List Mgmt. Tim O'Brien

[macdaddio]

Morning all I don't usually start threads much these days as I'm too busy.
But I'm curious as to where he is at?
Can we just bite the bullet and play him while lake is out just to give us that extra tall down forward.

 

[Hawk Dork]

Pretty sure the Spang man will be in after the break

 

[Roger Rogerson]

Pretty sure the Spang man will be in after the break

just sucks has hasnt played for some time and i may be incorrect but wasnt it a repeat injury - it is was then we will have to be extra cautious with him. Stocks are pretty thin at the moment.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

TOB in with Schoey back might have been a better option last night as opposed to Cheney in hindsight, but I guess you back your guys to do well. Thought Cheney was ok when our mids evened things out (though his disposal was poor), but got killed when they got the ball in quickly.

Another season at Box Hill though won't hurt him in the long run.

 

[macdaddio]

I think had we played him it would have taken another defender away from the swans and let Gunston to do his thing.
Who knows if he will be any good or not but he was given no.23 for a reason!!

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Needs more time for mine. Looked ok on the lead at the start of the year but raw.

I'd probably prefer to bring in Ceglar to help in the ruck and swap McEvoy and Hale at FF.

 

[SSSSSS]

Would like TOB to just play in the ressies for a while and start dominating there to build confidence.

 

[Roger Rogerson]

What is frustrating is that Grimley has been down with injury and form. Ideally he would have replaced O'Brien when he ran out of puff after the first couple of rounds.

 

[seysearles]

21yrs old in March. Hasn't shown much in his 4 senior games or his VFL form either from what i gather. We all know that KPP's take longer to develop. To put it in perspective Roughead and Franklin were the same age at the beginning of the 2008 season and we both know how they did that year. Is it fair to say that TOB needs to show major improvement in 2015 or is it too early to make that call? If he is still on the fringes of the squad in 12months time and not performing in the VFL is he guaranteed a spot on the list in 2016?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

21yrs old in March. Hasn't shown much in his 4 senior games or his VFL form either from what i gather. We all know that KPP's take longer to develop. To put it in perspective Roughead and Franklin were the same age at the beginning of the 2008 season and we both know how they did that year. Is it fair to say that TOB needs to show major improvement in 2015 or is it too early to make that call? If he is still on the fringes of the squad in 12months time and not performing in the VFL is he guaranteed a spot on the list in 2016?

His VFL form has been ok, without being brilliant.
He's young, and it's unfair to expect as much of him as we got from Rough and Bud at the same age.

 

[seysearles]

His VFL form has been ok, without being brilliant.
He's young, and it's unfair to expect as much of him as we got from Rough and Bud at the same age.

Do you think we should be hedging our bets and having alternatives should he not take the next step though? I feel like Sicily has shown a lot more promise thus far than O'Brian (193cm Weight 83kg) but is Sicily a KPP (Height: 1.89m Weight: 73kg)? Could we consider any of Brand (Height 198cm Weight 84kg) Tatupu (Height 197cm Weight 98kg) Willsmore (191cm Weight 82kg) or Langford (189cm Weight 83kg) as potential backups? As it stands we dont appear to have another Roughead (193cm Weight 100kg) on the list. It would be interesting to know what the coaching panels plan is.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Do you think we should be hedging our bets and having alternatives should he not take the next step though? I feel like Sicily has shown a lot more promise thus far than O'Brian (193cm Weight 83kg) but is Sicily a KPP (Height: 1.89m Weight: 73kg)? Could we consider any of Brand (Height 198cm Weight 84kg) Tatupu (Height 197cm Weight 98kg) Willsmore (191cm Weight 82kg) or Langford (189cm Weight 83kg) as potential backups? As it stands we dont appear to have another Roughead (193cm Weight 100kg) on the list. It would be interesting to know what the coaching panels plan is.

So far Brand is a key back, Shem a key forward. The others aren't KPP, although Sicily will pinch hit, ala Gunston.

All that being said, I think TOB has a bright future ahead, and there is no reason to worry about his development at this stage.

 

[Procrastinator35]

21yrs old in March. Hasn't shown much in his 4 senior games or his VFL form either from what i gather. We all know that KPP's take longer to develop. To put it in perspective Roughead and Franklin were the same age at the beginning of the 2008 season and we both know how they did that year. Is it fair to say that TOB needs to show major improvement in 2015 or is it too early to make that call? If he is still on the fringes of the squad in 12months time and not performing in the VFL is he guaranteed a spot on the list in 2016?

The Kid has beautiful skills/movement....His marking is solid, has a beautiful long straight kick on him, has excellent agility & ground skills for a tall & he is a good mover & quick on the lead.

We have the luxury of developing him slowly over time While Roughead plys his wares.

Can't see what your worried about to be honest!

 

[Dipper]

Physically he looks a fair way off so it's it's a no brainer to put a bit of time into him, when we drafted him weren't we a little surprised he was still there and went for him as too good to resist at that price and threw the needs template out of the window.

I'm always intrigued at how Shem will come on, I still see it as a massive long shot, but the way that we are prepared to put years into players does give him a chance. For all our prescient use of lower draft picks, trading for mature players and the possibilities offered by FA it's still always going to be a tough job getting in top notch KPFs with a regular lack of very high draft pricks, so patience is required with these 2.

 

[JoeHawk]

21yrs old in March. Hasn't shown much in his 4 senior games or his VFL form either from what i gather. We all know that KPP's take longer to develop. To put it in perspective Roughead and Franklin were the same age at the beginning of the 2008 season and we both know how they did that year. Is it fair to say that TOB needs to show major improvement in 2015 or is it too early to make that call? If he is still on the fringes of the squad in 12months time and not performing in the VFL is he guaranteed a spot on the list in 2016?

Those were very different circumstances. Roughy and Buddy and the whole team were about at the same level in terms of age and experience. Also, they're two very special players with natural ability, who further learned their trade by playing together in a young team. TOB however is that same young kid now amongst a very seasoned group of players. I think we need to persevere with him this year and wait what he does next year. Although I'd like to see him come in at some stages just to give him a taste. I think Clarko would be well aware of this. As mentioned before, he was given no. 23 for a reason.

 

[The Post Man]

The club was forced to get games into Roughead & Franklin from day 1 given the state of the list. Clearly people on here are forgetting what they were like in their first 2-3 seasons, they were pretty ordinary at times and somewhat covered up by the overal poor performance of the whole team. Their development had to be fast tracked and it was was, playing games when they weren't ready and when form suggested otherwise.

TOB may be a little behind Roughead at the same stage, but the club is in a very fortunate position where he can develop more methodically at a lower level with the odd taste of the big time. TOB is classy, I believe he will be the player we need for the Roughead succession plan.

 

[Ordovician]

21yrs old in March. Hasn't shown much in his 4 senior games or his VFL form either from what i gather. We all know that KPP's take longer to develop. To put it in perspective Roughead and Franklin were the same age at the beginning of the 2008 season and we both know how they did that year. Is it fair to say that TOB needs to show major improvement in 2015 or is it too early to make that call? If he is still on the fringes of the squad in 12months time and not performing in the VFL is he guaranteed a spot on the list in 2016?

Hardly a fair comparison as Roughy and pussy whipped boy were:

i. top 5 picks

ii. drafted a year earlier hence had three full AFL seasons by the time they were 21 having played 58 and 56 games respectively

iii. genuine KPPs, Roughy had the mass and the other one had the height to be true KPPs

TOB is really just an under-bodied tall flanker, a poor man's Gunners if you will. Not that that is a bad thing as if he ends up anywhere near as good as Gunners then the club would have done well.

He just will never have the +94 kg body required to play as a key marking target forward like Roughy, Schulz, Petrie, Hawkins, Farkland, Cloke etc. He even effectively said that himself when he remarked that he was not intending to bulk up just for the sake of it.

He has a lot of positive attributes as mentioned by P35, so he will be given time and we'll see how he performs over the next two years.

 

[seysearles]

genuine KPPs, Roughy had the mass and the other one had the height to be true KPPs

Roughead and TOB are both 193cms

He just will never have the +94 kg body required to play as a key marking target forward like Roughy, Schulz, Petrie, Hawkins, Farkland, Cloke etc. He even effectively said that himself when he remarked that he was not intending to bulk up just for the sake of it.

So given that KPP's take up to 4yrs to properly develop, who are our KPF's in waiting?

 

[Ordovician]

We don't have any KPFs under development other than Shem who is a very long shot and the only real backup to Roughy is the Super Schoey who is hardly a favo around here outside of the small circle of hard core cognoscenti. This issue was discussed in the Hawks greatest threat to winning the next flag thread, when some of us addressed what would happen if Roughy went down for a few months.

In the KPD stakes we have the ineffable Brand (a Fletcher style defensive back) but we really don't lacks tall defenders with Lake, Frawley and Super Spang, so it is not a pressing issue atm unlike the issues we had back in the pre-Lake era.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Tim O'Brien is definitely our long-term KP forward replacement for Roughead.....No ifs, buts or maybe's about it!....The kid has all the hallmarks of a genuine full forward, he just needs to put on sum KGS over the next 2-3 seasons is all.

 

[WWSD]

Tim O'Brien is still only 20 and is not yet ready to hold down a key position spot. Season 2015 will be another learing year for him at Box Hill. If his form can improve in the VFL on last year and he can show signs of improvement he will then get some games in the senior side throughout the year. I think 2016 is the year he wil start to push for a spot in our best 22.

 

[seysearles]

We don't have any KPFs under development other than Shem who is a very long shot and the only real backup to Roughy is the Super Schoey who is hardly a favo around here outside of the small circle of hard core cognoscenti. This issue was discussed in the Hawks greatest threat to winning the next flag thread, when some of us addressed what would happen if Roughy went down for a few months.

In the KPD stakes we have the ineffable Brand (a Fletcher style defensive back) but we really don't lacks tall defenders with Lake, Frawley and Super Spang, so it is not a pressing issue atm unlike the issues we had back in the pre-Lake era.

Im pretty sure TOB was recruited to be a KPF ....

"The Hawks’ first selection at the 2012 NAB AFL Draft, O’Brien justified his high rating with a promising first year at VFL level. A developing key forward, the South Australian played 11 senior and eight development league matches for Box Hill, booting a combined 24 goals. Still needs to add size to his frame and looks likely to spend another season at state level."

http://www.hawthornfc.com.au/player-profile/tim-obrien

 

[WWSD]

Im pretty sure TOB was recruited to be a KPF ....

"The Hawks’ first selection at the 2012 NAB AFL Draft, O’Brien justified his high rating with a promising first year at VFL level. A developing key forward, the South Australian played 11 senior and eight development league matches for Box Hill, booting a combined 24 goals. Still needs to add size to his frame and looks likely to spend another season at state level."

http://www.hawthornfc.com.au/player-profile/tim-obrien

When he fully develops over the next 2-3 years, O'Brien will more then likely be our CHF with Gunston at FF. There's our two KPF covered for the next decade.

 

[daniel23]

I'm just not seeing it with him , was very promising early on but do not think he improved at all last year playing for box hill , has all the attributes but lacks confidence amd does not demand the ball , would also love to see him string a couple games where he kicks 5+ goals for box hill even grimley has done that , he definitely needs a big year

 

[Roger Rogerson]

Geez there are a few impatient people around here.

O'Brien is coming along well. Yes we have high expectations for our youngsters but they are not realistic for all players. Look at Rough and Buddy's career records and you will work out they are pretty much freaks. Bit much to be using them as a yardstick for TOB. TOB would have 20+ games under his belt at other clubs and be getting pumped up by the press. He is at a club that has made 3GFs in a row and has had the best KP fwds in the comp. Pretty bloody hard to get a decent look in.

He is definately AFL class. Incredibly clean and quick hands, always in front on the lead. He has the Gunston, Mark Williams knack of reading the ball and getting to the right spot at exactly the right time. Lovely kick for goal. Some of the things he does trapping the ball and giving quick hands are blink and you'll miss it type stuff. Maybe those who have said they cant see it with him need to watch more closely.

He will improve this year and the club will give him games where the opportunity presents itself to keep him developing. He is still slight so needs time to fill out which might take a couple more seasons so he can hold front position and he needs to stay involved in games for longer but there is no way he is at risk of being moved on after this season or next. I think we have found another player here so keep the faith and be patient.