Greece

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So if no deal is reached, Greece finally catches up with the illustrious economic wizards in Germany for most state bankruptcies. :D
I'm sure we can catch up to our Mediterranean kin in Spain by the middle of this century, unless they go bankrupt in the fallout now as well. They really need to stop trying to one up us. Haven't they been paying attention to the media?

CIt_YaDUsAAwnoX.jpg


I guess 1924, 1929, 1932 and 1953 are distant memories for Germany.
 
Cyprus has said if Greece is forced to leave the Eurozone, then Cyprus will leave as well.
That will be the first big steps towards a permanent Russian presence in the Eastern Mediterranean, a nightmare scenario for Washington.
European project big success...:drunk:
 
FPPF said:
Cyprus has said if Greece is forced to leave the Eurozone, then Cyprus will leave as well.
That will be the first big steps towards a permanent Russian presence in the Eastern Mediterranean, a nightmare scenario for Washington.
European project big success...:drunk:
Click to expand...
So if the troika gave in we know it is because of USA pressure
 

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The IMF just gave the Greek government a huge referendum boost
Oscar Williams-Grut Jul 3, 2015, 4:56 AM

Greece’s ruling Syriza party just got a huge boost for their campaign to get Greeks to reject current bailout proposals in Sunday’s referendum.

The International Monetary Fund (IMF), one of Greece’s three main creditors, admitted Thursday that Greece’s debts need restructuring.

That’s pretty much the key demand Greece has been making all along. Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis told Bloomberg TV earlier Thursday that he’d rather “cut his arm off” than sign a new bailout deal that didn’t include rehashing the deals to make payment dates more realistic.
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http://www.businessinsider.com.au/i...rs-and-admits-debt-needs-restructuring-2015-7

Who controls the IMF?
Like I said, the American's wont sit idle while unstable states are created because Germany is too pig headed to see the writing on the wall and offer what was offered to it before(even by Greece). This is a message to the Europeans to sort it out. The American's aren't worried about Greece's economy, they are worried about the implications for their foreign policy and geopolitical interests.
It's in America's interests for Greece not to fall out of the EU,(and by extension Cyprus) because the Russian's are waiting(and they aren't keeping it a secret either). The Eastern Mediterranean is of strategic importance to the Americans.

When Uncle Sam eventually says jump, Hanz and Fritz will ask how high sir.
 
Chameleon75 said:
wishful thinking
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Can you clarify which part of my post is wishful thinking?

The fact the IMF is an American tool?
The fact the IMF has said the same thing the Greek government has been saying is needed?
The fact that it is not in America's geopolitical interests to have a strong, permanent Russian presence in the Eastern Mediterranean, in Greece and/or Cyprus?
The fact that the Cypriot government said if Greece is forced to out/to leave the Eurozone, they too will leave?
The fact the Russian's have indicated they want a military base in Cyprus?
The fact the Eastern Mediterranean(and indeed the Mediterranean as a whole), is of strategic importance to the Americans?
The fact that America will take steps to prevent the Russian's getting a presence in that region?
The fact America is the top dog, and the Europeans are their client states?
 
Greece : Nine Myths About the Greek Crisis By Prof. James K Galbraith


http://www.globalresearch.ca/nine-myths-about-the-greek-crisis/5460153

"
1. The referendum is about the Euro. As soon as Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras announced the referendum, François Hollande, David Cameron, Matteo Renzi, and the German Deputy Chancellor Sigmar Gabriel told the Greeks that a “no” vote would amount to Greece leaving the Euro. Jean-Claude Juncker, President of the European Commission, went further: he said “no” means leaving the European Union. In fact the Greek government has stated many times that – yes or no – it is irrevocably committed to the Union and the Euro. And legally, according to the treaties, Greece cannot be expelled from either.

2. The IMF has been flexible. IMF Managing Director Christine Lagarde claims that her institution has shown “flexibility” in negotiations with the Greeks. In fact, the IMF has conceded almost nothing over four months: not on taxes, pensions, wages, collective bargaining or the amount of Greece’s debt. Greek chief negotiator Euclid Tsakalatos circulated a briefing on the breakdown that gives details, and concludes: “So what does the Greek government think of the proposed flexibility of the Institutions? It would be a great idea.”

3. The creditors have been generous. Angela Merkel has called the terms offered by the creditors “very generous” to Greece. But in fact the creditors have continued to insist on a crushing austerity program, predicated on a target for a budget surplus that Greece cannot possibly meet, and on the continuation of draconian policies that have already cost the Greeks more than a quarter of their income and plunged the country into depression. Debt restructuring, which is obviously necessary, has also been refused.

4. The European Central Bank has protected Greek financial stability. A central bank is supposed to protect the financial stability of solvent banks. But from early February, the ECB cut off direct financing of Greek banks, instead drip-feeding them expensive liquidity on special “emergency” terms. This promoted a slow run on the banks and paralyzed economic activity. When the negotiations broke down, the ECB capped the assistance, prompting a fast bank run and giving them an excuse to impose capital controls and effectively shut them down.

5. The Greek government is imperiling its American alliance. This is a particular worry of some US conservatives, who see a leftist government in power and assume it is pro-Russian and anti-NATO. It is true that the Greek Left has historic complaints against the US, notably for CIA support of the military junta that ruled from 1967 to 1974. But in fact, attitudes on the Greek Left have changed, thanks partly to experience with the Germans. This government is pro-American and firmly a member of NATO.

6. Alexis Tsipras called the IMF a “criminal” organization. That was, charitably, an overheated headline slapped by Bloomberg onto a very moderate parliamentary speech, which correctly pointed out that the IMF’s economic and debt projections for Greece back when austerity was first imposed in 2010 were catastrophically optimistic. In fact, every letter from Tsipras to the creditors has been couched in formal and respectful language.

7. The Greek government is playing games. Because Finance Minister Varoufakis knows the economic field of game theory, lazy pundits have for months opined that he is playing “chicken” or “poker” or some other game. In Heraklion two weeks ago, Varoufakis denied this as he has done many times: “We’re not bluffing. We’re not even meta-bluffing.” Indeed there are no hidden cards. The Greek red lines – the points of principle on which this government refuses to budge – on labor rights, against cuts in poverty-level pensions and fire-sale privatizations – have been in plain view from day one.

8. A “Yes” vote will save Europe. “Yes” would mean more austerity and social destruction, and the government that implements it cannot last long. The one that follows will not be led by Alexis Tsipras and Yanis Varoufakis – the last leaders, perhaps anywhere in Europe, of an authentic pro- European left. If they fall, the anti-Europeans will come next, possibly including ultra-right elements such as the Greek Nazi party, Golden Dawn. And the anti-European fire will spread, to France, the UK and Spain, among other countries.

9. A “No” vote will destroy Europe. In fact, only the “No” can save Greece – and by saving Greece, save Europe. A “No” means that the Greek people will not bend, that their government will not fall, and that the creditors need, finally, to come to terms with the failures of European policy so far. Negotiations can then resume – or more correctly, proper negotiations can then start. This is vital, if Europe is to be saved. If there ever was a moment when the United States should speak for decency and democratic values – as well as our national interest – it is right now."
Responses
 
Let the "Greece situation" be a warning to the voters of Australia - they elected a dangerous leftist who has sold out-dated ideas to empty headed dreamers and in doing so has driven Greece over the proverbial cliff.

What a train wreck.

Only a strong leader can save Greece now. One man. To lead them back from the brink and hold the rent seekers to account.
 
Jones_3_16 said:
Let the "Greece situation" be a warning to the voters of Australia - they elected a dangerous leftist who has sold out-dated ideas to empty headed dreamers and in doing so has driven Greece over the proverbial cliff.

What a train wreck.

Only a strong leader can save Greece now. One man. To lead them back from the brink and hold the rent seekers to account.
Click to expand...
http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft...ds=.&br=1&c=174&s=GGXWDG,GGXWDG_NGDP&grp=0&a=


Gov debt was 328 billion Euros in 2010 (144% GDP)

342 billion Euros in 2014 (180% Gdp)

Neo liberial nightmare
 

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not a warmonger said:
http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2012/02/weodata/weorept.aspx?pr.x=44&pr.y=8&sy=2010&ey=2017&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&c=174&s=GGXWDG,GGXWDG_NGDP&grp=0&a=


Gov debt was 328 billion Euros in 2010 (144% GDP)

342 billion Euros in 2014 (180% Gdp)

Neo liberial nightmare
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No lazy Greek rent seekers created the nightmare.

Too many leaners - not enough lifters.

The lifters got sick of it - and left Greece decades ago. Only the parasites stayed behind. Now they have to live with the mess they have created.

It is a warning to the leaners of Australia. If you keep sponging (and punishing hard work with a regressive tax system that punishes hard work) then the lifters will simply leave.

Leftists love to "cut and re-cut" the pie - but when the lifters pack up and leave town there will be no pie left to cut. That is the situation Greece now finds itself in. And we are only 2-3 years behind.
 
Jones_3_16 said:
No lazy Greek rent seekers created the nightmare.

Too many leaners - not enough lifters.

The lifters got sick of it - and left Greece decades ago. Only the parasites stayed behind. Now they have to live with the mess they have created.

It is a warning to the leaners of Australia. If you keep sponging (and punishing hard work with a regressive tax system that punishes hard work) then the lifters will simply leave.

Leftists love to "cut and re-cut" the pie - but when the lifters pack up and leave town there will be no pie left to cut. That is the situation Greece now finds itself in. And we are only 2-3 years behind.
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Rentiers are the landlords and oliograchs that sponge off the wealth created by community
Jones_3_16 said:
No lazy Greek rent seekers created the nightmare.

Too many leaners - not enough lifters.

The lifters got sick of it - and left Greece decades ago. Only the parasites stayed behind. Now they have to live with the mess they have created.

It is a warning to the leaners of Australia. If you keep sponging (and punishing hard work with a regressive tax system that punishes hard work) then the lifters will simply leave.

Leftists love to "cut and re-cut" the pie - but when the lifters pack up and leave town there will be no pie left to cut. That is the situation Greece now finds itself in. And we are only 2-3 years behind.
Click to expand...
Yes austerity has been catastrophic for the working class
 
Jones_3_16 said:
No lazy Greek rent seekers created the nightmare.

Too many leaners - not enough lifters.

The lifters got sick of it - and left Greece decades ago. Only the parasites stayed behind. Now they have to live with the mess they have created.

It is a warning to the leaners of Australia. If you keep sponging (and punishing hard work with a regressive tax system that punishes hard work) then the lifters will simply leave.

Leftists love to "cut and re-cut" the pie - but when the lifters pack up and leave town there will be no pie left to cut. That is the situation Greece now finds itself in. And we are only 2-3 years behind.
Click to expand...

Who are the parasites? o_O
 
spinynorman said:
So all this talk of it being too close to call was just the media acting in the interest of capital. Who would have thought?

Great result for the overwhelming majority of Greeks.
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private media was completely biased towards the yes vote and therefore lied about the level of opposition to the Troika. The people were not fooled by the propaganda and fear mongering from the financial criminal class.
 
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