Social AFL Drug Debate

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bedford said:
9 Swans tested, only 2 behind the filth
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Please provide a link for that. Andrew Ireland (who would know the number as CEO and is on the sub-committee that came up for the policy) stated on radio that we as a club were "in a good place" with our figure. Famous last words I know

But I rather not have this board chase its tail over misleading information (as its so good at doing).
 
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This is what people are basing their numbers on...it's been shared around a bit. Tbh i don't really care what they do during the off season as long as it doesn't negatively impact on the club/performance
 
Regardless of your views about whether drug laws are unjust, possession and/or use of those drugs is a criminal offence in New South Wales with a penalty of up to $2,200 or 2 years imprisonment. If those tests had been performed by police rather than the AFL, they would be sufficient grounds to lay charges and likely to convict.

I'm not ok with it, at all.
 
RUNVS said:
If true then there is something deeply wrong at Hawthorn.
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A three peat would suggest otherwise;)

Also how on earth is Gold Coast only on 4?
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Its the current list so Bennell got moved on before these figures were done and their main problem last year was the drink

Other than that I'm going to hold fire on this as its a complex area as its not one used for punishment rather medical. Having raw numbers is one thing, knowing the full story is another and thats something I'm sure the club CEO's and Football Managers would have a better handle of. I wouldn't want to players returning a positive because they are on a certain medication to be thrown under a bus in the rush to the high moral ground.

Remember these tests don't have to be done as part of the WADA code and are really only there because people think players aren't human and allow for education and support when they don't have to submit to it.
 
robbieando said:
Remember these tests don't have to be done as part of the WADA code and are really only there because people think players aren't human and allow for education and support when they don't have to submit to it.
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If tests were done by a club and they found that players were guilty of other criminal offences such as rape or assault, they would report them to police. Why not these?

Or are clubs now the bastions of moral authority, with the absolute discretion to deterimine which laws are important and which are not?
 
swansfan51 said:
Regardless of your views about whether drug laws are unjust, possession and/or use of those drugs is a criminal offence in New South Wales with a penalty of up to $2,200 or 2 years imprisonment. If those tests had been performed by police rather than the AFL, they would be sufficient grounds to lay charges and likely to convict.

I'm not ok with it, at all.
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The risk is there and no one should hide from that fact and players have been caught before and faced up to it (Libba Jr, Tuck Jr, Michael Johnson and a range of Eagles players from a decade ago), but away from that the health is far more important as I rather if they were found to be doing it at all at least there is help available rather than a cold shoulder from the game.
 

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swansfan51 said:
If tests were done by a club and they found that players were guilty of other criminal offences such as rape or assault, they would report them to police. Why not these?
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Because testing positive in itself is not a criminal act. Possession doesn't apply retroactively.

Or are clubs now the bastions of moral authority, with the absolute discretion to deterimine which laws are important and which are not?
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On drugs they have very little wiggle room as unless a player turns up to the club with drugs in their possession its not likely there is anything to charge them with just going by a positive test.
 
swansfan51 said:
If tests were done by a club and they found that players were guilty of other criminal offences such as rape or assault, they would report them to police. Why not these?

Or are clubs now the bastions of moral authority, with the absolute discretion to deterimine which laws are important and which are not?
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This is a very good question, albeit one which I am not in a position to answer right now. At the very least we can say this is a league wide problem.
 
robbieando said:
Because testing positive in itself is not a criminal act. Possession doesn't apply retroactively.
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The second part is correct, however use is also a criminal offence in and of itself. Testing positive to an illegal drug would at least strongly suggest prior use.

See Section 12 of the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act 1985 (NSW).
 
Having 4 match bans for a positive test would make the first few rounds of the AFL season very interesting. Hawthorn would not be able to field a team and god knows what players would be missing from our best 22 and the best 22 of every other club.
 
swansfan51 said:
The second part is correct, however use is also a criminal offence in and of itself.

See Section 12 of the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act 1985 (NSW)
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Problem is the players could claim to be anywhere in the off season (the 8 weeks after the season ends) that these tests cover that they would render that act pointless. The police would need to see them doing it
 
swansfan51 said:
Regardless of your views about whether drug laws are unjust, possession and/or use of those drugs is a criminal offence in New South Wales with a penalty of up to $2,200 or 2 years imprisonment. If those tests had been performed by police rather than the AFL, they would be sufficient grounds to lay charges and likely to convict.

I'm not ok with it, at all.
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The level of holier than thou ness that seems to permeate this discussion is bizarre.

Do none of you j walk ? Go just that little bit above 60km/h. Have none of you thought that the pens from work would also work at home ?

Have none of you gone to a pub at 17 and lied about whose drivers licence you were using ? Driven home uncertain (but suspecting) You would exceed the limit if tested ?

None of you knowingly claimed something on a tax return that was not quite there ?

These are all offences.

And on the weekend when you aren't at work are you allowed to get a little off your face ? Let off some steam. Vent at the scg having had a few drinks ?

Why can't footballers who for 44 weeks have to be skin fold tested and measured and prodded and then have some other guy try to knock them into next week for chasing a bit of leather and have a bunch of people on websites single out their performance as the thing that cost their team a victory (while all the while having to deal with the same issues like families, and mortgages and unlike the rest of us be made to move to their first employer which might or might not be as far from their family as you can imagine) and whose likely career will be less than ten games be allowed some personal privacy in the off season ???

When it comes down to it I stand wholly with the players in this - I would encourage them to make smart choices and I would prefer it if those choices did not involve illicit drugs but if it is going to happen then I hope anything was done in a way which protect their lives.

but I will not abide the moralising of an outraged tabloid media that seems to suggest that employers have the capacity to determine what people do in their spare time.
 
Better to monitor it in-house and keep the players from falling into full blown addiction through counseling. No one wants to see another Cousins scenario.

It's pretty outrageous that these figures are getting released. I'm sure the AFLPA will be denanding the list of people with access to these figures be reduced or the whole regime will be cancelled.

The real addicts here are the media which have simply become addicted to scandal and have run with this story because the Essendon situation has run out of steam.

Ka-ching! $$$$$

That said, I don't believe the sceenshot posted earlier.
 
The figures, if true, are pretty much in line with what I'd expect. If anything, they're probably lower than what I'd have expected.
 
swansfan51 said:
If tests were done by a club and they found that players were guilty of other criminal offences such as rape or assault, they would report them to police. Why not these?

Or are clubs now the bastions of moral authority, with the absolute discretion to deterimine which laws are important and which are not?
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Would you expect the club to notify the police of players jaywalking on their way to training or starting to back out of the car park without their seatbelt all the way on?
 
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