2nd Test Australia v Pakistan Dec 26--30 1000hrs @ the MCG

[JimmyBC]

Slater ruined his own career really, he could've retired with 20 to 25 test centuries if he'd sorted himself out.

If I was picking two openers in my lifetime I'd be going Slater & Hayden.

 

[Soggy2112]

There's nothing to pretend about David Warner being a spud.

He never made a century in England, India, New Zealand, Pakistan, Sri Lanka or West Indies. 26 average in England, 21 in India, 13 in New Zealand, 25 Sri Lanka, 26 West Indies, slightly more respectable but still pretty sh*t 33 in Pakistan - these are 6 of the top 7 test teams.

Across 44 tests in these countries in more than a decade between 2012-2013, the man couldn't make a single century. It's an almost cartoonishly awful record for a test opener and cricket historians in the future will be utterly baffled that a man with such a record could retain his spot for that long.

20 of his 26 centuries were in Australia, and 3 of his away ones were in the one series nearly a decade ago on pitches most similar to Australia in South Africa. It was a great series - but a great series isn't supposed to buy you another f*cking decade as a test opener. Two of the other three were vs Bangladesh.

And remember that his other century wasn't actually in Pakistan, so the man only ever made test centuries in the home country of his opponent in two series, one of whom is a minnow and the other was a decade ago.

It's an utterly pathetic away record, and an utterly pathetic, indefensible decision by Cricket Australia to allow it to continue. It's hilarious how many halfwits will offer apologia for it.

Away averages of other openers during Warner’s career:

Ed Cowan: 26.94
Joe Burns: 35.00
Matt Renshaw: 19.12
Cam Bancroft: 26.70
Marcus Harris: 9.67

Warner’s is 32.50. Meanwhile he’s been completely dominant at home.

His away record hugely effects his reputation, but to suggest he has not deserved to play as many tests as he has is laughable.

Also, we seemed to have an arrogance about us now that we think home tests don’t matter and we could roll out with anyone in the shield and win. That is not the case. Warner played most of his career when winning at home was no guarantee. We have needed his home performances and that should not be forgotten.

 

[PhatBoy]

Away averages of other openers during Warner’s career:

Ed Cowan: 26.94
Joe Burns: 35.00
Matt Renshaw: 19.12
Cam Bancroft: 26.70
Marcus Harris: 9.67

Warner’s is 32.50. Meanwhile he’s been completely dominant at home.

His away record hugely effects his reputation, but to suggest he has not deserved to play as many tests as he has is laughable.

Also, we seemed to have an arrogance about us now that we think home tests don’t matter and we could roll out with anyone in the shield and win. That is not the case. Warner played most of his career when winning at home was no guarantee. We have needed his home performances and that should not be forgotten.

Rogers 41.
Marsh only ever opened in 5 away tests but he averaged almost 39 as well.

I agree he’s done enough to deserve his spot though

 

[Millky95]

Rogers 41.
Marsh only ever opened in 5 away tests but he averaged almost 39 as well.

I agree he’s done enough to deserve his spot though

I would love to know Warner's stats on who he opened with. I think Rogers complimented him perfectly and they were our best opening combo since Hayden and Langer

 

[PhatBoy]

I would love to know Warner's stats on who he opened with. I think Rogers complimented him perfectly and they were our best opening combo since Hayden and Langer

They did go really well together it seemed just thinking off the top of my head, but so do he and Khawaja in general terms when you put aside his obvious failings on the road

 

[revo333]

His away record is why I’d have him behind both Langer and Hayden, just of the recent opening bats.

Just speaking strictly test cricket , I'm the same.

 

[revo333]

I take it back, he must have finished his career stronger than I remembered because I didn’t have him pegged as an above 50 average. He still wouldn’t replace Greenidge or Haynes because he’s not an opener, Richards or Lloyd but he’d replace Richardson or Logie. Still, when you add in Lara and Sobers, his omission from all-time isn’t remotely surprising.

Like Hussey a career average of 50 is a little generous to him.

 

[Linda Lovelace]

Away averages of other openers during Warner’s career:

Ed Cowan: 26.94
Joe Burns: 35.00
Matt Renshaw: 19.12
Cam Bancroft: 26.70
Marcus Harris: 9.67

Warner’s is 32.50. Meanwhile he’s been completely dominant at home.

His away record hugely effects his reputation, but to suggest he has not deserved to play as many tests as he has is laughable.

Also, we seemed to have an arrogance about us now that we think home tests don’t matter and we could roll out with anyone in the shield and win. That is not the case. Warner played most of his career when winning at home was no guarantee. We have needed his home performances and that should not be forgotten.

The good old inflated (bit still shoddy) career average trick to try to justify why he was still getting selected a decade later. My math here lay be a little off but I think it's close:

Warner 2012-2015 = 1792 runs at 41.7,
4 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 = 1556 runs at 25.9,
2 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 minus minnow Bangladesh = 1305 runs at 23,
0 centuries

You simply take out his consecutive 2014 series vs South Africa and Pakistan, and his career away average was 27.

So basically any 'respectability' you can find in Warner's away record relies entirely on a purple patch of form in 2014-2015 (he was pretty good against England here too) and a one-off two test series vs non-serious test minnows in 2017.

For the other decade plus - I repeat, more than a f*cking decade - of his career he was not a test standard away opener. Aside from 2014-2015 he was a 23 - 27 away average player, who could not deliver centuries at all against serious test nations.

No better than Cowan or Bancroft and worse than Burns. And the difference of course being they weren't in the team across 14 different years.

If you want to be an apologist and try to rehabilitate Flat Track Davey's image by desperately pointing to 2014 as proof he didn't suck for literally his entire away career, fine, but this doesn't justify him still being in the team into the year 2024.

Just like how we found Khawaja in his right spot, we had plenty of time to experiment and find a better alternative.

 

[PhatBoy]

The good old inflated (bit still shoddy) career average trick to try to justify why he was still getting selected a decade later. My math here lay be a little off but I think it's close:

Warner 2012-2015 = 1792 runs at 41.7,
4 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 = 1556 runs at 25.9,
2 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 minus minnow Bangladesh = 1305 runs at 23,
0 centuries

You simply take out his consecutive 2014 series vs South Africa and Pakistan, and his career away average was 27.

So basically any 'respectability' you can find in Warner's away record relies entirely on a purple patch of form in 2014-2015 (he was pretty good against England here too) and a one-off two test series vs non-serious test minnows in 2017.

For the other decade plus - I repeat, more than a f*cking decade - of his career he was not a test standard away opener. Aside from 2014-2015 he was a 23 - 27 away average player, who could not deliver centuries at all against serious test nations.

No better than Cowan or Bancroft and worse than Burns. And the difference of course being they weren't in the team across 14 different years.

If you want to be an apologist and try to rehabilitate Flat Track Davey's image by desperately pointing to 2014 as proof he didn't suck for literally his entire away career, fine, but this doesn't justify him still being in the team into the year 2024.

Just like how we found Khawaja in his right spot, we had plenty of time to experiment and find a better alternative.

I don’t disagree with you but you can’t just remove a team from an analysis because you don’t rate them, when they squared the series, and have competed with basically everyone they’ve hosted for the better part of a decade bar India

 

[eddiesmith]

Who is saying that? Way to lose credibility as a journalist. Over the last 35 years, it's Taylor, Hayden, Langer, Khawaja/Warner. Swampy Marsh went ok too.

100%

Lol putting Khawaja as one of Australia’s greatest opening batsmen

 

[DaRick]

The good old inflated (bit still shoddy) career average trick to try to justify why he was still getting selected a decade later. My math here lay be a little off but I think it's close:

Warner 2012-2015 = 1792 runs at 41.7,
4 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 = 1556 runs at 25.9,
2 centuries

Warner 2016-2023 minus minnow Bangladesh = 1305 runs at 23,
0 centuries

You simply take out his consecutive 2014 series vs South Africa and Pakistan, and his career away average was 27.

So basically any 'respectability' you can find in Warner's away record relies entirely on a purple patch of form in 2014-2015 (he was pretty good against England here too) and a one-off two test series vs non-serious test minnows in 2017.

For the other decade plus - I repeat, more than a f*cking decade - of his career he was not a test standard away opener. Aside from 2014-2015 he was a 23 - 27 away average player, who could not deliver centuries at all against serious test nations.

No better than Cowan or Bancroft and worse than Burns. And the difference of course being they weren't in the team across 14 different years.

If you want to be an apologist and try to rehabilitate Flat Track Davey's image by desperately pointing to 2014 as proof he didn't suck for literally his entire away career, fine, but this doesn't justify him still being in the team into the year 2024.

Just like how we found Khawaja in his right spot, we had plenty of time to experiment and find a better alternative.

BAN have been reasonably competitive at home for about a decade, and those decks were very spin-friendly. Not easy to score runs on.

If anything, the century in the 2nd BAN Test ranks among Warner's best in my book.

 

[sosos]

Lol putting Khawaja as one of Australia’s greatest opening batsmen

Put someone up who displaces him from that list.

 

[Young Redleg]

Put someone up who displaces him from that list.

I think Chris Rogers was a better player but he started way too late.

 

[PhatBoy]

Lol putting Khawaja as one of Australia’s greatest opening batsmen

England openers in the last 40 years to average within 10 of what Khawaja does opening: (2536 runs at 59)

Downtown, Paul

56 runs at 56.

Who the f*** cares where he sits in Australia’s pecking order. He’d walk into any English XI’s since Hutton hung up the gloves.

 

[eddiesmith]

England openers in the last 40 years to average within 10 of what Khawaja does opening: (2536 runs at 59)

Downtown, Paul

56 runs at 56.

Who the f*** cares where he sits in Australia’s pecking order. He’d walk into any English XI’s since Hutton hung up the gloves.

More pointless shitposting from you…

Wonder how many England openers you can find who average more than Khawaja in tough batting conditions in England …

 

[PhatBoy]

More pointless shitposting from you…

Wonder how many England openers you can find who average more than Khawaja in tough batting conditions in England …

Lolllllll

Again, in the last 40 years there are literally 3 England openers who average more than Khawaja’s more than respectable 42.4 opening in England, who have actually scored more than 1500 runs there, and one of them you guys thought was so freakish to average 43 you gave him a f**king knighthood

Nice one, again, though.

 

[FredLeDeux]

More pointless shitposting from you…

Wonder how many England openers you can find who average more than Khawaja in tough batting conditions in England …

For you to accuse someone else of shitposting is the absolute definition of chutzpah.

 

[eddiesmith]

Lolllllll

Again, in the last 40 years there are literally 3 England openers who average more than Khawaja’s more than respectable 42.4 opening in England, who have actually scored more than 1500 runs there, and one of them you guys thought was so freakish to average 43 you gave him a f**king knighthood

Nice one, again, though.

He averages 31 in England, but nice try.

 

[PhatBoy]

He averages 31 in England, but nice try.

No, he averages 42 when he opens genius. You wanted to slag off his credentials as an opener, well debate his credentials as an opener and learn how to use a stats filter.

In fact his average rockets up to 50 when he’s lucky enough to face your team of plonkers instead of India’s over there. At least they aren’t f***ing dumb enough to keep feeding his f**king pull shot and bowling on his pads despite having 350 test matches worth of experience in their f**king ball pairing

 

[eddiesmith]

For you to accuse someone else of shitposting is the absolute definition of chutzpah.

But in his cases it’s true as you cannot criticise a single Australian player without his reply being But England!!!!

 

[eddiesmith]

No, he averages 42 when he opens genius. You wanted to slag off his credentials as an opener, well debate his credentials as an opener and learn how to use a stats filter.

Keep moving things around to suit, oh had had one average series in his life so we’ll ignore every s**t one to make him look good…

By that calculation then Zak Crawley is clearly a better opener than Ussie…

 

[PhatBoy]

But in his cases it’s true as you cannot criticise a single Australian player without his reply being But England!!!!

You realise I actually like England MORE than Australia right?

F**k me you are dumb

 

[PhatBoy]

Keep moving things around to suit, oh had had one average series in his life so we’ll ignore every s**t one to make him look good…

By that calculation then Zak Crawley is clearly a better opener than Ussie…

Well in England he isn’t.
Zak Crawley averages 37 opening in England. Usman Khawaja as you’ve had pointed out to you several times now averages 42 opening there.
Crawley also averages 30 as an opener for his career so, you know, a little way off Khawaja’s career opening average of 59 but hey, we will call it even.

It has nothing to do with who I support mate.

If you had actually mastered reading, you’d know I support the West Indies first - which is even funnier because England is the only half decent side we regularly bend over and f**k for fun - Australia last, India and England somewhere down near the bottom and everyone else in between.

I just get a kick out of pointing out your utter bullshit

 

[Young Redleg]

Keep moving things around to suit, oh had had one average series in his life so we’ll ignore every s**t one to make him look good…

By that calculation then Zak Crawley is clearly a better opener than Ussie…

Lmao Khawaja was literally the leading run scorer in the last Ashes series and he averaged nearly 50. Not to mention that we wouldn't have even been close to winning that Edgbaston test in the first place if it wasn't for him.

You're just letting your really weird dislike of Khawaja get in the way of facts.

 

[sherb]

Don't feed the troll.

We are approaching Ed's 20th anniversary of trolling the cricket board.

Well, the 19th at least, he was in full trolling form for the 2005 Ashes.

Some of us remember.........