Jonas and Butters subbed back on after head clash - with no concussion protocol undertaken

[Vikingnz]

Can you let me know which law firm you end up at? So i know not to go there

If he actually does have a degree he's obviously one of the 95% of law degree obtainers who can't actually get a job in the industry lol.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

Similar incident last year and not sure if they underwent concussion test? Any West Coast fans know?

Eagles win soured by shocking head clash

West Coast’s big win over Collingwood has been soured by a shocking head clash between teammates Tom Cole and Josh Rotham with just seconds remaining in the match.

thewest.com.au

Just rewatched it on Kayo - doctor immediately watched the incident and entered the players into the concussion protocol.

 

[Profop]

If footy journalists was in any way competent at least one of them would have known about the previous incident when Hinkley was going on about "are you questioning a doctor with 25 years experience?" and could have called him out on it

Instead we're stuck with the real boys club bottom of the barrel types we have now

 

[Vikingnz]

I'd like to think that it was the players choice, surely if they didn't feel up to it, they'd tell the trainers/doctors/Kenny himself that they were not feeling the best at the time!!!

This is literally the reason concussion protocols were implemented.

 

[HairyO]

How can you review it though in 6 minutes?

You will often see 'obvious' signs of concussion in that time period, but we all know that concussion can be delayed, and that it's very common for 'obvious' signs to not show immediately.

Concussion is caused by the brain rattling inside the skull. You do not need a medical degree to know that a collision like that one is a very, very high risk one in terms of the likelihood of concussion.

Even if there are no obvious signs, it's staggering to not take 20-30 minutes to see if any develop. Staggering.


As for Holmes' partner playing AFL footy, it doesn't make her an expert. That's nonsense.

It gives her a heightened sense of the personal risk a player is under after a collision to the head like that. It gives her perspective that the Hamish McLachlan's of the world with the 'trust the doc and get back out there and get on with it' mentality, might not have.
It's a perspective that plenty of us have, where the fact that there's only 20 minutes left and it's a close and important game is irrelevant. It's a perspective that that decision last night is heavily flawed, regardless of whether it's a doctor error (which do, and have happened by the way) or a gaping hole in the AFL's rules.

I dont know how because I am not a doctor trained in identifying concussion.

Is Abby ? Or her football playing partner?

Or you ?

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

I dont know how because I am not a doctor trained in identifying concussion.

Is Abby ? Or her football playing partner?

Or you ?

My point is that it doesn't matter how well you're trained - you can't actually tell in the very short term. No one can.
Even after 20 minutes doing the lame AFL concussion test, you still can't 100% rule out concussion.

That is why in some sports they don't even bother trying to test for it, and instead focus on the nature and severity of the collision. The UFC bans you from competing and even training for 3 months if you get knocked out.

Concussed or not, you're out for 3 months.

 

[HairyO]

My point is that it doesn't matter how well you're trained - you can't actually tell in the very short term. No one can.
Even after 20 minutes doing the lame AFL concussion test, you still can't 100% rule out concussion.

That is why in some sports they don't even bother trying to test for it, and instead focus on the nature and severity of the collision. The UFC bans you from competing and even training for 3 months if you get knocked out.

Concussed or not, you're out for 3 months.

Eye socket and top of cheek bone. What is the likelihood of concussion in those parts of the head?

Dont answer because you dont know. But you will still rabidly question.

 

[_Mike_]

This certainly appears to constitute negligence in terms of their duty of care to the players. It was a big collision, and both players appear pretty dazed afterwards and stumbled off the field.

The question of negligence comes into play had Jonas or Butters been suffered consequential injury to the head as a result of further head contact after being cleared to play. There's no question of negligence until damage has occurred, and you cant sue or challenge the duty of care required for something that hasn't occurred or might happen.

 

[_Mike_]

The AFL has a concussion rule in effect to minimise the likely occurrence of further injury to a head knock, if the Port medico cleared the players to return without a proper test its on the AFL to request a medical report. Otherwise it makes a mockery of the rule, IMO

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Eye socket and top of cheek bone. What is the likelihood of concussion in those parts of the head?

Dont answer because you dont know. But you will still rabidly question.

The impact was in those spots, but that doesn't mean that the force of the collision didn't rattle the brain.

 

[Xtreme]

This is literally the reason concussion protocols were implemented.

I thought it was because the AFL don't want lawsuits on their doorstep.

 

[Punchy Bassett]

How can you review it though in 6 minutes?

You will often see 'obvious' signs of concussion in that time period, but we all know that concussion can be delayed, and that it's very common for 'obvious' signs to not show immediately.

Concussion is caused by the brain rattling inside the skull. You do not need a medical degree to know that a collision like that one is a very, very high risk one in terms of the likelihood of concussion.

Even if there are no obvious signs, it's staggering to not take 20-30 minutes to see if any develop. Staggering.


As for Holmes' partner playing AFL footy, it doesn't make her an expert. That's nonsense.

It gives her a heightened sense of the personal risk a player is under after a collision to the head like that. It gives her perspective that the Hamish McLachlan's of the world with the 'trust the doc and get back out there and get on with it' mentality, might not have.
It's a perspective that plenty of us have, where the fact that there's only 20 minutes left and it's a close and important game is irrelevant. It's a perspective that that decision last night is heavily flawed, regardless of whether it's a doctor error (which do, and have happened by the way) or a gaping hole in the AFL's rules.

Ignoring the fact Holmes herself played in the AFLW competition and would have a fair idea what the protocols are.

 

[Punchy Bassett]

And ironically, and predictably, the medi-sub, which was brought in EXCLUSIVELY for concussed players, was already used on a guy who blew his calf, again compromising the doctor and the system.

Port have got form on this one as well

 

[Muddiemoose]

Eye socket and top of cheek bone. What is the likelihood of concussion in those parts of the head?

Dont answer because you dont know. But you will still rabidly question.

Can you get a concussion from a hit to the chin or jaw?​

Yes, sure. Although the jaw or chin can absorb some of the blow, if you are hit in the right place, it can definitely cause a concussion


“A concussion occurs when your brain bounces or twists inside your skull or experiences rapid, whiplash-type back and forth movement that causes it to collide with the inside of your skull”

Concussion: Causes, Symptoms, Diagnosis, Treatments, Prevention

A concussion is a mild traumatic brain injury caused by a blow to your head. Headache is a common symptom. Recovery involves rest and a gradual return to activity.

my.clevelandclinic.org

 

[Redline]

The AFL has a concussion rule in effect to minimise the likely occurrence of further injury to a head knock, if the Port medico cleared the players to return without a proper test its on the AFL to request a medical report. Otherwise it makes a mockery of the rule, IMO

I agree with this. It feels like this was the scenario the rule was brought in for.

I think we all know had the circumstances of the game had been different and a sub available then we are probably not even having this discussion as they wouldn't have gone back on.

 

[tenderwarrior]

Not saying it's not a valid question to ask

This was the only relevant part of your post..

 

[BringFevBack2021]

Can you get a concussion from a hit to the chin or jaw?​

Yes, sure. Although the jaw or chin can absorb some of the blow, if you are hit in the right place, it can definitely cause a concussion


“A concussion occurs when your brain bounces or twists inside your skull or experiences rapid, whiplash-type back and forth movement that causes it to collide with the inside of your skull”

Concussion: Causes, Symptoms, Diagnosis, Treatments, Prevention

A concussion is a mild traumatic brain injury caused by a blow to your head. Headache is a common symptom. Recovery involves rest and a gradual return to activity.

my.clevelandclinic.org

You can get a concussion from body impact too.

Concussion can be caused by body hits too

Because concussion is a type of mild traumatic brain injury (TBI), it’s often assumed there must be a blow to the head to cause its effects. But that is not the case.

qbi.uq.edu.au

 

[sobrave]

The impact was in those spots, but that doesn't mean that the force of the collision didn't rattle the brain.

You'd think this was blindingly obvious.

 

[Bearded Clam]

Can you get a concussion from a hit to the chin or jaw?​

Yes, sure. Although the jaw or chin can absorb some of the blow, if you are hit in the right place, it can definitely cause a concussion


“A concussion occurs when your brain bounces or twists inside your skull or experiences rapid, whiplash-type back and forth movement that causes it to collide with the inside of your skull”

Concussion: Causes, Symptoms, Diagnosis, Treatments, Prevention

A concussion is a mild traumatic brain injury caused by a blow to your head. Headache is a common symptom. Recovery involves rest and a gradual return to activity.

my.clevelandclinic.org

Not sure its even worth arguing this point with HairyO..

It is quite clear they havent even got the faintest idea what causes concussion…

 

[HairyO]

Ot sure its even worth arguing this point with HairyO..

It is quite clear they havent even got the faintest idea what causes concussion…

Apparently you know better than Port's doctor.

Care to share your qualifications ?

 

[_Mike_]

Case closed

 

[Big Crow]

Surely the next question then is are the AFL’s match day protocols for concussion appropriate?

 

[sobrave]

Case closed

DO NOT QUESTION THE DOCTOR!!

Be good to hear some other doc's opinions on this

 

[PrisonBars4life]

Haha I haven’t heard someone be referred to as a nerd in years!

View attachment 1420591

Apparently having some idea of what you're talking about isn't allowed on the main board. Only dumb c8nts get to post.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

If he actually does have a degree he's obviously one of the 95% of law degree obtainers who can't actually get a job in the industry lol.

I finished it and came out in 2008 where the industry was so bad, people were getting offered the award 38k (expecting 60+ hour weeks), if you didn't already have a clerkship at a firm, and you didn't want to work in bottom feeder areas of practice like family law, you were ****ed. So yeah, broadly accurate.