WSYD GWS - Too Much, Too Soon?

[The Swans Blog]

I don't know what make sit like that but I agree. I always find the GC games so much more interesting than the GWS games.

Turns out the game this arvo is a ripper as well.

 

[mcgarnacle]

Disagree entirely, let's be clear this model is about long term.

I myself don't like the GWS moniker or them playing in Canberra nor them not actually being based in western Sydney.

But to say they have it all wrong just shows ignorance.

It's not surprising that the biggest knockers didnt grow up in Sydney or spent a great deal of time their ether.

Fact is this the AFL is modelling GWS on the swans.

And as much as the trolls might not like it, lets be clear about one thing the Sydney Swans are the largest sporting team in Sydney. They have the most members of any club in Sydney (not including the extra 10K in Melbourne) the sponsorship for the jumper is worth more then any other club in Sydney, premierships are celebrated with more fan fare and attendance's are the highest in the city.

What more could you ask for in a city that isn't and never will be an AFL city?

Swans weren't an instant success and yet are now dominate, to say GWS can't do the same just shows your own ignorance of the city.

I'm from Sydney.

I've been a knocker.

The current approach of the AFL & the current GWS management are leading to the same outcomes of the early 90s Swans. The argument that GWS have to go through such an uncompetitive period as well is absolute BS. Just because this period may be similar doesn't guarantee that GWS will be in the same position as the Swans are now 20 years down the track. You're overlooking certain extenuating circumstances that really gave the Swans a boost.

With the Swans as the laughing stock of Australian Sport in the early 90s, it set the objectives of Australian Football in Sydney back a decade. If not for the intervention of the AFL and the recruit of senior experienced players providing competitiveness, as well as other extraordinary events, the Swans of today will never have been.

What brought the crowds to the SCG was the recruit of Lockett, and also, a competitive team with the associated appointment of Barassi as coach and recruiting of other players at the time such as Roos, Dyson, Kickett to compliment Kelly, Bayes and others at the club that were half decent. With Eade in '96 they went on a premiership run.

A further leg-up was provided from the most unlikely source, and an event that frankly may never happen and probably will never happen again. Superleague. The disenchantment of rugby league supporters during this time provided a boost to the support of the Swans. I'm not deluded in thinking that most of those rugby league fans that had a look at the Swans and Australian Football during this period rusted on. But with the marquee players, with the Grand Final, and importantly, an opposition home grown code fragmented, the Swans became the big ticket item event at the time. It brought in other folks who probably weren't rugby league or sports fans in general, but they were drawn in by all the extra attention the Swans got at the time. Many of these folks liked what they saw.

Apart from minor blips along the way, the club has been generally competitive in the 16-17 seasons since. It is this sustained competitive on-field performance that has provided the platform for what the Swans are.

It extremely optimistic and unrealistic to assume that GWS will encounter similar wider scenarios and fortune to what the Swans had. It is also extremely unrealistic and naive to assume that GWS will have the success to bring in supporters, and then, the sustained competitive on-field presence that can maintain the interest in them.

 

[mcgarnacle]

People were saying the exact same thing about the Gold Coast at this time last year. Patience..
In saying that they need to look hard at trading in a bit of extra experience.

This has been repeated several times.

No way was there the same reaction to GC last season. They were also attracting double the crowd GWS were at this time.

 

[MrPresident]

Anyone bagging GWS needs to remember where the Suns were just last year. In the middle of their own 2nd year issues. Losing to GWS, getting belted by everybody. And look how far they've come in their 3rd year when a bunch of talented players starting turning the corner all at the same time.

GWS will be there next year. There is nothing Sydneysiders love more than getting on a bandwagon. GWS is not that far away from winning a lot of games. When they do their crowds will pick up. Skoda is the sort of boutique stadium that will provide excellent atmosphere when 80/90/100% full. And all these problems will be long forgotten.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

People thinking this club shouldn't exist have rocks in their head. Same people who'd have been against Sydney and Brisbane back in their shitty days (on and off-field).

Totally agree with the OP. The western suburbs of Sydney are NRL heartland. The majority of locals follow one of the local sides and hate AFL.

I never once heard western Sydney described as "NRL heartland". Not until the AFL announced they were putting a club there. Then the NRL and its supporters were and still are falling over themselves to call it such...

And apparently our sport is hated there. Not merely not cared about but hated!! Yeah... that = bullshit.

 

[Gaz_Brownlow]

Anyone bagging GWS needs to remember where the Suns were just last year. In the middle of their own 2nd year issues. Losing to GWS, getting belted by everybody. And look how far they've come in their 3rd year when a bunch of talented players starting turning the corner all at the same time.

GWS will be there next year. There is nothing Sydneysiders love more than getting on a bandwagon. GWS is not that far away from winning a lot of games. When they do their crowds will pick up. Skoda is the sort of boutique stadium that will provide excellent atmosphere when 80/90/100% full. And all these problems will be long forgotten.

GwS are going to be s**t hot sooner than later. They have recruited beautifully and even there senior recruits haven't peaked yet. I think they will start knocking off sides next year and will send some scares around the AFL.

If they could get a signature like Buddy.... Watch out.

 

[Blood Bath]

Give them time....

They are a new AFL expansion franchise club that is set in an area that is completely foreign to AFL. There was clip I saw that had an interviewer interviewing residents of the Western Suburbs of Sydney and they had no clue who Greater Western Sydney even were.

They club is still adapting to AFL standards, but it will come. Gold Coast are in a more fortunate habitat that has a large AFL following and they always get a nice crowd into the Metricon for a third year club.

I think we're heading in the right direction with clubs like GWS being put into the AFL. Not only does it promote the team and the game (especially in Western Sydney) but in a few years time it will make the AFL a much more competitive competition once GWS have started getting some growth and experience.

 

[Lord Rod]

People thinking this club shouldn't exist have rocks in their head. Same people who'd have been against Sydney and Brisbane back in their shitty days (on and off-field).

I never once heard western Sydney described as "NRL heartland". Not until the AFL announced they were putting a club there. Then the NRL and its supporters were and still are falling over themselves to call it such...

And apparently our sport is hated there. Not merely not cared about but hated!! Yeah... that = bullshit.

I had the misfortune to live in western Sydney whilst in the Army, and let me assure you, most of the leaguies there call it GayFL.. GWS will be a monumental disaster !

 

[Sydney Bloods]

I'm from Sydney.

I've been a knocker.

The current approach of the AFL & the current GWS management are leading to the same outcomes of the early 90s Swans. The argument that GWS have to go through such an uncompetitive period as well is absolute BS. Just because this period may be similar doesn't guarantee that GWS will be in the same position as the Swans are now 20 years down the track. You're overlooking certain extenuating circumstances that really gave the Swans a boost.

With the Swans as the laughing stock of Australian Sport in the early 90s, it set the objectives of Australian Football in Sydney back a decade. If not for the intervention of the AFL and the recruit of senior experienced players providing competitiveness, as well as other extraordinary events, the Swans of today will never have been.

What brought the crowds to the SCG was the recruit of Lockett, and also, a competitive team with the associated appointment of Barassi as coach and recruiting of other players at the time such as Roos, Dyson, Kickett to compliment Kelly, Bayes and others at the club that were half decent. With Eade in '96 they went on a premiership run.

A further leg-up was provided from the most unlikely source, and an event that frankly may never happen and probably will never happen again. Superleague. The disenchantment of rugby league supporters during this time provided a boost to the support of the Swans. I'm not deluded in thinking that most of those rugby league fans that had a look at the Swans and Australian Football during this period rusted on. But with the marquee players, with the Grand Final, and importantly, an opposition home grown code fragmented, the Swans became the big ticket item event at the time. It brought in other folks who probably weren't rugby league or sports fans in general, but they were drawn in by all the extra attention the Swans got at the time. Many of these folks liked what they saw.

Apart from minor blips along the way, the club has been generally competitive in the 16-17 seasons since. It is this sustained competitive on-field performance that has provided the platform for what the Swans are.

It extremely optimistic and unrealistic to assume that GWS will encounter similar wider scenarios and fortune to what the Swans had. It is also extremely unrealistic and naive to assume that GWS will have the success to bring in supporters, and then, the sustained competitive on-field presence that can maintain the interest in them.

You do realise what set Sydney back was the lack of support from the AFL and players ******* off back to Melbourne, this won't happen with the giants.

Your from Sydney so let's be honest how many people know and support the western Sydney soccer club that just played in a final? Bugger all Because people don't give a heck about soccer, they have to build the exposure of the game first.

You can have all the instant success you want but without building the club up first it means Sweat heck all.

Most people still don't know who the players of warriors* or the giants are but the media campaign for the giants is massive its everywhere the mantra is where building something come with us. What's the warriors btw?, I don't actually know.

As for the success, it's not guaranteed even if you recruit senior players and i btw plugger was a legend of the game when he came to Sydney the very sort if player that sheedy (you know a famous coach) tried to recruit and the clubs said no.

Taking middle of the road or end of career players wouldn't have helped them unless they are the sort of players that can mentor, help and put an extra effort in and they don't grow on tree's (look at Melbourne)

They missed a generation? both the warriors* and the giants were never converting anyone in they're first 5 years, From the outset the AFL said this was a 20 year project a generation is a long time and your already putting up the white flag.

Giants membership in their second year is over 12,000 with are core membership of about 3,000-5,000

The suns right now? 10,000 odd that's right everybody talking up the suns and how they got it right yet the giants have more numbers this year.

It ludicrous to think if the giants were playing in a grand final next year that everyone would jump on long term, do the hard yards first get people loyal to the team that way people support the club through the good and bad. (Like having 25,000+ swans supporters sitting through torrential rain watching them get the s**t kicked out of it)

You know the biggest disappointment in regards to the giants? It's the flogs on this site putting the boot into them and their supporters every second day.

Bigfooty is pretty much the only all encompassing footy forum and the largest in regards to AFL, given the limited coverage of AFL in the Sydney most people wanting to get there info come here.

And would be giants and suns supporters walk straight into the throngs of hostile flogs that want them banished from the comp, in there second year announcing there inevitable demise to all an sundry.

And once again I raise the question why is it always the supporters of hopeless teams starting these threads?

 

[Colonial]

I had the misfortune to live in western Sydney whilst in the Army, and let me assure you, most of the leaguies there call it GayFL.. GWS will be a monumental disaster !

Wrong but keep going.

 

[Slax]

Anyone bagging GWS needs to remember where the Suns were just last year. In the middle of their own 2nd year issues. Losing to GWS, getting belted by everybody. And look how far they've come in their 3rd year when a bunch of talented players starting turning the corner all at the same time.

GWS will be there next year. There is nothing Sydneysiders love more than getting on a bandwagon. GWS is not that far away from winning a lot of games. When they do their crowds will pick up. Skoda is the sort of boutique stadium that will provide excellent atmosphere when 80/90/100% full. And all these problems will be long forgotten.

GWS are further away than you think. I just keep looking at the leadership group there and I do not see the same level of experience, maturity and presence that I saw at GC 12 months ago. Maybe than can prove me wrong, but I'd be willing to bet a substantial amount that this time next season GWS are not travelling as well as GC are now.

 

[Colonial]

GWS are further away than you think. I just keep looking at the leadership group there and I do not see the same level of experience, maturity and presence that I saw at GC 12 months ago. Maybe than can prove me wrong, but I'd be willing to bet a substantial amount that this time next season GWS are not travelling as well as GC are now.

Def think we are one off season away from being mid table competitive. Once we are competitive the crowds will come, I hear allot of people talking about the Giants and saying they would like them to be good, but they wont spend their hard earned on a team they know will get flogged week in week out.

Once again patience is the key, we arent going anywhere.

 

[Slax]

Def think we are one off season away from being mid table competitive. Once we are competitive the crowds will come, I hear allot of people talking about the Giants and saying they would like them to be good, but they wont spend their hard earned on a team they know will get flogged week in week out.

Once again patience is the key, we arent going anywhere.

Definitely agree that patience is the key and also think that they will not be judged on their first few season by the locals either. I think that you're one season behind GC, due mainly to have less mature bodies to help protect the kids.

Also think that if GWS are smart they'd be better off spending their money chasing Leuenburger than Buddy, you desperately need a developed ruckman.

 

[Tulip]

Def think we are one off season away from being mid table competitive. Once we are competitive the crowds will come, I hear allot of people talking about the Giants and saying they would like them to be good, but they wont spend their hard earned on a team they know will get flogged week in week out.

Once again patience is the key, we arent going anywhere.

Bit of a problem, that attitude. Though you can't expect any less from people committed to other sports. My question is whether you think people, other than yourself and a pocket of other real fans, will stay when the kids get older or if you never really kick on.

 

[calyam]

GWS are further away than you think. I just keep looking at the leadership group there and I do not see the same level of experience, maturity and presence that I saw at GC 12 months ago. Maybe than can prove me wrong, but I'd be willing to bet a substantial amount that this time next season GWS are not travelling as well as GC are now.

GC lost their first 14 games last year and had a percentage of 55 per cent at the time. A lot can obviously change but there is no available evidence thus far that suggests that GWS will not improve massively by this time next year. Anyone suggesting that there was a significant difference between the two team's second season to date have very selective memories.

 

[Colonial]

Bit of a problem, that attitude. Though you can't expect any less from people committed to other sports. My question is whether you think people, other than yourself and a pocket of other real fans, will stay when the kids get older or if you never really kick on.

Really?? I have an attitude? Oook a bit condescending, people are allowed to follow more than one sport and still be passionate. I do think that once we are mid table and at least competing across the board for 4 quarters then we will be drawing crowds. I do have confidence in the squad we have and they will put us on the front foot in the years to come. I guess we will see within the next few years.

 

[Colonial]

Definitely agree that patience is the key and also think that they will not be judged on their first few season by the locals either. I think that you're one season behind GC, due mainly to have less mature bodies to help protect the kids.

Also think that if GWS are smart they'd be better off spending their money chasing Leuenburger than Buddy, you desperately need a developed ruckman.

Thats the thing, do we get a marketable big name player that will get the kids/families through the door, or do we go the safe route of chasing players who, while may not be as marketable, will be a better fit for the club and the developing players. We may be last but it is exciting times at the club and which way we will go.

 

[Tulip]

Really?? I have an attitude? Oook a bit condescending, people are allowed to follow more than one sport and still be passionate. I do think that once we are mid table and at least competing across the board for 4 quarters then we will be drawing crowds. I do have confidence in the squad we have and they will put us on the front foot in the years to come. I guess we will see within the next few years.

Not your attitude, the attitude that people will only jump on a team when they're winning.

 

[Colonial]

Not your attitude, the attitude that people will only jump on a team when they're winning.

At the moment its not about just winning, its about being competitive. Thats the main part. Fans will stick solid once they have an attachment to a club, we are brand spanking new as such it will take some time to build up that attachment to the everyday fan. Losing is 1 thing, getting 100 point floggings week in week out when you have only just been created is another.

 

[Slax]

Thats the thing, do we get a marketable big name player that will get the kids/families through the door, or do we go the safe route of chasing players who, while may not be as marketable, will be a better fit for the club and the developing players. We may be last but it is exciting times at the club and which way we will go.

I think you're better off going the safe route. You guys have some great talent that could be very marketable in the years to come like Cameron, Patton, Congilio. Geeting someone like Buddy doesn't make sense to me, but if you do I can see Cameron or Patton looking for a new home.

 

[stupidlikeafox]

I never once heard western Sydney described as "NRL heartland". Not until the AFL announced they were putting a club there. Then the NRL and its supporters were and still are falling over themselves to call it such...

In fairness they have 4 NRL teams in WS alone (5 up until SuperLeague). WS is Rugby League heartland whether you like it or not.

 

[mcgarnacle]

You do realise what set Sydney back was the lack of support from the AFL and players ******* off back to Melbourne, this won't happen with the giants.

Your from Sydney so let's be honest how many people know and support the western Sydney soccer club that just played in a final? Bugger all Because people don't give a **** about soccer, they have to build the exposure of the game first.

You can have all the instant success you want but without building the club up first it means Sweat **** all.

Most people still don't know who the players of warriors* or the giants are but the media campaign for the giants is massive its everywhere the mantra is where building something come with us. What's the warriors btw?, I don't actually know.

As for the success, it's not guaranteed even if you recruit senior players and i btw plugger was a legend of the game when he came to Sydney the very sort if player that sheedy (you know a famous coach) tried to recruit and the clubs said no.

Taking middle of the road or end of career players wouldn't have helped them unless they are the sort of players that can mentor, help and put an extra effort in and they don't grow on tree's (look at Melbourne)

They missed a generation? both the warriors* and the giants were never converting anyone in they're first 5 years, From the outset the AFL said this was a 20 year project a generation is a long time and your already putting up the white flag.

Giants membership in their second year is over 12,000 with are core membership of about 3,000-5,000

The suns right now? 10,000 odd that's right everybody talking up the suns and how they got it right yet the giants have more numbers this year.

It ludicrous to think if the giants were playing in a grand final next year that everyone would jump on long term, do the hard yards first get people loyal to the team that way people support the club through the good and bad. (Like having 25,000+ swans supporters sitting through torrential rain watching them get the s**t kicked out of it)

You know the biggest disappointment in regards to the giants? It's the flogs on this site putting the boot into them and their supporters every second day.

Bigfooty is pretty much the only all encompassing footy forum and the largest in regards to AFL, given the limited coverage of AFL in the Sydney most people wanting to get there info come here.

And would be giants and suns supporters walk straight into the throngs of hostile flogs that want them banished from the comp, in there second year announcing there inevitable demise to all an sundry.

And once again I raise the question why is it always the supporters of hopeless teams starting these threads?

who are the Warriors*?

who's talking about instant premierships and measuring success in that way?

how about a little bit of competitiveness. small successes to begin with.

 

[NUFC Tiger]

What GWS/the AFL should have tried to do was instead of giving them the potential to build a super team down the track, give them a mature/competitive team that could hold its own in the AFL rather than cop weekly beatings almost all the time.

I remember when the Storm came to Melbourne, they were instantly successful and won a premiership in their second season from memory. In my eyes, the best way to get locals to embrace a team is for them to sit up and take notice of a winning team. For the locals in Western Sydney, why would they care to see a team from their area getting smashed most weeks? That's hardly a compelling reason for them to take any interest in the team.

 

[Colonial]

What GWS/the AFL should have tried to do was instead of giving them the potential to build a super team down the track, give them a mature/competitive team that could hold its own in the AFL rather than cop weekly beatings almost all the time.

I remember when the Storm came to Melbourne, they were instantly successful and won a premiership in their second season from memory. In my eyes, the best way to get locals to embrace a team is for them to sit up and take notice of a winning team. For the locals in Western Sydney, why would they care to see a team from their area getting smashed most weeks? That's hardly a compelling reason for them to take any interest in the team.

As much as it would of been a good idea, the NRL and the A-League do not have a draft (Cap only), as such when players decide to leave a club its to go to where they want to go, and not have their new club have to meet some payment option to their old club. Much easier to start a successful club in both those competitions.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

People said the same thing about us when we came in...

But yeah fold them

Disagree. Everyone knew you guys were being set up in an aussie rules state and that at least you'd have the WAFL Fremantle clubs as base support.

Calling an SA team Port Adelaide was a bad idea.

Setting up a team this early in Westie land was a bad idea.

Letting GWS swap their pre-draft kids to the Suns was a bad idea.