History Mein Kampf

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SwampCreature said:
Actually it's largely because he ignored advice and invaded Russia. Spread himself too thin in the northern winter.

Everything was going pretty well up to that point tbh
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Less proclivity for invading and he likely would've been in power until a natural death in the 1970s with a state funeral.

He certainly did leave a mark on world history.
 
Gough said:
If you ever want to wind up a Pom, and endure a lecture on British stoicism, suggest to them if it wasn't for the Americans, they'd be speaking German now.
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On the contrary, I'm a Pom, and I freely admit that US assistance was vital to our survival, in more ways than one.
 

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darth_timon said:
On the contrary, I'm a Pom, and I freely admit that US assistance was vital to our survival, in more ways than one.
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Yeah but it's like a little in-joke isn't it? Not really true but actually is..if you know what I mean.
 
Lester Burnham said:
As for John Maynard Keynes' merging races, many Israelis believe that intermarriage between a Jew and non-Jew is a threat to the survival of the nation. When Benjamin Netanyahu's son was rumoured to the dating a shiksa.

even the prime minister's brother-in-law, Hagai Ben-Artzi, spoke out strongly on their affair, warning his nephew that if he doesn't end his relationship with Leikanger, it is as if he is spitting on the graves of his grandparents.

"From my point of view, if he does such a thing, I personally won't allow him to get near their graves," he told an Ultra-Orthodox website. "This is the most awful thing that is threatening and was a threat throughout the history of the Jewish people. More awful than leaving Israel is marriage with a gentile. If this happens, God forbid, I'll bury myself I don't know where. I'll walk in the streets and tear off my hair - and here this is happening."​

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26067980
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More along the same lines. And another banned book - this one for promoting anti-racism.

It is a literary love story between an Israeli woman and a Palestinian man which some hoped would unite a region divided.

But today Israel’s Ministry of Education excluded from school literature curriculums the novel on the grounds that it could promote mixing between the two nations and undermine the distinct identity of Israeli Jews.​

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...israeli-palestinian-love-affair-a6792441.html
 
Lester Burnham said:
More along the same lines. And another banned book - this one for promoting anti-racism.

It is a literary love story between an Israeli woman and a Palestinian man which some hoped would unite a region divided.

But today Israel’s Ministry of Education excluded from school literature curriculums the novel on the grounds that it could promote mixing between the two nations and undermine the distinct identity of Israeli Jews.​

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...israeli-palestinian-love-affair-a6792441.html
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Speaking of banned material... I wonder what Jewish/western material is banned in the totalitarian Palestinian territories... or the Hamas punishment would be if found with some.

I agree that books shouldn't be banned (including the one in question in this thread), but don't try to make Israel look like the literature banning monster. There are plenty of places where they actually do ban literature like N. Korea, many Arab states, the Palestinian territories.. How do you feel about these where racism is encouraged and where anti-racism material is banned? I wonder why you're trying to put the magnifying glass on the most open, secularised, western democratic state in the region - the only state in the region where it is free to be gay, atheist, free to follow any religion that also has the highest tolerance of free speech. - isn't that what this thread is about.
 
strauchnyy said:
Speaking of banned material... I wonder what Jewish/western material is banned in the totalitarian Palestinian territories... or the Hamas punishment would be if found with some.

I agree that books shouldn't be banned (including the one in question in this thread), but don't try to make Israel look like the literature banning monster. There are plenty of places where they actually do ban literature like N. Korea, many Arab states, the Palestinian territories.. How do you feel about these where racism is encouraged and where anti-racism material is banned? I wonder why you're trying to put the magnifying glass on the most open, secularised, western democratic state in the region - the only state in the region where it is free to be gay, atheist, free to follow any religion that also has the highest tolerance of free speech. - isn't that what this thread is about.
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The thread is about a book that was banned for many years for its racist statements about Jews. Now we have a book removed from schools in Israel because it promotes anti-racist views.

Are you in favour of Israel’s Ministry of Education banning the novel, Borderlife, from Israeli schools?

Do you view intermarriage between a Jew and a non-Jew as a "awful thing" that represents a threat to the survival of Israel?
 
Lester Burnham said:
The thread is about a book that was banned for many years for its racist statements about Jews. Now we have a book removed from schools in Israel because it promotes anti-racist views.
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And as you pointed out earlier in the thread, the wider topic is censorship - and when discussing censorship issues in the ME, the Arab and Palestinian territories are in a completely different ball park to Israel. Whilst the Palestinian territories and Arab states are comparable to say North Korea in their totalitarian ideologies, Israel is more like the USA or Australia. Apples and Oranges. Which is why I find it trivial that you put the magnifying glass on Israel.

Are you in favour of Israel’s Ministry of Education banning the novel, Borderlife, from Israeli schools?
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They didn't ban the novel, they removed it from the list. And no I'm not in favour of that.

Do you view intermarriage between a Jew and a non-Jew as a "awful thing" that represents a threat to the survival of Israel?
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No, not at all.

I think that is an extreme view, held by the strict orthodox maybe? I think it would be safe to assume that the majority of the secular Jews in Israel would not hold the same view. Heck, most it bacon anyway!

Do you think the Palestinians would be pro/against intermarriage? What do you feel about racist indoctrination of children in Palestinian schools where martyrdom is encouraged, where the demonisation of Jews is in the curriculum? Comparing racial issues in Israel to the Arab/palestinian territories is trivial. If you honestly pick on Israel whilst ignoring the others, logic says it can only mean you have an agenda against them.
 
strauchnyy said:
And as you pointed out earlier in the thread, the wider topic is censorship - and when discussing censorship issues in the ME, the Arab and Palestinian territories are in a completely different ball park to Israel. Whilst the Palestinian territories and Arab states are comparable to say North Korea in their totalitarian ideologies, Israel is more like the USA or Australia. Apples and Oranges. Which is why I find it trivial that you put the magnifying glass on Israel.



They didn't ban the novel, they removed it from the list. And no I'm not in favour of that.



No, not at all.

I think that is an extreme view, held by the strict orthodox maybe? I think it would be safe to assume that the majority of the secular Jews in Israel would not hold the same view. Heck, most it bacon anyway!

Do you think the Palestinians would be pro/against intermarriage? What do you feel about racist indoctrination of children in Palestinian schools where martyrdom is encouraged, where the demonisation of Jews is in the curriculum? Comparing racial issues in Israel to the Arab/palestinian territories is trivial. If you honestly pick on Israel whilst ignoring the others, logic says it can only mean you have an agenda against them.
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False equivalence. And your logic is poor.
 
imagine tony Abbott banned a book about a relationship between a European Australian and an indigenous Australian...
 

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strauchnyy said:
What do you feel about racist indoctrination of children in Palestinian schools where martyrdom is encouraged, where the demonisation of Jews is in the curriculum?
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can you cite this 'racist indoctrination' by Palestine? in this thread we have an obvious example of Israel doing so.
 
strauchnyy said:
And as you pointed out earlier in the thread, the wider topic is censorship - and when discussing censorship issues in the ME, the Arab and Palestinian territories are in a completely different ball park to Israel. Whilst the Palestinian territories and Arab states are comparable to say North Korea in their totalitarian ideologies, Israel is more like the USA or Australia. Apples and Oranges. Which is why I find it trivial that you put the magnifying glass on Israel.



They didn't ban the novel, they removed it from the list. And no I'm not in favour of that.



No, not at all.

I think that is an extreme view, held by the strict orthodox maybe? I think it would be safe to assume that the majority of the secular Jews in Israel would not hold the same view. Heck, most it bacon anyway!

Do you think the Palestinians would be pro/against intermarriage? What do you feel about racist indoctrination of children in Palestinian schools where martyrdom is encouraged, where the demonisation of Jews is in the curriculum? Comparing racial issues in Israel to the Arab/palestinian territories is trivial. If you honestly pick on Israel whilst ignoring the others, logic says it can only mean you have an agenda against them.
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To be honest, the biggest reason that we should hold them to a higher standard is because the same things were perpetrated against them. It would be like Native Americans or Aborigines forcing immigrants into uninhabitable areas and then shrugging and saying "Well, it's worse in Rwanda, right?".

Unfortunately it's an aphorism that your greatest enemy is your greatest teacher.
 
katana said:
can you cite this 'racist indoctrination' by Palestine? in this thread we have an obvious example of Israel doing so.
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http://www.post-gazette.com/opinion...iolence-breeds-bloodshed/stories/201510200030

"From the earliest age, many Palestinian children are subjected to propaganda that promotes hatred and violence. TV networks are full of programming with Disney-style characters and friendly looking hosts who encourage them to kill innocent people and become martyrs. Schoolchildren in the West Bank study antiquated curriculum that legitimizes indiscriminate violence against Israelis.

Older children hear Palestinian leaders and official Palestinian Authority religious leaders praise jihad and martyrdom. They follow social media outlets containing videos, graphics, cartoons and texts that glorify violence against Jews."

Other sources:

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/palestinian-people-children-indoctrinated-hate-article-1.999059

http://www.contracostatimes.com/opi...ren-endure-another-summer-hate-indoctrination



Feel free to do a quick google search yourself.

There are also videos that teach the best ways to stab Israelis (on social media), their leaders encourage the stabbing etc.

I hope the above suffices your request.
 
EagleMan87 said:
To be honest, the biggest reason that we should hold them to a higher standard is because the same things were perpetrated against them. It would be like Native Americans or Aborigines forcing immigrants into uninhabitable areas and then shrugging and saying "Well, it's worse in Rwanda, right?".

Unfortunately it's an aphorism that your greatest enemy is your greatest teacher.
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Agree that there is a higher standard, but I don't think your analogy is comparable. It is far more complex. Anyway, back to the thread, I don't Hitler's insane rantings be banned, they should be used in the context of teaching the world that this is the epitome of evil and something like what happened should never happened again.
 
Present Not Past said:
Hitler had his shot at world domination and failed - why did he fail? Because he was hopeless.
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they could have won the war. they made the mistake of fighting a war on two fronts... again. Furthermore, getting the Americans involved didnt help either... again.

If it weren't for the USA the world would be a different place.
 
Lester Burnham said:
The thread is about a book that was banned for many years for its racist statements about Jews.
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do you have a source for this? my understanding was the (handful of) countries that banned mein kampf (and other nazi material) did so because of their association with the axis before and during the war, either as axis members themselves or having been subjugated by them.

...

i don't favour banning books but i really don't get the big deal about the banning of mein kampf by a small number of countries particularly sensitive to the atrocities carried out within their borders. we might not agree with it but surely we can understand it.
 
LanceRomance said:
they could have won the war. they made the mistake of fighting a war on two fronts... again. Furthermore, getting the Americans involved didnt help either... again.

If it weren't for the USA the world would be a different place.
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The reason they opened up the eastern front was 'intelligence' that Stalin was creating a massive stockpile of armaments (Hitler was amazed at it's breadth after he attacked). He wanted to attack before it became even stronger and was convinced that the capitalist west would alter it's focus and join him against the communists. Nb. the Rudoph Hess approach:
http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v03/v03p291_Anon.html
 
strauchnyy said:
http://www.post-gazette.com/opinion...iolence-breeds-bloodshed/stories/201510200030

"From the earliest age, many Palestinian children are subjected to propaganda that promotes hatred and violence. TV networks are full of programming with Disney-style characters and friendly looking hosts who encourage them to kill innocent people and become martyrs. Schoolchildren in the West Bank study antiquated curriculum that legitimizes indiscriminate violence against Israelis.

Older children hear Palestinian leaders and official Palestinian Authority religious leaders praise jihad and martyrdom. They follow social media outlets containing videos, graphics, cartoons and texts that glorify violence against Jews."

Other sources:

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/palestinian-people-children-indoctrinated-hate-article-1.999059

http://www.contracostatimes.com/opi...ren-endure-another-summer-hate-indoctrination



Feel free to do a quick google search yourself.

There are also videos that teach the best ways to stab Israelis (on social media), their leaders encourage the stabbing etc.

I hope the above suffices your request.
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That's mental
 
Long Live HFC said:
do you have a source for this? my understanding was the (handful of) countries that banned mein kampf (and other nazi material) did so because of their association with the axis before and during the war, either as axis members themselves or having been subjugated by them.
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You might be right. I could not find a reliable source for exactly why Mein Kampf was banned. It seems to be part of the Denazification after the war.
 
strauchnyy said:
I think that is an extreme view, held by the strict orthodox maybe? I think it would be safe to assume that the majority of the secular Jews in Israel would not hold the same view. Heck, most it bacon anyway!
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These are not extreme views within Israel. They are the norm.

An Israeli group of prominent rabbis' wives has urged Jewish girls not to date or work with Arabs, underscoring the rising power of the religious Right and fuelling fears of growing racism in the country.

The incident is the latest in a series of anti-Arab initiatives by Israel's religious Right. Earlier this month there was outrage after dozens of municipal rabbis signed a petition urging Jews not to rent or sell homes to non-Jews. The petition was widely condemned, including by Benjamin Netanyahu, the prime minister. But a poll published this week found that 44 per cent of Israeli Jews supported the rabbis' call, while 48 per cent were opposed.

A few weeks ago Jewish residents protested in the Tel Aviv suburb of Bat Yam, warning Jewish women to stay away from Arab men​


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...bis-wives-call-on-Jews-not-to-date-Arabs.html
 
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