Abbott Leadership challenge - "Et tu, Turnbull?" - 14/9/15

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Ratts of Tobruk said:
Given the Liberals policy is made up of the Labor party's policy of not allowing any boatpeople into Australia + turning boats around + TPVs, I think your reference is 7 years out of date.
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Scott Morrison has come out and said he's Christopher Pyne's "apprentice fixer". Weird move by him, but clearly a signal that he isn't going to be going for the top job. If the Libs had in-fighting over the next leader they'd run out of time before the election, so maybe there has been a hierarchy worked out behind the scenes.

I'm thinking Bishop PM and Turnbull Treasurer. Bishop continues to get good reviews for her foreign policy diplomacy, and both her and Turnbull could try and blame their policy-area problems on Abbott if he goes down.

You'd think Labor would lose to that pairing, but how they dealt with Abbott's supporters would be the trick. Surely Bernadi and friends can be side-lined without any impact to their core vote, and Hockey is devoid of confidence so would accept a lesser ministry. So long as the rabid Bolt-style right-wingers swallow real action on Climate Change this could be a smooth transition.
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
So long as the rabid Bolt-style right-wingers swallow real action on Climate Change this could be a smooth transition.
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Lol as if opposition to an ETS/Carbon tax is the preserve of the "rabid" right. FFS. Turnbull knows a carbon tax is a non starter unless there is an international agreement.

If he was offered the leadership on the condition of no carbon tax I would think he would accept that in a heart beat.
 

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Ratts of Tobruk said:
Scott Morrison has come out and said he's Christopher Pyne's "apprentice fixer". Weird move by him, but clearly a signal that he isn't going to be going for the top job. If the Libs had in-fighting over the next leader they'd run out of time before the election, so maybe there has been a hierarchy worked out behind the scenes.

I'm thinking Bishop PM and Turnbull Treasurer. Bishop continues to get good reviews for her foreign policy diplomacy, and both her and Turnbull could try and blame their policy-area problems on Abbott if he goes down.

You'd think Labor would lose to that pairing, but how they dealt with Abbott's supporters would be the trick. Surely Bernadi and friends can be side-lined without any impact to their core vote, and Hockey is devoid of confidence so would accept a lesser ministry. So long as the rabid Bolt-style right-wingers swallow real action on Climate Change this could be a smooth transition.
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I won't address all the juvenile nonsense in your post, but will educate you on one simple fact, Turnbull is only interested in the top job, not being Treasurer to a new Prime Minister.
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
I think Shorten will be undone by the same thing that failed Gillard - his communications.
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lol, she failed because of hopeless policy. Just as Abbott isn't failing due to bad "presentation" he is failing due to poor and adhoc decisions and changing his mind on policy ie budget emergency.
 
medusala said:
Lol as if opposition to an ETS/Carbon tax is the preserve of the "rabid" right. FFS. Turnbull knows a carbon tax is a non starter unless there is an international agreement.
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You are aware when you quote someone it shows exactly what they wrote above your attempt to reframe the debate, right?

I say "real action on Climate Change" and you change that to "ETS/Carbon tax" in order for you to "Lol" before saying "FFS". Good on ya; so brave.

Of course most political analysts suggest Turnbull's enemies were worried he'd agree with Rudd's ETS, but you and Baldy Head know Turnbull better than professional journos, his fellow MPs and even himself. I hope the Psychology board won't discipline you both for revealing what he told you in confidence during your in-depth sessions.
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
Of course most political analysts suggest Turnbull's enemies were worried he'd agree with Rudd's ETS, but you and Baldy Head know Turnbull better than professional journos, his fellow MPs and even himself.
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http://www.theaustralian.com.au/sub...tory-e6frg6xf-1227211055236&memtype=anonymous

07/02/2015 · A SUDDEN change in government leadership will not trigger a policy shift towards a carbon tax, as Malcolm Turnbull warns against the idea

I say "real action on Climate Change" and you change that to "ETS/Carbon tax
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Right so what other real action is there then? In favour of direct action now are you?
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
Of course most political analysts suggest Turnbull's enemies were worried he'd agree with Rudd's ETS, but you and Baldy Head know Turnbull better than professional journos, his fellow MPs and even himself. I hope the Psychology board won't discipline you both for revealing what he told you in confidence during your in-depth sessions.
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What on Earth are you referring to here?

I haven't commented on Turnbull in respect of Rudd's ETS for ages, if at all on this board.
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
You are aware when you quote someone it shows exactly what they wrote above your attempt to reframe the debate, right?

I say "real action on Climate Change" and you change that to "ETS/Carbon tax" in order for you to "Lol" before saying "FFS". Good on ya; so brave.

Of course most political analysts suggest Turnbull's enemies were worried he'd agree with Rudd's ETS, but you and Baldy Head know Turnbull better than professional journos, his fellow MPs and even himself. I hope the Psychology board won't discipline you both for revealing what he told you in confidence during your in-depth sessions.
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His merchant banking friends would have thanked him forever. nothing quite like easy arbitrage
 
medusala said:
Right so what other real action is there then? In favour of direct action now are you?
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Check the internet.
Baldy Head said:
What on Earth are you referring to here?

I haven't commented on Turnbull in respect of Rudd's ETS for ages, if at all on this board.
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It was a reference to you being very sure that Turnbull wouldn't accept Treasurer. You could well be right, but given your opinions and consistent inability to take into account alternate opinions, I'm confident you don't have special insight into Turnbull's thinking.
 
Ratts of Tobruk said:
Check the internet.

It was a reference to you being very sure that Turnbull wouldn't accept Treasurer. You could well be right, but given your opinions and consistent inability to take into account alternate opinions, I'm confident you don't have special insight into Turnbull's thinking.
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Everyone one knows that Turnbull's only after the top job, so no special insight from me, just unbelievable ignorance from you.
 

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Baldy Head said:
The Left always like to deceive themselves like that.
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I don't think you truly believe that. You've been caught out holding positions that contradict yourself, and it doesn't change the tone and metre of your contributions to the board. You know full well that you are one-eyed, and enjoy deceiving yourself so you don't have to think too hard about your positions.
 
Baldy Head said:
The Left always like to deceive themselves like that.
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Its probably because they want the world to be something that it isn't. They want wealth to be handed out as if it is just created by itself but don't want to contribute to creating it. They want education but don't want to contribute or pay back their education costs. they want to be free loving and fair to immigrants (like refugees) unless the foreigners want to be successful and work (457s).

What they don't appreciate is most of us all want these things but the difference between left and right is one wants to contribute to making these happen and aren't threatened by success. Deceiving themselves is just a coping mechanism, so they don't have to see the flaw in the model, the selfishness and the failure to accept responsibility.
 
Power Raid said:
Its probably because they want the world to be something that it isn't. They want wealth to be handed out as if it is just created by itself but don't want to contribute to creating it. They want education but don't want to contribute or pay back their education costs. they want to be free loving and fair to immigrants (like refugees) unless the foreigners want to be successful and work (457s).
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Strong generalizations are strong - but incorrect.
You're confusing equality of outcome with equality of opportunity, a common strategy for people who buy into "the myth of the other".
 
Mofra said:
Strong generalizations are strong - but incorrect.
You're confusing equality of outcome with equality of opportunity, a common strategy for people who buy into "the myth of the other".
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of course, it is a generalisation, meaning the one size will not fit all.

but you can see a trend in postings that would support that generalisation.
 
Power Raid said:
but you can see a trend in postings that would support that generalisation.
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I'd argue the opposite - it's the Greens who independently fund their policies, request a Federal ICAC, invest in future jobs rather than lead us down the path of being China's dirt-bunnies, and would adequately fund the collection of general revenues owed (the case for new taxes is not adequately made until existing revenues are collected).

The LDP present policies as economically rational yet socially progressive (they don't neatly straddle the standard left/right divide) however a glance of their policy positions indicates social progression does not necessarily mean economic cost.

Your assumptions also miss the increase in net migration under Howard - he's hardly the flag bearer for "the left"
 
Power Raid said:
His merchant banking friends would have thanked him forever. nothing quite like easy arbitrage
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Yep, most people cant grasp that whilst academics love the notion of an ETS in reality it is next to hopeless and will get games. See EU system and massive fraud. Nor do they understand all the revenue in the forward estimates relied on a carbon price way out of line with the EU price.

Its the same with the mining tax, look at how many people on here support it without having any idea in reality how it would work, how few iron ore companies are making money at the present time and how even those that do would pay extremely little.

Turnbull is not a fool, he must know you cant resurrect an ETS in Australia with a carbon price vastly different to that in Europe which is under EUR10.

A spell as treasurer would be good for him. He is daylight better than anyone on either side in talking economics and finance IMO.
 
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