which it is accepted. If Hawthorn (just picked them as they're premiers) are playing at home to Fremantle or Port Adelaide, who are outstanding sides, surely the supporters should be flocking in to see a clash between two top teams and that we should not come to expect a significantly reduced crowd compared to e.g. Hawthorn v Carlton. I understand the old VFL rivalries are still strong but next year is 25 years since the national competition was inaugurated (if you take 1990 as the cut off, others may choose 1987 or 1982), shouldn't the excuse of an interstate team no longer lead to diminished crowds?
Whether it be on here, radio or television, I often hear people saying that Victorian club v non-Victorian club's attendance was low because of the very fact the game is against an "interstate" club, which puzzles me to a certain extent not least because of the readiness with which it is accepted. If Hawthorn (just picked them as they're premiers) are playing at home to Fremantle or Port Adelaide, who are outstanding sides, surely the supporters should be flocking in to see a clash between two top teams and that we should not come to expect a significantly reduced crowd compared to e.g. Hawthorn v Carlton. I understand the old VFL rivalries are still strong but next year is 25 years since the national competition was inaugurated (if you take 1990 as the cut off, others may choose 1987 or 1982), shouldn't the excuse of an interstate team no longer lead to diminished crowds?
DardySingh360
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It's mainly due to the opposition fans going to the game, you might get 10-15k Carlton fans go to an away game against Hawthorn yet only 1-2k Freo or Port fans.
Hawks got 43k against Freo in round 3 this year.
I'm sure for Hawks fans if the opposition is a good side it won't worry them as to whether they go or not.
Thanks for the reply. It's just that the impression I get is that Victorian based fans seem to place the games against non-Victorian sides on a lower plane when the "national competition" mentality should see to it that the strength of the team is the major factor. Not a criticism because I think the crowds you get for AFL are incredible (and deserved) and will be even bigger next year once the ticketing arrangements are fixed.
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You need to think of it as Victorian clubs having 7 or 8 "derbies" or "showdowns". Attendances are lower outside Victoria for games against interstate sides as well.
DardySingh360
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The location of the opposition has far less influence on crowd numbers outside of Victoria than in Melbourne though.
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Victorian supporters really couldnt give a crap about interstate sides though, whereas for teams outside of Victoria EVERY team is from interstate, bar one. Ive said this before, what killed Fitzroy and what is killing teams like North, the Bulldogs, and Melbourne now isnt poor management, its the number of games they are fixtured against low drawing interstate sides at the expense of return bouts against the bigger Victorian clubs.
I guarantee you that no Victorian club is out there requesting games against interstate sides at home when they put in fixture requests.
Hawthorn effectively is because they request as few away trips as possible because of their Tassie home games. If they're not playing interstate teams away then they're obviously going to play them at home.
But if you have a look at crowd figures, it wouldn't appear that any given group of fans show up in big numbers only when they're playing a Victorian club. It's just that there are a lot fewer opposition supporters.
In recent years our games against non Victorian games have been amongst our higher drawing home games (GWS and Gold Coast notwithstanding):
2014
Hawks v Swans - 72,764 (#1 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v Dockers - 43,583 (#4 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v GWS - 17,908 (#7 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v Swans (Buddy factor) outdrew Hawks v Cats (72,275), Hawks v Pies (70,460) while Hawks v Dockers outdrew Hawks v Demons (37,088) and Hawks v Saints (32,924)
2013
Hawks v Swans - 54,725 (#4 of 7 Melbourne games)
Hawks v Eagles - 32,567 (#6 of 7 Melbourne games)
Hawks v GC - 28,112 (#7 of 7 Melbourne games)
Hawks v Swans outdrew Hawks v North (42,108), the only games larger than Hawks v Swans was Hawks v Cats (76,300), Hawks v Pies (71,533) and Hawks v Tigers (64,537)
2012
Hawks v Eagles - 50,023 (#3 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v Lions - 35,492 (#4 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v Crows - 33,527 (#5 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v GWS - 26,518 (#6 of 7 MCG games)
Hawks v Suns - 23,098 (#7 of 7 MCG games)
The only reason why these games were the 5 lowest drawing games was due to the Hawks only playing home games against Collingwood (78,466) and Geelong (65,287)
The point is, if the game is of a high standard fans will turnup regardless of the opponent. Its just you don't get a 20k, 30k or 40k bump against the low drawing non Victorian club as you do against a Carlton (for example)
Of course the Hawks might be different from the rest as we've arguably got more rivalries against non Victorian clubs (having played 3 successive GF's - and 4 overall - against non Victorian clubs)
If a game is of a high standard, Victoriam fans won't discriminate by opponent (unless the traditional rivalry is strong, for example Hawks v Cats, Blues v Pies, Blues v Tigers etc.)
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I completely understand that this will help attendances in the long run, But if you want to go to the footy you will go, I’m a uni student who traveled from Bendigo to every Richmond Home game a d a few away, i live off $150 a week and still managed to make this work because I wanted to go to the footy. if you want to go, you will go
Fair enough, but not everyone shares the same passion as I gather you do. I think costs would have deterred a lot of people who would go to the footy occasionally, say 2-3 times a year and also home and away members from going to away games because of the ridiculous upgrade fees they would have to pay to ensure a seat. I think there comes a point where a lot of people say, "Enough is enough, I'll watch it on TV".
Yet they also dont want to travel excessively....
manicmagpie
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A pedantic point about a good post but is the difference between "attractive football" and "defence laden" really as small < 8 points a game?
Geelong - For: 2518 Against 1702
C'wood - For: 2349 Against 1658
Ned_Flanders
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I think it did, but not from an event perspective
Richmond fans hate Carlton, and they don't have a huge amount of love for us. I remember the last time we played the blues in the opener we had preview threads for the game starting virtually after the season ended. Mods on the RFC board kept shutting down the threads (they were started multiple times) because it was quickly descending into a trollathon between the two supporter bases.
Six months of anticipation and trolling definitely leaves you pumped and eager for the game when it finally comes around.
Counter to this, for our GC opener we had hardly any discussion other than "why the * are we playing the Gold Coast??"
Round 1 presents one opportunity we get from no other round, the ability to build up anticipation and hype months in advance. It works for the RFC/CFC rivalry very well
I think that we just pretend to try to get Vic sides to Tassie (to keep our sponsor happy).
Obviously we prefer the big games @ MCG.
manicmagpie
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Yes, Jeff in particular was big on talking up getting Collingwood etc down there to the Tassie press but there's no evidence that Hawthorn ever actually requested it.
It's also a case that your mates are more likely to support the opposition so you have someone to go to the football with
Ned_Flanders
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This is one I think a lot of people forget
I have mates who dont go to the footy much at all, but whenever their team plays the Tigers they give me a call because they know I go most weeks. Its a good excuse for them to catch up with me and enjoy the game
also I usually go with my old man, but if he's busy I'll shout out to friends and family who follow the tiges or the competing team. If I can't find anyone I'll usually stay home and watch on the box. Reckon I'm not alone there. This is therefore more likely to happen when playing GC (for example) than Essendon, because I have no mates/family who support the GC, but plenty who follow EFC (in fact its a game I usually end up snubbing a few on)
Also Richmond and Carlton have made this game into what it is Today minus last year both coming off a round 1 loss . 2 Clubs with limited recent success have created a blockbuster game and now they should have the right to this game, likewise to Essendon and Collingwood on Anzac day unless attendance drops dramatically.
I believe in 2015 we will be back around the 85000 mark as it is the first game of the year, Tigers will be back on the bandwagon, blues likewise and will draw out a lot of football starved MCC and AFL reserve mutuals.
2013: 80971
2012: 78285
2011: 60654
2010: 72010
2009: 87043
2008: 72552
2007: 59847
Not sure how you can make the argument that the Blues will be on the bandwagon when every indication is that they are far from it (just look at their 2014 attendances)
Not to pour coal on your excitement but the 2009 coincided with the Cousins movement to Richmond, that match had a number of storyline plots that made it an enormous match. It wasn't a stock standard round 1 match it had a huge build up + it was a Richmond home game which tend to draw much larger Carl v Rich crowds.
I also dispute whether both clubs have made this fixture from nothing into the behemoth blockbuster it is today.
Aside from 2009, 2012-13 I don't think the fixture has drawn more than would otherwise be expected for an early season Carlton v Richmond fixture (the same applies to the Hawks v Cats Easter Monday fixture, often we over state the importance of scheduling on crowd attendance)
Starting the season with a big match isn't a recent phenoninum. From 2002-04 the AFL launched the season with Collingwood v Richmond and if not for the shortsightedness of the Richmond administration (who reneged on their deal with Collingwood to split the gate) would have continued long into the future
Anyway just my thoughts...
Not to pour coal on your excitement but the 2009 coincided with the Cousins movement to Richmond, that match had a number of storyline plots that made it an enormous match. It wasn't a stock standard round 1 match it had a huge build up + it was a Richmond home game which tend to draw much larger Carl v Rich crowds.
I also dispute whether both clubs have made this fixture from nothing into the behemoth blockbuster it is today.
Aside from 2009, 2012-13 I don't think the fixture has drawn more than would otherwise be expected for an early season Carlton v Richmond fixture (the same applies to the Hawks v Cats Easter Monday fixture, often we over state the importance of scheduling on crowd attendance)
Starting the season with a big match isn't a recent phenoninum. From 2002-04 the AFL launched the season with Collingwood v Richmond and if not for the shortsightedness of the Richmond administration (who reneged on their deal with Collingwood to split the gate) would have continued long into the future
Anyway just my thoughts...
at the Start of the year every club has new hopes and dreams, therefore more supporters come out until they get a feel of how the year is going to go.
Richmond Vs Blues round 1 is always going to draw more than Richmond vs Blues round 5 with 3 looses and 2 wins each, its simple.
The recent 2013 elimination final also helps build the rivalry and the results of recent time have always been down to the wire. Im not sure too many other teams would be capable of pulling these numbers in the same game with the exception of a already built up rivalry like pies, bombers or gelong and Hawks
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