Roast Rants, off-topic banter, who ignores who & what Greg Williams' relatives know

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BlacreJacks said:
Over the moon that Jason showed everyone some of what he can do on the big stage last night.

Mind you, it was Vardys first game for the season and Blicavs is a mid being played in the ruck due to injuries and I reckon he broke even against those two last night.

I'm as excited as everyone else but reality is that Longer is younger, more promising and has done it for the whole season. Bit of disrespect to think we have just replaced him.
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Too right. Too much extreme reaction to a single game, article, quote, assumption, or even hollow rumour on this forum. One bloke plays well, the other bloke should be delisted/traded/call it quits. He's no good anymore. Seems we love to pair a positive with a corresponding negative toward someone else. Some very short memories and some very reactionary opinions that are complete day-by-day propositions.

Chill your **** boys. Holmesy did well.
 
BigSassy said:
Too right. Too much extreme reaction to a single game, article, quote, assumption, or even hollow rumour on this forum. One bloke plays well, the other bloke should be delisted/traded/call it quits. He's no good anymore. Seems we love to pair a positive with a corresponding negative toward someone else. Some very short memories and some very reactionary opinions that are complete day-by-day propositions.

Chill your **** boys. Holmesy did well.
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I can see you are new, but that how a football forum operates. Why do you want to censor other posters opinion. Really don't need someone telling me whom I can praise or criticise or when I can be excited or not.

Maybe take your own advice
 
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Joffaboy said:
I can see you are new, but that how a football forum operates. Why do you want to censor other posters opinion. Really don't need someone telling me whom I can praise or criticise or when I can be excited or not.

Maybe take your own advice
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Joffaboy said:
What a silly post. So Vardy has not rucked for two years? has not trained, or played any VFL games? Just sat out doing nothing for 2 years playing X Box and suddenly got up on Saturday morning and was picked to play for the seniors?

Fair dinkum, some need to think before posting.

it is as dumb as posting, "got to remember as well Vardy was playing against someone who has never played AFL before"
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K.
 
Smoke_Me_AKipper said:
I've only ever had nasty personal messages by one person ever in the whole time I've been on this site and he's just been given a day off - again!! #fivecansshortofasixpack #acoupleofsandwicheshortofapackedlunch
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Same only ever the 1 nasty personal messages, off the same person as you
 
Mowman said:
Same only ever the 1 nasty personal messages, off the same person as you
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What am I doing wrong? I haven't had any.
 
Going to pose a genuine question here and I hope we can discuss it as adults -

Do we (St Kilda) have an issue with Aboriginal/Indigenous players?

What I mean is; Are we, as a club, behind the times in regards to development and support when it comes to Indigenous talent and has this lack of support seen us shy away from drafting these players? Looking through our draft history and we don't seem to pick Indigenous players with any sort of regularity - Raph Clarke in 2003 then nothing until Ross Tungatalum as a rookie in 2008 and Nick Winmar in 2009. I don't think we have drafted an Aboriginal player since Winmar.

I don't believe there is any racial motivation for this to have happened. I do believe that there are those at the club who might feel we lack the proper support networks and integration programs to help some of these players adjust to AFL football.

So tell me Big Footy Saints, is it something the club should make a conscious effort to change? Should the club work with the Clarke Brothers, Nicky Winmar, Gilbert McAdam etc and specifically target Indigenous players to bring to the club in the coming years? Or do we feel comfortable drafting 'best available' regardless of their culture and creed?

While there aren't many notable Indigenous players from recent drafts that I feel we should have taken it does feel as though we are missing something by being the only club in the AFL without an Indigenous player on it's list - http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=790

The club made a public statement earlier this year about how we were a "trailblazer" for Indigenous players - http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-05-25/st-kilda-a-pioneer-for-indigenous-players - but now it feels like everyone has passed us by, and we are only falling further behind.
 
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L_W_P said:
Going to pose a genuine question here and I hope we can discuss it as adults -

Do we (St Kilda) have an issue with Aboriginal/Indigenous players?

What I mean is; Are we, as a club, behind the times in regards to development and support when it comes to Indigenous talent and has this lack of support seen us shy away from drafting these players? Looking through our draft history and we don't seem to pick Indigenous players with any sort of regularity - Raph Clarke in 2003 then nothing until Ross Tungatalum as a rookie in 2008 and Nick Winmar in 2009. I don't think we have draft an Aboriginal player since Winmar.

I don't believe there is any racial motivation for this to have happened. I do believe that there are those at the club who might feel we lack the proper support networks and integration programs to help some of these players adjust to AFL football.

So tell me Big Footy Saints, is it something the club should make a conscious effort to change? Should the club work with the Clarke Brothers, Nicky Winmar, Gilbert McAdam etc and specifically target Indigenous players to bring to the club in the coming years? Or do we feel comfortable drafting 'best available' regardless of their culture and creed?

While there aren't many notable Indigenous players from recent drafts that I feel we should have taken it does feel as though we are missing something by being the only club in the AFL without an Indigenous player on it's list - http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=790

The club made a public statement earlier this year about how we were a "trailblazer" for Indigenous players - http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-05-25/st-kilda-a-pioneer-for-indigenous-players - but now it feels like everyone has passed us by, and we are only falling further behind.
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I don't think its a case of anything other than drafting the best available at the picks we have had & in those cases a non indigenous kid has got the nod.

Having some sort of Indigenous Academy or focus is definitely something that I'm sure the club has considered. Like everything else it is a matter of funding to get anything up & running. Hopefully they're considered this as part of the Moorabbin re-development...there's always grants & funding available for projects that have a real community benefit to them (hence Richmond hosting an indigenous centre at Punt Rd as part of the development there).
 
L_W_P said:
Going to pose a genuine question here and I hope we can discuss it as adults -

Do we (St Kilda) have an issue with Aboriginal/Indigenous players?

What I mean is; Are we, as a club, behind the times in regards to development and support when it comes to Indigenous talent and has this lack of support seen us shy away from drafting these players? Looking through our draft history and we don't seem to pick Indigenous players with any sort of regularity - Raph Clarke in 2003 then nothing until Ross Tungatalum as a rookie in 2008 and Nick Winmar in 2009. I don't think we have draft an Aboriginal player since Winmar.

I don't believe there is any racial motivation for this to have happened. I do believe that there are those at the club who might feel we lack the proper support networks and integration programs to help some of these players adjust to AFL football.

So tell me Big Footy Saints, is it something the club should make a conscious effort to change? Should the club work with the Clarke Brothers, Nicky Winmar, Gilbert McAdam etc and specifically target Indigenous players to bring to the club in the coming years? Or do we feel comfortable drafting 'best available' regardless of their culture and creed?

While there aren't many notable Indigenous players from recent drafts that I feel we should have taken it does feel as though we are missing something by being the only club in the AFL without an Indigenous player on it's list - http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=790

The club made a public statement earlier this year about how we were a "trailblazer" for Indigenous players - http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-05-25/st-kilda-a-pioneer-for-indigenous-players - but now it feels like everyone has passed us by, and we are only falling further behind.
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There's all sorts of challenges recruiting Indigenous kids. The biggest one is their cultural attachment to their family, which makes any permanent move very difficult. In an ideal world we would draft an Indigenous lad who has been at boarding school in Victoria since he was 12 years old, the reasons for this are many.
So the jury is out on most of these lads.
 

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weve had some very talented Aboriginal players over the yrs. I wouldnt be overly concerned L W P that at this very period we dont have any.
I cant see it being club driven at all.
If we are picking "best option" in the upcoming drafts, if that option happens to be an aboriginal im sure the club would take him without blinking.
We had the two Clarke boys and Alan Murray all at our club at the same time in our recent history and all 3 were pro active in the Aboriginal community and were fine ambassadors for our club and their race.
It does feel a bit odd not having any indigenous boys on our list at the moment but id bet my left one it hasnt been done on purpose or through poor club management.
 
L_W_P said:
Going to pose a genuine question here and I hope we can discuss it as adults -

Do we (St Kilda) have an issue with Aboriginal/Indigenous players?

What I mean is; Are we, as a club, behind the times in regards to development and support when it comes to Indigenous talent and has this lack of support seen us shy away from drafting these players? Looking through our draft history and we don't seem to pick Indigenous players with any sort of regularity - Raph Clarke in 2003 then nothing until Ross Tungatalum as a rookie in 2008 and Nick Winmar in 2009. I don't think we have draft an Aboriginal player since Winmar.

I don't believe there is any racial motivation for this to have happened. I do believe that there are those at the club who might feel we lack the proper support networks and integration programs to help some of these players adjust to AFL football.

So tell me Big Footy Saints, is it something the club should make a conscious effort to change? Should the club work with the Clarke Brothers, Nicky Winmar, Gilbert McAdam etc and specifically target Indigenous players to bring to the club in the coming years? Or do we feel comfortable drafting 'best available' regardless of their culture and creed?

While there aren't many notable Indigenous players from recent drafts that I feel we should have taken it does feel as though we are missing something by being the only club in the AFL without an Indigenous player on it's list - http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=790

The club made a public statement earlier this year about how we were a "trailblazer" for Indigenous players - http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-05-25/st-kilda-a-pioneer-for-indigenous-players - but now it feels like everyone has passed us by, and we are only falling further behind.
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Im comfortable with picking Best available.
Our Club has already proven its willingness to pick up players with the greatest repect to Cultures and Nationalities.
 
I agree that we should make some sort of an effort to get some indigenous players onto our list. A good start might be to get Xavier Clarke back as an assistant coach. He has had success with his own team in the Northern Territory. He should be able to point towards some good players to rookie for a start. And I would like to land one of Harley Bennell, Jaegar O'Meara, from GWS, and even Jetta from Sydney.
 
L_W_P said:
Going to pose a genuine question here and I hope we can discuss it as adults -

Do we (St Kilda) have an issue with Aboriginal/Indigenous players?

What I mean is; Are we, as a club, behind the times in regards to development and support when it comes to Indigenous talent and has this lack of support seen us shy away from drafting these players? Looking through our draft history and we don't seem to pick Indigenous players with any sort of regularity - Raph Clarke in 2003 then nothing until Ross Tungatalum as a rookie in 2008 and Nick Winmar in 2009. I don't think we have draft an Aboriginal player since Winmar.

I don't believe there is any racial motivation for this to have happened. I do believe that there are those at the club who might feel we lack the proper support networks and integration programs to help some of these players adjust to AFL football.

So tell me Big Footy Saints, is it something the club should make a conscious effort to change? Should the club work with the Clarke Brothers, Nicky Winmar, Gilbert McAdam etc and specifically target Indigenous players to bring to the club in the coming years? Or do we feel comfortable drafting 'best available' regardless of their culture and creed?

While there aren't many notable Indigenous players from recent drafts that I feel we should have taken it does feel as though we are missing something by being the only club in the AFL without an Indigenous player on it's list - http://www.aflcommunityclub.com.au/index.php?id=790

The club made a public statement earlier this year about how we were a "trailblazer" for Indigenous players - http://www.saints.com.au/news/2015-05-25/st-kilda-a-pioneer-for-indigenous-players - but now it feels like everyone has passed us by, and we are only falling further behind.
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This is pure speculation on my behalf and I fully believe that it could just be the result of no players being there at the picks we have had:

However, if the clubs financial situation is so bad that it can't afford to provide the level of support needed to properly accommodate indigenous players then I could see them putting a temporary freeze on their recruitment. It's not good for the player or the club to be in a situation like that and I'd guess the AFLPA would agree with that.
 
I think its more discriminatory to select a token indigenous player just because we don't have any on our list. I mean, seriously, this stuff really gets to me. Just pick best available kid - if that happens to be a young Aboriginal kid from the outback then pick him, if its a kid from the suburbs of Melbourne then pick him - but lets not select someone based on their race!

I swear the world has gone mad, its like going for a job interview with an 'equal opportunity' employer. Knowing you're a better candidate but missing out on the role because the employer wants to beef up their minority numbers to get some decent publicity.

Sorry if that offends, but lets not categorize people/potential draftees - lets just do what's best for our list so I can see a bloomin flag in my lifetime!!
 
Race is just such a complicated issue. It seems like somewhat of an oxymoron to claim that everyone is on equal terms, whilst simultaneously claiming that there tends to be difficulties in relocating indigenous players from their local communities. As long as any such relocation difficulties are judged on a case by case basis, and not simply attributed to a player because of their ethnicity, then that's all you can ask for. If it just so happens that this is a factor that causes a recruiting team to select another player, indigenous or not, then so be it, and I will have no objections as it is a selection on merit.

Simultaneously, though, a team should not just select a player because of perceived deficiencies in the number of players of their ethnicity in a given club.
 
BlacreJacks said:
I think its more discriminatory to select a token indigenous player just because we don't have any on our list. I mean, seriously, this stuff really gets to me. Just pick best available kid - if that happens to be a young Aboriginal kid from the outback then pick him, if its a kid from the suburbs of Melbourne then pick him - but lets not select someone based on their race!

I swear the world has gone mad, its like going for a job interview with an 'equal opportunity' employer. Knowing you're a better candidate but missing out on the role because the employer wants to beef up their minority numbers to get some decent publicity.

Sorry if that offends, but lets not categorize people/potential draftees - lets just do what's best for our list so I can see a bloomin flag in my lifetime!!
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Not wanting to sound rude to you but that's an ignorant comment. Liam Jurrah, The Krakouers through two generations, Ashley Sampi, and numerous other indigenous kids recently have quit or been in trouble with the law.
I don't reckon our club, at this stage of our development, needs anymore scandals so we need to minimise the risk.
 
After the hate and vitriol directed toward Raph Clarke by sections of our so called supporters, if I was aboriginal, I would be loathe to come to St.Kilda.

Yes Raph was inconsistent but the vitriiol I read about him transcended just scapegoal status.

In my opinion of course.
 
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